Do you think I'm nuts? I have been doing A (well) for a week or so. I don't think I can do it. WH just dropped off son after a weekend-we exchanged information about w-end and that's it. I want to ask so much. When did the A start? What's going on with it? Why don't you move in with her rather than rent house? (we can't afford it)I just discovered that OW bought a house 1/24/02 so WH must have been involved in that. Plans for the future? We are separated and exchange kids frequently and that's our only contact. I'm in such a bad mood. I know you all keep encouraging me.
I want him to go public with the A so maybe it'll die eventually. But he doesn't tell anyone (except roommate and some co-workers)about it. Should I out him?(to parents, etc).
I just can't keep doing this. Pretending it's all OK when he's around-it's not.
Thanks for any comments.

CS;<p>I don't mean to be harsh, but the realities of these situations are very hard to deal with, and one week of Plan A is just too short.<p>Plan A is designed to make you strong, and to give you the internal fortitude to deal with life without your partner. It is only tangentially designed to make your WS perk up and see that what they are doing is wrong.<p>Plan B has ZERO chance of success if it is not preceded by a strong, solid, Plan A. And it will take several months, not several weeks. Plan B will not succeed if you don't begin to see some changes in your WS during Plan A. Until your Plan A does that, and you see that the fog lifts even a little, a couple of times, that your WS notices and starts thinking, you are not there yet.
If, after that, the WS still does not end the A, and doesn't show signs of wanting to fix your M, then, and only then, will it be time to think about Plan B.<p>It will take time, and it will take more will-power than you feel you have (more than any of us should ever be expected to have!) at a point in our lives when we are the least prepared for it. I know of what I speak, I was laid off from a very good job, 3 weeks later I discovered the A, and here I am, 8 months later, still without work, and my WW is still in the fog...believe me, I know ehat you're feeling!<p>So try to relax, breathe, get counseling, read the books, improve your Plan A (it takes time to begin to master it), work on you, get support, and you can prevail!<p>Have faith, have courage, make yourself a better person.<p>[ May 05, 2002: Message edited by: Spacecase ]</p>

Well, I blew it. I called and asked him all kinds of q's. He won't give me any info. Just says, "you are not moving on if you need this info. I won't talk about it. I didn't leave this marriage because of her. Believe anything you want"
He called OW on the way home from weekend to tell her he was on his way. I asked son if he called to tell me he was on his way and my son said yes. So, I knew he called her. I asked WH about it and he said nothing.
I'm done with it. I don't think I'll be posting here anymore. He can take a hike.
Bye.

I do want to say that I was wrong to ask my son that question. I shouldn't do that and won't anymore. My husband screamed at me over the phone at the top of his lungs. I can't believe how much anger HE has..He just keeps saying that he tried for 8 months to get me to make some changes and I didn't care enough about him to do them. And now that he's gone, I am losing weight and looking for a fulltime job (his two requests). And that he's completely pissed that I am doing it now. He said he couldn't be a f/t dad anymore because he couldn't stand the kid's mother. He said he thought that at some point we could get along again because we used to be great friends but now he knows that's impossible because of the way I act and things I say and said to him after he left. (I WAS ANGRY and still am) He said the kid's have the best mom in the whole world and that he appreciates what I do for him. I asked why he doesn't come out in public with OW (in our world) and he said well, maybe someday you'll know.
I needed that conversation because after I saw him today, knew he called OW...I was so sad, betrayed and missing him. And now...I feel like he's such an idiot, he can go to H###.
Thanks for letting me vent. I feel like I am crazy.
Bye.

OK..I am calmer now. I did everything against everyone's advice..asked q's about relationship, A, got mad, etc. Should I just skip it cuz I've lost a week's worth of work? or go back to Plan A.
Does anyone have anyone comments on H's outburst? Just fog?
Thanks.

