H attempted intimacy with me. Says we yearn for each other because we're both lonely people. Asks me to tell him that I don't love him. Says he wouldn't believe me even if I did. <p>Says that his attempt at intimacy was a test to see where I was at re:letting him go. Realizes that he still has so much control over me. Asks me, "When am I going to get it?" He's never coming back. He doesn't love me the way that I want him to...<p>Says we'll always be friends. Says he keeps me in his prayers each night. <p>Then attempts intimacy once again and again... I am so attracted to him that it's really hard to resist.<p>What is going on? The very reason I have hope is because of this behaviour. Funny thing is that I don't get angry or cry at all of this. I look at him calmly and look straight into his eyes, "I don't believe we are OVER." <p>Then he goes to get his shoes on to leave. I say to him, "I wish you didn't have to leave." He says, "Well, do you want me to stay and have some wild sex?" I say, "No, I wished you lived here. Then wild sex would come with it."<p>H reluctantly leaves, "Are you sure?" I open the door and say, "Yes". H turns around and says, "Get some rest. Lock the door and don't forget to turn the alarm on."<p>This is when I love him all over again. And realize that I've given into him again.

T- Your H reminds me so much of mine.. he wants sex and so do I... I have given in... and I have loved it... I want him home.. and feel that I should be strong like you and say no... to the sex... they do start to want it more than we do... and my counselor even told me I have that in my favor... he will really start to want it...<p>What else.... I read a book about men that says they feel rejected... just as much as we do when we approach them for sex and get turned down... so he does feel rejected.. but I think you were very clear... that it would come with his return to your home...<p>I have missed my H sooo much, that I have given in to him... and I have spent way too much time at his place.. since he doesn't even want to come over here... but he wants to spend more time at our home... when I don't go over there... <p>i have to say that sf with him is great... and I know it makes a man feel in love... so that is one reason I have done it ...it also makes me feel closer... but I do feel he starts to get this well,, hey I get to live over here.. have my wife, see my kids.. have more money to myself... attitude.. and it just starts to break me... <p>I think your h and my h will be back in our lives...if we keep up our good attitudes and strength- I can see his love for you in your posts... this is why he has been so angry...
My h has done the same ridiculous things... been mean as heck to me...t hey have to blame us... or they hate themselves so much they cannot face what they are doing... why else would they do this... and of course there is the issue of them (needy guys) not getting the same attention they did from us pre-mommy days.. not that we don;t want to be more "in-love" and spend more time with our h's.. but that we have little ones tugging on us... all the time... and there is only so much of us to go around...<p>I have tried to get this through my h's thick skull..<p>You will make it, be strong... I think your no sex.. until your back boundary is a good one.... and I do not like him telling you it is over... it is not... over... he will eventually change his words... My h's words are starting to change..<p>Last night and called and said he is closeby and not that far away... he even came by to ck on my broken fence.. .but my neighbor had already fixed it.... what do you think of that... ? this from a guy who had to get away from me at all costs???<p>thanks, and god bless you, hugs to you sweetie... be strong... I know it is hard.. to see them... it hurts every time h and I are apart now... but it is almost like those days when we missed each other so much we had to be together...?// more? ya know... I know he is missing you, just give it time... time and more time... he will come home.
believe this in your heart.. and have that confidence... do not let him know you know this.... laugh when he walks out the door and says it is over.. you know it is not...<p>hugs again, my friend... take care.
H

Honey, Thanks for responding. You sound good this morning. Hope that's true.<p>I will always cling to my beliefs that he will turn around and come home. Regardless of what he says. <p>And I hope that happens for you too. Thanks for your faith.

You are in a process. You will never be perfect. Don't be so hard on yourself. I hope you see the mistake as the part where you said "I don't believe we are OVER". IF that is not your mistake please tell me what you perceived it to be. <p>Next, why is it you are soooo attracted to him. For someone to treat you as he has been and you find it hard to resist him says something for your self esteem. Although, again, you are in process so give yourself a break at least you did resist. I am very proud of you on that one. You would've felt like dogpoop had you given in. <p>Are you in counseling?

