Just curious, is this not some type of mental cruelty? I've read the book "Men are from mars" etc. and I understand the "cave" concept. Men have to retreat to a cave and we must leave them cool and recollect their thoughts.<p>BUT does this also mean that they hardly speak to you let alone show any affection?<p>My H is not physically abusive but I wonder how to best handle his "silent treatment" <p>He's a taker, as long as things are going "his way" as long as we are doing what "he wants" all is okay. Actually it is ok with him if I want to do something and he doesn't, to tell me "go out by yourself" Hello, I am married, why should I have to go by myself?<p>Sheesh MEN!!!

I'll just have you know where not all bad. Men and women both use the silent treatment, I think they believe the other person has ESP. I admit that I used it in my relationship, but usually because I was so upset that if I opened my mouth I would upset my wife with what came out. It hurt her as much when I was quiet, but usually I would calm down, think about what I needed to say and be a lot less confrontational. Try to remeber that as long as he returns form his cave to talk to you he is the one that has the issue that he needs time to figure out. Alot of time when he is giving you the silent treatment a ice breaker such as, "It appears that you need some time to think, when you are ready to talk please come and talk to me." If he dosen't come back in a reasonable amount of time (few hours maximum), let him know that the silent treatment he is giving you is very unfair, and that you need to talk about what is bothering him, because presently it is bothering you." Hope it works.

Well, when your H comes out of his cave, it sounds like you guys have to sit down and negotiate a POJA on how to fill each other's ENs. It sounds like one of your top needs is recreational companionship and it's probably not high on his priority list of EN's. When he tells you to go by yourself, it's probably not meant to hurt your feelings, but he probably would go out by himself and not think anything of it. It's just that you are not enthusiastic about going out alone so POJA time...<p>My H is like yours, gets quiet when upset. He comes around, but only in his timing. Some people are just wired that way. I wouldn't pressure him to talk tho, just seems to make them withdraw even further and frustrates you even more.<p>When my H forces me into isolation by his chosen isolation, I just go find something to do to keep my mind off of his (BAD) behavior... Read, pray, pray, read, go do stuff with my kids, take a nice long, hot bubble bath, treat myself to a movie, ANYTHING to dial his behavior out. It's HIS problem, not mine. But, it's tough because you want to keep a "right" attitude when they come out of their cave... Hang in there, I'm sure he'll come around and you guys can revisit the conflict that started this withdrawal.<p>You've been around here, you know the MB drill... [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img]

Having to retype this because my computer froze up. [img]images/icons/mad.gif" border="0[/img] <p>Call me the Queen of Clam! That's been part of our problem for years. I clam up and try to get over things without ever discussing it, getting it off of my chest. I expect him to know why I'm mad and never repeat the incident, etc. again. GUESS WHAT! That Does Not Work!!! I held these hard feelings in, these hurt feelings in and it made it hard for me to respond to his attempts at affection - thus part of the reason he sought affection from another.<p>Just the other night we were having one of those discussions that comes up when the BS is at the bottom of the emotional roller coaster. I was "preaching" on a rather sensitive topic and when I finished he gathered up his pillows and left the room. It was real late, so I figured he might be just so tired of hearing my rattling that he wanted to go to sleep, or he needed some time to reflect. I knew we weren't mad at each other, so I did not follow him out. Within 3-5 minutes, he was back. He said, "It never has solved anything to leave the room, has it?" See - PROGRESS!!!! [img]images/icons/grin.gif" border="0[/img] Both of us have had to try to make improvements in this area.<p>It's been fairly easy for me since his A, because my emotions rage when I get offended. I don't have the ability I once had to be forgiving of his inconsiderate ways, etc. If I feel I've been done wrongly, he's going to hear about it!! I'm doing my best to keep him talking too. I don't want him to become the KING of CLAM in order to try to protect my feelings. It's a 2-way street.

Lostinspace,<p>I am losing hope for my M. All our married years I have craved conversation w/my H, he being unable to talk AT ALL. Now, when we are faced with this do or die situation in our M, it seems to be die. Any topic we try to discuss ends up in a fury and the silence this thread discusses. Most of the time it is me being quiet (but him as well) because I have learned that continuing to talk only upsets him more and is truly futile. I have to "corner" him if I want any conversation at all. i.e., when he has gone to bed, while he eats. Still, he does not comment, says, "What do you want me to say?" I have asked him over the years to read books, listen to tapes, etc. It doesn't happen. Recently he went to a counseling appt.-once. Didn't like what he heard and hasn't gone back.
Right now I am just sitting here crying because I see no way to resolve this. How are we ever going to be able to work this out if he won't try to learn how to communicate? This man was raised in a pastor's family, the old "children are to be seen and not heard" mentality. Yuk. His opinions didn't matter, just do what you're told. Obey. Old school theology. Poison. I can't even get him to tell me what he would like me to make him for dinner when I want to make him something special! He's just not important-to him.
But it's killing us. He cannot carry on a conversation about anything important. (But he sure can talk online with those EAs.) There is a lot going under the surface, but I know nothing of it. I'm afraid it is going to cost us our M. I am to the point where it is making me physically sick. I suffer with a siezure disorder and stomach trouble from the meds. I am ending up in bed fighting siezures most of the week and if it isn't that I'm vomiting because of the stress. This cannot be-I have children to care for! The only thing I see possible is to separate for a time at least to get myself back on my feet. This has to stop immediately. Anyone ever resolved something like this?

