I don't get it. I guess I may never understand. I broke down, cried uncontrollably and asked H for the truth. I asked him what his intentions were with the OW. I asked him to give me something so that I could just close the door. He just wouldn't budge...said I was being neurotic. He doesn't have any plans. I stormed upstairs and promised myself that I would give up. Not five minutes later, he came up and said, look at me, you're not really giving up, are you?<p>I just walked away but why does this always happen? Just when I'm ready to close that door, he reopens it.

Terrified,<p>Once again, the message playing in my head is "There must be a WS Handbook out there that they ALL read."<p>My H did the exact same thing, many, many months ago; and I can still recall every second of it. It was nearly 6 months after d-day #1, and we were in an especially bad state. H was being intolerable, actually quite cruel towards me, and I was just barely holding it together, having just started taking anti-depressants. On our Saturday night date (we were living together), I pressed the 'what are your thoughts about the future of our M' issue. Well, the answer I got, over a period of hours was that I should just leave it alone because he was still with me and that if I had to know, he was only with me because of the children, that had not changed in the 5+ months of recovery, and he did not think that would ever change, even if he stayed with me for a lifetime. Well, I knew I should not have asked, but I did and then I had to deal with the reply. On Sunday morning, I could barely get myself out of bed and with nearly every breath I took, I cried softly. I stayed out of H's sight and tried not to be audible with my anguish for hours, but then he walked into the room where I was folding laundry alone. He crossly asked "What is wrong with you now?" And I just could not answer through the tears. He managed to control a tirade and gave me a hug; then he said, "Don't give up on us, yet, okay? If you give up, then where would we be?" All I had the strength to say was "How can you be saying that now?"<p>So, I think I know how you feel. It is unfair. It is so, so unfair. But I think you probably know the the answer to your question "why does this always happen? Just when I'm ready to close that door, he reopens it."<p>It happens this way because he knows you are close to the end, and he is not prepared to see that happen. He is not ready to really work at recovery, yet he is not ready to see an end to the M.<p>I don't remember off hand where you are in the scheme of things, whether your H is still involved with OW or whether he is in withdrawal. Either way, I think the analysis is pretty much the same. If he is still involved with OW, then he is being a cakeman; if he is in withdrawal, he is still holding onto some part of the A and unwilling to work at recovery.<p>I could be way, way off base here. So, feel free to tell me that I am all wet. My personal experience with a very similar episode in our recovery was the 'withdrawal with hidden contintued contact' scenario. I also wondered what it was about and did not know what to make of it.<p>In hindsight, my H did a pretty good job of manipulating the situation, because I stayed with plan A or the best I could make of plan A for another 6 months. It took him that time to finally 'get it' enough to take responsibility for his personal issues and see an IC; well, time and my asking him to leave the house. But, that is another story in itself.<p>Anyways, that is my 2 cents worth.<p>Hugs,

Terrified,<p>I gotta say OneDay is dead on. They push us and push until we are ready to break, then they reel us back in. They are scared to be on their own. Scared to be with us. No explanation available other than the FOG<p>Needing

<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr>So, I think I know how you feel. It is unfair. It is so, so unfair. But I think you probably know the the answer to your question "why does this always happen? Just when I'm ready to close that door, he reopens it."<p>It happens this way because he knows you are close to the end, and he is not prepared to see that happen. He is not ready to really work at recovery, yet he is not ready to see an end to the M.<p><hr></blockquote><p>Wow! OneDay...this kinda said it all for me...I'm having one of 'those' days too...<p>Terrified...[[[[[[[[[hugs]]]]]]]]]]]...from (c a l i) I know how hard this is...I am tired too.

