Welcome to the
Marriage Builders® Discussion Forum

This is a community where people come in search of marriage related support, answers, or encouragement. Also, information about the Marriage Builders principles can be found in the books available for sale in the Marriage Builders® Bookstore.
If you would like to join our guidance forum, please read the Announcement Forum for instructions, rules, & guidelines.
The members of this community are peers and not professionals. Professional coaching is available by clicking on the link titled Coaching Center at the top of this page.
We trust that you will find the Marriage Builders® Discussion Forum to be a helpful resource for you. We look forward to your participation.
Once you have reviewed all the FAQ, tech support and announcement information, if you still have problems that are not addressed, please e-mail the administrators at mbrestored@gmail.com
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Page 1 of 2 1 2
#999516 05/08/02 12:36 AM
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 109
C
Member
Member
C Offline
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 109
I have really been so shell-shocked since my WW and I had another big D-day on April 19th. Two things really hurt... finding out that they had been in onging contact since D-day No. 1 (three years ago almost to the day) and finding out that she had met him at least three times at the new house we are building (which was supposed to be our "fresh start" and chance to get away from the OM, etc.).<p>I still am in such a funk. My will to do Plan A after these revelations is shot and my love bank is on zero for her. I am just trying to take a breather, get things on track at work, and love my children. That seems about all I can manage right now. It is just very tough for me to get my mind wrapped around the idea that everything that has happened the past three years is tainted with her A... every holiday, every trip to Disney, all the heart-wrenching discussions and promises, all my efforts, everything... poof... dashed on the rocks. <p>At this point, I don't know if I will be able to recover. She says it's really over this time, but all the words are the same ones I have heard before. The emptiness is so painful I just try to shut it out for now and concentrate on all the pressures that are rushing at me... demanding job and getting close to finishing our "dream house" (now tainted by thoughts of him waltzing around in it). It's like she couldn't leave me one place to feel clean of the OM and her A. I don't even give a damn about the new house now. It sickens me to think of all the bull she fed me about wanting to get from all the bad past... when, in reality, she was calling him multiple times a day and meeting with him frequently. Yuck!<p>I wish I had better news. The only positive thing is that thanks to snooping, at least I am not living a lie and fooling myself.<p>Better luck to all of you.

#999517 05/08/02 01:28 AM
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 17,837
O
Member
Member
O Offline
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 17,837
D/d's far apart are like reliving it all over again. Not as much hurt as disappointment. <p>I understand how you must be feeling. So let her prove not just with words but with actions what 'over' really means. <p>Are you able to get some counseling? Maybe Steve or Jennifer can help?!?!? <p>I am sorry for these added revelations. Not healthy at all. Now the ball is in your court as to whether you want to try again or not. But this time, she needs to put forth more effort. Loss of trust makes each time a bit harder. <p>For me, knowing that the burden of proof on recovery was more on H's (ws) shoulders than mine made it more tolerable. There are still times where I wish I had chosen the D. This tells me that I am NOT in a full recovery yet. <p>One day @ a time. <p>Take Care,
L.

#999518 05/08/02 06:49 AM
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 109
C
Member
Member
C Offline
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 109
Thanks for your reply. I think this D-day No. 3 is just as depressing as D-day No. 1, but for different reason like you stated. There was shock and rage with the first time and now it is just a sick feeling. I've grown wiser over the past three years, but not immune to pain.<p>I know I need counseling, but I need to just get a breather before I even start that. Maybe I will start as a birthday present to myself later this month.

#999519 05/08/02 08:40 AM
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 2,868
S
Member
Member
S Offline
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 2,868
Conan,
No wonder we haven't heard from you around here. But this is actually the time you probably need to be here the most.<p>What agreement have you come to regarding "No Contact"? I think it has to be a very solid one this time. She must agree to verification. Like negotiators used to say about US-Soviet treaties: "Trust but verify".<p>Keep your Plan A in force, better than ever...and if you see she really starts responding (being very vocal about plans, where she is and what she's doing, allowing you access to her for verification, cell phone, etc.) then maybe you can start believing it this time. The burden is on her. Does she understand and acknowledge this?

