I�m not sure if this is the right place to post this topic, if not please let me know where I should post it.

This all started around Christmas this past year. I thought my wife was cheating on me because of some strange behaviors, so I installed some hidden cameras around our bedroom and had them feed to my computer. What I found was much more devastating. See my wife suffers from insomnia and takes medication that completely knocks her out till the following morning when the meds wear off. Well my stepson knew this as well and took advantage of it. I had already expressed to my wife that I thought his relationship with her was inappropriate. He would walk in on her while she was changing or in the shower and was constantly talking about her boobs and would go so far as to even try to touch them.

What I caught on my cameras was my stepson having sex with his sleeping mother. He raised her night gown and removed her panties to expose her naked body and then proceeded to take pictures with his digital camera. This only got worse when one of his friends stepped into the picture and also proceeded to have sex with her. Then another friend walked into view holding a digital camcorder. He also had a turn with her. When they all finished my stepson cleaned her up replaced her panties and covered her up and kissed her full on the mouth and left the room.

When I watched this I sat crying and shaking at my computer. I didn�t immediately run to my wife and tell her. I usually work 3rd shift and was home alone when I discovered this. I went and found my stepsons laptop and with the help of a friend did a search of the computer and found more than 20 video files. I reviewed some of them and found my stepson and many of his friends including one of their dads all engaged in having sex with my wife.

I took his computer and broke the news to my wife as gentle as I could, needless to say she broke down. Since then my stepson has been arrested and is being treated at a psychiatric hospital and my wife is seeing a therapist 3 times a week and we have a lawyer filing suit against all the parties that were involved. But my relationship with my wife is totally different. I myself am not seeing a therapist as I can�t afford it what with the cost of the one for my wife. I have been to my wife�s therapist with her for her help and received some helpful information. But things between my wife and I are to say the least very damaged. She has no interest in being intimate with me, she also has stopped undressing in front of me too. We don�t kiss or touch for that matter either. I found out that her therapist is trying to help her in dealing with the events involving her son, but has not addressed the issues with our marriage.

If anyone has any suggestions on how I can try to save our marriage I�d greatly appreciate it.

Just for clarification, your stepson is your wife's son?

If there is video recording of these people, why are there not criminal investigations going on? Jr. needs more than treatment in a psych hospital, if you ask me.

tl

Prison. For the stepson. And his friends. Prison.

Call the police. NOW>

Removed at poster's request

I have some questions for you:

1. How old is your step-son?
2. What medication did your wife take?
3. What "strange behaviors" was your wife exhibiting that led to initially install the video cameras?
4. What led you to Marriagebuilders, specifically this section on Surviving an Affair, when this is clearly incest?
5. This happened 20 times or more? During what time period? A month, a year, six months?
6. I assume your wife works since you made your discovery while you were home alone during the day?
7. These assaults took place while you were at work on the 3rd shift? Starting around 11:00 p.m.?

I have reasons for all these questions.

Is this seriously for real? I'm smelling a troll.....
I this is for real then yes call the police and give them the tape....and yes you're wife NEEDS to be told

Wife has been told, stepson arrested, in psych hospital (probably a legal gambit).

It's in the post....

Come on, you guys, don't feed the trolls.

Just to clarify some points. Yes my stepson is her biological son. The police and child protective services are involved along with several lawyers, including ours. Two of boys fathers were arrested and released on bonds and have restraing orders. The bad part is every neighbor knows what has happend and because my stepson made videos, many people have seen it. There was a court order to remove the videos but there is no telling how many other people may have seen or downloaded the videos. I can't discuss the details of my stepson's issues other than to say he is in a hospital for observatioin.

have some questions for you:

1. How old is your step-son?
14 when this occurred 15 now

2. What medication did your wife take?
it's a type of generic Valium

3. What "strange behaviors" was your wife exhibiting that led to initially install the video cameras?
a lack of interest, whispered conversations to girlfriends, specific types of clues in the bed

4. What led you to Marriagebuilders, specifically this section on Surviving an Affair, when this is clearly incest?
I found Marriage Builders by a Google search as for this section I honestly wasn't sure where to post

5. This happened 20 times or more? During what time period? A month, a year, six months?
for around 8 months to a year based on the info in his computer

6. I assume your wife works since you made your discovery while you were home alone during the day?
yes part time during the day

7. These assaults took place while you were at work on the 3rd shift? Starting around 11:00 p.m.?
I work 3rds Tue-Sun from 10p-7a most of the events occured on Fri&Sat

I have reasons for all these questions.

