Copied from thread "Plan B - can it work". I was curious for a response to this point.

My (recovering?) WS says she sometimes has an ofoverwhelming feeling of panic or a desire to run away. That she feels she needs to just run out the door and find some space to be on her own from time to time. Then when she does think about being away from home or goes out somewhere, has a craving to be back with me and our home. She says its a feeling of being caged or trapped but she doesn't understand this craziness and is struggling to understand what is going on in her head.

She says that during the A sometimes she was not actually with OM but getting off somewhere on her own. So, some of the times I was thinking she was with him she was actually just chilling out on her own.

Interestingly, I know that she used to have similar feelings when she was a child. We have spoken about this long before her A so I know it isn't just the current situation. I used to think it was mostly to do with her turbulent upbringing - her father had numerous A's which drove her mom crazy at times with 4 young daughters to care for. My W as a child used to run away to friends and relatives when things got a little too difficult to cope with at home. May be related to this, may be not.

Are there any WS's out there had similar feelings?
Are you a BS that has been told anything similar?
Is she doing something underhand or just as mad as a hatter?
Is it just the past haunting her?
Maybe its too complicated an issue to deal with here?

It is confusing the heck out of me so I can only imagine what it could be doing to her.

Any thoughts?

Call the Harleys while you still have time to save your marriage. Scrape up the money and see if she will talk to them.

Yes, she may have a caged feeling because her marriage is interferring with her affair.

<< Yes, she may have a caged feeling because her marriage is interferring with her affair. >>

LOL yes that is one of my fears...

From my other thread you might see a bit more of this and the fact that she seems to be trying to sort things.

My real Q is whether this is a common symptom of recovery or whether it is just her.

As I mentioned, she had these same feelings long before the A so it is quite possible it is totally different issue.

I asked on the other thread whether its poss to get counselling from the Harleys via something like MSN, Skype etc. since we are not in US. Anyone tried this?

I don't know if it's common but I've heard it expressed as "fight or flight". I've felt it a few times myself during all of this. In fact, I've felt it several times in my life. It WOULD be so much easier huh, just run away, forget everything. Maybe it is more common than people admit. Your wife just admits it.

She may have had these feelings for a long time. Too bad she didn't get counseling instead of finding an affair partner.

She may be going through the empty nest syndrome. She may have FOO issues. You may not have met her EN's.

But it is clear that she must end all contact with the OM and put her energy toward working on the marriage.

See if she will agree to speak to the Harleys.

You are doing well right now, but could lose your love for her almost overnight.

I feel this way alot but i am a BS. I think it is more of running away from the responsibilities of the real world and into the fantasy world that so many WS fall into. My feeling is more of running away from the reality I have to now face not really my real world responsibility.

I know that people all over the world have done the phone counseling, but not sure how.

Here is what it says on the home page -

For calls made from outside North America, please call 011-651-762-8570 for additional information.

Well, we've analysed the heck out of the A and I'm pretty confident that the A came from me not meeting her EN of affection.

Working long hours, working away from home, in fact, working far too much and jumping down her throat at times when she was looking for affection. I'm sure I'm not the only guy that ever did that but was naive as to where it would lead. The problem is that while I was failing to meet her need for affection, Mr OM was telling her how his W would never be affectionate toward him so the two of them hit it off.

There are also some SF probs as well but nothing that couldn't be sorted with a little effort. Before the A our sex life was pretty good but could have been better. Putting it another way, if I hadn't failed her need for affection the SF one would never have been realized and filled.

So, in a nutshell we know what caused the A but there was issues before it even started. We can fix them but the A itself has caused an even bigger issue.

We really would like to consult to the Harleys direct but it's difficult from the UK.

<<edit>>
Crossposted Believer - thank you for the number

Yes, whatever else is going on, the main problem NOW is the affair and her contact with the OM.

All the rest can be fixed. But she may not be too willing to really work on the marriage and get her feelings back for YOU when he is still in the picture.

Yes, it's very common for a WS to say they 'just need space' and want to run off. Have you read SAA? The story of Jon and Sue pretty much nails it. Sue flip flops back and forth between wanting to be home and not. It's not Recovery.

Yes I've read the book, got the t shirt and all...

There's a long story behind my WS's A in a couple of other threads but it was this one issue that I wondered about.

It is possible she's still in contact with OM and this is a way of providing a cover for future "run-offs" but I don't buy that theory. My instincts are about 80-90% sure she's not carrying on the A and this is a different issue cos it's something that has arisen at various times through the time I've known her.

It doesn't really relate directly to the J&S story. She is saying that she sometimes FEELS like running still; she doesn't actually do it now but she did do it at times during the A. In other words, on an occasional few of the times I assumed she was going to see OM she was actually just going off for a drive or sitting in a park. She is prob telling me the truth cos there is no reason to lie about what's already happened. She's not denying having seen the OM on most of those disappearances but, wants me to know that a few of the times, she wasn't. She says doesn't understand at all why she has often felt like this and wants me to try and work this out with her.

When was the last time she saw him, talked to him, or had any kind of contact with him?

Believer,

AFAIK on or about 8th Oct - she ran into him at work and had an argument, he accused her of letting him down (seeing as he had left his W for her!) then she came home and cried on my shoulder. Like I give a toss what happens to him!

I know she called him up briefly on 20th Oct but didn't connect the call (I spyed on her cellphone bill without her knowing - a 4 sec call which she had already told me abt).

All evidence says she ain't spoken to him since then and she swears to me she has not.

Ther could be covert stuff going on but if i aint meant to know it can always be hidden.

She also swears that she loves me and he is out of her life for good.

Why do you ask?

WW ran into him at work. Many a BH wants to ignore that WW and OM can never be allowed to work together any more. Can not have NC if they work at the same place.

TR - I thought we had this convo before. She doesn't work with him at all but the nature of where she works means that there is a possibility she might run into him. I can't give you any more details for reasons of privacy but there is no more danger of her bumping into him than any people that live and work in the same town.

Of course, moving home and transferring jobs is on the agenda but doesn't happen too quickly esp. in this current financial climate.

I suppose I could lock her in the closet until then but I don't think that would help.

There have got to be limits to how far someone can go!

Nothing explains her feelings of running before the A either. That's the bit that I find most difficult to work out right now.

Hey y'all, I aint posted for a bit but just wanted to give an update.

Well, we're still living together. She swears she has had no contact with OM since October.

She's in the process of a transfer of job and we are talking regularly and getting on great.

I feel we're making progress and definitely coming together. Building on our relationship and getting on better than we have for years. She has started to become a lot more affectionate and open about her life now.

However, I am not naiive enough to think it is all sweetness and light without a lot more work.

There is a lot more to how things have happened over the past 6 weeks but maybe I'll post these up if anyone is interested in the story...

Thanks all for your input and help so far.

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Of course we are interested. What's been happening in the last 6 weeks?

Here's the update:

Uh oh...
Spoke to soon.

First let me explain whats happened.

For the most part of of November we got on great. She kept re-assuring me that she had NC with OM and that she doesn't want to have anything more to do with him.

There was a little episode in late November when her car got trashed. Seriously trashed! Someone smashed all the glass and mirrors, scratched up the paint on every panel then has poured a gallon of white gloss paint across the whole car. Bearing in mind the car is deep purple it didnt look too smart after. I think she knows more about that than she is letting on but at least she did report it to the police with me. Personally I think it was done by OMW. Anyway, she was due for a new car so we went out and got one for her. Hopefully this new one won't be recognized and she will be safe. I dont like the idea of someone confronting her with a risk of physical harm. Maybe I was wrong to buy the car for her but she knows I did it to protect her and I've said that the car is owned by my company on paper so if we ever split it goes back to the firm.

