Dear MB'ers,
Contrary to what many of you believed last time ... I did not post here to boast nor to demean anyone in anyway.
I am sure that many of you may have been able to see that it was an exchange of information. You as spouses had information that I was privledged to gain insight to and in return, seeing the pain that many of you expressed in not seeing into the "darkened" side of your significant others affair I shared the working from the other side with you.
My intention then as it is still was simply that... an exchange of information. Thinking that maybe we could all learn something about ourselves and the situations that we found ourselved in in the process.
At that time, I did listen to you all, but any decision that I made was made before I logged onto MB ... at that time I had decided to end the affair ... which I did ... I ended it in December.
However, ending the affair and NO CONTACT only intensified our feeleing for each other. Now, we have decided that we are going to be togehter and he will be filing for divorce.
I am sharing this information with you now to show that each situation is different. We did as all MB'er suggested as all the books suggested to reunify his marriage ... but what happened was it clarified how unhappy he was and how happy we were together. We had no contact for over 4 months ... none ... but every waking and sleeping thought was about the love we shared with each other .... Again the reason for this is to maybe help someone there see that there ARE NO PAT formulas for this kind of thing. Do not blindly follow what someone or some methods is telling you .... follow your hearts.

4 months isn't long enough, IMO. And(sorry, but I've gotta say it) wrong is wrong is wrong no matter how much time passes.<p>at peace

Oh god...are you ever in for fun...<p>Yea, I went through that too. OM and I spent 6 months apart and when we got together it was all better and hotter than ever. Then, once we almost got all we were trying to get...reality seeped in. It is NOT POSSIBLE to work on a marriage, nor to judge a marriage when your head is still focusing on a fantasy life with someone else. It's more likely that the last 4 months were spent sabotaging the relationship so that it would be "ok" to walk out with minimal guilt. The old "I tried, I really did try". NOT. I was the wayward spouse, I absolutely insisted that I was trying...and I woke up 2 weeks before our divorce was final and realized that I hadn't let go of my stubborn, pigheaded pride and anger long enough to REALLY let my H in.<p>I am afraid you are headed for the worst kind of heartbreak...the deserved kind. Atleast when someone SINGLE dumps you, you can blame them. But when you apply for the job of doormat...well then, only person you can blame is yourself.<p>I know you think you are right and that your love will carry you through, because your situation is different and you'll show all of us know-it-alls....but you aren't and you won't. I'm sorry for your future pain...and more so for the pain that you're causing others. Karma...it's a *****.<p>Take care.

Hailey,<p>Every situation may be different, but the principles never change. Just because you and your married man have decided to follow your "heart" and get together does not mean that it's right or a good solution. Look at the wreckage that has been left in your paths. Your type of relationships are almost always doomed for failure [90% failure rate] because what is started in deceit almost always ends that way. If he was unfaithful to his wife, he will be unfaithful to you - count on it. And vice versa.<p>Also, following one's "heart" is not usually the wisest path to follow. Emotions can often be very misleading and decisions based upon one's ever changing emotions are very bad ones. Best to make decisions using logic and reason and principles. Best to try and be a thinker and use your mind instead. Just think, Ted Bundy followed his "heart" and it told him to commit multiple murders.

let me clarify ... I did not mean that MM and I were going t "follow our heart" I ment that each person should trust what their heart tells them about their situation ... if that's fight ... fight like your heart and intuition says fight... trust YOURSELF .... I am trying to say ... trust yourself .... don't try to follow what some guru tells you to do with whatever it is going on in your life ... YOU are the authority... do what YOUR intuition say to do. That's what I'm trying to say.

Hope, you are so very right. It is impossible to truly work on your marriage if you still hold on to fantasy's about OP. I have gotten past that point, and hindsight makes that very clear. OM and I would not have lasted, I really knew very little about being around him all the time, I didn't know what side of him I was getting. I know he snowed me with a lot of BS early on to get me hooked. I do know that now that my head is out of the clouds, I see what I have and I don't want to lose it. I love my H, and my D, and I want us together as a family.

