Here's a question I keep mulling over, and I'd like some opinions. Is it possible to do everything you think is right in meeting your WS's needs and still have them have an A ? I, like many of you here was sandbagged by my W. I may be too dumb to read signs but she never gave me any indication that anything was wrong between us. I knew she was unhappy with other aspects of her life, but she always said we were great together. I think I have been a pretty good H and although I identified and corrected some things that I felt were wrong with me, I wonder if what she has said about it being her and not me isn't somewhat true. Care to comment ? especially WS's or anyone who has wondered this. This is not to absolve me of blame, just another attempt to understand and if this is possible how do you fix it ?

First of all, none of us are perfect, and our needs are always changing, so there's no way all of our EN's can be met at all times.<p>sooooo, <blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr>Is it possible to do everything you think is right in meeting your WS's needs and still have them have an A ? <hr></blockquote> YES.<p>Many of us were blind-sided. Sure, there were "signs" our WS's gave us to indicate there were some problems, but I doubt most WS's ever stepped up to the plate and said, "I am very unhappy. We need counseling and get some things fixed, or I can't be married to you anymore." My H is either a VERY good actor, or WAS happy in our marriage, cuz he sure SEEMED happy. We even went to a weekend Marriage Seminar in Feb. 2001, and renewed our vows! 2 months later his EA was going full swing, then turned PA and he was GONE!<p>I believe I fulfilled MANY of my H's EN's, and YES, he had an affair.<p>Were all MY EN's met??? Nope. Did I have an A? Nope.<p>Unmet needs are a PART of the formula leading to an A, but not the whole thing!<p>Here's my theory: (mathematical [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img] )
A Unmet needs (in ALL marriages)
+
B Oppurtunity (a willing OP) (happens to everyone)
+
C Lack of commitment/value on the marriage
=
AFFAIR<p>[ March 05, 2002: Message edited by: Faith1 ]</p>

Absolutely a WS can have an A even if all there needs are met.<p>If someone is bent on having an A, there is NOTHING you can do to stop it. <p>IMHO I think our marital issues with my H A is because he is insecure and to have me fulfilling all his needs of admiration, needs of SF and everything else, his own low self image of himself, he needed more. PLUS the abandonement issues he suffered as a child I think he always needed a back up plan for someone to love and support him in case I too abandoned him.<p>This weekend in counseling we spent an hour trying to find out what my H would like changed in our marriage. He couldn't come up with anything. Why, because to ask for something is to express you are vulnerable or in need and that was just too humbeling for him to do. I use to get angry about it, now it is just kinda sad. To feel you have no voice, no choices, no options.<p>And here is my new theory on life: <p>I am a success story. <p>What I have come out of rock bottom knowing is that it was all worth it for the person I am now. With or without my H I am totally complete and satisfied. That healthy mindset empowers me to set appropriate boundaries in my marriage and not settle for less than what I am worth. Even if we divorce 10 years from now I will not look back and say I wasted my life. Because I like who I have become. The icing on the cake is that my marriage is becoming better but it does not determine my success in life.

Mark,<p>My wife and I were blissfully happy, symbiotic, best friends and GREAT lovers. We used to say we r sick to be this in love. It is exactly how we felt. She will tell you exactly what she told me - "I was getting everything from you then, I never dreamed I could love like this". <p>Well, during this time she got an opportiunity to do a shopping trip in NYC. She then proceeded to seduce a man in a bar (could have been Ted freakin Bundy!) drove to his house after the second date the following day, and slept with him. Sick sh**<p>Her affair was about her need to crave and attract the attention of the opposite sex, and nothing to do with my not fulfilling her needs. She has a pattern of behaviour that left her wanting to get what she wants and to hell with everyone else. It is an emotional disorder I have come to find, and therefore an impulse control issue as well.<p>So to answer the question - YES an A can come out of the best and most fullfilling relationships - it happened to me.