#999520 05/09/02 12:07 AM
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 10,816
2
Member
Member
2 Offline
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 10,816
Conan:<p>I just saw this thread. Yikes! My heart goes out to you, man! <p>I guess you might want to think about what you might be doing to contribute to your W's cakewalking here. I mean, is she just too comfy with the knowledge that she can have a 3-yr A and you'll not only put up with it, but you'll even build her a new house and let her and her OM play in it? I know this isn't what you're doing, but in some twisted way might this be what she's thinking (using that alien implant brain of hers)?<p>In today's sellers market, might it be possible to jerk her awake by putting the house on the market and selling it without moving in? Maybe say "We can build another one later provided you are devoted to our family and our M"? <p>I don't know. Just some thoughts, somewhat similar to what I was thinking the last couple of days re our house being rebuilt, before my W seemed to come partway out of the fog when she seemed to have realized what she would lose by insisting on keeping OM as a friend.

#999521 05/09/02 03:16 AM
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 103
O
Member
Member
O Offline
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 103
ditto 2long do a 180 and take care of yourself

#999522 05/09/02 04:16 AM
Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 2,457
B
Member
Member
B Offline
Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 2,457
I have to second what 2long said. She lies to you and continues a 3 year affair and has sexual encounters in your new home you are building? It really sounded like there were no repercussions to her behavior at all in the past and she was rewarded by having you build a new house for her. The fact that she could continue this for so long and desecrate your new home is way over the top. She does not deserve you and your marriage. She clearly does not care how much pain, disrespect and humilation she has forced on you. I would look to sell the house and look for a new life for you and your children. This is not a person you would want to teach values to your children.
What a piece of work she is. You deserve so much better than this. Why would you ever trust anything she ever says again. Don't let her ruin the rest of your life. I wish you luck.

#999523 05/09/02 10:06 AM
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 196
J
Member
Member
J Offline
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 196
Conan, <p>When do they pour the concrete for that new house, maybe we can have someone drop by then. I don't see how you can resolve this in the absence of a forced choice by your ww, as long as she can have both the A and the marriage she will try to, who wouldn't we might ask. Once experienced it it difficult not to like, however immoral, cruel or dishonest it is and regardless of how sure we are that we would not indulge in such behavior. From a ww standpoint their life becomes a kind of composite taking and piecing together of different parts to meet different needs. I think guys in our position have to simply break up their formula and put the ww's in a state of extremis where they have to find a new one. I am pissed that this is happening to you and would like to brain your ww but you are the only guy who can fix this right now, she is not competent and the OM sure isn't going to help you. Stick around and let us know how you are doing.<p>Jack218

#999524 05/09/02 10:20 AM
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 197
C
Member
Member
C Offline
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 197
Conan,<p>I feel for you. I had 2nd D day in April, last one was December 2001. I have spent the last 18 months 'rebuilding' with my WSO, or so I thought! I feel i have wasted that time, that the betrayal is worse as he allowed me to think we were working together. I have been frantically trying to fill a leaky bucket, making allowances all over the place, trying not be too demanding..I am tired, upset but not in the same shock of the 1st D day. He never really came back to me and i don't like the man he now is. i want him to move out but, faced with that, he is dragging his heels. I have been posting in 'recovery'. I am convinced he is not going to change. i did plan b in september for 6 months but it didn't work, he lied and said A was over and i believed him. We have a 7 year old D and it is hard to keep no contact.<p>Anyway, just to let you know you are not alone. It is hard to stay strong and resolute but i think that something has to change in our situations and we are the ones who have to do it, they won't, there is no incentive for them to.