I guess I am a cave woman. Mostly since dday. I know things upset me that shouldn't/ I try to hold it in and calm down before bringing the subject up so my (famous temper) does not get the best of me. But this makes my WH angry. Then he pushes and we end up arguing after all.<p>I am not trying to give him the silent treatment or pouting as he calls it. I am just trying to wade through my anger and hurt before I talk to him about what ever has triggered it. THis happened this very morning.<p>Last night I got on the computer and saw where he had gone in and checked his yahoo account. It was the was that he and the ow emailed each other. I got so angry I couldn't see straight. He came home a few hours later and I was not cold but stand offish. I wanted to talk about it but was still angry and didn't feel it was the best time. Well he told me I was pouting and he was sick of it. So I let him have it. With both barrels. Not good. Sometimes the silent treatment is not really being cruel it is just trying to cool off.<p>Music

The number one problem by far in my M for me has been my H's failure to treat me with respect, the A being the pinnacle of the 10-year mountain of disrespect. Among his punishments of choice was the silent treatment. He would treat me as invisible. I would talk to him; he would ignore me. This would go on for days or weeks. Usually I would end up in the same mode, avoiding him like the plague--who wants to be around someone who acts like you don't exist?<p>He has now admitted that he did this purposely to punish me, as well as withholding my ENs to punish me. During the first 4 months of Plan A, he was still going into this mode when I displeased him, but I did not respond in kind because I knew I would not stay in a M like that. During the first one I tried just acting "normal", a 180 from my previous way of responding. I stayed next to him, I stayed in physical contact with him, I continued talking to him. I decided I was just going to act as if I WAS visible.<p>Well, I was not able to last very long this way--I think an hour was as long as I could take that massive rejection while putting forth my best efforts. When he was ready to reconnect a few days later, I told him that I wanted us to work on a plan for what we would do the next time that happened, and I asked him what he is looking for from me when he does that.<p>He said he justs gets so angry and all the old resentment comes back and basically complained instead of coming up with a plan. So I got specific, should I give you an hour, 2 hours, a day? to cool off. When would you like me to approach you again?<p>He still was nebulous, so I came up with my own plan and told him what *I* would do the next time it happened: I will give you an hour to cool off and leave you alone during that time. Then, I will attempt to reconnect with you. If you reject me, I will take that as my cue that I am to live a separate life from you, and will do so. Then, if you later DO want to reconnect with me, we will have to start all over and deal with whatever issue preceded your rejection of me. I will no longer go along with pretending it didn't happen once you are ready to play with me again.<p>This sort of worked in shortening the duration of his punishments, but eventually I decided that I just was not going to live like that anymore--being treated like a doll that could be picked up at will and enjoyed to the max one minute and then tossed aside like an old shoe the next. After a 4-month Plan A, I was ready for Plan B, partly because of this issue and all the other bludgeoning devices of disrespect he used on me.<p>He chose recovery rather than Plan B, and hasn't done a single one of his punishing behaviors since January. They ARE capable of stopping it when they want to and something is in it for them. I don't know if anything would have changed if I didn't decide I wasn't going to live with it anymore. But I know the first step is to have a plan for yourself how you are going to deal with it, and it obviously has to be something different than you've ever tried before because obviously none of that has ever worked.<p>The important thing to understand with all of these behaviors is that there is nothing you can do to change them. You can only come up with your own plan of dealing with your responses to the way you are treated.<p>[ May 12, 2002: Message edited by: Conqueror ]</p>

Sobroken - I believ epeople use the silent treatment in their marriage when they believ ethe marriage is bullet proof. When either of us used it it was for different reasons, and it was not very often that one or the other used this treatment. If I believed that my marriage was on the rocks, I would most certainly not have used it in hindsight ever. It just does the opposite of communication, but sometimes people need the time to think. If your husband is using it all the time, then he I hope he knows what it is doing to his marriage. Have you had a conversation with him to indicate that based on teh lack of communication you may have to separate for a while to evaluate what both of you want out of the marriage. A few points that I would suggest, if you threaten to separate ensure you have thought about it upfront, and are committed with a plan to follow through. Secondly I would let him know that in separating you are both married and you as he should intend to hold steady the marriage vows (Even if he hasn't been up to now, he needs to know that separating so he can be free to go and have flings is not acceptable, rather to truely think about the marriage, and what is happening). Lastly I guess I suggest separation as if your health is really bad, and stress is a big trigger you need to get away from the main stress. I hope you have family or friends around to help, as now unlike most times in life you will need help, because it will be very tough. By leaving he could choose to do anything, nut ultimately your health, and the abiltiy to care for yourself and your children need to be your highest priority. Good luck and I hope this helps.

<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by MusicMW:
<strong>...I am just trying to wade through my anger and hurt before I talk to him about what ever has triggered it. THis happened this very morning...I let him have it. With both barrels. Not good. Sometimes the silent treatment is not really being cruel it is just trying to cool off.
</strong><hr></blockquote><p>Excellent point! I believe this is very true for my H... I guess I get selfish when most likely I caused his anger but he refuses to discuss with me. That is not a good attitude (for me) because I'm not being the giver, I'm being the taker. I need to "give" him the right to cool off. Hmmm... Thanks for giving me something very helpful to consider if/when this happens to us again! [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img]