I was wondering if we might start a thread of the actual process of Step Four. Please outline some questions for beginning to take the inventory of ourselves and how to proceed along.<p>I think this might be helpful to many.
Thanks....<p>[ March 14, 2002: Message edited by: Susan ]</p>

Would step four apply to D folks too?

Yes, I am sure it would be helpful for ANYONE to take an inventory of themselves... [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img] We certainly won't exclude divorced people.

Susan,<p>I just wanted to drop in and say Hello. I haven't posted to you in a long time, but someone brought up a post from 1999, when we were posting to one another.<p>I hope that things are going well with you.<p>God Bless,<p>JL

JL, Hello to you too! We've been here a long time...huh...<p>How interesting...and what may I ask, exactly were we posting (that was beneficial enough to bring back up)?<p>Things are going good for me including my marriage. We had a painful two years of IC and MC, but in the long run it was worth all of the effort and hard work.<p>I look back many times now at myself and think "who WAS that girl????" I am happy to be where I am now!<p>[ March 14, 2002: Message edited by: Susan ]<p>[ March 14, 2002: Message edited by: Susan ]</p>

Bump for Rosie Posie [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img]

^ bump ^ where is she?<p>Does anyone want to do this?

Hi Susan,<p>Well, someone was looking for my story and as it turns out, it was you that asked for it back then. [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img] So who comes out of the mists of time, but you and my responses. I really cannot believe that someone found it. Talk about nosey!! [img]images/icons/grin.gif" border="0[/img] <p>Hope you all get this thread going and congratulations on getting your marriage back and in a place you are happy with it.<p>God Bless,<p>JL

Yes, you were very helpful to me "way back then". It seemsed everyone loved and appreciated your advice, but NO ONE asked about "YOU". I guess I was the nosey one. I wanted to know your story and your journey in life.<p>Good to know others are still curious and "nosey" like I was. I think it speaks well of you and your influence that they are interested.<p>Looks like there is not much interest in this Fourth Step inventory. Thanks...

one last bump? [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img]

Hi Susan - sorry it took me so long to reply - I've not been here for a couple of days.<p>I've got my inlaws coming over for my H's birthday party today, so I can't reply now, but I'll get back to you.

Ok, I'm back! <p>I think its great that you would like to do a 4th step. For me, my first 4th and 5th step resulted in a great deal of personal insight, growth and healing. <p>But, the reason WHY that 4th and 5th step worked so well for me was because I had done all of the work on the first three steps before hand. I was going to regular Al-Anon meetings, both face to face and online, I had a sponsor, and I had done quite a bit of writing and work through the first three steps; thats why the steps are numbered 1-12 and thats why they are in the order that they are.<p>I wish to goodness I could just take the results of that hard work and just give it to you and to others on this board. But unfortunately, its a personal journey that just can't be handed out the easy way! [img]images/icons/frown.gif" border="0[/img] <p>I could, easily, post a great deal of material and questions for a 4th step moral inventory. And I fear that if I did this, the result would actually be far more harm for you and for others than it would be beneficial.<p>Why? Because without the benefit of actively working the first three steps, and without the loving wisdom and guidance of a sponsor, a forth step could easily turn into a tool for self-abuse. If I had not had my sponsor to consult and talk to while writing my 4th step, I would have beaten myself up quite badly for being a bad person. Not only did she keep me on the path of treating myself with gentleness, she kept me on the path of reality, and kept me from taking responsibility for things that were not mine to own. And besides...a 4th step is a moral inventory - which means bad as well as good. I would have focused on the bad, and not seen anything good in myself. With her help, I was able to identify wonderful things about myself that I had never recognized.<p>I am afraid, that there are many who would attempt a 4th step on their own, taking a 'short-cut' if you will, and end up angry and frustrated because the results would be less than expected, precisely because the short-cut had been taken.<p>The 12-steps are NOT a 'self'-help program. It is not a program to be worked alone, in isolation of our own thoughts, without the support, input, guidance, wisdom and love of others.<p>If you are really serious about doing serious recovery work that includes the 4th step moral inventory, I'd really encourage you to seek out an Al-Anon meeting (if you are affected by the disease of alcoholism in someone else) or at the very least, a Co-dependents Anonymous meeting (every BS here qualifies as a co-dependent to their affair addicted spouse). Get a sponsor and do the work. You will be so very glad you did! I know that I will be forever grateful to the woman who spent many frustrated hours with my stubborn refusal to "get it" while I cried on the phone to her.<p>Even though I won't post a bunch of 4th step questions here, what I will do is give you some ideas for reading material that might help.<p>Chapter 5 of the Big Book of AA has one method of doing a 4th step. You can read that chapter online at http://www.recovery.org/aa/bigbook/ww/chapter_5.html<p>Al-Anon has a 4th step workbook called: Blueprint for Progress and you can order it online at: http://www.al-anon.org/catalog5.html<p>There's no one right way to do a 4th step (except with a sponsor!). My sponsor actually had me do something else entirely, and it worked wonders for me. Different sponsors will have different methods, so its mostly just important to find a sponsor that has something you want, that you are drawn to. <p>But if you are not willing to join a 12-step program and get a sponsor, there are lots of recovery books available that can help you in your self-assessment.<p>Sarah Ban Breathnach: Something More: Excavating Your Authentic Self is great.<p>Any of the books by Melody Beattie (Co-dependent No More, Beyond Codpendency, and The Language of Letting Go) are all good too.<p>I hope this helps.<p>[ March 16, 2002: Message edited by: BrambleRose ]</p>