#999525 05/09/02 10:42 AM
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 10,816
2
Member
Member
2 Offline
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 10,816
Conan:<p>I think the point of all these replies to you is that you have to really think about what you want to accomplish with your WW and your future.<p>Let's assume, for the moment, that your W was a loving, beautiful, intelligent person and truly wonderful to be around when you stared your journey in life together. That's probably true, in fact. But now, she's gotten wrapped up in this fantasy life and can't see her way out of it. Heck, doesn't WANT to see anything but it because she's been able to have her cake and eat it for 3 years now. Let's further assume that she's still the same person, but her perspective on life is all screwed up with this illicit relationship with OM. Right now, she can't see how rewarding your M CAN BE if you both hunker down and work on it. And she can't work on it at all until this OM is pinched off and out of your lives forever. She doesn't want to give that up. But she doesn't seem to want to give up her family, either. <p>In my case, real progress started to show when my W realized, finally, that I was serious when I said that I could be a content single dad if I had to, but that I doubt that I could afford our house on my salary alone (and it would be too big for just 2 or 3 of us, anyway), and so I'd probably sell it and find something smaller. My W then changed her "I figured I'd just have to be alone" remark to "I never wanted to be alone" followed just the next day with "I just realized I've never had to break up with anybody before" (regarding no contact) and "I never meant to hurt you" comments. In some ways, it's still probably too early to tell, but I think we're beginning recovery with those realizations of hers.<p>Was it all worth it to me? Is a duck's butt waterproof?! HELL YES! But whether it's worth it to you to try to rebuild your M is entirely up to you. You simply can't accomplish anything while your W continues to take advantage of your love and accomodations for her the way she does. Shocking her back to reality by doing something like selling the house, or moving her out, may be the only way to get fundamental progress going. Again, just like determining the "value" of your M is entirely up to you, this kind of decision is a big one, and should ultimately be your decision to make. <p>Since I'm not a professional in this area, though, I always advise people not to take advice from non-professionals! [img]images/icons/wink.gif" border="0[/img] This is just my read on what's happening and an offering of some possible alternatives for you. <p>In the end, though, make your own decisions, especially about something so important to you. <p>warmest regards,

#999526 05/09/02 11:03 AM
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 966
J
Member
Member
J Offline
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 966
Hey, I've got to second 2long's comments...<p>Let's look at it from the MB textbook angle for a moment... Plan A is NOT INTENDED to change the WS in any way... can't be done.<p>Even Plan B can't... the textbook definition for Plan B is to "defend the last of your love"... and it IS. BUT... Let's be perfectly honest here.. there are other factors that it has in its favor, including:<p>- Gives the WS a real taste of life without the BS. Often, especially for cake eaters, they can't seem to fathom life without the BS in some way. Plan B presents cold, hard reality in a big way - if it can be implemented correctly.<p>- It's true that psychologically, we tend to "want what we can't have." And in the heat of the A, the OP seems like the forbidden fruit. By "giving up completely" - as Plan B portrays to the WS - suddenly the BS is the forbidden fruit in a way. It's sad but true that the human mind works this way.<p>If you read Divorce Remedy, Weiner-Davis talks about the "After the Last Resort Technique." It's basically to cut of ALL contact with the WS... exactly Plan B!!! See... it's not a unique concept.<p>I have a friend who had a WW... She moved out early in the process, and they talked on the phone 2-3 times a month. It'd be simple stuff, but would also involve R talk - his WW would sometimes make promising noises, but usually reverted back to verbally beating my friend. Well, he filed for Dv, hoping it might shake her out of her fog. It didn't... but then again, they were talking regularly still, and he hadn't "let go" really - and I think they really did LB each other quite a bit. Shortly before the Dv was final, he told her that was it - no turning back. She didn't bite. It was a couple of months after it WAS final that she called him up, in tears, begging for another chance, willing to do ANYTHING. He was truly done, however - sadly or not.<p>My theory... their contact had really, truly ended, and his exW at that point could finally, truly see the "big picture" - he would no longer be any part of her life - no more phone calls, no more "effort". That, and the fact that OM was LB'ing her didn't hurt!

#999527 05/09/02 11:55 AM
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 10,816
2
Member
Member
2 Offline
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 10,816
J.R.<p>Excellent points. In my case, and in many others, plan A may be sufficient enough to wake up the WS, but recognizing that's an ancillary result - it's not the purpose of Plan A. <p>There is so much here that we don't know about Conan's situation, or any other posted to this board, for that matter, that needs to be kept in mind. <p>First, WSs are people too. Pretty messed up people, perhaps (but so are BSs), but people. Many of them still have potential to rebuild their integrity and commit to one intimate partner, even when they've had multiple As (as Peggy Vaughn's husband).<p>The BS certainly shouldn't enable the A, or be a doormat for any longer than they feel is right for their particular situation, but they shouldn't just toss the WS out with the garbage either, in my opinion. Sure, they're untrustworthy and can't be respected for what they've done or are doing. But they just might be after the fog lifts. Only Conan can make that decision in his case.