Her job situation - she was looking for the transfer we spoke about and something did eventually come up which she has applied for. It is also a promotion & a little more cash so it would be good news for her all round. She will know by end of Jan if she's got it.

Anyway over the weeks we have been trying to do things together. Prepping for Christmas has been fun. Christmas shopping trips together and wrapping presents. We have also been laughing and playing, going out to eat a lot too. I still caught her shedding a tear or two here and there. She has also been open enough to tell me how she feels abt OM and admits that she still feels a lot of love for him but knows that he isn't the person for her in the long term and she loves me very much although there is still that spark missing from our relationship that she still feels for him.

One of the things we do together and have done for a couple of years is go to the gym almost every day. Four weeks ago, on a Saturday we went down to the gym as usual. Having a real good time actually, laughing and joking. Chatting about silly stuff all the way there and went through our usual workout. When we came out of the gym she said that she said she wanted to show me something. We were in her car and she was driving so I apprehensively said OK and we laughed and joked as we went about our journey for a few miles.

We stopped at a place about 3 or 4 miles away at some appt blocks Ive never seen before. She wouldnt tell me anythin but got out of the car with me and we walked holding hands into one of the blocks where she walked into a first floor appt with a key. I instantly recognised some of the stuff in there. Furniture, ornaments and pictures that had recently gone missing from our home which I was told she had thrown out.

She then told me that she'd had this place for some weeks since (8th October) and had been prepping it. She told me that she hadnt said anything up til then cos she didnt know what to do, back and forth with the keys as she had told me she had done. She then announced that she was going to stay there for a bit to get to know herself. I told her that I was disappointed she had been deceitful again. I thought she had really betrayed me again after all had been said, I was sickened and walked out. As I walked up the road to get a taxi she came past in the car and told me she was gonna go home so I should hop in - I did and we went home in silence. She stayed home that week but said that she would go back to the appt to stay there at the end of the week.

On the following Saturday we had a conversation where she again talked about having these feelings to run and find her own space. She Said she was going to have to do this for her own peace of mind and then may know what she wants from life. She went over to the appt and I agreed to pop around later to drop some stuff off, put a curtain rail up for her and fix the TV aerial. I did all this and after she started freaking out screaming at me that I didnt love her and that I couldn't wait to get rid of her. Again confused, I got up and walked. As I drove out of the appt block she ran up crying saying that she wanted to come home and make everything alright. I said that she needed to sort her life out. I told her I would support her in whatever she decides as long as she can promise to never bullsh*t me again and that the A is over. She had a cry and we cuddled in the car then she went up to get most of her stuff. We drove home, ate and went to bed and hugged and kissed all night which was nice.

Since then we have got on fine. We've been sending each other little messages on SMS. Buying nice little gifts and at Christmas we got some nice sentimental things for each other, spent a lot of time together and really enjoyed the time we had together. Our son spent a little bit of time with us at home but we didn't really visit any other relatives spending most of the time enjoying each other's company. New year's we sepnt driving out to a local hillside viewpoint and overlooking the town where we kissed as we watched the fireworks and lights. Just the two of us it was very nice and we giggled most of the way home though we did sadly have a convo about the situation where she said she still felt like running.

New years day she came to me and said that we have to make a new start in the new year. That she was going to try to move back into the appt and stay there. I was disappointed but again said that I would support whatever she wanted to do as long as it is just us and OM is nowhere in the picture. She explained that its really nothing to do with him and she just wants to find herself. Anyway, she went and is now living there. She pops in to see me most days to visit the dog and yesterday we sat and chatted about things where she said that she is taking the time to think about us but nothing else. When asked she also swore that OM is not even a factor in any of it, that he is history though she did admit to being tempted to send him a txt msg to say hi.

I'm still at home on my own of course. Never had to be home alone before and it is quite lonely. I chat to my friends on the phone a lot and Sunday night I went out for a beer with a friend but most of my time so far has been in my own company thinking about things. She still sends me the sweet little messages on SMS and I usually reciprocate. This week is proving hard though. Especially nights alone in the bed.

My own confusion at this time is not knowing how to handle this situation. Do I just let her run the show and support her? Do I cut the contact with me? Do I change the locks or tell her to avoid coming round? Should I try to treat this like a Plan B scenario?

Not quite sure how to handle this for the best. What I am a little concerned about is that we seemed to be getting very much closer when she was at home and I fear this may damage the recovery.

What do you guys think?

Sorry for your pain, Bob. MY WS expressed the same things about needing to run. While home, he filled free time with outside activities that did not include me -- like golfing with his buddies. Anything to stay away from me, the kids, and home. And I gave him space to deal with withdrawls.

Fast forward -- two days after Christmas. Walks in and says "Let me go. I'm miserable here." After several hours of talking, crying, confusion -- he walks out door to see OW and returns 24 hours later to get his stuff. Haven't heard from him or seen him in a week. Dark Plan B in effect.

I swear I couldn't have kept him from leaving unless I physically restrained him. The lure of OW was (and is) so addicting. I can't understand it.

As for the running, he said that when he and her are together, he just focuses on her -- no golf or friends or anything else. When home, he wants out. And the stuff he does with her (movies, concerts, trips) are the things I've suggested we do. the problem is that he just doesn't want to do them with ME.

Bigbob,

I think you have already answered your own question. You said
Coping mechanisms developed as children are often brought into adulthood, unless they are addressed. I have not read anything but what you have posted here, but I would guess that the A, and her overwhelming need to run away are in fact coping mechanisms. They are very poor coping mechanisms but they are what she has used and will use unless she gets counseling to address these things AND she develops other more healthy coping mechanisms.

YOu may not realize it, but if you read the articles here, you will see a whole list of coping mechanisms that are far more healthy. They include the policies of radical honesty and surely the policy of joint agreement, POJA. I would also suggest that meeting each others needs is also a coping mechanism.

She needs to exmaine this and make a decision to change how she copes with stress.

God Bless,

JL

Thank you JL thats one of the most useful, lucid and constructive posts I've had.

Interestingly she did seek counselling help for this problem a year before the affair and the advice was that if she feels to run off she should just go and leave me behind regardless of the cost. I thought that was irresponsible of them to tell someone unstable and in a state of depression to run off on their own but hey I'm not a professional.

She feels very against getting any more help in counselling right now though which makes thing awkward but I think she might talk to the Harleys. We need to make more definite plans in this respect

She came around to see us this evening and has said that she wants to come home at the weekend. I'm even more split now.

Do I agree or would it be better for her to stay away a bit?

All further input would be gratefully received.

Thanks again,

Bob

She needs to overcome this fear and if possible you need to help her.

You say she ran away from things at home when she was younger. Did her parents smother her or not pay enough attention?


ETA: I ask only out of curiosity.

Hey Bob! I haven't had time to post here, but checked in, saw your update, and here is a very quick response. I think what your W is doing is pure bullsh!! After my H's A I knew that what I wanted if I stayed with H was to be with a man, not a little boy. Your W is playing the little girl role very well.