I think in the encyclopedia they have my picture under "spousal co-dependent".<p>How would one go about seeking out and hooking-up with a Co-dependent's Anonymous meeting?<p>I live in the Pacific Northwest, Eastern Washington, Gig Harbor. <p>Jo

Resilient, <p>For Co -dep. anonymous -check the meetings scheduled section of your local newspaper.<p>FOR EVERYONE<p>Here's a non 12 step step life sucess program: <p>web page Life Success Intl<p>I do 12 step program, mentor program and prayer group.

Well, if this link works right, Resilient, it will give you a list of meetings in Washington State. I don't know if any are close but it's likely not a complete list you could call one of the contacts for more info.<p>CODA<p>I'd really suggest you take BrambleRose's advice and try Alanon. You know, you don't have to be married to an alcoholic to attend. Perhaps one of your parents, or even grandparents were alcoholic. Maybe your child. <p>My father was alcoholic and I'm a recovering addict myself, but I went to Alanon after dday when no one had used alcohol for many years. I had no trouble fitting in, and it was a big help.
David

Well, I've been out...I had guests for dinner. Sorry it took me so long to see reply, but thanks for replying...<p>Wow..I never thought of it that way..and yes, I think I would like to attend Al-Anon...except, that I am in no way associated with an alcoholic. I just think that so much of what you learn there is healthy living regardless! <p>Thank you for taking the time to reply and I'm sorry that it is not cut and dried and something we could address here on the board. Maybe I too was hoping you would be my sponsor. [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img]

I have been attending Alanon for the past year. I don't think that I have an Alcoholic in my life, but I think that the program is the best thing that has ever happened to me.
I have been one HUGE co-dependant. I had NO idea that I was untill I went to my first meeting. It hit me like a brick.<p>It's true that I came here because my Daughter is an OW. Between the principals of MB and Alanon, I found out how I contrubuted to the problem.<p>I can't thank the program and my sponser, who is 15yrs younger and light years ahead of me, enough.<p>I have learned that:
angry outbursts push people away and give the person justifcation to be MAD at me,<p>disrespectfully judgements DON'T teach<p>I am NOT my daughters higher power <p>I have robed my Daughter of lessons she will still have to learn<p>I am NOT her teacher, God has someone else in mind<p>She will get it in God's time NOT mine<p>I am powerless over her in all ways <p>The list goes on and on and on.

Thank you gottruth...I think that I may find a meeting and go.<p>Meanwhile, when I tried to open the copy of Chaper 5 of the Big Book, I could not read it. It looks like lots of little boxes...not letters.<p>Could someone that can read it, copy and paste it and email it to me? Thanks. <p>email: SlmDav@aol.com

I got the book Self Matters this past weekend. It is FANTASTIC...I can't get it away from my husband so that I can read it! We are just at the beginning, but I hope that he gives good solutions. So far he has discribed in colorful detail the symptoms!!! now if we can just get to the results...