You know I understand how strange all this sounds but I assure the lives of my wife, myself and our children have been deeply effected by all of this.

The police are involved along with several childrens advocacy agencies both for my stepson and the other children involved. There is a lengthy investigation still going on. Some charges have been made against the adults involved, as well as the minors. Due to the fact there are minors and an investigation still undergoing there are certain facts I can't disclose.

Critize if you must, but I'm just looking for a way to cope with this myself. I've talked to family and friends and they always focus on my wife, which is great but I'm trying to find a way for me to deal with this situation.

PM whats up with your last 2 posts?

Just preserving the record so to speak.

Ah.

I think I see where PM's coming from. MMW may be required to remove his posts due to ongoing court proceedings in the matter.

As for you, MMW, I have no words. I know you must be going through a whirlwind of emotions. You probably want to both hug your wife and murder your stepson, among other feelings (I can imagine because I think I'd be feeling that way). All I can tell you is, do what you can to comfort and reassure your wife that you don't blame her for this in ANY way, and don't mention wanting to kill the stepson ('cause she probably still loves the miscreant in spite of everything, that's mothers for you).

For yourself, find someone to talk to, a counselor, a pastor, a good friend. Someone who can listen without judging (or at least voicing that judgment). It won't be easy, since there's often very little support for men in times like this, everyone assumes we'll just bear it on our own. And, no matter how bad you may be feeling, RESIST the temptation to self-medicate with alcohol or other such substances. Your going to need a clear head in times to come, and the rest of your family is also going to need you clear-headed.

I read your thread missmywife, and the whole time i was reading it my hand was over my open mouth, I could not believe this! I am soo sorry for the pain you, your wife, and your whole family is going through. Right now I am speechless, but wanted you to know that you are in my prayers only GOD can help your situation, I've heard that people have been raped yes, but not LIKE THIS, not like what your wife had to see and watch on those videos!!

Just remember that we are all god's children and he loves every single one of us, and this will pass some day.

You are in the right spot missmywife, we have the best support system on this site.

Again you and your wife are in my prayers.

Have you thought about selling your home and moving away?

To another city? State?

I am sure the home is a BIG trigger, knowing that is where it all happened would not help your situation, GET out of it AS SOON AS YOU CAN!

Also I would BURN the bed!

You will find some very knowledgeable rape and incest survivors on here to help you. Schoolbus is one of the best.

More than that, the MB program can still help you rebuild your M. I even think the infidelity forum is a good place for you to be - even though your W was not unfaithful, there will be a number of parallels for both of you in your R: how to deal with triggers, getting rid of the mental movies, rebuilding intimacy, etc.

Stick around and keep learning every day. You will both get through this.

These types of things will be critical in your R.

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I do not understand this? What, they say you can't sell your home and purchase a new home? That doesn't make any sense, if you can't move out of the city by all means MOVE OUT OF THE HOUSE! The house has too many BAD memories, and if this happened to me that would be the first thing on my list to do to recover from all this mess.

Why would you "SHOW" them the videos?? You did not have to do that, that does not make sense either, please you do not have to SHOW people what happened to your wife.

Agree about moving to another house in the same area. When Neak (my daughter, which is why I paid attention) talked about moving being critical to recovery, I wondered if that would be an option because of the legal process...but as long as you're in the area, I don't see how they could tell you that you had to stay in the same house. I mean, it's not like you're under house arrest. Would they really have the authority to force that? If you can swing it financially, though, a different house and different neighbors would be a definite plus, though.

As far as her family goes, family reactions to sex crimes within the family are often weird. It's too bad they aren't supportive to your wife, and this attitude may change as time goes on, but in the meantime, if they aren't helping you need to keep them from doing harm to your wife...and if that means keeping away from them, and them away from you, I think you're the only one strong enough right now to take on that job. Who's got your back? I hope you have someone, or find someone, because I think you're going to need it before this is over.

tl

P.S Don't break anybody else's nose! Glad you got that guy, though. What a cretin!

I got from his previous posts that the videos had been passed around the net prior to discover of the crime....