Dear ILuV, Thanks for replying. There are SO many processes. Which is the one I'm in now? <p>So many mistakes...letting him know that he still has power, giving in to his touch even once, still yearning for him despite his abuse, asking him to come home...and knowing full well that he's not even close to wanting our marriage back.

Good, The fact that you recognise it is huge. Since you can see it happening you have a better chance of dealing with it better the next time.<p>Are you in counseling?

I think the BIG QUESTION you should be asking your H is "Why do you believe that I should be EMOTIONALLY ABUSED by you" Because that is what it appears that he get's a kick out of most, abusing you!<p>[ March 05, 2002: Message edited by: trying2_4give ]</p>

Dear ILuv, Yes, I'm in counselling.<p>Dear Trying, Good question. Why does he torment me? Any guesses?

Sweetie -- I'm glad you're here getting some answers!<p>I think you're getting stronger every day!
And I also think you're getting to the point where you recognize that he's playing games with you. <p>Turn the tables on him! Does he REALLY want you to prove that he has no control over you? What do you think his reaction to a Plan B or true detachment would be? What if you no longer let him hang around your house? What if you made some of his choices a reality?<p>I think a lot of what he's doing is playing games.
Put some boundries in place and make him stop messing with you.<p>Put yourself and your daughter FIRST -- you DESERVE IT!!! You are AWESOME!!

Why does he torment and abuse you?<p>1. Because you let him
2. Because there is absolutely no consequence for doing it.
3. Because he has absolutely not one ounce of respect for you.<p>The solution is incredibly simple. Don't let him do it anymore. You are way past due for Plan B. Your H has to respect you first before he can ever love you again. One thing you can insist on in all of this is respect for yourself. The $hit he is pulling is just disgusting. Why do you allow it?

Hi Lex, I hope you're doing well today. Thanks for checking in. I know they're games he's playing...that's why I don't cry with him anymore.<p>Because of what had happened the night before regarding my mention of someone else, he had to prove that he still had his effect on me. Wanted to see what stage I was at...what is that anyway??<p>Thanks for your encouragement. <p>Hi MB, You're so right. I do allow his behaviour without consequence. And I don't know why I allow it. I would never accept that kind of behaviour from anyone else.

Terri,<p>Some day you will look back, read these posts and the "creep factor" will kick in.<p>Frankly, your husband's emotional manipulation of you is developed to a sadistic art form. And once you see it, you will truly be ready to lock the door and turn on your internal alarms that will tell you that everything the man says and does is a lie. <p>At that point, there will be zero attractiveness to him in your eyes. Any "good looks" will be wasted and you will see the ugliness of his soul.<p>All you have to do is start looking and your emotional equilibrium will start to return, even when he's around.

Hi KA, Thanks for replying. But what if one remembers when the soul wasn't ugly?

<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by mthrrhbard:
Why does he torment and abuse you?<p>1. Because you let him
2. Because there is absolutely no consequence for doing it.
3. Because he has absolutely not one ounce of respect for you.<p>The solution is incredibly simple. Don't let him do it anymore. You are way past due for Plan B. Your H has to respect you first before he can ever love you again. One thing you can insist on in all of this is respect for yourself. The $hit he is pulling is just disgusting. Why do you allow it?<hr></blockquote><p>Terrified,<p>I see you are getting stronger but I have to echo what motherhubbard has said to you. Please re-read her post to you ... PLEASE!<p>And I also just have to say, your H is a real [censored].<p>Jo

