Don't know what happened but it seems that the MB forum software messed up on PatV's first post/thead here on MB. So I've started this thread for him. He could us our support.<p>
PatV's post.....
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I'd like to join the group! I've been reading this forum for several weeks and its time to add my mess. I'm emotionally taxed and although I've been seying a C for months, I need another outlet. My wife started her EA in August with OM whom they lost their virginity to each other when they were 16. He got back in touch with her thru classmates.com although they lived in diff. towns. He lives out of state and they roundevoused in SLC Sept. 21 for the 1st time. I found out she flew to SLC that weekend, 10 days after Worl trade Center, I guess they wanted to be together real bad! Had sex that weekend as I was later told by my WS. I didn't ask how many times or how it was but that was the time I took of my wedding ring. She had hers off before she told me she wanted a sep. for her time and space. I moved out of house then before I knew of EA to honor her request and once I found out about EA, I still allowed her to stay in house. My wife told me that she loved this man who is also married and has 2 sons 7&8 and wanted to move back to WIS. and marry him. She was willing to leave our sons (7&11) with me. What drives a woman to leave her own sons behind? OM flew here to se her for her BDay, Oct. 19, his wife found out about EA 4 days before he came here and he still came. His wife become highly suicidal so his weekend was cut short. That was One good thing. My wife has told me that the EA was stopped at the end of NOv. which I believe because she tried to take her life that week. She is now taking anti-depressants. So I think Plan A has worked. Worse thing I said to WS during affair was that she was a f**king liar. The lies can be some of the worse actions to endure! My wife still has no interest in reconciliation. I refinanced our house to buy her out so the boys could have stability in their lives (rather than selling) and she bought her new house DEc. 21. I helped her move, hook up stuff, etc. now over the last 3 weekends. I feel used and like a doormat but keeping telling myself its what a caring supportive husband should do. She tells me that OM will forever be in her heart and that she cares for me deeply but doesn't love me. I'm hoping that changes as time creates a chasm between her and OM. However, I waver daily whether to leave because of the lies, the cheating, her heart will forever be elsewhere and the thought og her leaving our boys. I also very much still love her and don't want to cheat our boys by being too impatient and leaving our marriage when maybe we can work it out. She doesn't want to see MC bt has told me she will starte seeing C for herself. God, I hope she does, she doesn't know who she is. I'd like to hear from WW on how long it might take for her to consider getting back into our marriage? I'm 39 and she's 38. Like most of you, I would never have imagined this would happened. I do take responsibility for not meeting her ENs but she never told me as we neer fought and she was a conflict avoider so she kept it in. How do you survive in limbo while waiting for your spouse to decide yor future? Seeing that she now has her own house, I think I might be in limbo for a long time. I asked her if she has given any more thought to a D and she has said yes and I asked why and it was because she felt it wouldn't be fair to me because she couldn't give me her love like before. I thinking she is waiting for OM to recontact her since he has started anew job in KY and it appears like his wife will not be joining him. What do I do? stick it out or file for divorce. Everything is already divided thru mediation and I'm paying child support per our parenting agreement which we are implementing voluntarily.
--------------------<p>Married 13 yrs, together 19
Betrayed H
2 Sons, 7&11
D-day was labor day
Separated since then.
OM is her first love who she hadn't seen
in over 20 years and is out of State.<p>
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------<p>[ January 08, 2002: Message edited by: zorweb ]<p>[ January 08, 2002: Message edited by: zorweb ]</p>

Pat,<p>I need to get to work right now, but other's should be right behind me.... Hope this gets you started…<p>Here are some links to get you started:<p>WAT's Quick Start Guidelines for Betrayed Spouses <p>http://www.marriagebuilders.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=29&t=000940<p>General Welcome for All New Builders<p>http://www.marriagebuilders.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=29&t=000553<p>Notable Posts/Threads <p>http://www.marriagebuilders.com/forum/Forum29/HTML/000554.html<p>Acronyms, Smilies, UBB Codes <p>http://www.marriagebuilders.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=29&t=000557