I am sorry, I know you are in pain and so it is hard for you to think clearly. Have you read "Boundaries" by Henry Claude and John Townsend. Your frustration is because you are not setting appropriate boundaries. Can you live with the way things are "till death do you part"? Your h is content and you are miserable. He has no reason to change because he is happy with the way things are. He has no responsibility - you are doing it all with daughter (from your last thread). He has no accountability - no one knows about what is going on. He has the best of both worlds - why would he change? You are the one who is not happy so you need to make changes so you can be happy. How long have you been in Plan A? It may be time for Plan B or at least see it as a goal for the new year.

Yup, they pull and push until they drive us nuts. Mine is doing the same thing... dated for 3 weeks and now has called it off. No explanation. Leaves me devastated AGAIN !! So the roller coaster ride continues.
When do you start believing what they tell you ?
Is this movement back and forth a sign that they are moving into full blown recovery ?
I have read that movement is a good thing, because they are not stuck in one stage. But its dynamite on my brain and my soul !
I also have been tempted to make some statements to try to get a committment of one kind or another from him. But I am afraid of the answer I will get. I know he would not tell me what I want to hear. So why ask ?
Because living in limbo is the most horrid experience. And you think that if you just knew what was going through their heads you would be able to move on a heal. But their heads are totally screwed up and no amount of analysis is going to figure it out.

I think its time for STRENGTH.<p>Do NOT let him manipulate you. Don't cling to that little ray of hope he sparked in you. ITS NOT ENOUGH.<p>Proceed with what will make YOU feel better. Go to that party tonight. Tell friends "gosh didn't you know? H got himself an apartment" And enjoy yourself. Don't get caught up in misery. Don't go to the party feeling sorry for yourself. Start to enjoy life.<p>Believe me -- neediness is not appealing -- but strength is. He will be more attracted to you if he thinks you're moving on.

T:<p>Again, I have to say been there also.<p>What I believe is the minute we (BS) start thinking about ourselves 1st & stop worrying about whether they (WS) are lying to us or playing with us we begin to heal.<p>We allknow we aren't really 100% thinking about ourselves, but we are trying & trying hard not to obsess about them & they did to us.<p>I found that when I finally had no energy left I had two choices die or try & live for me.<p>My motto became " It's all about me !"<p>I swear the minute I started to behave this way (it was really hard) My H started to feel threatened & acted really different.<p>Things aren't great, but he is trying very hard & I'm delighted about that.<p>Good Luck....It's all about YOU & you deserve it.

Terri,
I dito eevryone else!
He's not sure what he wants, as long as we (cause I'm in similar boat, baby!) always placate their little whishes & way of doing this, they're content.
If we want it differntly, wehave to be ale to take a stand & do things differently -- give him a reason to make a choice -- simple he makes comiitment to come back & work or you ask for Divorce! Key here is that you take the intiative!
You & I can only be dooormats for so long -- if it doesn't feel good, we have to have courage to speak up! The Dobson book offers good perspectives about this approach!
Peace,
HH

"you're not giving up are you?"<p>Please tell us what your answer to that question was.

I agree with many of you...don't let H manipulate you. Why do you want to be with someone who treats you like this?!?!?!? You deserve better!!!!! I know it's easier said than done, but now, 10 months after d-day (which includes oc born 3 months ago), I am done being manipulated by H's depression, moods, selfish behavior,etc, etc, etc. He wants nothing more than for us to stay together but after everything that's happened I don't think I can put myself in a vulnerable position again.

Terri,
Lexxxy makes a good point. It reminded me that when I spoke of you asking for D, I never actually felt or thought of it as an actual motive. The Motive is to send a real clear & loud message that you are willing to pack it in, that you have your limits & boundaries. This is where from my persective, we show strength, strength that our respective conroling S's did not see in us or realize we posess. This is I think, is an effective way to get their attention (in certain situations) & play a little bit of their game perhaps. Grab some power back -- equal the scales a little.
Best of Luck!
PS--
Believe it or not, I can see that while I know you are in a lot of pain & somewhat uncertain, you are definately stronger & better equipped to deal with these kinds of issues, than when you first posted!
Peace,
HH