I am a counselor who presently am working with kids and their families. Lately I have been making this comparison with my families to this dog trainer on TV called Victoria. Ever see her? Anyhoo, Victoria will take these magnets with everyone in the family's pictures on it, including the dog. Then she asks the family who has the power? Who is the top dog? I've been asking my families the same question. Usually it's maybe a 6 or 11 year old kid who is totally running the family. Total chaos! I look at them and think, "How did this happen? How is this 11 yr old running circles around this entire family, and everyone's jumping through hoops."

So I listen to your story, including the kissing and the cuddling, and am thinking your WW is really doing a great job keeping you totally stuck. JMHO here! If you want to let her have her own space, fine, but at least have some deadline in your head. Don't let her string you along indefinitely. Personally I would not give her an option as to whether she wants therapy. I'd have it be a condition for you "MAYBE" allowing her back into your life. I don't know, whacky WSs drive me a little crazy! Even crazier is when I see nice BSs like yourself getting walked all over by their whackiness.

It was a very difficult childhood for her. Her Father had numerous A's and left mom at home to fend for herself with four girls. When he used to come home, there would be violent arguments and police called etc...
Didn't help that her elder sister has mental probs either. Bipolar and always in trouble with police too.
All of the sisters apart from my W ended up in care at some point.
I think our marriage was a real comfort to her as she got stability which she never had at home.

BigBob,

I like CV's comments. I have a thought for you to consider. If you think that her problem is coping mechanisms and I certainly do or I would not have posted that to you, then perhaps you need to show her what I wrote or compose something that simply asks her the questions: "Isn't there a better way to handle our problems than running away?"

You cannot educate her that is for sure, but you can plant seeds of thought that might get her thinking about alternative ways to address her problems and by definition YOUR problems. This may take awhile and require many conversations, but I think it might help her.

As for the counselor she went to, that counselor should have the license removed. "If it makes you feel better do it." is not counseling, it is enabling. I wonder if they would feel so charitable with someone feeling better if it made them feel better to burn the counselors house down? Somehow I doubt it.

I would seek recommendations for a real counselor, and I would recommend that you interview this counselor. Do all of this before you even mention counseling to your W. There is no need for her to go unless and until she wants to address her problems. She is not there yet, she is just running.

If you can stop the running and start her thinking even if you don't like what she thinks I believe that she might then be more ameanable to counseling, IF YOU HAVE ACTUALLY FOUND A GOOD COUNSELOR.

Just thoughts. Hope they help.

God Bless,

JL

Hi again JL / CV

Yes Im certain it's a coping mechanism too; she has always done it. Previously on her own or with friends but this time she picked a friend she was very much attracted to!

How to change that behaviour?

In brief I know I need to achieve 2 goals
1. Take control of my our situation by stopping her demands and indecisiveness.
2. Get her to understand and get help to modify these coping mechanisms.

She came round to me a short while ago today. She still says she wants to come back at the weekend. I still havent agreed to it as I'm not sure whether I should. I'm torn between trying to help her and being taken for granted / a mug.

She may well now be open to the idea of some counselling and I will approach her with your ideas JL. Also find a good counsellor in our area. The previous one was a local girl appointed by her employer. I didnt really think that she was particularly skilled and I think rather just looking out for the interests of the employer. Looking back I think she was at the tail end of seeing this counsellor when she embarked upon the A so what fantastic counselling huh?

No doubt I will talk to her at some point tomorrow and I'll mention the running as a coping mechanism to gauge a reaction. I'll see her reaction to further counselling too.

Much love to all for your concern and help.

Bob

Seeing how she has her own apartment....how do you know the OM hasn't visited?

Hi ILF, the short answer is that I don't of course.

Why do you ask, is this of any great relevance at this point in time?

As far as cheap calling, I use yahoo instant messenger. I loaded 25 dollars on it, use my PC as a phone with a headset with mic, and it costs 1 cent a minute. International will cost a bit more, but still the cheapest route.

It seems like this may help you talk with the Harleys.

Good luck. Been in your shoes awhile myself.

Hi, BB. I'm a FWW and yes, I've had these feelings. I don't know that I use running as a coping mechanism -- in fact I'm not known as one who will back down from a necessary confrontation. I'm more fight than flight. But when it relates to my infidelity, I want to run.

When the PA this year ended, I was all alone. FOM and I were in NC after his W found out, and I hadn't disclosed my cheating to anyone but my once-a-week IC. Everyone I looked at and everything I did reminded me of the liar and betrayer I was. It was hell. I don't deserve sympathy. Just want you to know the feelings were overwhelming. I had my first ever anxiety attack at age 42 and I was out of control. I wanted to be alone. I avoided friends, I would drive in circles around town, I would pretend to be working in my home office... I believed I was the scum of the earth and looking at people whom I knew trusted and loved me only exacerbated my self-disgust and pain. I finally asked my parents to watch our kids while H was out of town and holed up in a condo we rent for three days. It was during those days that I posted my first post on MB. Through the support of so many here, I mustered the strength and confessed everything to my H. Hardest thing I've ever done to begin healing from the worst thing I've ever done.

As I mentioned, I agree with others that running is her coping mechanism and she needs professional help addressing this reaction for all areas of her life. From my vantage point, I can see where even though you hopefully know everything, you still represent her ultimate guilt. In my case, my H does know everything and therefore unfortunately represents bad and good. His presence alone reminds me of what I did, how low I sunk, how bad I can be, my deception, and everything I may still lose if we don't make it. One can feel bad only so long until they turn it around, give up, or get away. There are still days, 7+ months since the PA ended and almost 3 months past d-day, that I am compelled to run. But H represents good too, which thankfully wins out in the end. His response to my confession has been undeservedly amazing and he now represents safety, affection, SF, comfort, strength, our family, financial security, the love I want, and more.

So yes, I can understand her conflict here, even though it's not my own personal MO.

I think you're a good man, BB, to want to do anything for this woman whom you still love and want to stay with. Take advice from the vets on here -- they rock. My only advice for you is to make sure you have boundaries. What those boundaries are need to be determimned by you (others here may guide you) and it'll be up to you to enforce them.

I wish you only the best.

Hey L4 thank you for your post. It's really quite good to hear from someone who has has experienced something similar. Perhaps gives me an insight to my WW's way of thinking. I know you said that you are not looking for sympathy but i think you deserve a little. All of us make mistakes and you clearly recognise what happened was just that. It is also clear that you are a sensible person who has a good loving family - you deserve some peace and bliss.

As for me, I think I am going to see where this takes us and set a date in about a week when we can go out to talk. Mention that in that talk we can discuss whether she should come home or not (ie set the boundaries and make a target). I was thinking maybe go for to a restaurant and sit and chat about the way forward after 7 days. In the meantime she can continue to experience her life as a single person (but knowing that I do still love her) and I can research the counselors in the area and see if we can give her some options at that time.

All of this is clearly tearing her to pieces, especially if she is going through all of the same emotions as L4. The frustrating thing is that as much as I would like to just help her through this I feel some of it is a journey she needs to do on her own. All I can do is be there as an example of the strength she needs.

As for whether the A is continuing only time will tell but hopefully being on her own for this time will help her see where she wants to be.

Lets see how we get on later today...

Hi all,

Sorry its taken a little while to post but life has been busy and lots has happened.

Last week we had a chat as I said I would and I sowed her a copy of the msg from L4. She read that and said apart from the fact that OM hadnt gone back to his W, the situation was pretty much exactly as described. That was a pretty accurate description of her feelings (tyvm L4 :o) ) She also agreed to some counselling in principal and also to let me find that counsellor for her.

