This may sound like a stupid question, and to me it is obvious, but I would like to be able to show my WS how contact, even the slightest, with the OM can cloud her judgement. I have no reason other than my own suspicion to think there is, but just in case. Anyone care to comment on this obvious question.

I agree completely. I was a WS and even when I was sure I could remain "just friends" with the OM any contact would just keep my head from clearing. It's like being in a fog and not realizing it until you're OUT of it. All the resentments and picking apart of our marriage was an attempt to make it ok to leave. It took months of being on my own and getting a clearer view of the OM to finally pull my head out. There were valid problems in our marriage...but any relationship with ANYONE else would have taken adjustment and work on my part...so why not put that towards the partner I had made a solid commitment to. She can't pretend nothing ever happend and go back to "normal", nor can you have any peace of mind while there is contact...I think a true commitment to rebuilding the marriage means NO CONTACT...period.

Can I jump in on this thread?<p>hope4future, you being the WS, can you say anything more about how your A died? You said that it took some time on your own to see OM in a new light. Did you have contact with him throughout this time? When you were done with him, were you still in contact? How did contact end (you? him?) How did your feelings change for OP over time? (You must have gone through withdrawal at some point - did you recognize it as that?) How much contact did you have with BS during the separation? What things contributed to the death of the A? Looks like you almost divorced there - was that an influence (i.e., seeing "the end" around the corner)?<p>[ February 21, 2002: Message edited by: J.R. ]</p>

I'll do my best to explain how this all came about. If you read my story you know that we suffered the loss of our home and our possessions in a tornado. The OM had a basement that he loaned us to keep what things were salvaged stored until we could get a new house built. My friends knew I was getting a crush on him, but they thought it was cute. Heck, when I revealed that I was actually in love with him they cheerleaded me right on. My husband was not, and had not, been there for me in any way emotionally after the tornado and they saw how miserable I was. It was easy to make it his fault...and my biggest "cheerleaders" were miserable themselves..I became their poster child, ya know? Live through me kinda crap. The cycle went something like this: I was depressed...OM and I began chatting...I formed the crush. I started flirting and our chats became later and more secretive. Then I found some excuse to call him and we started talking by phone. It was all just friendly for the most part, but certainly not appropriate! Just as soon as "I love you's" were exchanged I pulled away dramatically from my H. I wouldn't touch him, or sleep by him or anything. This was when he figured out I was depressed...but he still thought it MY problem. I made an appt with a counselor in January and the OM and I agreed that I needed help so we broke of the inappropriate contact...but I still kept him "updated". Yea...he was my sounding board for how the marriage was or wasn't going...NOT GOOD! We on again off agained for quite a while when he said he had to pull back completely. We did and I just went through major withdrawls. H and I weren't doing any better and the more I missed the OM and fantasized about how it could be with him, the worse it got with my H. So..I decided I was just going to have to leave. I moved out in Oct. with no intentions of going back. But...again, I had confusing feelings so H and I decided to give it one more "one more" chance. We decided to see another counselor and give ourselves 6 months. But...OM made contact again and with my new freedom it escalated pretty quickly. I had been without any physical contact for almost a year and things weren't going well with hubby again...so we became physical. It wasn't long before I couldnt' stand myself. We broke off contact again, but I also told hubby it was over. OM and I had no contact for quite a while. I worked on myself and my life. I met someone online and that almost turned into something but THIS TIME I listened to myself and slowed it to a hault pretty quickly. We parted before getting in too deep. OM managed to make contact again by sending my son an anonymous birthday present. I emailed to thank him and it started up again. We were together a few times but all those old crappy feelings didn't feel good at all, especially after coming so far out of that hole. I KNEW this was not going to work out the way we had originally seen things. The community thinking us a cute couple and my stbx understanding that we were just meant to be together. What a load of crap. I started to see the OM as selfish and hurting and weak. He stalked me at one time in the rollercoaster. I began to resent him like I had once resented my husband...and I began to realize just what it was I had done to myself, my marriage, and most of all my husband. My H and I were still quite friendly and he had finally pulled out of the "poor me" rut he had been in. I knew he was going out with his brother a lot, but I wasn't aware he had met someone. Anyway...the message board I posted on was extremely helpful in helping me see the light. Once I let go of the resentments I was better able to see my H for who he really is/was and why I ever loved him in the first place...and the more I was able to love him again the more I was able to see the OM for who he really was. He always told me we could make it work...and he was right. We could. But if he and I could, then my H and I can too...and I guarantee you my H would never do to anyone what the OM did to him. I respect my H far more than the OM. I was able to walk away from the OM with no hesitation or doubt this time...and it has not haunted me but on an occasion where something sparks a brief memory. I'll always care about him, and under different circumstances we would have been great together...but an affair is disgusting, demoralizing and completely self-serving...it doesnt' serve well for any kind of relationship foundation. Not sure if that answers your question or not...if not, feel free to ask again and I'll try to dig deeper and remember more.