<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr>I am sharing this information with you now to show that each situation is different. We did as all MB'er suggested as all the books suggested to reunify his marriage ... but what happened was it clarified how unhappy he was and how happy we were together. We had no contact for over 4 months ... none ... but every waking and sleeping thought was about the love we shared with each other .... Again the reason for this is to maybe help someone there see that there ARE NO PAT formulas for this kind of thing. Do not blindly follow what someone or some methods is telling you .... follow your hearts. <hr></blockquote><p>Hailey,<p>Four months is not long enough for serious withdrawal to be over, and it doesn't appear that you were in any good marriage counseling to help you.<p>I'll tell you what---come back in 10 years and tell us what a success your (planned) marriage is. You haven't proved anything at this point. I've got $100 that says the two of you won't survive three years together. This is sad but true---and why for the most part, the "pat formulas" actually work well, when applied correctly. You are very likely to end up as a failed affair statistic.

<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by hailey:
<strong>let me clarify ... I did not mean that MM and I were going t "follow our heart" I ment that each person should trust what their heart tells them about their situation ... if that's fight ... fight like your heart and intuition says fight... trust YOURSELF .... I am trying to say ... trust yourself .... don't try to follow what some guru tells you to do with whatever it is going on in your life ... YOU are the authority... do what YOUR intuition say to do. That's what I'm trying to say.</strong><hr></blockquote><p>And Hailey, again I will reiterate that following one's "heart" or intuition is not a very good course to follow. <p>And yes, we are all the "authority" in our lives, and we do have the authority to make bad or stupid decisions. One shouldn't trust themselves if they have bad judgement and poor reasoning abilities or are unprincipled. Best to use logic, reason and sound judgement based on principles rather than fleeting emotions or "intuition." One who bases their decisions on unfiltered intuition or emotions has very poor judgement and poor decision making abilities. Which is evidenced with your involvement with a married man and the subsequent break-up of his family.

Hailey - I wish you the best in your life; we all deserve that. I will not offer my thoughts against your choices, as they will do no good. I will not offer my support, because that would be false. I will offer my wishes that you never have to suffer the pain BS are suffering around you.<p>One thing. Have you thought about this man's wife? Have you thought about what he did or didn't do to see if his marriage was worth it? I can't help but to think of this poor woman as sitting there, knowing what she knows, trying not to care so as not to really get hurt, but - now here's the best part of this image - when he is gone and the kids (if there are any) are asleep, she's sitting and looking at old pictures (wedding pictures, family pictures, etc.), maybe even watching home videos, crying her eyes out because her HEART is so in love with this man. She has this unconditional love for him, and she can't help but wonder what she did wrong. What she could have done different to make a difference. Do you honestly think he gave it a chance?<p>You will do your own thing, and again I wish you well in your choices. I still can't help but feel for this woman.

I agree to a point ... but I'm afraid I'm still not making myself clear. I have just been reading here and see that there are all these plans and proceedures that everyone is trying to follow and I'm afraid it's giving people false hope ... like saying if you do A then B will follow ... and the truth is "not always" not always ... and we end up spinning our wheels and then blaming ourselves like it's all our fault ... we say ... we did everything that our guru of the moment suggested ... we followed our plans to A tee and still the outcome we so feared has now come upon us ... and then we beat ourselves up asking "why" and we think it was something that WE did ... I just believe that we have become a nation of followers .... regardless of the cause. We follow for what we hope someone else can help us with ... for what we hope that someone else is an expert on... for what we hope that someone else knows better than us .... and we have forgotten that we don't need to follow .... that we do know our way.... and that not always does our path look like we know where we are going but we trust in God that he knows where we are going .... that's all... I see a lot of dissapointment here because people are not trusting themselves for their answers... but trusting plans and schemes .... I think this place is great for support .... and that the majority of people here are very sincere in wanting to help each other ... but don't give your power away .... If what you have to go by is the bible, your holy book if you are of another religion, your prayers, your family, your friends, and most of all yourself ... listen to what you hear in the silence ... when you ask .... then trust it .... just don't give your power away.