That day she went back to the appt on her own (by mutual agreement) and we arranged to go out on the following Saturday to have a chat and perhaps make a fun night of it.

On Saturday she met me at home and we went off to a restaurant for a meal then after went to see a movie. We had a really good time and done a lot of talking about us but also had a lot of laughs too.

On the serious side I told her that it was decision time; that she had to make up her mind. She could either come home and do all the things I had asked to start a repair process or remain living away from home but this time I wanted no contact with her until she either wanted to come back or wanted a D. I told her that I loved her and really wanted her home but I wanted all or nothing and the procrastinating has to end. I asked her to think about it and talk to me the following day (Sunday) when she was coming round to take the dog out.

Sunday came and when she came round she had very little to say. She was clearly very tired (having already told me she had not slept for thinking about our situation) and just sat in silence then while I was busy making dinner, she fell asleep on the sofa. I woke her and told her to go and have a proper sleep on the bed which she did and I was pleased to see her catch up on her sleep in a settled way. Later in the evening I woke her again toeat and told her that I needed to know where we are and that she needed to decide so that she could either go back to her appt or be sure about our future. She didnt answer and decided to just get up and go back to the appt. I was disappointed but not particularly surprised.

At 4am I was sitting in bed unable to sleep when there was a knock at the door. It was her and she came in crying. She said that she wanted to come home and knew where her head and her heart was - that she knew it is me she loves. I said that this can only happen if she is sure and wanted to be here and that it was going to take a lot of work. She said she agreed to all I had asked and just wanted to be home with me. We went to bed and both slept well in each others arms.

Since Monday morning we have both been very busy and not had a chance to talk much further but I know there is a lot of ground rules we need to agree on. I will probably do this on Friday this week as we will both be off work. What we have spoken about is the fact that we are both determined to make our marriage work but not quite sure how to take the next steps. She also knows that she needs to get some counselling but not sure the best way to go about this. I was going to speak to my counsellor and see if he has any recommendations - it would clearly not be healthy to be seeing the same chap as me!

My question to you all now is how best to proceed from here? Do I get her to look at the rules from HNHN now? Do I wait until after she has had counselling? Maybe it is best to contact the Harleys right now (even tho it will be expensive).

I am certain she means our M to work for us now but not sure what or how to go about things if indeed we need to do anything other than just give each other time.

Buuuuuuuump

Hi Bigbob,

I haven't read your thread before, and I haven't read anything yet except your last post - but as soon as I have a chance, I intend to read the whole thing, and I'll probably have more to say that's on point then. I did want you to know that somebody's read your latest.

I think it sounds fantastic that your wife decided to come home! Congratulations!

As for the next step... I think that talking to the Harleys (Steve or Jennifer) is always a sound move... although I understand it is expensive, they can help you both come up with a recovery plan to restore the love and rebuild the marriage.

HNHN is a good book, I also recommend Love Busters.

I guess I'll have more to say after I read your thread.

tyvm cc

Sry for the bump, I don't mean to be a pain but was hoping to get some feedback before we get to chat later today.

I've got HNHN and SAA and read both but she's not much of a reader

Still working on the counselling thing but not got very far yet.

Hi again!

Took me a minute to figure out what "tyvm" meant. I haven't seen that acronym before!

I like what Just Learning said about coping mechanisms. Have you brought that up with your wife?

I'm hoping you'll have good luck finding a counselor. I didn't realize before you were in England, so I can see how calling Harleys would be expensive... but I still think it may be worth it, at least once. But it sounds like you are also wanting her to get individual counseling - just make sure that it is good individual counseling.

I usually recommend the book "Love Busters", as I mentioned, because in most cases you get a bigger payoff by eliminating LBs before you put too much effort into meeting ENs. I like to use the analogy of a barrel... think of trying to fill your wife's love bank as akin to filling a barrel with water. Love Busters are like kicking holes in the barrel, and as long as there are holes in it, it won't ever fill up. HNHN has a chapter on love busters, so you've still got some info on them in what you've already got... but "Love Busters" goes into greater detail.

Apart from that, I've not got any specific suggestions, but I am very happy for you that your wife has chosen to reconcile instead of run. I hope she'll make the most of this chance to recover your marriage. I know you will.

Hi everyone, it's me again!

Well, I haven't posted for a long long while. Things have been rather hectic and as you may guess lots has happened.

Our lives have gone through all sorts of stresses and strains but in brief, she stayed home for a bit. After Christmas, she left and went back to her appt. She said it was to be alone and try to re-awaken her feelings for me but I suspected it was to spend some time with OM. I was of course correct and she did have him stay at the appt at least some nights.

In January we had a deja-vu where she promised it was all over and she came home. Told me that she wanted us to be good again blah blah blah...

In March it all went pear shaped again (am I seeing a pattern here d'ya think??) and she said that she was going to give up on us. By this time OM had found a place to live and she moved into his appt.

At that time I was weak, vulnerable and lonely. I met someone and was starting to see them on and off as a friend. I guess I was alone in the house and needed that - this person was very kind and understanding and helped me through. One weekend I went to stay with her at her place which is a few hours drive away. My W found out about me seeing this person and she went crazy. Accused me of not caring and tried to kill herself. I raced back from where I was to try and sort it all out and ended up in the ER at her side looking after her. Maybe it should have been OM looking after her but he told her that he needed to go to work and had disappeared.

Anyway, since then she has come home and told me she knows that its not OM she wants to be with and that she knows now that I am the person that she wants in her life. That he is history and she won't be seeing him again. Things had been real good. She was being more attentive and loving and I was respoinding. We were talking, spending time together, making plans for the future and generally starting to restart all of the things that we planned before the A.

However, the other day she was making dinner and said she was going out for some bread. I made like I wasn't paying too much notice and just said "fine honey, see you in a minute" but was suspicious. So I let her go, waited a few minutes then hopped into my car and drove round to OM's workplace. Well, there they were sitting in her car hugging. So I walked up and tapped on the window. She screamed at me to go away so I walked round to his window and spoke to him, asked him to wind down the window so we could talk. He just sat there stoney faced looking straight ahead. Refused to even look at me.

She started the car and tried to turn the car round. I stood in front and told her not to drive off so we could just all talk it through and sort things out there and then. At that point she drove her car into me and over me to get away. I managed to get back into my car and just drove home. She came back about a half hour later. She was crying and said that she only went there to arrange to pick up some belongings that were still at his appt. At that point I didn't even want to listen.

I wasn't badly hurt, just badly bruised and more upset. I thought the incident had given me a clear message that she was perfectly happy to run me down to protect him and her sordid little affair. Even now, so many months on she is still lying, still trying to perpetuate the situation and willing to risk my life to do so.

For her part, she says that it really wasn't anything and that although she is still friendly with him there is no physical or emotional relationship going on. That in any case, it was only a "one-off" meeting for practical purposes.

But I am not happy with this. I have told her that I love her and want things to be right between us and if she felt real love for me she would be able to remove this person from her life completely and totally. I really don't know if it really is a one-off meeting or whether she has been seeing him continually. I want to believe her but I don't!

Right now, I have an opportunity to move into another place. I know that I cannot put up with her having any future contact with this person. I could not deal with that at all.