#999528 05/10/02 08:26 AM
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 109
C
Member
Member
C Offline
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 109
To all:<p>Thank you for your supportive and helpful comments. I had to go out of town to take care of my parents (who are getting better now).<p>I am still in such a fog. I really hear the comments about the cakewalker concept. I have considered selling the new house, but I feel I would be so bitter about it, that I would never want to be M'ed to her in the future. See, I built her dream house, but on my dream location (a wonderful peaceful lake). I have had so many wonderful times already with my daughters boating on the lake, skiiping stones, etc. I hate to let that dream go.<p>I am thinking I should at least have a conversation with her about the fact I am in such a confused fog and what my feelings are (without LB'ing too much). Really it is just about my feelings in reaction to the situation. I think it may be helpful to see her reaction to those thoughts. In the past, I always made it clear that I wanted to work on the M and that I was very positive about the possible results. I usually have this "never say die" attitude and believe that more, harder, smarter work can win the war, even if you lose battles along the way. One of my favorite sayings is, "A setback is a setup for a comeback." I just don't know if I can mount another comeback this time. <p>God, I have to get some counseling. I had a lot of time to think about my life while driving back and forth to my parents... and I am troubled how I can't seem to get any mental traction going. It just feels like my mind keeps spinning but i don't get anywhere... can't make a decision, can't formulate a plan, can't picture the future, nothing.<p>thanks again to all, I just don't know if there is any advice right now that can pull me out of this, but thank you so much for trying, it at least makes me feel better, and that is a start.

#999529 05/10/02 09:18 AM
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 248
D
Member
Member
D Offline
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 248
Conan,
What you are going through is harder than almost anything else. My Dad's extended illness and dying were easier than these past 2 years of my marriage.
Only you know how much you can take and when you need a break. Sometimes just doing something for your SELF helps. Don't feel like you're failing if everything doesn't work at once. This isn't a 98 minute movie that wraps up neatly. It goes overtime.
When my W came back, she moved back into the house we built,and we resumed where we left off, with some extra rec time thrown in. It didn't change what was happening in our marriage to resume same thing.
My wife was keeping in contact with OM contantly. Then It stopped abrutply, by him. We went through Oct,Nov,Dec holidays. Then in January found out from OM sister why he wasn't calling W any more. He moved up to live by OW#2 and was going to get married. This put my wife into a tailspin. I think that it took away her backup plan. If things didn't work with us she always had him to talk to and hope for. Now she decided she needed to find out who she was before she could go on. Since then we sold the "dream house" (she thought I never would,or would punish her for making me sell it)and moved to separate places we each rent. We are finding ourselves, and getting together fairly often. We both needed some safe space to ourselves.
Well since we live apart she has seen that she is not helpless she can do alot. It also showed that there is more to it than she thought. I don't think she likes having to make all the choices.
She could let me make choices, then complain if they didn't work out, or take too long, or cost too much. I talk to her everyday sometimes 2-3 times. I help her with some of the projects, when asked, I set down to meals with her and the kids afterwords. The kids are here 1/2 there 1/2 time. We are both getting a taste of what it would be like to be apart. My wife asks me if i miss the HOUSE and I can say I honestly don't. Home is where you decide it will be.
I think my wife knows it could go either way with us. I do too.
I'm not saying it is the way to go for anyone else, but we have relaxed, and that has done us both good.
Take care,
D<p>[ May 10, 2002: Message edited by: Daniel ]</p>

#999530 05/10/02 10:03 AM
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 2,868
S
Member
Member
S Offline
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 2,868
Conan;
Get a session with Steve Harley. It did wonders for me, he gets it totally, and he can help you. <p>For me, it's the hope I have to try to get WW to see the pain she's caused, to start coming out of the fog. After that, the only option is a Plan B.<p>But you should exhaust the options; I urge you to try Steve.

