H and I talked last night until about 2 am - The first time in a while that he has been willing to do this - I got alot of my questions answered but dont really know what to make of the answers: Maybe some of you can shed some light on these for me:<p>His A ended 2 months ago - they still work together but have not been seeing or talking (at least that I know of)- I asked H what OW did for him that I didn't, what she had that I dont - His answer: we are very much alike, have a lot of the same interest, they were friends for 3 years before the A and just have alot in common.<p>He said that he is miserable with him life right now and cant work on us until he works on himself - that he thought life would be different at this point. He wanted to know why i love him, told me that I should have thrown him out a long time ago, that he is an A**Hole. I told him that I can explain why I love him or why I was with him and that we have been together for 12 years and that I loved him for who he is. A good, caring Man (at least he was up until 2 months ago)<p>He told me that he is just living life one day at a time right now and couldnt give me more than that - I told him I needed more - We have 2 kids to think about, summer vacations to plan, things like that - I need to be able to wake up in the morning and not have to worry that if I do or say the wrong thing today that he might just not be there when I get home - That I was tired of being afraid all the time. He told me not to worry about him but to take care of myself and that he wasn&#8217;t going anyplace, anytime soon. <p>I guess this is good - its all very confusing to me - His words say one thing yet his actions say another - <p>So finally about 2 am he asks me if I want to have sex? That maybe it will shut me up - so we do and it&#8217;s very good and yes it shuts me up. Then again this morning he wants sex - ok I'll take it but for some reason it confuses me even more. Ahhh... the frustration level just keeps rising.<p>sorry this is so long...hopefully it is understandable.... [img]images/icons/confused.gif" border="0[/img]

RDV - Count the blessings that he was willing to talk, willing to answer your questions, and that it went well (no LB, no fighting, etc.). Sounds like he needs to work on a Plan A - himself too here. He needs to do some soul searching and gain some self-esteme and start to like himself again. I see things here that I went through when beginning to really work, seek answers, etc. I think this may be a wonderful step forward. Don't try to read too much into it all. Think of it as progress. Remember, listen to what he says and accept that you can know the answers, but may never fully understand because you cannot relate (as you would not do this). As for the comment about you and the OW being a lot alike, and him thinking he'd be somewhere else in life right now, I think I can bring that into a better perspective for you. The OW was on borrowed time. She was a lot like you, but when he was with her it was living all the fantasy with none of the responsibility. We all have an idea of what lies ahead when we start our own lives, get married, have kids, whatever. Very seldom does it go exactly as we planned. However, some of us are able to realize that even though the path there isn't the same, the final destination really is. Those people embrace the changes as something good and how it is supposed to be, possibly with a twist. Others, like your husband (and myself), for some reason can't get past the different path. We see this changes path and reject it as "this isn't how things are supposed to be". We get so hung up on rejection instead of embracing this good, that we fail to see that the end result is still the same and in fact is wonderful and possibly better than we had imagined. With a little time, effort, and support, I think your husband will eventually see this and begin to see that his life really is where he wanted it, that it is beautiful, and what his heart was seeking has been right in front of him the whole time. <p>I hope this helps and makes sense. It is a lot to find these answers for ourselves, and even more difficult to not only explain them, but simpy admit them to our spouse. It's very humbling, and makes us feel vulnerable. It is a wonderful step in the right direction, and I feel you husband is getting to the point that he is ready to take that step. Maybe suggest this site to him, or some books - if you think he'd be interested. You are doing a great job. I wish you both the best of luck. Take care.

Tutter - <p>I have gotten alot from your posts - I always look for your questions and answers. My H has read HNHN's and I printed a bunch of stuff about SAA, which he also read - He hasnt said much to me about it (only that he read it) but I think he understands that the A was his way of dealing with things when they got tough - and things were tough - We had been living with my parents, in the basement with 2 kids and 3 dogs, for a year and 3 months when all this started - I was trying to keep everyone happy and missed all the signals that something was wrong, looking back I now realize I should have seen this, but... my H has never been an affeciante person, he was very abused as a child and all he has even seen in his life it when the going gets tough - you leave! I'm trying to prove to him that I'm here to stay and that no matter what he does he is not going to be able to push me away.<p>I have always been a half full kind of person -always looking for the good and he is a half empty person, only seeing the bad [img]images/icons/mad.gif" border="0[/img] <p>I hope your right that with time he will see that this is what he wants