Hi Can't Sleep,<p>You are not crazy nor is your marriage doomed to fail because you cannot Plan A for very long. Jennifer harley once told a poster here than most people cannot do a great Plan A for longer than six weeks with an active affair flying in their face on a daily basis. Sure some people have but most of the time a great Plan A for a long time is flawed with lots of LBs. Plan A does not require months and months of perfection on your part while your H throws his A in your face. Sure the longer you can last in Plan A the better,but not everyone is capable of months on end of dealing daily with a Ws's affair.<p>Know that there are a number of old time marriage builders that have succeeded with putting there marriage back together successfully after short plan A's especially when you still see your spouse because of your children. That alone gives WS a chance to see your improvements even if you have to go to Plan B after a short Plan A. He may act like he doesn't notice the new and improved you but he will.<p>I could not do a long Plan A myself . Sure I made mistakes in my marriage but I was not some horrible, awful spouse who had lots of changes to make. My H was selfish and self absorbed and most of all depressed and chose his affair as self medication instead of the hard work it would take to fix what was wrong inside himself. His affair was more about him than it was about having such a horrid marriage. That is the case in many instances here. You can still use the concepts here and move to Plan B or act "as if" you are divorced and go about improving yourself so that despite the outcome of your marriage you will be the better person from all this and will have learned and grown from this trial. Believe me all is not a bed of roses in affair land and H and OW will have the problems of daily life as the affair wears on. That is inevitable. You need to just go about making yourself the best you can be, making the improvements WS has complained about, tell him you love him and want to reconsile but realize you have no control over what he chooses. By removing yourself from the daily pain, striving to make yourself better, you just might become the more attractive option in all of this. Please search my posts as I have posted extensively over 3 years here and have seen marriages succeed with short Plan A's. <p>Hang in there! Only you know how much you can tolerate. Your H must respect you before he can feel in love with you again. Live respectably,use the concepts and keep posting for support! All the best to you.

Thanks for reply. I will go back and read some of yours. Cheers to happier tomorrow.
Bye

Can't sleep,<p>I feel like the last person in the world to give advice but I'll take a "stab" at it, ok? I just found out last month that my WH is still connected to the "OW". Things had been good for us for well over a year and I really believed that she was "GONE". We still had issues because of his working over 100 miles away. he was back to telling me that he loved me, missed me, keep dreaming and etc. That only reason we were apart was because of his job. Well.......I was informed that he had contact with "OW" in March. I just did order all the books and best I can tell I was in PLAN A.......<p>Well.......I love busted all over the place when I learned of recent contact. i did it all, cried, threatened Divorce if he didn't cut her off and even that I would drag her right into the middle of this if it went to court. My WH also lost his job a few days later and has now "CUT ME OFF". I have no idea where he is, probably with "OW". I flew clear to pieces....."SSSSSSSTTTTTUUUPIDDD"<p>I am praying that he will realize that had he not had contact I wouldn't have "flew of the handle" and in time he will reach for me and we can try to rebuild again........<p>Don't be so hard on yourself as we are all human.... KEEP TRYING.....STAY STRONG......<p>Keep reading, keep learning, keep praying....AND STAY HERE WITH THE REST OF US BROKEN HEARTS!!!!!

Dear Cant- I could only do a plan A for 10 days and thought my marriage was definitely over because thats all h kept saying to me. Like your H he was having a serious EA/PA with a single coworker. It was impossible for me to keep my anger and anguish all inside me while H continued to flaunt his A in front of my face! It was hard enough to keep our 3 kids from finding out! I did 'out him' after a few wks though- confided in some friends and his brother and my family. I wanted them to know why I was such a basket case and that I was doing the best I could. H was very angry with me during his A but wasn't in touch with it until much later on. Like your H he was convinced we should divorce and OW certainly encouraged that line of thought with him on a daily basis!I say it isnt over till the divorce final papers are dry. Have you read Love Must be Tough by James Dobson?He gives lots of guidelines for doing Plan B. I found it hard to do because of H wanting to see the kids frequently but I did the best I could with it for a few months. I just think you shouldnt assume your marriage is over even though it seems hopeless right now. God specializes in hopeless cases here. I know because mine was one of them. Take care- lifeismessy

Dear BL214: I wish you the best in recovering from all of this. It is miserable, isn't it? Sounds like you are moving in the right direction.
Dear LIM: Thanks for reply. I am curious if your WH ever said why he didn't make the affair public and if it made any difference after you told a few people? My WH's parents don't know..and I don't think it's fair to me. Would you recommend telling?
I asked why he didn't move in with her and he said, "that's just not how you do it" and said what? And his reply was "you don't tell someone you are moving in with them" I said, Wouldn't she want you too? And he said, "Probably not." I don't get it. Maybe it's all BS.
What do you think turned it around for your H? Time?
Thanks.