#999531 05/10/02 10:22 AM
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 109
C
Member
Member
C Offline
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 109
I know this has been said a hundred times, but why do we have to go through this!!!<p>I feel so bad for each person that shares their story here. I had not heard from Daniel before, so thanks for checking in, and good luck to you. But it just reminds me of how much sorrow there is out there. I am sorry that you had to sell your dream house, but I am heartened to hear that it has not left a bad mark on you. Good for you!<p>SC, I know, I need to talk to SH, I just feel too weak for it right now.

#999532 05/10/02 02:52 PM
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 10,816
2
Member
Member
2 Offline
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 10,816
Conan:<p>You should talk to a C (and though I haven't used one of the Harley's, I think calling one of them since we post to their site and use their "tools" makes good sense). You should talk to one as soon as possible. <p>When you feel "weak" is probably the best time to get this kind of help. How will you become strong if you don't have a live person to listen to you that understands?

#999533 05/10/02 07:25 PM
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 248
D
Member
Member
D Offline
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 248
Conan, I sometimes can't make it onto the computer, kids on it or homework to help with. I lurk here quite abit.
I answer when someone else is where I have been, or when I have to get my 2 cents in.
My wife called during her lunch and I need some advice but son is watching me now. Later.
Thanks. D.

#999534 05/10/02 07:47 PM
Joined: Jun 2000
Posts: 8,069
R
Member
Member
R Offline
Joined: Jun 2000
Posts: 8,069
Dear Conan,<p>Reading your story and words, my heart just breaks for you. I thought maybe if I posted BrambleRose's Profile story, that it perhaps would offer you hope and some strength.<p>I hope it's okay with Rosie that I have copied it here for you.<p>You are in my prayers,
Jo<p>**************************************************
BrambleRose's Story
Copied from MB Profile Thread in JFO<p>Well, I've been on this site for almost 6 months, and haven't gotten around to posting my story. I guess it's about time! Better get a BIG cup o java first tho, and settle in, cuz its long!!
I met my husband in 1986, our first week of college together. We dated (semi-engaged) 4 years (much of it long distance) and did not have sex because we were waiting for marriage. This fell to pieces when in 1989 he had sex with someone he met through his friends. <p>I decided to break up with him, he begged me not to leave and I stayed. He quit college, joined the Navy, and asked me to marry him as quickly as possible. We were married in Sept 1990.<p>His betrayal prior to our marriage caused us a lot of problems, mostly because I was expected to 'get over it' and he was tired of listening to me cry over it. If only I had known about the Harley's back then!! <p>Due to sexual problems as a result, his heavy drinking (I didn't know then that he was an alcoholic), and his long absences due to deployments, our relationship suffered a complete breakdown. I was miserable - in fact I can't ever remember being happy or fulfilled in our marriage - I seem to have always been waiting for some event or another to occur so we could start working on our marriage.<p>Money was always a problem. He spent more than we earned and I resented him for it. Much of his money was spent on booze. When I started tallying up the liquor purchases, I was able to add up $100 or more a month, NOT counting bar and restaurant tabs.<p>There may have been one night stands with prostitutes while he was on deployment overseas - at least my gut tells me that there was. I don't know. There was also another possible EA/PA with a woman in his squadron - he called me one night from Japan, hysterically in tears because she had aborted a baby (his?) that my H had asked me only a few days before if I would consider adopting with him.<p>We had 2 children early on, our oldest son born in 91, and the second son in 93. <p>He left the Navy in 95, and 4 months later, after we moved from the West Coast back to NJ to be near his family, I had a complete breakdown into depression. I don't mean the blues...I mean seriously dysfunctional, unable to carry on conversations with people, etc.<p>Unfortunately, my husband reacted by throwing himself into work, coming home in the evenings, locking himself in his office with a bottle of wine or whisky, and downloaded porn or played video games.<p>I wandered the internet til 5 or 6am most nights, slept a few hours, and got back up to spend the day on the computer. My internet life was more "real" and comforting than my real life, and I couldn't face reality.<p>I do believe that there was at least one EA during this time. A former co-worker of my H's was constantly calling and lying to me about who she was and what she wanted with my husband. It ended when I called her and told her to leave my H alone.<p>No one intervened - my inlaws thought I was lazy, my H's friends encouraged him to dump me and move on...no one thought to find out what was wrong...<p>Our children were so seriously neglected that had social services been alerted, they would have taken them from us. It was awful. <p>One day, I finally hit bottom. I woke up and realized that I wanted to die. If my H had been a responsible and good father, maybe I would have killed myself. But he wasn't. He was horrible to them, and horrible to me, and I didn't know who would care for them. So I made a decision to get better. But I didn't know how. But just the act of deciding meant that things started improving.<p>I got on anti-depressants, started to feel better, then my 19 year old sister died in a hiking accident. My H lost a $250k a year contract with a major firm in the area, due to a merger. The next year was hell, because he went to work at a job that turned to a nightmare, and I was struggling with my depression and grief over my sister. We turned in on each other, ripping each other to shreds rather than supporting each other.