hope4future, I know I'm kind of hijacking Mark's thread here, but I will respond to his topic also... (it's nice to see some new stories, especially from WS out there - I feel it helps me as a BS understand better - thank you!)<p>So you saw your H "letting go" and "getting on with life". How important was that in your mental process?<p>How much "love busting" did OM do and how much did your H do? (Disrespectful judgements, angry outbursts, etc.) How much did THAT affect you?<p>Can I throw out a hypothetical question... if your H had broken off all contact with you - in a "loving way" (i.e., I can't see or speak to you because it hurts too much, knowing that you're with OM) - how might that have affected your perspective during the A? (I know what the MB crowd is thinking - J.R. - it's not about MAKING the WS DO ANYTHING - it's about protecting you - I'm just curious from the WS perspective what the world might look like - my guess is that you already had enough to deal with on your own, it might not have mattered too much. Sounds like your H is a strong person.)<p>How important was being ALONE and AWAY from H in coming to the point where your feelings started to change? Could you have done it in the same house, do you think (again, hypothetical)?<p>Another hypothetical... if you had to be around OM frequently, such as having to work with him during the A, do you think it would have been harder for you to stop? I guess what I'm trying to get at is the process that took place for you to go from seeing him one way (totally "in love") to a completely different way (selfish, etc.) - whether that shift would be able to take place with nearly constant contact. (You can tell this is what I'm wrestling with - WW and OM work very closely - she's his mentor!)<p>Which leads into my response to Mark on "no contact" - I agree that it's essential. Dr.Harley counsels it for very good reason as explained in SAA - it's an addiction, and the only effective way to treat addicitions of any kind is total avoidance - for life. Which is rather sad, because an addict is often losing out on something (well, except for the druggie maybe). An alcoholic is missing out on the joy of light social drinking, for example. The WS is missing out on what could have been a nice friendship with OP, instead of having to avoid them forever.<p>[ February 21, 2002: Message edited by: J.R. ]</p>

My WH also works closely w/the OW. They are no longer involved in the PA and from what I can figure, the EA is now over too. (Of course that could change at any moment.)<p>The reason I have not pushed for my H to quit his job is 2 fold. <p>1. He wont. His job is all he's got now, he's good at it he wont leave.<p>2. He has to choose me despite seeing her. I have to know this in my own mind. I have to be more important.<p>Of course, you should know that my H is planning on moving out. I think "she" has only backed off because she thinks he has chosen to work on his M to me. I don't know what will happen if she finds out he has left. (He has'nt yet and I'm still praying, but he is looking for apts and I think he found one he likes) I'm sure her man hungry claws will come out in full force. <p>I do not want my husband if I am his second choice. I want him to choose me above all others, despite whats already happend. To me it's kind of like letting the A die a natural death. The whole relationship has to die and he has to just not want to be with her anymore but with me. <p>Do I think this will make things harder, probably, but it's the way my life is right now.<p>Lotsva had an excellent thread on this type of subject. She is a success. I don't know where it is or how to link it, hopefully someone else here will.<p>That's my story.<p>Needing

Do a search for lotsva, she dealt amazaingly with the issue of OP and spouse working together.