My question is whether I just leave right now?
Do I accept this one incident as a one off and a bad experience then continue to work on things with her?
Should I just leave to give a real signal that I won't put up with it and serious about ending us if she won't do this for us?

If this were a one-off incident as she said it was, she wouldn't have committed a felony trying to run you over with the car to escape. That was a fear/flight response.

get the he77 away from her. Move out. This time don't go back. She could have killed you. I think you have done all that could be asked of you. She is a nut. And if you stay any longer, I would be concerned about your sanity.

My God Bob, do you have to die before you realize this woman doesn't care for anyone but herself?

You know what to do. Will you do it?

Or maybe you are here in hopes of finding one person tell you to stick it out so you can justify it?

Leave. she is too selfish and you are allowing her to cake eat

How could you even think of staying???

I'm not clear on when this assault happened. If it was recent (as in the last couple of days) you need to contact the police and report it. She is your enemy. I'm not sure what else needs to happen to show you this.

After what your WW has done ... if you are still even considering the above ... as a fellow BH, I must say ... "I'm embarrassed FOR YOU!!!".

It is simply outside of my comprehension how some of these MB BH's have so little self-respect that they are willingly settling for this level of abuse and humiliation.

Bob,

Seriously, the time for "giving signals" is over. She ran you over with a motor vehicle. Hello? After you held her hand in the ER while OM went to work?

This is crazy. Dude, you deserve so much better. She is gone.

You really need to protect yourself now financilly, legally and emotionally. Get this over with and protect yourself.

I think this may be the worst case of trying to protect the OP I have seen on these boards.

Ran you over with a car with the OM inside after telling you she was going to get bread, and you are thinking about giving her another chance.

Bob, seriously...

ETA: And no, I don't think there are any chapters in books on saving or building marriages entitled, "What to do/how to recover when your WW runs you over with the family car."

I agree! This woman is clearly not stable and I'd bet you $50 that contact with OM never ended... not just "contact" but "sexual contact". She's playing you AND him big time. You have to ask yourself the question at what point does she cross the line with you enough to say enough? I think that line was crossed way back before she ran you over.

I don't think I'd be moving out. I think I'd be taking a day off from work and filing for a divorce and a restraining order and changing the locks and locking down every dollar we ever thought of having.

THIS IS NOT THE TIME TO BE MISTER NICE-GUY!!!!

I'm a FWS and mostly will encourage BH or BW to keep holding on and fight for their M... especially where there seems to be some positive actions by the WS.
However having read your thread I felt something did not fit the pattern of behaviour your wife was showing and then clang your last post. It all fell into place.

Your WW has NEVER been in recovery she has been jumping between the OM and you as she feels like it. The affair never ended at all. I feel you need to accept this and face this sad fact. She has been betraying you all along.

She did not 'accidentally' run you over. That is easy to work out because if it was an accident why would she not jump out in horror and run over to you? Make sure you were not hurt or needing emergency aid?? For all she knew she had killed you.
No she just did not care!!!
I'm sorry but this has to be made clear to you... SHE DOES NOT CARE.... at least not enough to ensure you were ok after she ran you down and THAT is a pretty big sign that YOU need to have her out of your life.

Some actions ARE not and should not EVER be permitted to be put behind you. Your WS trying to cause you serious injury by running you over with a car certainly gets into that class.

No excuse of anger or flight fear can justify that action.

Due to my own position I rarely recommend a M to end... however sadly I feel you need to get away from this woman who was your wife. Your wife is gone. Will the wife ever return? ... well who knows. But what will you do when she tries to hurt you the next time? ...

You are no longer just dealing with a WS.. you are dealing with a person who actively attempted to seriously injure you.

Move away and keep her away even if it takes a VRO .....I suspect she will do another 'I'll kill myself' and if she does you should get the Police and medical staff involved.

I know this is easy for us here to say this but so much harder for you to do... but what is your alternative? keep going like this until you are in hospital or worse??

Sorry you are going through this as you deserve a lot better... frankly anyone does.

take care

I had the Wookie do the same thing to me - where he set up a household, then sprung it on me...

You need to let her go. All the way, let her go...

She knows she can play you and you need to kick her out of your sandbox onto her hinder.

She will NEVER attempt recovery otherwise.

And you need to file a police report on her a$$. This woman needs a wake up call in the worst way.

Shoot. We treat armadillos in Texas better than she treats you...at least we stop (usually) and make sure we just clipped it.

GAH!

Bob,

File a report on her assault with a deadly weapon on you. Then bag up all her belongings, change the locks and file for D and an RO against her. This woman is dangerous, mostly because she seems to have zero empathy or compassion. I am so sorry.

In total agreement. The solution is before you.

You are setting yourself up to

A. Get MORE injured
B. Get your @$$ handed to you in a divorce slanted in her favor.

Get off your butt and clean her clock, get a lawyer and get everything you possibly can from her.

Well, thanks for all your replies. I knew all of the above. As you all say, it's plain to see. I think just needed some strength and encouragement to see that leaving is the only thing to do.

Unfortunately, in the UK where I am the law is very different. I cannot throw her out as the house is 50/50 owned by her. The other thing is that a D here is a very different process. I have spoken to a lawyer and I'm afraid all I can do is walk. I have made arrangements to move out and go live somewhere else. A rented property about an hour's drive away. Once I've done that I CAN stop her coming to bother me there. I can THEN get a RO if she comes causing trouble.

I just need to let go of someone I have loved for nearly 30 years. We have always had a very close, intimate and loving relationship but in the past 18 months it has all gone the opposite direction because of this affair.

So sad but the facts are there. I DO need to just walk for my own safety and sanity.

Bob in the UK these are the requirements for a RO

The court may make a number of types of orders depending on the situation.
Non-harassment orders

A non-harassment order will provide protection where there has been violence or threat of violence. The court will make an order that the person offering the violence must not assault, harass, or annoy the other party. The order will have written on it a warning that says if it is disobeyed, the person disobeying will be in contempt of court. Being in contempt of court is very serious because there has been deliberate disobedience of a court order. The court will punish contempt. It may impose a fine and a prison sentence.
Occupation orders

An occupation order excludes one party from the family home. The court will usually exclude the violent party from the home. The court can create an exclusion zone around the home. If the excluded party enters that exclusion zone, the court order will be disobeyed. Again, the court order will have written on it a warning that says that if it is disobeyed, the person disobeying will be in contempt of court.

A non-harassment or occupation order may be available in the following circumstances:

* Where a person is or has been married to the person against whom the order is sought
* Where a person is living with the person against whom the order is sought as husband and wife
* Where a person has lived with the person against whom the order is sought as husband and wife
* Where a person has lived in the same household with the person against whom the order is sought and that person has not been an employee, tenant, lodger, or boarder
* Where a person has lived in the same household with the person against whom the order is sought and that person is a close relative such as a grandparent, grandchild, aunt, uncle, niece, nephew, step-parent, or step-child.
* Where a person has agree to marry the person against whom the order is sought and any termination of the agreement to marry has not occurred more than three previously.
* Where a person is the parent or has parental responsibility of the person against whom the order is sought.

Protection from harassment

It is a civil wrong to act in such a way as to cause alarm or distress to another. If a person is caused harm by two or more acts to another, the court may make an order prohibiting the person from doing those acts again. If they can show that they have suffered significant harm, they may be entitled to receive compensation from the person responsible.