Where is the BioDad of this boy? If he isn't being tried as an adult, he will soon leave the criminal and juvinile justice system and when he does, they will send him right back to your family....

Sorry you are here and terribly sorry for your W

JMVHO

I assume the advocates for the children are more on the lines of a Guardian Ad Litem. As the police process through this they should offer you and the children victim's advocate services.

If you haven't been offered the contact info yet, have your atty get the number and set up an appt. for you with a counselor through the local victim's advocacy group. It's a free service to victims of crime, as well as their family members.

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How is the housing market where you are? Could you rent out your house for the loan payment, and then rent something somewhere else for you and your family?

tl

Our family has been through the legal wringer with the 3 adopted children of my youngest daughter. They were molested in their biological mother's house. That's where we found out how weirdly bio-families can react to sex crimes within the family. We also went through the severing of the bio-mom and dad's parental rights. One thing you do need to find out an answer for is what happens to your stepson if he's still a juvenile when his legal consequences end. And if the theory is that he would come back to your house, you need to start finding out a way to circumvent THAT! As a mother, I sympathize with the horror your wife feels, on so many levels, and it might break her heart to turn him away--but having him back would be even worse. That's not an issue to wait to find out about until it's "time". By the time it's "time", it may be too late to protect her and your children from the damage his presence in the home would produce.

tl

I am so sorry that you have to deal with those men at work! I actually feel disgusted, can't you get them fired?

I also want to know what will happen to that boy when his sentence is payed, if it was my child I wouldn't be able to even look at him, let a lone come back to live in my house.

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I think what will be the best for you and your marriage is to get out of that neighborhood as fast as you can.

have you guys got rid of EVERYTHING that was your step sons? I would pack it ALL!! and hide it, so nothing is in the home that can remind your wife of her evil son.

I thought I have heard the worst of the worst of adulterer's and then something else comes a long and tops it ALL

Let your wife know that we are here to support her!

I've just reread missmywife's posts sequentially.

I am not sure if all you MB'ers are familiar with the concept of "trolling". It's very common on internet forums, although this is the first time I've seen it on MB boards.
Basically, it's when somebody starts posting for attention. It can be a fake story, a fake persona, or both - and it's intended to get attention. Typically "trolls" either want to stir things up, mess with people on the board, or have a deeper need they are satisfying.
Bizarre, yes. But not at all uncommon.

Missmywife's story smacks of a troll to me. The initial post sounded more like a cuckoldry story on a sex story site (it's a hugely popular fetish much to my disgust), with unnecessary and salacious details. His initial post references "lawyers filing suits" against those who were involved, and only upon other posters' quizzical examination did he change that. Come on. This would be a HUGE police investigation - police would have filed rape charges against everyone involved. He amended his story later to make it sound more believable.

I debated whether or not to post this throughout the past two days on the off chance that it was real. But after reading one of his posts tonight, I had to say something. There is NO WAY any police office in America would make a rape victim watch tapes of their own rape. NO WAY.

"My wife watched each of the videos crying and realizing just how violated she was by her own son."

This, again, sounds like it's out of a cuckolding/incest sex story. Google one if you have the stomach for it, and note the similarities.

Am I the only one thinking this way?

I sure hope this is not a Troll, but my husband's first thought was a troll as well.

Missmywife, if this is true I am sure this would be on the national news, so please link the story so we know that this is true.

If you wont link the news then we all know that this is fake.

I know we aren't suppose to call out suspected trolls...but I thought the subject line was weird. Wouldn't you say, 'my wife's son did such and so'?' And prostituted? No where in there does he mention money being paid....and I also don't believe she would be forced to watch the videos....ANd I don't believe a co-worker would ask for a 'turn' at his wife...all sounds too weird. I hope it is a fake story.

My troll-o-meter is also pinging. However, this is an anonymous forum. I don't think - if this is real- he should be forced to reveal himself. Operating under the assumption that this IS real - it would only compound his hurt and remove an avenue of support.

As for being prostituted - the son did allow the neighborhood to participate - while money may not have exchanged hands per say - I doesn't seem strange for the OP to use that term.

I, too, hope it is fake. But stranger things have happened. There is no harm in providing MB advice - it may help at least a lurker dealing with an abuse of his/her own spouse.

MMW, has your wife had a full STD screening?