At first I said yes there can be an A even if all needs are being met because I did everything in my power to meet her needs as best as I could and it still happened. <p>But that's not exactly true I guess... Her financial needs were not being met completely. I've worked since I was out of High School to support us. I've always made pretty good money, but with 2 kids and a mortgage, we needed better than pretty good money. So she had to start working part time as a waitress to supplement my income. Well that led to me not being able to meet other needs.<p>She enjoyed her job, great I thought. She made new friends, good for her I said. She enjoyed her job so much, it went from 2 to 3 nights a week to almost every night, I was glad she found pride and joy with her work, so I encouraged her to stick with it. <p>After that we never really saw each other, I worked all day, she worked all night. She got to where she'd rather go out with her friends after work instead of coming home and being a wife. She was around her manager(OM) much more than me. He made better money than me... well he had fewer expenses. I couldn't go out with her after work... somebody had to stay home with the kids. I couldn't spoil her like I wanted to with gifts and money... somebody had to pay the bills.<p>I did my best, I know I was a good husband, I know I did everything in my power to keep her happy. Not meeting that one need completely, led to our relationship crashing and burning. Things changed pretty quickly after our divorce, after OM started dating another married woman, after my XW was left to provide for herself. After she saw me(and our kids) moving on and doing quite well without her.<p>So I guess, even if we(BSs) are doing everything we know to fill needs, there's always room for improvement.<p>Oh yeah... before that d*** waitressing job, she always told me how happy she was, how great I was, how perfect our marriage was.

I would like to add my equation to the discussion that is my experience plus stuff I heard from Harley too to confirm it.<p>A Unmet needs (in all relationships)
+
B Oppurtunity (a willing OP) (happens to everyone)
+
C Not guarding your weak spots (that we all have)
=
AFFAIR<p>IE- everyone is capable of having an affair IF they do not ensure that their ever changing needs are known by both themselves and their partners, they have an opportunity, and do not protect themselves from opportunities by not exposing their weaknesses and unmet needs to be met by anyone but their spouse.<p>Many people have unmet needs- I would venture to say all. We all have opportunities in this life that are what we make of them. We all send signals that we are available or not, make decisions on whom to open up to and whom not to, who we will let meet our needs and who we will not. Not everyone understands how to be in love and be committed and how to stay that way. It is not known from birth, it is learned.<p>It is NOT, and I must say this as clearly as possible so you will understand, implied by this site, Steve Harley, or myself in ANY way that YOU are to blame for the affair. YOU ARE NOT.<p>Where you meeting her every need? Probably not.<p>Was she meeting your every need? Probably not.<p>Are there things you can do to try to save your marriage and make it stronger. Yes. <p>Can you make your marriage stronger and completely affair proof alone? No.<p>Are you in control of her decisions in any way shape or form? NO.<p>Could a person who has all their needs met have an affair? :<p>First off I doubt anyone on this earth ever had all their needs met every day of every year of their life. That is because our needs change. Sometimes we don't even realize they changed right away. Needs are not concious decisions, and they are not fixed for life from birth. Examples: A wife who has always stayed home with the children goes to work or to school. She develops a need for greater domestic support that she didn't have before. A husband who has always worked for a living decides to start a new business venture on his own might find an increased new need for financial support from his wife. A spouse who suddenly finds themselves stressed out by demands at work might feel a big increase in the need for recreational companionship they didn't realize or need as much before.<p>It is our job and resposiblity to recognize the new need and get it met. Sometimes our partners do not respond or see the new need. It is then still our choice. We can if we have learned how use stuff like POJA, Honesty, Time, and continue to try until we get the need met from our spouse, or we can see an opportunity to easily meet it somewhere else and take it. It is not always so obvious at the time to everyone as it is with hindsight and or learning, the results of the later.<p>Spouses are usually sandbagged by affairs when they are equally unaware of changing needs in life and in their partners, and the importance of trying to ferret them out and fill them. There's nothing in it for our takers until you learn that that is the key, that is how we get our needs met, that's how we feel and receive lasting love.<p>In any event, even IF a person knows this, it is not their fault they did not know how the other person felt or what they needed. Sometimes it is happens that the OP is just not willing to allow you to meet that need for them. Or they have the silly notion that if they loved me they would know or they would do this, and they never let on because it just wouldn't fit their idea of "romance". We can sure try, but none of us are mind readers, and none of us are perfect, and ALL of us have takers too. <p>Think it over. [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img]