This means that if a person is harassed by another, the courts will give protection. The exact meaning of harassment is not clear. In practice, it is usually obvious if an act is harassing another. However, it must be on two separate occasions.

In addition, the criminal courts offer protection. If a person harasses another, they will be guilty of a criminal offence and punished in the criminal courts. Furthermore, putting someone in fear of violence is a criminal offence. If a person is convicted of harassing another or putting another in fear of violence, the court may make a restraining order. This is an order forbidding a person doing one or more things that may harass another or put them in fear of violence.
Occupation orders

The court may make an order excluding one spouse or cohabiting partner from the home. If the application is made by a spouse, the court will take into account different factors than if the application is by a cohabiting partner. The court also will make different orders depending on whether a spouse or cohabiting partner makes the application.

The court may order that one spouse or cohabiting partner:

* Permit the other to go into the home or part of the home and stay there.
* Regulate the occupation of the home by either or both.
* Stop one spouse or cohabiting partner from living in the home.
* Require one spouse or cohabiting partner to leave the home.
* Exclude the one spouse or cohabiting party from part of the home.

The court may order that the rights of either spouse to live in the home shall continue after any divorce or death of the other. In deciding whether to grant an order, the court must take into account:

* The respective housing needs and housing resources of them both and any children.
* Their respective financial resources.
* The likely effect of any order or of any decision not to make an order on the health, safety or wellbeing of them both and any child.
* The conduct of the parties in relation to each other.

The court will apply the balance of harm test. The test is whether making the order would do more harm than not making the order.

The court will not make an order if:

* The person whom the court is considering excluding is likely to suffer significant harm by being excluded.
* The harm likely to be suffered by the person whom the court is considering excluding is as great or greater than the harm attributable to the conduct.

The court may make other orders dealing with the payment:

* Of the mortgage.
* Of other outgoings.
* For repair and maintenance of the home.

The court can also order the occupying person to pay the excluded person's rent where the excluded person had a right to occupy the home. In addition, the court can grant either party use of the furniture and contents of the home. It may order either party to take reasonable care of the furniture and contents. Before making any order, the court will have regard to all the circumstances.

In urgent cases, a court can make non-molestation and occupation orders without telling the other person. In deciding whether to allow an application to proceed without telling the other person, the court will take into account all circumstances including:

* Any risk of significant harm to the person making the application or a child if the order is not made immediately.
* Whether it is likely that the person making the application will be deterred or prevented from pursuing the application if the order is not made immediately.
* Whether there is reason to believe that the person to be told is avoiding being told and any delay would cause a risk.

If an order is made without telling the other party, any order will be for a short period. The court will fix a hearing. At that hearing, the court will hear from both parties and decide the issues. Occupation orders are rarely granted without the other person being told of any hearing in advance.

To avoid the court making a find of fact against one or both, it will accept a promise not to do something. If the court makes an order, a power of arrest may be attached to the order. The power of arrest will mean that if a person comes within a specified distance of a place, the police may arrest them. It is not possible to attach a power of arrest to a promise.

Legal aid is not longer readily available to seek occupation orders. Thus, they are becoming rare. For legal aid to be available, the Community Legal Services expects the person to have reported the matter to the police and have exhausted all the protection that they can offer.
Non-molestation orders

The court may grant a court order forbidding a person from molesting their spouse or cohabiting partner or a child. The word molestation covers not only violence and threats of violence, but also pestering.

An order could be granted against a person who sends abusive letters to their spouse or cohabiting partner and persistently telephones in the middle of the night. When making the order, the court must have regard to all circumstances including the need to secure the health, safety and wellbeing of the person making the application and any child.

If the person making the application can show a genuine need for protection, a non-molestation order will be granted. The court order may be made for a specified period or until a further order. A court order may be made for an indefinite period, but the courts are reluctant to actually do this.
Enforcement

If the court makes a non-molestation or occupation order, it will be a court order. Anyone disobeying a court order will be in contempt of court. The court will punish contempt by a fine and imprisonment. If there has been a total disregard of the order and further violence, the level of punishment will be greater.

The court may put a power of arrest on the court order. The power of arrest will mean that the police may arrest the person if they come within a specific distance of a point. If the police arrest a person because they have disobeyed the court order, they must be bought before a judge or magistrate as soon as possible. The judge or magistrate will hear evidence as to whether the court order has been disobeyed. If they find that the court order has been disobeyed, they will punish the person.

If the court order was made in the county court, the judge may pass a term of imprisonment for two years and impose an unlimited fine. If the court order were made in the magistrates court, the maximum term of imprisonment is two months and the maximum fine is £5000. Only in the most serious case will the court send anyone to prison immediately. On the first occasion the court order is disobeyed, the sentence will usually be a suspended sentence. This means that the person will not go to prison immediately. However, if they appear before the court again, the court will consider whether to activate the sentence. On the second occasion, the sentence will almost certainly be activated and the person will go to prison.

A court will not put a power of arrest on a court order unless there has been violence or a threat of violence. Most orders have a power of arrest put on them.

SO this means you NEED to make a complaint to the Police when she ran over you and then apply to your Local Court.

He was playing POSOM.

I'm going to give a contrary view. While I don't think anyone would blame you for ending your M now, if you DID want to still try to save it, I would point out that you haven't yet done a proper plan B.

With a proper plan B letter, and rigid terms for her return - on your terms, not her whim.

Naturally this would include her accounting for all her time, and full access by you to all the information you need to assure yourself that she is in no contact.

An agreement to extraordinary precautions to ensure NC - moving would probably be needed.

None of this 'wanting to run away', flitting from bed to bed.

The A will probably end. Plan B will spare you more pain, and it's a shame you didn't use it sooner IMO.

I thought your WW was being melodramatic when she was choosing between home and apartment, and her para-suicide, and that type of behaviour really gets up my nose.

But maybe that, and her assault even can all be explained as typical crazy, possessed-by-aliens WW behaviour.

Was it all out of character, or does she have pre-existing histrionic tendencies?

Maybe it is just my history with my husband, but when I read your story, I can't help but wonder if your WW has some sort of bipolar. Has she ever gotten any sort of mental help?

I know this may not matter to you at this point, you have every reason in the world to be done with her for your own safety. However, I was just wondering since bipolar can be so different from person to person.

Yeah, maybe you aren't truly meeting all her Emotional Needs? Have you stopped to consider whether her "love bank" is full? How about setting up MC together and going on an MB weekend? EP's definitely need to be written down and she HAS to COMMIT to NC....blah blah blah...

HELLO????

SHE RAN OVER HIM WITH A FRICKING CAR AND DROVE AWAY NOT CARING IF HE WAS DEAD!

Time to stop considering this and extricate yourself from this INSANE person.

POSOM? Whats that mean?

Bipolar? Hmm well this is a very good point. Although genetic links to bipolar behaviour has never been proven the family links for tendencies or susceptibility toward it is a known fact. There have been more than three occurrences of bipolar in her immediate family. One sister, and uncle and an aunt. It would certainly seem to be supported by everyone that knows her (including her own family) telling me "get out, she's gone f***ing nuts!"

The running off thing she has always expressed to me for a few years. Even when we were very much in love with each other, she told me that she got those feelings sometimes.

Plan B? Well, I tried a Plan B of sorts. In January last she moved out but was only gone a few weeks then came back cap in hand saying how sorry she was and she wanted to come home. She agreed to NC and EP and also agreed to get a new job and plan a house move. This worked fine for a while and she worked with me for a few weeks but then started her little disappearing tricks again saying that I had to start to trust her and she felt stifled. D*mmed right I was not to trust her because I knew where she was disappearing to. The reason she felt stifled was because I was stopping her from eating that cake!