hailey -- if you were so sure of yourself, the last thing you would do is post here looking for validation.<p>You knew full well how much pain your post would bring to people still hoping their WS will wake up. Hope you enjoyed it.<p>I think you meant to go to this site: http://www.gloryb.com<p>Good luck. You're going to need it.<p>Psycho_B***h

Hailey - I don't really see anyone giving power away. I see a lot of people trying to make their marriages work because, now here is the kicker, THEY WANT TO, and THAT'S WHAT THEIR HEART IS SAYING. <p>What about HIS wife. What about her heart and what her heart is saying. Could it be possible her heart said to love this man, stand by his side, forgive his mistake, work with him to help it to work. How did her heart lead her wrong? It's not about principles, ideas, and/or plans failing because we aren't following our own thinking. Yes, plans fail, principles don't work the same, but just because you are working with advice from others, and plans already build, doesn't mean you are giving your power away. It simply says you are using your choices to take this information and apply how you think will help you best to "follow your heart".<p>JMHO

psycho - That is exactly why I have posted. I hope that those who are tainted by her post, can also gain some hope through mine. I am a WS, and I have, as you put it, "woken up". I see your pain in you message, but there is hope, and you hope all you want, because I know dreams can come true.

"Don't give your power away" ...... I agree ... and I would ADD this: Don't give your power OR your integrity away ... don't use your power to harm others.... OR to undermine your own values and ethics. Don't use your power for your own good if if destroys the good of another ... because, in the end, you destroy your own GOODNESS.<p>
Yes .... power to DO WHAT IS GOOD AND RIGHTEOUS is indeed a worthy goal.<p>You get it?<p>Pepper [img]images/icons/cool.gif" border="0[/img]<p>[ April 18, 2002: Message edited by: Pepperband ]</p>

K - I'd like a piece of this. I see your $100, and raise you another $100 that it'll be less than two years.

Hey WAT,<p>If we extend this bet to a 10 year timeframe, I'd be willing to put $10K on it...<p>That's what MY voice tells me, in the silence...<p> [img]images/icons/grin.gif" border="0[/img]

<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by K:
<strong>That's what MY voice tells me, in the silence...<p></strong><hr></blockquote><p>I'm a little concerned with the voices you hear in your head.<p>Lay down on this couch. Now look at this ink blot. What do you see?<p>AH, Corpse on tractor, eh? <p>Okay, I see it now. <p>Diagnosis: Dying to get outside!!!!

Hailey (although this post goes more to everyone who actually uses this site):<p>Plan A and Plan B are, among other things, personal growth plans (focused on behavior) to use when battling an affair. They do not guarantee success for restoration of the marriage. But if done well, they almost invariably guarantee success of the person using them---that they will deal with whatever outcome they face in a courageous and moral fashion, and that they will not "hurt" as much should the marriage end. Recovery from the pain of divorce will be quicker. And they will have skills to aid them in finding a new spouse (should they choose to) and making their marriage a success.<p>You, on the other hand, advocate "do what feels good". You have learned nothing. It's very easy to predict that you will fail over and over and over again, until you learn basic relationship skills and behaviors.

K... I just love your posts.<p>Hailey... follow your heart and it will lead you down the garden path everytime... everytime... everytime... and you will never be satisfied... because you seek OUTSIDE of you to FULFILL you.<p>Cali

Sheryl,<p>I do smell diesel fumes in my sleep...<p> [img]images/icons/grin.gif" border="0[/img] <p>(I'm having lots of fun---I've used my tractor to mow, move brush, carry logs and mulch, scrape a safety area for a bonfire, as a big hammer for fence posts, and as a dustpan).