Okay, here goes. I haven't posted a new topic yet, but I really need some feedback tonight. <p>My story in a nutshell is my H had an affair about a year ago, there has been on/off contact in the form of an EA. I am in counseling and that is helping me, I feel more and more we are moving to recovery, but as I am reading there needs to be NO contact with OW for recovery to start. <p>Here's my dilema. H is telling me more now when there is contact and he doesn't want to talk with her, he taken some measures to avoid contact but since she contacts H at work, he can't change all of it. I am doing plan A, learning to work on me and it is helping, but I found out last night that about a month ago they talked again and he gave her the phone number to where he was staying (he was out of town for work) H and OW are in two different states now. H did say he hung up on her, but as the day went on today, it was very hard not to let the hurt overwhelm me. H knows what to do, can't always do it and I know what to do, but as time goes on, these repeated contacts hurt so much more. <p>I know venting here helps, it helps right now just writing this, and I know that there is a way to talk with him about this, but the hurt is too much and I can't think of anyway to talk with him about this. I am not very good about putting my needs out there, I am learning how to gracefully stand up for myself and not be a doormat, and tonight I just want the pain to go away!<p>Any suggestions anyone?? And can I think maybe we are getting closer to recovery???

<small>[ February 07, 2005, 12:37 PM: Message edited by: hanora ]</small>

Dr. Harley told me to tell my H that what we're currently doing is working on the next A, which sounds like what the two of you are doing. I'd just tell him that: "My perspective is that we are currently working on another affair and/or a divorce, and I'd like to change course and instead work together building a foundation for a new and better marriage where we care for and protect each other. What would you like to do?"<p>Dr. Harley made it clear to me that we are all wired for affairs and that MY unhappiness in the M will eventually lead to an A by me (although I think I'd just get a D instead) and/or my H's continued neglect of dealing appropriately with the issues of his A will eventually lead to him having another A because he isn't figuring out why he had the first one and how to NOT have one.<p>In your case, your H hasn't even ENDED the A! No wonder it makes you miserable. Sometimes it gets to the point that you just have to tell it like it is: "Because of your ongoing contact with the OW, we are unable to begin marital recovery, and that is causing me great distress. What I need most from you are the extraordinary precautions (from SAA) so the A can be ended the right way in preparation for recovery of our M. I fear that without that, we will end up on the same path we were before and end up where we ended up before."<p>If he tries reassuring you that nothing is going on or he would never do it again or whatever excuse may come up, I'd just say, "As unhappy as I am, I'm afraid it might be ME next time. My needs are not being met in this relationship, and I really NEED your help with that."<p>I suspect that the more my H is hearing out of my mouth some of the things he was saying to himself in his own head prior to the commencement of his A, the more he is taking notice and listening and attempting to do something about it. He should know even better than I do where this level of marital dissatisfaction leads because he knows where he ended up.<p>[ April 18, 2002: Message edited by: Conqueror ]</p>

I ask you to search deep in yourself and ensure that you believe he is telling you the truth. I did not see you mrention where he commited to doing any counselling. I believe the counbselling for yourself helps you as a person for your future how ever it ends up. But the choices he made indicates he has a problem, and needs to work on his problems that allowed him to do what he did. If he is committed to you he will determine a way to stop the communication with her, and work to make things better with you.

I agree with Lost. There is no excuse for the continued contact. I have never yet come across someone who could communicate with me that I didn't want to communicate with. Even if he is front-line phone-answering person at his work, there is a simple thing called HANGING UP as soon as he knows it's her that can be utilized. And he sure as he!! doesn't need to be giving her any number at which to reach him.<p>Be sure to use the right terminology with him. You said he "knows what to do, can't always do it". Is it "can't" or "won't"? My guess is "won't". What on earth is stopping him from avoiding being the cause of his spouse's unhappiness? What is standing in his way but his own selfishness? Did someone hold a gun to his head and MAKE him give her his number?<p>If that mealy-mouth crap has been going on for a year, I think it is definitely time for Dr. Dobson's Love Must Be Tough, but you're going to have to toughen up yourself first, I suspect. Once you see the situation as it truly is, you will then find the strength to maintain your integrity and put him on notice about the status of his M.

Thank you all for your replies.<p>hanora, I have started keeping a journal, which has helped. I am learning to address the bad and stand up for myself more. I don't know why, but sometimes it is so hard to not just focus on the good and forget the bad, which can't be done. I can praise the good, but I still need to address the bad.<p>Conqueror, I am glad that you responded. I was hoping that you might. Thank for you the idea of what we are doing is really setting up another affair, I have been stuggling how to get my point across without activating his shame defenses. We were both in counseling until this last summer when he revealed on his own the EA. It goes back and forth and you are right about the won't. That is just hard to accept at times. I am learning in counseling what I and H are about and shame is a big issue for H. I am learning how to approach issues without activating shame, because when that is working, nothing goes well. I liked the idea of being more upfront with my needs, that may help trigger something within him also. I know in his fog, he has mentioned the reasons the OW had the affair with H and what is ironic is that we are in the same situation right now, H is traveling much and that is one of the biggest reason OW told H why she was unhappy. I know that when we are apart, H gets a little unsettled and the more independant I become it helps. The less I need him, the more he calls, etc. So I know plan A is working to some extent. I just needed help with you to express myself without blowing up at him which won't help. I will get the book, Tough Love. Reading has helped me so much.<p>lost in space, H doesn't want to go back to counseling, have invited, suggested a change in counselor etc. I can't make him, I know that, I go for myself now and I hope that that is noticed, that is all I can do. I have been searching within myself for the truth. I get encouraged when things are revealed that I don't ask for, hopefully that is a good sign.<p>Personal growth is hard, but I am committed to my growth, I need to remember it won't all happen in a day. Thank you all for your help. Part of this is being able to see this for what it really is and sometimes that is the toughest for me. [img]images/icons/frown.gif" border="0[/img]

I just wanted to let you all know, I am going to be logged off for awhile, I have some family commitments this weekend and next week that will take me away for awhile. <p>THANK YOU! [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img]

OSC,
Listen to Conqueror her advice is right on.

Hello again!<p>I am back, last week was busy but very good. <p>Conqueror, I printed what was posted to this thread and have read it many times. I was able to talk with H and used your suggestion about what we are doing here is working on another affair, either his or mine. I was able to present it in a very non-threating I message way. I was asking him to please join me in counseling again, being very honest and upfront about my feelings. He didn't come with me once again, but I was able to plant a seed. I was also able to confront him once again, just stating what I felt about the giving out of his phone number, and what that did to me. These things are hard, such a line between LB and standing up for myself, but I am learning how to do it in a manner where I don't lose my dignity. I haven't got the book yet, on my list for today or tomorrow. I went to counseling yesterday and talked about much of this, it is so nice to go and be reassured that I am on the right track.<p>So, I just wanted to thank you, and I am working through so much. <p>sad princess, thanks for the reply, this site and the people who offer their thoughts has helped much!