As for a renewed Plan B well, I still intend to give her a letter when I walk out of the door. She will not have notice of me leaving but I will leave a letter to explain why I have gone. To explain why her behaviour is abhorrent and what she has to do before I will even consider returning. My biggest problem is finding a mediator for us. She has attacked, abused, alienated EVERYONE we know. NONE of her family or our friends are talking with her right now, they all think she is crackers. The only people even on speaking terms are her workmates (no choice I guess), our son, her mom and one sis (the one with biploar!). I'm not sure who I could get to act as an intermediary I don't think it would be fair for our son to do it and her mom isn't exactly "sensible" herself having some very odd views on life. It's her mom who the violent behaviour has been learned from.

Incidentally, she has now a new set of friends though work and through OM and his family. She has deliberately and systematically kept me away from all of them. Probably because she has made up all sorts of stories and lies which would be dashed in any conversations with me.

I'll try posting up a walk-out/Plan-B letter in a bit I'm just keeping my head down until I walk next week. Not saying anything to rock the boat for fear of an outburst although I am a bit worried about her getting wind of the fact I'm not bothered by where she goes or does at the moment.

Why does this stuff happen? I can understand A's and the reasons why they take off but when it all comes out in the open why does it continue? WTF is going through the minds of WS's to let this go on? Why do otherwise reasonable humans embark on this mindless stuff? Is it a form of clinical mental condition? I'm really at a loss to where this sort of behaviour comes from because it makes no sense and holds nothing but misery for everyone including themselves. I know what I need to do but I do struggle with the rationale behind it all. I mean, over the past year, she left and asked to come back. I left and she asked me to come back. I even told her she could have the house and I would move way but she said she wanted me and to work on our M. It seems like she doesn't know WHAT she wants apart from continued misery for all. What reason is there in this?

I don't blame you one bit for walking away, I certainly would if someone tried to run me over with their car.

However, I did want to make one thing clear, there is definately genetic links for bipolar. I just had my stepson to the child pschyciatrist the other day and he told us that it is a genetic thing. Which makes sense since my husbands father, my H, and my stepson all have it.

Do what you need to do to take care of yourself, but I think her family should look into that possibility.

She tried to kill you. Do you not understand that? Did you report that to the authorities?

Hmm the last time she attacked me and I went to the police I remember three things being said.
1. Got any witnesses? Just you against her then I'm afraid.
2. Haha you're a big lad! How could you be attacked by a girl...
3. Look, if it's that bad why don't you just get out?

So now I'm just going for option 3

Big Bob,

One thing to consider this week before you "let her know" you are "likely" gonna move out.

If she takes a rusty blade to your testicles while you are sleeping and you awake in a pool of your own blood, you need to be prepared to tell her that that is a LB or "love buster."

SWW

YESSSSS Exactly why I ain't saying anything and there is a lock on the door of the spare room.

(Ouch! did you have to mention that)

Piece of $**t other man (as if there are any other kind)

There's the million dollar question. I personally think that someday, someone will discover an actual clinical medical condition that causes it. Other psychological diseases that have names and treatments don't have nearly as specific symptomology as waywards do. How else is it possible that they all read from exactly the same script? Because aside from an actual, real, physical problem in the brain - there IS no reason in this!

Brief Threadjack (better known as 't/j'):

In the southern part of the United States, there is an animal whose fairly proper name is o'possum. It's commonly called a 'possom'. When frightened, it lays down and pretends to be dead. It also moves at a very slow, leisurely pace - even when crossing streets - so it is most often seen in the form of 'road kill'. I have always thought the similarities between "possums" and exposed "POSOMS" to be somewhat amusing.

We have possums here too - usually dead on the road! I'll never look at them the same again. I wonder what form of roadkill would best describe an OW?

Vampire bat.

You forgot to add that they are EXTREMELY ugly (even their babies aren't very cute), look like ginormous rats right down to bald tails and UGLY set of canine teeth, they eat garbage, carry rabies, and hiss like a M/effer when cornered...and they can be meaner than a Southern Mother-in-law when ticked off.

If'n you think that Texans aim for armadillos on the highway, you should see the sides of the roads during possum mating season....you could carpet the highway with 'em.

Personally, I think the analogy fits like a glove.

BATS ARE WONDERFUL CRITTERS AND VERY BENEFICIAL TO THE ENVIRONMENT!

OW are ticks. Ginormous blood and life sucking ticks.

Ok, Vampire Ticks then. Good call!

Glad y'all understand!

POSOW's are just like POSOMs only female

ugly, mean, suited for life as roadkill, disease laden

An affair's supposed to be like an addiction. The affair partners crave contact and will do anything to get it. Even after exposure. Breaches of no contact seem to be the rule.

With a decent period of no contact - going cold turkey - your WW would probably go through withdrawal, and then she might recover. As you know, she never was in no contact with OM for any length of time.

I think there is extra pressure on the A right now.

OM has seen you now. In his peripheral vision anyway. He doesn't seem very brave. He might cool off now.

And your WW has to face the fact that she ran over her H of 30 years.

If your M is ever to recover though, I think you'd need to do more than talk about moving. How about the Outer Hebrides?!

I still think with a proper plan B your M might be saved.

Whether you want to try is up to you. I don't have an opinion on that.

Don't you cut your losses after you WW tries to kill you? What is there to save? His life is in danger.

Yeah, i think that is what you are supposed to do after your WW tries to kill you, at least I think so.

I am sure I read that somewhere, one of the books or something.

I think it was like, "OBTW, when she tries to run over you and kill you with the car this is a rather strong indication that she doesn't want to work on the marriage anymore and cut your losses."

SWW

Lostin, SWW, others... you've probably got more experience with infidelity than me, and I respect your opinions, even if you think mine's ridiculous.

Note, I'm not saying BB SHOULD try to save his M. I'm not saying the chorus who say he SHOULDN'T are wrong. Just not choosing to join the chorus.

I'm also saying grownups make up their own minds. BB knows a lot more about his W and all the circumstances (including the 'running over') than anyone else here.

His choice, right?

BB has been dealing with a WW. If his W ever shows up again, I think his previously happy 30-year M might stand a chance.

Do you agree with that?

So you are playing devil's advocate while giving advice?

LMAO

Hey you can play devils advocate if you want. As far as the advice goes I'm a big boy and a sensible individual. I know when or where my safety is compromised. I instinctively know what is right and wrong. I know that my W has more than just an A going on - she does have some bigger personal issues making the position even more complicated.

I didn't think my safety was an issue before this incident but now I know it is! The simple and plain truth is that yes there is considerable risk so I need to get away from this person as she is currently behaving. What I think is a shame is that I won't be able to see when that aggressive behaviour is channelled toward someone else. If she can't take out that frustration on ME it WILL be someone else. Wonder who that will be? If my W is being Jekyll & Hyde then OM can have both halves now.

And no, I'm not going to abandon her as a person I will do whatever I can from a distance. I need to get away and find peace but she needs help and she needs space to recover, whichever way she turns. If at some point in the future my W is a better person and we can find a way back to each other that would be great but right now its impossible.

