WH had a friendship, turned EA, almost turned physical. H says that OW showered him w/compliments, made him feel wanted & he liked being chased but really wanted it to be me that was doing the chasing. He says he did not return compliments but did listen when she complained about her H and told her that he was sorry that happened to her. I am fairly certain he is telling truth about changing his mind but the doubt is always there.<p>He checked into hotel room & then backed out before they ever went in. I discovered hotel on my own although he had told me about friendship a few weeks earlier & told OW they couldn't talk anymore - completely his idea.<p>They still did talk & when OW came on to him on a that very vulnerable night (he was in a jealous rage over something he THOUGHT I did & I was heading out of town the next morning) he agreed to the hotel but backed out. He still had trouble letting OW go even after I found out but has told her several times now he wants to be with me & never wanted her. One time he taped conversation.<p>A lot happened as a result of all of this but the status is now that he came back home, is going to marraige counseling, individual counseling & anger management. For the first two weeks after reconciliation we were more in love than ever, working through all of the hard stuff but together, supporting one another.<p>Then I caught him in a lie. He installed spy software on our computer (which I honestly was fine with - I have nothing to hide) but he lied over and over that he didn't do it. I told him to get out that I couldn't be lied to - it destroyed all trust. We ended up continuing to work on it after talking to MC. MC is not in total agreement w/this site's views but is good otherwise.<p>OW is still pursuing! OW also has some other guy on line & her husband is oblivious to it all (I informed him of what I knew about my WH) OW & WH work together & she will not back down. H refuses to talk to her, tells her he is busy or outright tells her to leave office. He always calls me to tell me when he has spoken to her & what he has said. H is also considering contacting OW's H to tell him to tell her to leave him alone. The only reason he is not quitting job is because he is being promoted and transferred shortly.<p>OW continually causes problems, brings up more pain & we have lost the great relationship we had after we initially reconciled. Also, the two had a business trip planned (cancelled - he spent the time with me). He had lied to me about her accompanying him, but cancelled trip due to being found out. Originally told me that nothing would have happened. <p>Today he admitted that it may have actually turned physical if OW had pursued and his EMs were not being met by me. He also admitted that he loved the chase, but reiterates that he wants me to chase him (i.e. want him which I was doing). He also said it wasn't her but rather anyone who was interested in him. I would have been OK with the truth up front but things keep coming up that hurt.<p>I believe that he is well aware of OW's psychotic tendencies (she has done some outrageous stuff & tries to make it look like I am doing it) and that is why he is so turned off by her. He says that he despises her and wishes her dead. He says that she is white trash, a whore (well, he agrees when I say that [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img] , that she is a ditz and a terrible, neglectful mother - the complete opposite of me. Her body type is even the complete opposite of me). <p>He takes responsibility for his part but feels he was manipulated and preyed upon. (She planned to move to another city after divorcing her BH and thought my H was moving there too so that they would live happily ever after - she was wrong - he had no long-term plans for her and we are moving to a completely different city).<p>But what about next time the damsel in distress or sympathetic ear or chaser comes along? And if I don't feel like chasing as I am hurt and untrusting how do I proceed? I was withholding love and admiration and that is my part in this even if it was justifiable by his previous actions. <p>HOW DO WE SURVIVE THE NEXT MONTH OR TWO UNTIL THE TRANSFER COMES THROUGH while she still pursues?<p>He is trying. I am trying but this is tough. I realize others are dealing with WSs who aren't as willing to change but I am so unsure of what to do. Help! Sorry so long. Not used to posting in chat rooms.<p>[ December 22, 2001: Message edited by: nursebetty ]</p>

Hi betty,<p>There are others here who have more experience with your situation than I do, but I wanted to let you know that someone is listening to you.<p>Weekends are really slow on the forum, and especially so this time of year, so don't be discouraged if you do not get many responses right away.<p>Thank goodness you are moving away from her. I think that rather than worrying about damsels in distress threatening your marriage, your efforts would be better spent strengthening you marriage, communication, and meeting emotional needs of each other. This takes time, of course. <p>I suggest that you read all the information on the main site. It is really helpful. Maybe your husband will read it too.<p>Without knowing it, your husband is doing a very good thing, actually something that MB suggests. He is being open with you about contact with OW.
Also he admits his responsibility even though he does seem to be trying to cast most of the blame on her.<p>There is a good chance that the two of you can work this out, especially since you will be moving. In the meantime, he must avoid time alone with OW. Definitely no busimess trips together. Do you know about the "No Contact" letter? It sounds like one would be appropriate ASAP in your situation. <p>By the way, may I ask why your husband feels like it's necessary to check up on you? Is he displacing his guilt onto you, or has something happened to cause him to be suspicious?<p>Welcome to MB,
Estes

betty,<p>This might help.<p>How to Survive Infidelity<p>Estes

<p>[ January 20, 2002: Message edited by: MMMMM ]</p>

Thank you Estes & mylife for your replies. I want to mention a few things to clarify.