He told me that he is just living life one day at a time right now and couldnt give me more than that - I told him I needed more - We have 2 kids to think about, summer vacations to plan, things like that - <p>The vacations are irrelevant. Forget about them. They are not important. Saving your marriage is. Your kids will still be there when you wake up the next morning. Raise them well. Your recovery has little to do with them.<p>I need to be able to wake up in the morning and not have to worry that if I do or say the wrong thing today that he might just not be there when I get home - <p>You can't have that. None of us has such a guarantee. Take each day as a blessing and live in the present, not a negative future. Neither of you can give the other the committment you likely want. And, honestly, what committment could he give you that would mean anything? I have been pushing my wife to have a recommittment ceremony. What is the point? A marriage ceremony was not enough to secure committment, a recommittment ceremony certainly won't do it either. Only time and consistant behavior will help you to feel/see his committment. Neither of you should be asking for more from the other person that they are willing/can give. Love Busting / Selfish Demands.<p>So finally about 2 am he asks me if I want to have sex? That maybe it will shut me up - so we do and it&#8217;s very good and yes it shuts me up. Then again this morning he wants sex - ok I'll take it but for some reason it confuses me even more. Ahhh... the frustration level just keeps rising.<p>Men have sex to reconnect. It is one of the ways most of us feel loved. If you are willing, meet his need for sexual fulfillment. That is likely how HE feels that you are committed to him. He is not the only one that is probably scared of the future.<p>It looks like the two of you are off to a good start. Take it slow with no demands and little expectations and I think you can make it. Start by being kind to each other. Grace is a great foundation for any relationship.

I have been reading a book called: Healing for Damaged Emotions, by David A. Seamands. Your husband may find it beneficial. I think it has helped me a lot, and I believe it will help my husband too. It helps with past and present things that are underlying issues that still cause you pain, etc. (e.g. childhood abuse). I was never abused, but my husband was. It is helping me along as a person, contributing to constructive rebuilding, and I believe it will help my husband with some inner peace, self-esteem, and generally liking himself. I wish you the best. Take care.

I will look for that book tonight - I find if I want him to read something all I need to do is leave it out and he has been reading it - He said it was his way of knowing how I'm thinking. He tells me he doesnt care what I do or what I think right now and that he doesnt want me to worry about him but I know if I stopped it would bother him.<p>I try very hard not to LB but when H pulls away or stops talking to me I get so frightened I start to push - He has told me again and again that he knows I love him and that I will be there for him but I need to give him his space to figure out what he wants. I'm trying very hard to understand, accept and do this but it seems the more frightened I get the harder I hold on and the more he pulls away.<p> [/QUOTE]vacations are irrelevant. Forget about them. They are not important. Saving your marriage is. Your kids will still be there when you wake up the next morning. Raise them well. Your recovery has little to do with them. <blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr> <hr></blockquote><p>Your right - I shouldnt worry about these things - but I'm trying to keep life as normal as I can for the girls - They are wonderful and deserve a happy and wonderful life and with our recovery they can and will be much better off - Our girls are the one thing that keeps me going and the only thing he says he really cares about right now. <p>I'm willing to (and always have been )and want to have sex whenever he wants - His commented to me yesterday that I have never been the one to iniate these things and I told him thats true because I was always afaird of him rejecting me but now that I know this has bothered him I will try and be more agressive. (I guess this is yet another EN I wasnt meeting) [img]images/icons/rolleyes.gif" border="0[/img]

I try very hard not to LB but when H pulls away or stops talking to me I get so frightened I start to push - He has told me again and again that he knows I love him and that I will be there for him but I need to give him his space to figure out what he wants. I'm trying very hard to understand, accept and do this but it seems the more frightened I get the harder I hold on and the more he pulls away.<p>I do the exact same thing; so does my wife. She wants her space, I want to push and crowd her. We have to give them the freedom to be their own person or guess what? They will take that freedom for themselves. We are not our spouses. They are not us. We cannot expect them to act as we would.<p>Your right - I shouldnt worry about these things - but I'm trying to keep life as normal as I can for the girls - They are wonderful and deserve a happy and wonderful life and with our recovery they can and will be much better off - <p>Life can be "normal" for your girls by showing them how two people can be kind to each other. Your girls don't "see" the committment or lack of. They would likely see two people that love each other. They will be better off with your recovery. Give it a chance to happen. [img]images/icons/wink.gif" border="0[/img] This is a slow process. Things will never be "normal" again as you once knew them. That can be a good thing.<p>I'm willing to (and always have been )and want to have sex whenever he wants - His commented to me yesterday that I have never been the one to iniate these things and I told him thats true because I was always afaird of him rejecting me but now that I know this has bothered him I will try and be more agressive. (I guess this is yet another EN I wasnt meeting)<p>Don't be hard too on yourself. [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img] I want my FWW to be more aggressive as well. I want to feel desired, to feel that she is attracted to me and that she wants to please me and in turn, be please by me. I can only imagine that most if not all men feel this way.<p>I recommend the two of you read After the Affair. Near the back of the book are excellent exercises for the two of you on sexual desires. One of the exercises helps you to create an agreement as to how often it will occur and who will initiate. My wife and I use it currently.

