This week has seen minor breakthroughs and I am very confused about what to do next. As I previously reported, my WW and OM engaged in erotic talk via IM on Mon afternoon. Then I am pretty sure they were together between 9:00 am and 2:00 pm Tues.<p>Then, as I reported, on Wed morning WW told me "We will definitely be married one year from now" and I need to know that she will not break up our family, that she will keep our family together. She also said she thoguht I was different, she truly believed that I loved her the way she wants to be loved and she can love me the same way.<p>She then sent OM an e-mail, about 3 hours later, that said "just to let you know I'm thinking about you". No "I love you", like normal. No xoxo, etc.<p>Now, it's Friday am. My wife has not been on our PC since wed nite when she read one e-mail from OM - a very short note that said "thinking of you too", no "I love yous" or anything. <p>OM hasn't sent her any e-mails since that wed nite note (this from a guy who sends 5-10 a day!)<p>Last nite we went to dinner with another couple. They had received an e-mail from my daughter asking them to pray for my wife and I. Couple asked how we were doing and it ended up being all about me, how I lost 20 lbs, I'm under stress, I can't sleep, etc. My wife was very supportive, but of course we couldn't reveal the real truth. So to them it just looked like I was portrayed as a weakling who couldn't take the pressures of regular life. When we left, my wife was almost in tears apologizing, she knew how uncomfortbale I was, etc. She said she was so so sorry for everything that happened. <p>Later, in bed, I said that I feel like my wife doesn't need me at all. She rolled over and held me and said she needs me and she is sorry if she isn't making me know that. She said it like 4 times. Then I asked if she truly understood why I was not forcing her to end A, why I was giving her my love, not blaming her, etc. She said she understood it "very much- that I want to spend my life with her and I love her." I said yes, that even though it kills me to know that another man is touching her, kissing her, making love to her, hearing her say "I love you"- and I'm not- that I will keep on loving her because I believe she will come back to me. She then said "He is not doing that to me and I'm not doing that to him". She also said "I wish you could read my mind."<p>We went to sleep. This morning, no R talk, no A talk. But when I got out of the van, she said "Mark, I love you."<p>Now we head into weekend. I WANT TO ASK HER-IS IT OVER?? IS IT ALMOST OVER??? WHAT IS GOING ON???<p>I have told her that I will be here for her to lean on if and when she ends A, but she needs to open up to me, talk to me. <p>SHOULD I LET NATURE TAKE ITS COURSE AND HOPE WE ARE HEADING INTO THE END OF THE AFFAIR?? Just keep on no LB, meet her EN's, love her track?<p>Or do you think it is time to ask her point blank what is going on?<p>[ February 08, 2002: Message edited by: Boppo57 ]</p>

I know you want to know......have a real NEED to know actually....been there.<p>But....hold off. Kinda sounds like your W is coming out of the fog a little.<p>Give it a little bit longer....asking now may set her back into defensive mode.<p>Baby steps.....lotsa love.....and a ton of patience.<p>Take care!

Mark,<p> I think you have to slow down a little. I know how hard this is for you. But, it is a must that you notthink about the relationship 24/7. <p> She is telling you the things you need to hear. Or at least the things she thinks you need to hear. She will grow very tired of hearing the same old stuff come out of your mouth, when she thinks she has answered already.<p> Continue Plan A. Do your best to let some of this go. If you don't, you will push her away. <p> You better understand that OM is the one there for her right now. He is not LBing. He is just sitting back letting you push your W into his arms. Don't do it. Quit talking about it so much.<p> I know this is eating you up inside Mark. But you have to slow down. Also, you might want to stop reading her emails. All you are doing is keeping yourself torn up. At the very least, get to the point where you use any information you read to better your Plan A. <p> jd

SHOULD I LET NATURE TAKE ITS COURSE AND HOPE WE ARE HEADING INTO THE END OF THE AFFAIR?? Just keep on no LB, meet her EN's, love her track?<p><p>Yes.

Boppo,<p>easy thing to say, hardest thing to do - been there too. If you have the strength, then don't ask. If you don't have the strength then try and POJA the discussion - in other words get her to agree that it's ok to talk about it and what you do if she (or you) starts to feel uncomfortable. That way you can observe her borders and quickly divert the discussion away from the topic if needed.<p>It does sound like the A is dying though and congrats on loosing the 20lbs [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img] it feel great doesn't it ??<p>- Freddy

boppo, do not ask your wife anything at all, it is absolutely critical you let her disconnect from om in her own way, and reconnect with you in her own way...the revised you... respond to her in appropriate ways..but DO NOT QUESTION HER, she will tell you in her own time.....or if you do move into bonafide recovery, then counselling and discussion will become important....at some point radical honesty will be required...but that time is NOT now, trust me.