H wakes up every morning hating himself for betraying me and hurting me. He has even been suicidal. He does now see OW's part in this, sees her for who she is. He originally took all blame and tried to protect her. He tried talking to her husband yesterday but OW answered and wouldn't allow it. Today he told her that if she didn't leave him alone he was going to call her husband. Then he told her to get out of his office. He does not have time alone with her except to tell her to leave office. If they have any meetings or performance issues, he has another manager present and the third party conducts meeting. As for business trips, I am going on one with him and the other I will checking up on her to make sure she stays in town. He isn't going to tell her where he is going but she may find out.<p>I did not have an affair. He did suspect one with my neighbor BECAUSE he came home from a trip this summer and the condoms were out. My toddler found them and was playing with them. That same week said neighbor came over to see if I was OK after he saw me pulled over on the highway and I mentioned his kindness to H. He also suspected another old friend that I have no contact with for about three years because I admitted to having fantasies about him. Most fantasies were not sexual but some were. It was mostly admiration that this friend felt for me in the fantasies, comforting me after H cheated on me & divorced me. I knew it was wrong, considered it cheating and even though I have suffered under H's emotional abuse for years now it does not excuse it. Unfortunately, it gave him the license to take his EA to the next level (although he backed out). He has always been either extremely jealous (for no reason as I report all suspicous behavior & have terminated several friendships where the man developed feelings for me) OR goes into an "I don't care if you live or die" mode to protect himself.<p>I have been lurking this site and forum and have read all of the articles. I also have His Needs, Her Needs and so am familiar with the EN concept. Unfortunately, H lied about his ENs initially so I was doing the wrong ones AND he got the idea to take the affair to the next level from one of case studies! We are practicing open honesty now and trying to meet those needs for each other.<p>4)I AM worried about the future women now as I read more about infidelity and it is more difficult with OW constantly at his heels & new information coming to light. In addition, I do not like my role of private investigator & resent that I have to snoop now. I am pleased with his responses to her now though & his openess with me.<p>5)I sometimes feel that this hurt is not worth the pain & therefore don't feel like doing the "chasing" he wants. We have other issues, emotional abuse, and he currently has three criminal charges pending against him surrounding the D-Day incident where he broke down a door to get to me and put my head into the wall twice as he struggled to get the phone out of my hands. He is actively changing & is in counseling 2-3 times per week, including anger management. In addition, the key to his defense is to attack my credibility unless they offer a plea. Fun for me!<p>Also, this has put a financial burden on us with attorney fees, etc. & our standard of living will go way down. I love him & support him on his path to being a better man so I would easily be a poor man's wife for him. But it feels like it is all for OW! He was trying to get phone from me so that I would not call OW's BH because "Couldn't I just leave that family alone?" as if it was my decision to involve that family. He has never been my protector but our lives are in ruin for her - someone he never cared about & now despises.<p>In addition, his family has basically condoned his behavior , blaming it all on me and become verbally abusive towards me.<p>My children were present and are showing signs of the stress and strain. Obviously, I have a great deal to deal with right now, as does everyone else on this board!<p>So, I focus on keeping the LBs to a minimum, work on ENs, focus on positive thoughts, accepting what really did happen & trying to move forward so that this is a learning experience at the beginning of a long life together (as if the first 11 years didn't count!)

Thanks for the support!<p>betty

nursebetty --<p>Some of us are around here on weekends and holidays and will continue to be, so you post as often as you want and take as much time and space to get your thoughts out as you need--that's a part of what these BBs are all about.<p>We feel your pain. We hear you. You are hurt and sandbagged and reeling from it and who wouldn't be? The reason you're unsure of what to do now is that there isn't any single direction or clear path through the maze. We are all forced to make the really important decisions of life based on incomplete and inadequate information--so nobody knows what they need to know in that regard, ever.<p>I see some light at the end for you: frequent and intense counseling for him, openness with you and his willingness to discuss OW, acknowledgement of his responsibility in all of this, your continued love and support of him and willingness to work with him and the marriage--all big positives!<p>Don't give another moment's thought about future OW--you've got enough to handle without crossing the bridge before you come to it. Besides, what good does worrying do anyhow?--You can't see the future! Take each hour as it comes.<p>We support you and validate you and we're here for you anytime. You seem have a solid, healthy, and comprehensive grasp of the issues involved and "knowledge is power." I'll keep you very much in my thoughts and prayers. Hang in--we care!<p>Ammon

Betty,<p>I'm planning a quiet Christmas at home. I'll check in to see if you need to talk.<p>I suggest that you praise your H for his efforts to avoid former OW and reassure him that he's important to you. Take things one day at a time.<p>Take care,
Estes

Thank you all so much. This is really helpful. <p>Sometimes when I view other posts I get ideas in my head that shouldn't be there. Other times I feel guilty because I have a spouse, here, writing me 15 page-long love letters, weeping in my arms (well, that slowed down this week but for a guy who never cried before - impressive!), who calls me 10+ times per day from work to "hear my voice" or "see how I am doing" as well as update me on OWs activities. I have praised him on his efforts. We are both trying to practice positive thinking to get through the holidays. He is very loving and attentive and tonight he said "This is how it should be when I come home." <p>When he was at work today he called and said he felt like packing up the family pictures and just walking out of work forever. He wanted to come home to me so badly. This when he is so close to a great promotion.<p>Still, the healing takes time and with all of the lying and the "revelations" before that didn't last I don't trust all of this. He seems sincere though and is actively changing behavior patterns - a first in 11 years. I am too, I think.<p>Merry Christmas, Kwanza, etc. to all. I will check in if I can. Thank you for your support.

We are doing EMDR with our therapist. Anyone else doing that with an EMDR therapist?

NurseBetty --<p>We haven't heard from you for a bit, not since Dec. 23. How are you doing? Did you make it through Christmas and New Year's Eve? <p>What is EMDR therapy? It's a new term to me.<p>I still see good positives in your life from him, including the new ones in your last post. Still, it's normal for you not to trust completely these clues--indeed, how could you feel and be any other way? To rebuild that trust in you could take him (that's where it has to start) and you a very long time. In fact, don't put a time limit on it--when you think you've given it enough time, give it some more. In a way, it's totally up to him to help you to be comfortable with him again, so you just be the recipient for awhile.<p>Please post again and let us know how you're doing. We're thinking about you...<p>Ammon