PatV,<p>Welcome to MB, I hope you had familiar yourself to the concept. Your situation is similiar to mine in term of WW is beleiving that no love in the M since from the beginning. Also she is extreme giver and now she is snapped and become extreme taker. It is very tough.<p>First and for most is yourself. You have to be honest to yourself and do selfreflection. Do you think you still want W if she is back and willing to work on M ?. How long do you think you could stand it until you could convinced yourself it is time to go ?. The wait won't be easy as you have ridden the 'coaster for a few month now and it is for the long haul. Your love for her is as deep as on ocean but not bottomless and also you owe your happiness to yourself not to mention your kids.<p>"In Love" or romantic feeling is very conditional. You could fall in love with anybody if 4 gifts of love is applied, so does your W. So don't worry about what she said to you, staying & falling in love is intentional. The very selfishness that started A will burn it self out ... given time. You did the right thing removing yourself out from its path (interfering). The more you are not interfering the better since it will force WW to base on her own excuse (true love) not the one that you have created.<p>Access your own situation. How was her relation w/ kids ?, bonded ?. How was her memory in M ?. What did she say on why she "lurked" or wondered out side M ?. Who is OM (snoop/sleuth if you have to), all we know he might be child molestor - protect youself and protect her too ?.<p>IMVHO ....
From what you just describe you ought to stick it out for a little longer. She has not taste the life out her fantasy yet, OM has not moved in. My WW tastes it and MIA for a few days again this weekend, it is not because of OM but because trying to avoid pain to walk home and seeing her kids. How long do you think before OM LB'ed ?. Make sure A is exposed and make sure you get conseling w/ MB. You need third party (professional) to help you out to see if you are chipping away her beleive and reviewing your plan A. Get med if you need to to ease the pain. Spend time on this board to lend your hand to other that screaming for help. Get new activities that will help you out to fill in your schedule, get busy. Plan A'ng your butt off (show changes). If your state allows it just file for separation, to protect yourself financially and legally. It is up to you and you might even forget about filing. She trys to push you away and you get suck right into it. Tell her that you need time to burn the rest of your love out and hope she will be back before then.<p>I always tell people this, it worked and shocked WW's. Think of some action(s) that she never believe that you could do it and some action that attibutes to changes. Not for her but for yourself. Just to make a statement ... here plan A, I am coming. I color my hair, cut it very short (I like long hair), start putting new parfume & take care of my appearance like I am on a date every day, I change my dress code back to what it was before (I changed it for convinent before and her adviced), I get back active to church, and new schedule activities. I am look like in MLC, you get the point. At the same time you have to review your plan A. Thing that you could do to rattle her beleive, small things that is symbolic. Don't be clingy either, learn to speak fogese and learn how to be martians. (I hope Venusian Lady (Orchid) is here, you could ask her for coaching.) I am planning to take dance lessons, I will tell her that I need it to have a date. (She plead before w/ me to go dancing and beleive that I won't do it or hopeless, if she look at my changes attributed to her departure you will have to stick it for a long haul for her to beleive in [img]images/icons/mad.gif" border="0[/img] so you have to attibuted to yourself). Affections ?, give her love note every week (if she doesn't want it ask her to throw it away but you keep sending it.), small thing that you could do then add with new ones. Conversation ? learn to listen and talk about nothing. Talk about current event that she like and so on. No R talk and no "deep" talk, if she starts it it is fine but if it is getting repeatative subject decline it 'cause it will hinder your effort.<p>Good luck, I have to go to work too and drop my 2 D to school. Catch you up later.

Hi, Just want you to know I am here and with you. Listen to Redhat and Zorweb they have a lot of wisdom. YOu can save your marriage, but you have to be the bigger person, and start plan a, and get a copy of the book Surviving an Affair, if you do not already have it.<p>Marriage gets hard, and sometimes people are weak... unfortunately many of us here are in this situation. I am really growing here, I have found a good place to vent, get feedback and advice and grow.<p>You may want to find a counselor familiar with Marriage Builders techniqes in your area. I just did and I am thrilled, he has been to 4 MB Conferences and has been working with the principles since 91. I am so very excited about this, as he knows what I am trying to do... and I have been in IC, and so has my H, and we have been together to one counselor... and it helped just faintly... my H wanted to bash me, and say how awful I am and why it won't work... traditional therapy will help to analyze problems, and mirror back what you say to you so you hear it better... at least that is my current take on it... MB counseling and techniques help you restore and build love, and reduce Love Busters.<p>Read everything you can find on this site, and get the book surviving an affair, and possibly his needs her needs, there are other good programs out there too.<p>I am really feeling there is a chance for my marriage, as I PLAN A. I am so much happier...it is hard, hard work to save your marriage... but you sound like the kind of guy who can do it.<p>Post, be strong, and build some support systems locally and in church if you can.<p>We are here for you, I am by no means an expert or all that experienced, as I found out about my H's affair sept. 15; but I am a quick study, and working hard.<p>WE CARE, and we will get through this together.<p>My heart goes out to you.<p>HONEY

Z,<p>Yesterday afternoon the BB's indexing was hammered, hence PatV's and one of Katie Scarlette's post was meshed. Email went out to Admin and they must have rebuilt to correct last night.<p>Jo

Resilient <p>Yes, that was weird wasn't it? But it gets weirder. This morning I looked at Scarlett's post and it was still linked to PatV's. So I copied his post to this thread. Then I went back to Scarlett's, PatV's stuff was still there. I responded to Scarlett's. That seemed to have fixed the link to PatV's post. However I cannot find a thread started by PatV anywhere. So it looks like the pointer to his thread was permanently lost. <p>Maybe I should send this to the moderator. I do a lot of trouble shooting and debugging too... know it's helpful to have all info possible.

bump

PatV,<p>Listen to these guys(and girls), they may not be experts, but damn close. [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img] They have helped me to "understand", and to this day are continuing.<p>Just hang in there, somtimes it is all we CAN do.

thanks Zorweb, Redhat, Honesty and others! I saw that my post was messed up so I reposted under Angling4Answers an looking for help from WWs. I have'nt read SAA yet but Private Lies by Pittman, Affairs by emily Brown an excellent book I night add and After the affair which is another great book. My wife is amazed at well I have handled this and has told me so, says what we have which is a friendship now after all this is rare, I agree and like to think its becasue I haven't LBed thru this. Worst I called her was a F*** liar. After 5 mos. I stil haven't called her sisters or parents and here is a girl that went to a Catholic HS. Never conronted the OM or called his wife. My brother did call his wife which in my opinion really made the PA stop. She attempted suicide as well. It's so hard sticking it out for the kids because he is like an addiction to here. 4 days after and amazing XMAS card that I wrote along with gifts representing angels, hope, spirit and inner beauty that I worte about(she cried and kissed me for the 1st time in mos) she sends the OM an email telling him how he will forever be in her heart and she wil love him always. funny that is the inscription she had on my wedding ring 13 years ago. I just dont get it but hope she will eventually come out of the fog. Looks like it will be a long time before there is aplan to get ot that island where her heart is. Maybe there will be an upthrust of a tectonic plate that will thrust her island back towards me! thanks, you guys are wonderful!