T, I hear alot of the same stuff coming to you.. that i get when I post about how awful my H is... it is awful to be treated so horribly... by someone who once treated you like his princess.... ??? I really believe my H and yours have a big case of acting like they are 2... they throw temper tantrums... but in big boy style... it is sad.... <p>I think understanding who are h's are.... is one thing... that helps and hurts.. ... but that does not change that what they both are doing is abusive... <p>For me, it is sooo hard.. because just a few months back he was my loving husband.. and this strange person he has become is just nuts... !???! and I see it... more than he does... anyway... that does not mean what my h or yours does is right in any way... but it is just what they do... <p>You have the right to decide what to do and when to do it in your M.<p>Remember that... you know your H.<p>Do not let anyone here.. urge you into plan b or something you are not ready for... <p>I know my h needs distance... and some 180 action is good... as he does not see me as at all attractive... when I cry and tell him how much I "need" him....<p>But, mY h would be ok with a "D" if I was... right now... in fact I think a sign of me giving up on him... would help destroy the M... and bring us towards... it... sometimes it take s 1 to bring the other one home... or back... but... just be careful... you are the one who knows your H.. is what I am trying to say.<p>i know my H, and I know his temper tantrums... I do not like them... but I know he will come home..if I am the big person, I show him I love him, even at his ugliest... one day the rewards.. will be even more.. when he comes out of the fog... but I do try to distance, etc... when there is abuse..<p>I do not think your h is just playing you... I think he really misses you and wants you back... he just doesn't know it yet. I think he blames you, so that he can feel better about himself... maybe he is not acting 2, but 12? what do you think?<p>Hugs again, it will be ok... just take distance when needed, and stand your ground...<p>I know i am not an expert... and I take way too much crap from my h... problem is , he is a spoiled... baby... hope this situation will teach him to grow up... I just don't want to come out stinking instead of smelling like a rose.. when he comes to his senses..<p>Hugs, H

<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by Terrified:
<strong>Hi KA, Thanks for replying. But what if one remembers when the soul wasn't ugly?</strong><hr></blockquote><p>That's why it's hard and takes a while. But one of these days, he's going to be doing his ugly stuff, and you are going to see past the memories to what he's doing right in the here and now - and that's when you'll get the creeps and realize - he's not the man he was. <p>That's when you'll finally be free to grieve.<p>I have a friend who has a "Tombstone" process her therapist taught her. When someone dear to us dies, we place a marker to remember them by. She bought a porcelain figurine of a bride and groom, to remember what she had lost, to help her see and feel it, and to mourn it's loss. She wrote a eulogy and framed it - read it a few times until the eulogy and the figurine were the same - then she filed the eulogy in her journal. Looking back at the figurine of the happy couple, she's now able to look back and remember the happy times without crumbling with pain. It helped her to move on.

WOW, Dr. Phil just said something profound that you mention T...he said, the emotional abuse people put their mind in is by REMEMBERING the SPOUSE/EX HOW THEY WANTED THEM TO BE, NOT HOW THEY ACTUALLY ARE RIGHT NOW! Basically, dwell on what could of been or what should have been instead of accepting what is NOW.

Thanks for your replies. Jo, I hear you. I think that sometimes, I'm blown by my H's 180's. Never know where he's coming from...are they lies or not, is he for real or not, etc. Crazy stuff!<p>Honey, thanks, I used to think I really knew my H. The thing that bothers me now is that I'm not so sure that I ever really knew him if he can turn into this person, you know what I mean? Then I remember what a priest recently mentioned in a sermon, "you will hurt the ones you love the most". Strangely enough, I hang on to that. <p>KA, I agree that I must accept the here and now of who my H really is but the tombstone theory sounds like Divorce which I'm just not yet ready to face. <p>Trying, I'm definitely guilty of the creating the emotional abuse. Quite honestly, I'm becoming much more accepting of who he is NOW most of the time. However, it's when I see glimpses of his former self that it throws me off balance.<p>Thanks again to all of you for your insight.

T: Why do you continue to make so many mistakes?<p>Because you are human.<p>And you are so incredibly brave to post your story here, in such detail that we see both your faults and your strengths.<p>Guess what? Seeing your mistakes is the first baby step to eliminating them. A few months ago you wouldn't have seen them. This is one reason why progress is so hard. It's depressing to see them all and tempting to give up. I gave up last month, but now i'm ready to try again.

Terrified,<p>Thought I would share part of my conversation with Steve H. today. The subject was SF & here's what he told me - That it's hard to give direct guidelines, that if it feels right do it , if not that's ok. He went on to say that If I didn't feel comfortable having SF right now just to say that I don't feel connected to him & hope that we can regain that once more. I asked Steve if I should say wait till your back here & he thought that was manipulative. Don't use SF for leverage.<p>When I got through, I thought of this post. I hope this helps some.<p>God Bless<p> [img]images/icons/shocked.gif" border="0[/img] [img]images/icons/shocked.gif" border="0[/img] [img]images/icons/tongue.gif" border="0[/img] [img]images/icons/tongue.gif" border="0[/img]