Gota love this slow process - I know the M didnt break down overnight so its going to take a lot of work to get it back and I know this is going to sound weird - but we are actually talking more, having sex more and being nicer to each other - if anyone who didnt know what was going on in my H's head saw us they would think we have a wonderful realtionship. I have to believe that we are going to have a better and stonger marriage after all this is over - unfortunately I dont think my H is at the point of believing it yet (Hopefully he'll get there at some point). [img]images/icons/wink.gif" border="0[/img] <p>Its truly amazing to me the things I'm finding out that have bothered my H for the past 10 years - Its like he has bottled all this stuff inside until he busted and couldnt take it anymore - I'm the type of person If something is bothering me I'll let you know - but yet he just keep everything bottled. <p>We have to give them the freedom to be their own person or guess what? They will take that freedom for themselves. We are not our spouses. <p>I'm just now starting to get this - its harder than I would think it should be, I'm hopeing with regained trust that it will get easier [img]images/icons/frown.gif" border="0[/img]

I'll start with the "agressive" thing. I think Mr. Bunky is right - it must be a man thing. Plus, us women don't usually realize we are (or should I say aren't) doing this. My husband has mentioned the same thing to me. Actually, now that you are aware of it, you will find it's not the hard to adjust. At least, that was my experience. Now, I think we both do our share of initiating.<p>I try very hard not to LB but when H pulls away or stops talking to me I get so frightened I start to push - He has told me again and again that he knows I love him and that I will be there for him but I need to give him his space to figure out what he wants. I'm trying very hard to understand, accept and do this but it seems the more frightened I get the harder I hold on and the more he pulls away.<p>Explain this to him this way. Let him know that you are trying not to push, but this is why. . . Then work on you and your thinking. Don't overanalyze it. It's possible that perhaps he's uncertain as to exactly what's bothering him, or what's on his mind. Suggest to him that if this is the case then maybe he could try saying something like - "yes something is on my mind, but I'm not really sure what." This will let you know it's nothing specific, allow you to relax about it, and allow him time to figure it out. You in turn should acknowledge it and let him know that when he figures it out you are there for him if he wants to talk about it. When you feel frightened, don't push, use that energy to help him to feel comfortable. Say, rub his feet, hug him, cuddle on the couch - you get the idea. Use your actions to say I care, I'm here, but it doesn't seem as pushy as words. If he doesn't talk, respect that. I'm sure you have moments when you just simply can't put something to words, or don't want to talk at that moment for whatever reason. Don't take it personal. Simply stay positive, and continue to work on you. My counselor told me that when I see something is wrong and ask, if he doesn't tell me it is no longer my problem - he now owns it all alone. I still have a hard time practicing that, but just thought I'd share it.<p>Good luck to you, and take care.

Its truly amazing to me the things I'm finding out that have bothered my H for the past 10 years - Its like he has bottled all this stuff inside until he busted and couldnt take it anymore - I'm the type of person If something is bothering me I'll let you know - but yet he just keep everything bottled. <p>I think your H and my wife are related. [img]images/icons/rolleyes.gif" border="0[/img] [img]images/icons/wink.gif" border="0[/img] <p>I'm just now starting to get this - its harder than I would think it should be, <p>Heck ya it is! It drives me batty.

sorry- I wasnt around yesterday - Had a killer headache and H came home with some Interesting news.<p>He just rejoined the Amry Reserve and is being sent away for a month, leaving next friday and then when he gets home on May 25th he will only be home for a week and then leaves again for 2 weeks - I'm not sure if this is good or not. The good thing is that maybe it will give him the time to realize that he does love me and the kids and want our M to work and it gets him away from OW (the still work together) but the scary part is the money - we are just making our bills now and he will be makeing about 1/2 of what he is now - plus... what if he decides that he loves being away from us and doesnt come home... I'm just very frightened of the whole thing. I'm trying to be very supportive and not let him see that I'm frightened but its so hard.