No one in MB is ever obligated to "prove" themselves to complete strangers by providing to the board personal, identifying information about themselves. People can make of that refusal what they will, but there's still no duty on the part of any poster here to satisfy suspicious others with "proof." I'm not judging whether this story is true or not. How would I know? But he sure as hell doesn't need to tell us all how to find the news stories, see the names and locations, just to set people's doubts to rest!

tl

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Talk to a cop I know, read the story to him, he found so many things that do not add up. The list was quite long. He actually works in sexual assault division. I know a lot of cops so picked the one who would know more.

Here are some of his concerns. There would be NO lawyers filing anything. The DA or SA would be handling all filings. No one gets an attorney before the defendants have been prosecuted, because you need to wait until all the evidence is in (during the trial) then a lawyer could file for civil damages.

In most PD's the victim is not made to watch the whole video (they treat things like this with more tact than they used to)and they way they handle it is to take photos off the video and allow the victim to ID if she knew them. He did point out that this is highly unlikely, but with everything there is a slight chance of it happening, very slight.

U-Tube does NOT allow these types of videos to be posted, no way no how.

I could go on, but sadly this is not adding up. His final words to me was that it was either the greatest s*** storm to have ever happened or the greatest lie ever told.

He had other things that bothered him, but those were the main things.

Just thought I would add that in. Isn't there an attorney on this site that could chime in on that part.

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TY for clarifying this for I did not know, maybe in the back of my head I was hoping this was not true, it just breaks my heart into pieces! I have two boy's and I CAN NOT IMAGINE one of them doing that to me.

As for misssmywife, if you are truly here for help and hope I advise you to stay on MB, yes people might speculate, yes they might judge, but you can always put those people on ignore, heck if I made you mad you can always put me on ignore. MB web site WILL HELP your situation as long as you are following the principles.

Have you talked to your wife about getting on and getting help? Maybe if she can read some of the other rape victims stories it can help her? I know she is seeing a councilor twice a week, but it might be good for her to have something that is close by and she can get on and get help right then and there.

I put together all his posts, emailed it to my uncle who was the DA of a large California county for almost 20 years and he dismissed it out of hand. He said the poster is clearly not familiar with the criminal justice system, and he agreed that the fixation on the sexual / humiliation details was telling.

Among other things he said, a civil suit would typically not be started during a criminal investigation and pending criminal charges. I thought the same thing earlier.

I find it completely odd that no one is able or willing to help. Family? No help. Friends? No Help. Neighbors? One Helper. Coworkers? No Help. Police? Unable. Judicial system? Unable. Counselors? Unable. Way too much incompetance from people who know you are not anonymous.

Incest is a big no no in this country, and groups of people will jump at this type of opportunity to help out.

Too many exaggerations not pertaining to the story such as breaking a co workers nose. In many companies there would be suspension or some type of punishment for this type of behaviour. The availability of this type of video on you tube is not allowed. The amount of people in the workplace seeing the video is impossible without knowlege and links to where it is, and it would be stopped by any type of respectable supervisor. the police forcing her to watch all videos is wrong, they may use a still of a face, but entire videos? I have heard of witnesses on the stand who have to describe entire accounts, but not for identification purposes.

Lack of responsibility to the son, his friends, or friends fathers. Everything is pending here. Most times stuff of this magnitude gets moved through fast, 2-3 months and everything is determined especially with evidence.

I think it is a troll, and I just can't feed it. My wife can, but this is my choice.

I have been reading this thread and want to believe the poster was real because who would make this stuff up.

After reading through the first 3 posts, I googled it many different ways thinking a story this lascivious would be on AP news. Came up with NOTHING.

Poster did say stepson was arrested and a case like this would hit the news immediately.

Also he mentioned that his wife was in counseling and he could not afford to go into therapy also.

In rape cases there are many free counseling services that will also include the family.

If this is true, I apologize for my suspicious mind. But it upsets me that there are MBers baring their souls here and don't want this to be a mockery.

I agree.

For instance, ONE of the things that made me question the validity of such a story is that his insomniac wife was taking "a generic form of valium" to help her sleep. I'm sorry, but if she was taking this as a sleep aid, it would not knock her out to the point where she would sleep completely through an assault like this and wake up the next morning not feeling ANY of the effects. Sorry if this is a little graphic, but a woman would KNOW the next morning if she had been raped by multiple people on multiple occasions and a quick swipe of a wash cloth wouldn't erase that.