<p>It was then that I picked up a book called "Codependent NoMore" and read about myself on every page. I called my mom and said, "Mom, I think I'm married to an alcoholic." And to which she replied, "I've wondered that, and I'm just learning about alcoholism myself because MY dad was one, and I'm learning that me and your dad may have passed on those dysfuncions to you." <p>I took the kids and fled to WA state to live with my parents for the summer of 98. At my mother's suggestion, I started Al-Anon (thank you God) and also started therapy.<p>At the end of the summer I decided to go home and try to save my marriage. We did do some joint counseling which went no where. Unfortunately, things devolved into my struggling to work on myself and keep house and deal with all of the issues surrounding my neglect of everything and nonstop fights with my husband who resented my Al-Anon meetings and felt outraged that I thought he was an alcoholic. I slept on the couch most nights because I couldn't bear to be touched by him - because most nights I'd catch him downloading porn and masturbating. This wasn't an occaisional thing...it was an every day thing.<p>Finally, I was ready to separate. I told him I was moving out with the kids, and he begged me to instead help him to buy a house, and that if I did, he would go to counseling with me and we would put our marriage first. <p>With this promise, I threw myself into getting us moved and getting our first 'owned' home set up. We moved in Sept 99. For the first time in our marriage I could paint, fix, decorate, and no one stood by telling me not to waste my money on a rental!! <p>Sept, Oct, and then November went by. I wanted to start counseling. My H started disappearing every weekend. I cried, I threatened, I pleaded, I did everything I could think of to get him to stay home. He refused. The porn continued, the drinking continued, the spending continued.<p>I began to work very hard on my 12-step program at this point. I began trying to learn to detach, to be kind to my H, and to let him go. I started looking very hard at my own contributions to the mess of our marriage, and I started trying to correct my faults. In MB terms, I was doing a plan A.<p>In January I began to realize he was probably having an affair. I tried to give him the benefit of the doubt. I worked on me. At the end of the month, he disappeared with our son for an entire day. That night he walked into the house, son standing there, and announced "I got an apartment". <p>The next day, our very upset 8 year old told me that he had a new best friend but Papa told him not to tell me about it. I sat my son down and said "sweetie, any time you are told to lie to me - thats when it's most important to come tell me!"<p>His new best friend was the son of a nice woman that he and papa spent the day with and went to dinner with.<p>Well, all hell broke lose, but they were 'just friends'. So much for my plan A!! (I didnt know about MB yet). A week later I found a cell phone message from this woman gushing "Hi Babe, your wallet fell out of your pants"...<p>So in Feb, after 9 years of sheer hell, I told my H that he had to move out until he got help for his problems. I wanted him to go to therapy, go to parenting classes, and to pull his act together. I told him that he was destroying me and the kids, and I couldn't let that go on anymore. I told him that he could come home when he had gotten help.<p>But I didn't know that on the other side...his OW was encouraging him to move out and move on with his life.<p>Regardless, we spent the next month before his move date at peace with each other. I let go of my anger and resentments - and just tried to love him. We spent many hours together watching moves, smoking cigars together, and just having fun. We had the very best sex of our entire marriage that month. <p>He moved out on March 1st, 2000. On March 14th, I discovered that I was pregnant! On March 19th, after standing me and the kids up on his birthday, he told me that our marriage was over and he had no intention of getting help - that I was the crazy one, and that he was incredibly happy now that he was away from me. I was also accused of lying about my pregnancy to manipulate him (he was in the bathroom when I took the test, but I supposedly used sleight of hand to pour my pregnant SIL's urine on the tester!).<p>It wasn't until mid-April that I discovered hard proof of his affair. We had yet another riproaring fight. In May I took him with me to the OBGYN so he could hear the baby's heartbeat. No more accusations of lying - now I was told that I had gotten pregnant to trap him.<p>During these months I struggled with my Al-Anon sponsor to learn to detach, to let go, and to treat him with respect whenever I saw him.<p>In June after dealing with his threats to take me to court to allow him to see the kids at the OW's house...I told him that I was filing for divorce. That I could not be married while he was with another woman. He said fine. 2 weeks later he came and told me that he had broken it off with the OW, and that would I please hold off on the divorce until after the baby was born. He wasn't asking to reconcile, he just wanted to find a way to have a friendship with me, help me through the rest of the pregnancy, and to learn to be a better dad.<p>I agreed, with the condition that there were NO other women, no dating, no girlfriends. I told him I could not tolerate being married to him for any longer any other way.<p>A month went by peaceably....until he diseappeared for 4 days and I discovered that he had taken the OW to Cape Cod. The next week I discovered emails at his office that detailed the OW's plan for his divorce of me. It outlined for him how to hide his income from me, how to get the kids away...etc.<p>I cut contact with my H immediately. On August 26, I retained a lawyer. On Sept 6 I turned in my paperwork. On Sept 13th, I signed my divorce complaint. On Sept 15th (our 10 year anniversary) I ended up with severe nerve damage in my back and left leg as a complication with my pregnancy. I was forced to call my H for emergency help from the hospital.