Still going ahead with a letter to explain why I'm gone. Call it a plan B letter if you want. I am just calling it an explanation of my leaving even though I still love her and believe we COULD still have a future if she changes her behaviour and gets help. What she chooses to do with that information is entirely up to her...

Now you are sounding level-headed.

Proud of you, I know it's tough.

Don't get sucked back in, she needs professional help badly.

Keep posting.

SWW

Ok, I went back and reread:

Bob, I don't see anywhere in here where you EXPOSED!

Did you?

Hi cp thanks for your reply.

This is not the only thread of my experiences and in others you would have seen that yes, I did expose it to everyone. Very early in the whole business I did a full exposure & I did a superduper Plan A. There was even a plan B of sorts when I asked her to either stop seeing OM or leave in January last and she lived in an appt for a few weeks. She asked to come home and make an effort to make our M work but within weeks she was sneaking off with OM again.

As a quick recap, 12 mnths ago, OM's W left when she found out of the A and he is now single living in an appt only 15mins drive from our place. OM's workplace is 2mins drive from our place! They also work for the same company although they don't generally cross paths and don't have access to company lines of communication. Initially they just happened to have a chance meet in a company canteen room and became friends about two years back. Irritatingly, her older sister works with OM and disliked him before this. She pretty much hates him now which makes family relations strained to say the least.

Everyone we know, friends and family alike have all been directly either insulted, abused or upset by her. This is much of the reason all our friends and family are not talking with her now. Everyone has seen how she has behaved so terribly. The only friends she now has are OM and his friends and family.

This is the reason I'm having trouble finding an intermediary as the exposure and the subsequent behaviour has alienated her from everyone we know as a couple.

Well, it doesn't look like you have exposed to their workplace, or ONE of them at least would no longer be working there.

Yup! EVERYONE in work knows about their sordid little relationship.
All the staff in the place are all aware. No-one really cares much. Most people also know that she lived alongside him too. In fact, they seem to know more about it all than me as a lot of info comes back via her sister!

Why do you say one of them would not be there if it were exposed to the workplace?

BigBob --

Our stories are similar except I'm the woman version of you.

Multiple false recoveries...a "running" WH... MAJOR personality change including mood swings... together 31 years...A started in 07... signs of addiction to OW and willingness to sacrific everything to be with her... exposure to everyone under the sun....NONE of his family is supporting him....AND WH tried to run over his own mother in a parking lot last summer. (Yep, she stood in front of his truck with hand on the hood while he reved the motor and yelled at her. Thankfully, I talked her into moving so he could drive off and cool down.)

And today, through all the drama and fanfare and despite all I did, he's living openly with OW and her 3 kids and has filed for D.

FYI, his words, actions, personality, dress, habits, values, etc. have all changed since the start of the affair. He even LOOKS different, especially the expressions in his eyes. It's like a Dr. Jekell/Mr. Hyde thing.

My diagnosis of WH which may be what is up with your WW -- midlife crisis. Read some of the on-line articles and forums on it. My WH appears to be the poster child for a man suffering through a crisis. And his OW plays right into it by being the younger, wilder version that makes him feel young again.

Bottomline -- the midlife crisis will continue for him whether or not he stays married to me. His issues are with himself not with me. He has to get through this crisis but it may take years. And run as he might, he can't outrun the man in the mirror and the fact that he's getting older every day.

Hi HH, I think there is a lot of truth in what you say and I can indeed understand why you see similarities.

Midlife crisis most certainly. She has changed her appearance totally. Changed her diet, lifestyle, attitude - everything. One of the first signs of the crisis was when she started changing hairstyles and bleaching her lovely long brown wavy hair to straw coloured suicide blonde!

Also, OM is 10yrs younger and she says he makes her feel younger and more alive. When she started with him she started going to the gym every day and can now keep up with me on a cross country run (for a few miles anyway hehe). The ironic thing to that is that he suffers from diabetes quite badly, smokes, does no exercise and has an awful diet. Physically, he is less attractive than me, far less fit and certainly less active but I guess a younger face and a few sweet words is enough to get her there.

HH - I know both of these people will only realise what idiots they have been once it is too late to turn back the clock.

Well, I was talking about the OWNER of the company, because (1) it's impossible to be having a workplace affair without them wasting company time doing it and (2) if it's anything more than a tiny company (<50 people), they will have legal repercussions in place for any superior/inferior affair (as in a boss 'making' a subordinate participate).

So do the owner and HR know?

>OM is 10yrs younger and she says he makes her feel younger and more alive.

Yeah.

Till she breaks her hip.

10 years younger is an EON younger when he's barely out of his 20s and you're in your 40s...EON!

How puerile can you get?

Owner? Hmm it's a huge public company so not really that sort of setup. All the local management know though. Doesnt really affect the work levels in any way cos they only ever meet at lunch or outside of work. OM works from separate base and depts anyway so superior/inferior thing doesnt really apply either.

She didn't seem to be affected by the gossip either. In fact, the latest news on the firm is that they are actually a couple living together so no-one pays it a lot of mind now.

If it's a large public company, they almost definitely have rules about workplace affairs - the federal government pretty much demands it, as does the threat of lawsuits.

Look I get that it's pretty much over. I just hate to see people walk away when they could be doing something to stop something like this. It can't hurt to give the company's HR department a letter claiming that you are looking into the situation with your lawyer...that should be all it takes to at least start an investigation.

Another similarity -- OW is ten years younger.

What do we do about it, Bob?

Hi Bob! Saw your name and checked up on your story. I've got one thing to say to you. Cut your losses unless you enjoy living in this high drama. Your WW attempts suicide because you are seeing someone while she is boinking OM? HMMMM, a little cake eating going on there I'd say. She then thinks it's a better idea to run you over with her car as apposed to maybe having a conversation with you and OM? Maybe she's just a tad unstable ya think?

Unless you are enjoying this drama remove yourself from it. Allow her to drown in her drama. Really, you don't need this sh!! and you have the choice to not be a part of it anymore. I think I may have told you months ago she has to earn your trust. She's the guilty party here. She's done nothing to indicate she is willing to get healthy, so why don't you get healthy? You deserve better than this! Are you at the point that you value yourself more than putting up with her WW crappola?

Hey CV55 how you doing? Haven't heard for months.

Yes you did say that to me ages back and it all made as much sense then as it does now. I know what the truth is but like so many people on here, you think you know someone then they act just so out of character. Certainly I struggle to make sense of it at all.

I know she has to earn my trust but over and over she has broken it. Probably about 4 or 5 times now and with this latest episode I don't even trust my personal safety with her. I think she has lost the plot this time so what choice do I have other than to walk?

Since that night she has been so sweet its scary. Making dinner, running after me around the house. Its like the old W came back. Little hugs and kisses whenever the chance arises. Im playing along for now but I'm not gonna be suckered back in yet again. She keeps telling me that he's gone for good and it's just me and her. Just how many times have I heard that before she goes swanning off for a little afternoon entertainment!

Planning to quietly move out end of this week...

I find it hard to believe that you are living under the same roof as a woman who tried to run you over and kill you a few days ago.

Quietly slip away in the dark? Huh?

Why haven't you put her boney a$$ in jail for attempted murder?

Anyone want to take bets on whether they're still together Monday?

Yeh, OK I will cp...

Put your $1,000 on the table.

Easiest $1,000 I ever won.

Some people just ain't cut out as the betting kind are they? :crosseyedcrazy:

Glad to hear it, bob! Let us know...