Can't sleep,<p>My WH left me, home, family, friends and moved closer to "OW" and work. We were both making a 90 mile drive one way to work. I wanted to move but "NO" he wouldn't. When he left, he did exactly that, moved for "OW", I guess. That and he didn't intend for me to find out. He didn't go "public", he tried to hide it but because of the enviroment we worked in at the time (OW worked there too and same shift), the rumors flew and they flew from place to place, compliments of the computer terminals. His family has heard these rumors but probably don't much because of WH "secretiveness". I have not gone around and drug them in or bashed him to that. I love my WH family and I remain close to them, however I try to avoid talking about WH "A". If this works out for us i want their "respect" and face them with a "clean" heart. If this doesn't work out.....they still know that it was him.<p>I believe on here they recommend that you DO NOT involve family.....they are going to figure or find some of it out but it should not come from you, I don't feel. I also look at it this way: "If you go around discussing it with family member's, than don't you look like a bigger fool to still want the WS"? I would rather keep my dignity, respect and class per to say by just staying to myself and suffereing in private. WH is the one that has to deal with explanations for his behavior. I AM NOT the one that abandon him, turned my back on everyone, got myself involved in an affair with a woman 10+ years older than me.<p>I have been totally faithful, loyal, defending of him and determined to win him back and "re-build" this marriage and make it the best it can be....I have done that since 4/99 when this started and he left me. Until last month I thought we were pulling it together. Now with this last incident where i discovered he had contact in March and I blew my lid. Husband has lost his job and has cut me out of his life......I don't know where he is at and I'm not hunting him.<p>I've decided to let him go and let GOD deal with him and the "OW". I haven't given up on our love or marriage, just simply realizing that I cannot do anything about it........WH has to decide if he wants "OW" or me.......in the meantime, I am going to continue living as his faithful, loving wife and just do the best I can.......<p>This is so hard to swallow, obsorb and get through but being here reading, learning, listening and sharing......has helped me more than words.....<p>(((((HUGS)))))

BL214: I wish you peace and I admire you ability to let go and let God. I am trying. I am still at the point that I can't believe my H calls another woman before me when he's on his way home with my son and I am angry that he won't give me any information about this relationship except that it is over for us.
Thanks for your reply.

I didn't sleep last night -three hours. Talked to Wh this morning-big LB session. I basically told him we would be going through lawyers and the OW could have him as he was the lowest person on earth, etc. He hid money from me last month, wrote a big check and didn't tell last week (it bounced). I've had it. I am so hurt and I hate him.
Bye.

Hi again can't sleep- I hope you are feeling a bit more hopeful after reading these posts. I can remember the incredible despair I felt and not wanting to get out of bed but I had to because of taking care of our 3 kids. Whether to tell others about the A is controversial- I felt that once H moved out of the house I was done covering up for him.At that point I told our families and whoever else I felt like- I was surprised at how comforting they were about it and the emotional support I got. It was quite helpful to me and helped me remember that H was not living in reality-land. I had to really try to keep my head together during the time he moved out because by then he hadn't been intimate with me for 8 months(his choice, and pressure from OW) and during his lunch hrs he was visiting divorce lawyers and looking at apts. ( I knew because we would get mail from those places!)I finally came right out and asked him if he was getting his own apt. He said it was 'complicated.' I think financial reality combined with the fact that we would have to sell our house and get separate apts along with his being able to see our kids alot less began to change his mind. Along with the fact that OW began to LB by pressuring him to divorce me faster and make more of a commmitment to her. Affairs just aren't as enjoyable when these factors start to set in. Do whatever you need to do right now to take care of YOU! I went to several Bible studies a wk, had breakfast out with friends, went to Starbucks daily to think, took a strong anti-D, shopped till I dropped buying new clothes, makeup, books etc., took the kids out for dinner with me one night a wk- whatever I could think of to put a bit of enjoyment in my life to help combat the total despair I felt. Take care- lifeismessy