<p>And at that point, I had no choice but to accept his help. I was disabled, in severe pain, and had 2 months to go in my pregnancy. We called a truce. <p>He came almost every night to help me with the kids (sorta). We agreed to disagree on everything else and to refrain from discussions.<p>We got along very well...he swore that he had broken off with the OW again because of her objections to his helping me. With the understanding that she was out of his life (she was an OB nurse, and I had found out that he was telling her details of my pregnancy), I allowed him to be present at the birth of our daughter.<p>I found out much later that this was a lie. He called her the very next day.<p>Anyway, (gawd this is getting long-winded) he continued being very involved in our lives (me and the kids) coming home almost everynight to sleep in my bed with the baby. In December, as I started recovering, we started to talk about possibly reconciling. It was then that I found MBs, and I asked him to read the basic concepts. I asked him, "If you could be convinced that we could be happy together, would you stay?" And he said, "Yes, absolutely." He agreed to try MB, and told me to go ahead and make an appt with Steve Harley. <p>And the very next day...I got a phone call from a co-worker of his, looking for "ow". He'd just started a brand new job as VP at a new company, and no one knew about his marital status. I discovered from this co-worker that my H had taken his OW to the company Christmas party. The co-worker was completely embarrassed, not knowing that my H was married, and was just wanting to return some items that the OW had left at the party. I had asked my H to take me to this party, and he had sworn spouses werent allowed. <p>So yet again, I immediately cut contact. He responded by storming my answering machine with pleas. He called his mother in desperation and told her that the last few months had been wonderful and he didnt want to lose his family. He told me on the answering machine that he realized that he loved me, he wanted our marriage and that he would do whatever it took, including going to AA. He apologized over and over for his stupidity with OW, and promised no contact.<p>Recovery - so I thought. But the backpedalling happened within 24 hours. He refused to go to AA, told me he'd work on the marriage but that he didn't need AA. So I gave in, I was so desperate for my marriage to survive.... We kept our appt with Steve Harley. I started plan Aing and trying to follow Steve's advice and doing whatever i saw in the MB books that applied to my situation.<p>3 months went by, he quit seeing Steve, and things deteriorated btwn us. Lies and disappearances started occuring. Steve told me in January to go to Plan B, but I didnt have the courage to do it. But I pondered it daily. I worked on a plan B letter, and worked on trying to fix myself. I wrote my H a long heartfelt apology for all of the terrible things I had done to him during our marriage. He later told me that all of my Plan A, my apology, my love letters, my admiration, my openness to him sexually, was all a giant manipulation.<p>I started praying about Plan B. I asked God to send me a sign. The next day I found a message on my answering machine of him driving a giggling woman home at 1am. He swore he was just helping a woman with a broken down car. I cut contact after sending him my plan B letter. Plan B lasted all of one week. He fought it hard too. He finally showed up at the house, and swore that I had "won", he really wanted to commit now, etc - but still, the refusal to go to AA.<p>I told him I'd have to think about his promises, because I was really exhausted and not ready to get back on the roller coaster. During those next couple of days, I prayed and thought. A week later, he was still saying that he'd give me everything I wanted...and so I really started to give in...BUT, I went to his work to get some money from him. In his car, I found an email detailing his arrangements for a date with a woman, the same night I had gotten that voicemail. I confronted him, and he swore that he had done nothing wrong because there was no emotional attachment with her and he had never emotionally reconnected with me. Huh!?!<p>Again he swore he was ready to commit. I called Steve Harley and told him this latest development, and Steve told me that my marriage was over. That he could only recommend that I re-open my divorce to protect myself legally. Steve stayed on the phone with me late into the night that night - he's really a fantastic man and marriage coach. There was nothing to be done, unless my husband got treated for alcoholism - and Steve told me that even if my H started immediately into AA that my H would make so many mistakes, and do so much more damage to me, that our marriage wouldnt have a chance. At this point, I knew in my heart that Steve was right, but I didn't want to accept it.<p>I threw out plan A then, and love busted big time. I broke into his cell phone account, started pouring over the records. I started contacting women, and discovered 3 different women he had dated while we were 'in recovery'. He HAD kept his word about the OW, her number wasn't on there. After I confirmed woman #3, I stopped checking. I'm sure I would have discovered others. I was just too sick to my stomach.<p>I called my lawyer and had my H served. It's really over. I'm actually at peace with my decision.<p>I love my H with all my heart. I really do. But I also know that I can not be married to him like this, and the work I have done with Al-Anon, MB and Steve Harley have taught me what marriage and love and relationships are really about. I never had a real marriage at any point in time. <p>I pray for my husband every night with our children. I hope I can navigate through this divorce without making too many mistakes. I haven't kept up the plan B - I'm really at the point in acceptance that I can see my H, and not be too upset. I'm calm and at peace.
**************************************************<p>Needless to say, Rosie's story was not complete. She and her H are now in REAL recovery, I think they are approximately 1 year in recovery.<p>[ May 10, 2002: Message edited by: Resilient ]</p>