Boppo, I agree with all of the above.<p>As you acknowledged to me, I may be getting into a similar spot. Let's both be optimistic together, okay? We know that there's always ups and downs, so no expectations, but at least use this as an encouragement that Plan A is the way to go, at least for now.<p>I tend to agree about the health of the A... I've seen a similar thing in WW's. Last e-mail exchange between her an OM was pretty bland, if you ask me. If they were so ga-ga in love, I'd expect something a bit different, and more frequent exchanges.<p>I've always been worried for some reason that WW and OM are somehow "special". That he's actually some kind of decent guy who's doing no wrong in this, and that I have no way to ever look like an attractive option when compared against him. I mean, why else would she still be in the A after admitting that he's done things to p*** her off, unless his personality is somehow superior.<p>But you know... that's just not true. Especially with my changes, there's just no reason for me to feel bad about anything - I WILL be a great husband, I AM a great husband, and I WILL be happy with my life. Having let got a lot, I think WW is now in a position to see this more, not forced down her throat. I expect the same is true for you too - this stuff is so textbook it's kind of eerie!<p>One thing I'm finding quite effective: BE HAPPY. Happiness tends to be contagous - even WS's can catch it a bit. I've been pretending that OM doesn't exist for the most part, and acting like I really like WW as a friend. We've been talking about things with a lot less tension between us. My guess is that her and OM aren't quite so open and free - how can they be? They're in an A, built on fantasy (now crumbling), lies (WW admits she's getting tired of), and a dual life (WW also admits she's getting tired of)! Even if she were to go off and leave, she's still going to be living in that zone of fantasy and lies. If she goes, the only reason I can see is pressure from OM - and I think she's starting to see that for what it is: manipulation!<p>Anyhow, you rock, we rock, and hopefully our M will rock some day fairly soon!

Thanks JR. Really encouraging post. WE ROCK DUDE!<p>I will be following your posts, you follow mine, too. And if you want to talk directly, I'm at Boppo57@aol.com.

I agree with jdmac1. I have quit talking about it 24/7. I started a journal which helps alot. I even write my prayers in there sometimes. Now, as if you keep talking about it, it will push her inot OM's arms, it works in reverse, if he is pushing her to end it with you...he is pushing her to you...wait it out. I know it is so hard!!! I am doing the exact same thing right now. Please let us know how it is going.

Boppo (Mark),<p>Reading this thread I am very encouraged for you. Listening to the advice, I think you have gotten as good as it gets, but it did remind me of a joke. One of the few that I can seem to remember, but I think it applies here. So with your indulgence allow me to repeat it to you. If you have heard it tough! [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img] I cannot stop typing.<p>It seems there was this cowboy. He was involved in a rodeo and was about to ride a bull. He is mounted on the bull, he is wrapping and rewrapping the rope around his hand to get a better hold. All the while his friend is leaning over the fence steadying the bull, and giving him advice. The friend says: "Now listen up, this is very simple, you stay on this bull for 8 seconds and you are the champ. You got enough points so that all you have to do is stay on and you got it. Do you understand."<p>Meanwhile, a few feet away there are two other cowboys sitting on the fence listening to the instructions. One turns to the other and says: "That boy is about to learn the difference between SIMPLE and EASY."<p>I think the advice you have gotten is simple and right, but make no mistake about it, it won't be easy. Tighten up that rope cowboy, the ride is about to begin.<p>God Bless,<p>JL<p>[ February 08, 2002: Message edited by: Just Learning ]</p>

JL,<p> I loved the joke. And, a more true statement has
never been spoken. It will be hard.<p> Hang on for the ride Mark [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img] <p> jd

Boppo,
You have been getting excellent advice. As a bs I have been in your shoes and am now in good recovery. I just want you to know that all this good effort that you are doing will not be in vain. It sounds to me like your ww is almost home and when the A is over you can look forward to a better marriage than you ever could have dreamed of. I know, I'm living it now.
I posted this on another board and I thought I would paste it here to give you courage not to give up. I just learned this and it is so true....<p>Romans 5:2-4 “…..rejoice in sufferings, because we know that suffering produces perseverance; perseverance, character; and character, hope.”<p>First we must rejoice in suffering. Ouch, that seems so hard but you see that the end result is hope which is what we all are reaching for. <p>You see, God does allow us to hit rock bottom some times for the perpose of learning perseverance and building character in us. It seems like such a tough pill to swallow but when you think about it, and live it, it actually works. <p>Suffering, perseverance, character and finally hope. So often we don’t want to go through with it, we get half way and just want to give up. Why?? Because we feel HOPLESS!!! We have to remember that through all this God will make us a better person and we need to hang on and keep seeking Him for help in this process of rebuilding because in the end there is HOPE.<p>Verse 5 sums it all up…..”And hope does not disappoint us, because God has poured out his love into our hearts by the Holy Spirit, whom he has given us.”<p>I hope this encourages you and lifts your spitit.<p> [img]images/icons/wink.gif" border="0[/img] SH

Mark, hang on! It sounds to me like you are almost at the finish line, and you're going to be the winner. It's coming, let it happen.

Mark,<p>How did your weekend go??<p>JL