CS,<p>Hey it's me (formerly BL214). Don't give up. As far as "hating" your WH......I don't "hate" my WH, I "HATE HIS BEHAVIOR", what he has right here, loving him, wanting, needing him and "PRAYING FOR HIM"! I hate that he has not given his full heart and effort to this marriage. I am sure he "believes" that he has but how could he with "OW" still in picture.....another "LIE" he has to tell himself and believe, to avoid facing his own guilt. To "JUSTIFY" in his mind that I am to blame for his "A". Hogwash......<p>Yes, somewhere along the line I failed to meet him needs and he failed mine too.... I had a terrible time with my brother's death, mom's illness, stress of the long drive to/from work, job promotion and etc. I NEEDED HIM and he "ABANDON ME". He "RAN" instead of staying, he "choose" to step outside the boundries of our marriage and he brought more pain and suffereing.<p>I DID NOT turn my back on him nor did I turn my back when he started coming around.....I worked on me......busted my butt to look as best i could, be attractive, house immaculate and smiles when he started coming to see me. I cooked,devoted all my attention to him and for over a year, he seemed to be more and more my "husband". The intimacy never stopped, I never denied him or wanted to give him a reason to keep going to "OW". <p>Well, he had her in the picture all along. He even told me that he was "sorry about 2 years ago". He knew that I believed she was "OUT" and he let me think that. I see now, I made it easy for him.....I bought his deception......he betrayed me not once but twice now.<p>I still love him, still can forgive and know the trust can be earned back but the difference now...... "HE HAS TO PROVE TO ME SHE IS GONE"!!!!!<p>I LB bad enough that I don't know if he'll ever come around again.....I LB when I found out last month about the continued contact. I screamed divorce, told him she goes or else and you name it. He has lost job and I don't know where he is at. I suspect he went running for cover to the "OW" from the big-bad-all her fault Wife".<p>Well, you know what......that's fine....let her take care of him and put up with his moods, attitude and temper. She is a cheater right with him. "TRUST" must really be overwhelming between them huh? Especially with her being around 10 years older than him......if we end and they stay together.....as she gets older......she'll get insecure and probably "CLINGY". She'll eventually remember how she took him from a wife his own age, (notch on her belt right now), but if she could "steal him away", why can't she reap what she sowed.........<p>He'll reap what he sowed through her........right now I'm sure they are both on their "best behavior', because there is no committment or responsibilites. Even though this has gone on for 3 years, why hasn't he let go of me and just "GO TO HER" if she's so great and he's so sure? He not only "DECIEVED ME" but he also "DECIEVED HER" everytime he was with me (HIS WIFE).<p>Sooner or later, she is going to WANT MORE and start "PUSHING and WHINING". That will turn him away sooner than anything. I hope that if he is with her.......she pulls out all the stops and shows her true colors......CUT HER OWN THROAT.<p>In the meantime, I will learn, grow, worry about me and "PRAY" that GOD deals with them. I believe in miracles.......I am not going to rush into a DIVORCE.......he left me......he cheated......he can file if that's what he wants but he will not have his cake and eat it too. Obviously he needed or wanted me as well, so I am pulling back.<p>He will not have us both.....I don't believe that she can replace or fill my shoes..... I've had 10 years with him....she has had 3 years but it has been based on BRAEKING GOD'S LAWS.........<p>Sure they may be "BLISSFUL" and he may even be "RELIEVED" that he "cut me out" so they can "savor" each other, but you know what? I really deep down DO NOT BELIEVE that they will last or he'll stay "happy" with her.........<p>I keep telling myself that if they stay together and we end.......then "THEY DESERVE EACH OTHER" and whatever comes to them.....<p>I deserve BETTER!!!!! But if he ends it with her and is truely ready and willing to throw his all back into us......."THAN SO AM I"!!!!!!<p>I just won't waste another 3 years waiting but I'm not filing today, tomorrow or next week either......<p>Besides.......I'm the "WIFE", GOD BLESSED this union and I have asked and AM LETTING the "GREATEST POWER" take control.....<p>PS: Done unloading and still loving him through the pain..........

Hi. Your attitude sounds good and that you are doing the right thing for you. Like you are taking care of yourself. I have decided that I'm done with WH. I have severed as many ties as I can this morning and although I feel sad, I feel like I am doing what I need to do.
Good Luck to you. I'll be thinking of you.