#999535 05/12/02 11:24 PM
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 109
C
Member
Member
C Offline
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 109
Resilient,<p>When I first started reading your message, I thought you were telling me to throw in the towel. But is it true that you are showing me a story worse than mine and saying even it worked out?<p>Please clarify... my fog is kinda thick right now.<p>thanks.

Page 1 of 2 1 2

Moderated by  Fordude 

Link Copied to Clipboard
Forum Search
Who's Online Now
0 members (), 618 guests, and 77 robots.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Newest Members
Roger Beach, clara jane, LoneWolf59, leemc, smmpanel24
72,019 Registered Users
Latest Posts
How important is it to get the whole story?
by BrainHurts - 07/16/25 11:38 AM
Following Ex-Wifes Nursing Schedule?
by Roger Beach - 07/16/25 04:21 AM
My wife wants a separation
by Roger Beach - 07/16/25 04:20 AM
Spying husband arrested
by coooper - 06/24/25 09:19 AM
Annulment reconsideration help
by Oren Velasquez - 06/16/25 08:26 PM
Forum Statistics
Forums67
Topics133,624
Posts2,323,515
Members72,019
Most Online6,102
Jul 3rd, 2025
Building Marriages That Last A Lifetime
Copyright © 2025, Marriage Builders, Inc. All Rights Reserved.
Site Navigation
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 8.0.0