That's just ONE issue, never mind the legal issues, where the story completely derails.

The reason I'm not buying it? He said his wife takes Valium. My grandmother had a Valium prescription once. I, being a stupid teenager, decided to steal the pills and share them with my then-boyfriend. I took 3 of them in order to get "high." I was 13 at the time and weighed all of 90 lbs. I was tripping afterwards, to be sure, and I was pretty out of it for the entire day. However, I wasn't THAT out of it. I wasn't unconscious and I still remember everything that happened and everything I did. I certainly wasn't so far gone that something like this could have happened and I wouldn't have realized it.

Either he's a troll and making this up, or his wife was on enough Valium (every night?) to take out an elephant. I don't know any doctor that would prescribe someone enough Valium to knock them out to this degree. It's just not THAT strong of a drug to where normal prescription dosages would have this sort of affect.

This is assault. A police matter.

So much dogmatism in such a short time. What life must be like to go through it with such confidence in one's own knowledge and insight! Well, I wouldn't know. However, I will say (as a nurse--and on the subject of drugs) that different people react to medication in different ways, and a dose that has a mild (or even non-existent) effect on one person, can throw another person for a loop. In my many years of labor and delivery, I have seen 2 laboring women so profoundly affected by a single dose of Stadol that they went into respiratory arrest and required resuscitation. I've also had people accuse me of giving them nothing but sterile water, when I gave them the same dose as was given to the people who quit breathing. You cannot extrapolate all drug reactions by your drug reaction.

tl

Yes but from what he said, this happened on more than one occasion with many different partners. Really? A person could sleep through this kind of thing time after time while using Valium as a sleep aid? An insomniac? Really? I think it would have to throw them for more than a loop, more like put them in a coma.

thndrnltng,

Thanks for the insight on drug reactions. As a layman, I concur, and as someone who is prescribed diazepam (Valium), I can attest that it doesn't make me sleepy in the slightest, but will knock my girlfriend out pretty good.

However, as to your sarcastic preamble:
There are a lot of sociopaths, trolls, and weirdos in life and ESPECIALLY on the anonymous internet. They prey on the good nature of others and the hesitance of most decent people to speak up when something sounds fishy because they can't believe someone would be that cold or heartless to make it up. Stopping sociopathic behavior REQUIRES somebody to speak up, and others to corroborate that their "gut feelings" were tripped too. A great book on this subject is "The Sociopath Next Door", which puts the number of sociopaths in American society at 1 in 4, and advises what I just described to combat it as "normal" people. A case like this makes it hard for the first person to speak up and call BS on the off chance that they would be hurting someone else's feelings.

Anyway, just my two cents.

Peter

Yeah, I think a coma would be about the only thing that could make a person sleep through all of that.

If she had such a strong reaction to the Valium that it completely knocked her out and put her in a comatose-like state, I doubt any sane doctor would have kept her on it. Sleep aids aren't meant to have that sort of affect.

It has nothing to do with do with dogmatism, I have said if this story was true I apologize. It just does not add up.

Why would he post on an adultery thread when it is rape. There are many online support groups for rape victims and their families. Why chose marriage builders affair thread?

Willing to help anyone who comes on this board.

And I know for a FACT that there are people who come here with the sole purpose of starting a controversial thread so they can sit back and snicker at the ensuing chaos it might cause.

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Well, I'm truly glad you recognized it as sarcasm. I would hate to think I was losing my "edge" just because I'm a disabled senior citizen now! I'm not even going to attempt to decide whether or not this story is true. I just know that, 42 years after I became a registered nurse, and with decades of hospital experience with a wide variety of patients, there is more weird stuff going on in this world than most people can imagine.

And after going through the "mercies" of the legal system with my 3 adopted grandchildren, molested in their bio-mom's home while their bio-dad was imprisoned, and then seeing how that same system treated my 3 bio-grandchildren, molested by the adopted grandchildren when the oldest of the 6 kids was maybe 7 and the youngest was still an infant--I don't automatically discount weird stories about the police and the law, either. Before then, I would never have believed that prosecutors, detectives, sheriffs, anybody in law enforcement, could have been so derelict in their duties as those people were. Slipshod. Shoddy. Ineffective. Dishonest. We have suffered immeasurably over the last 8 years because of what happened, while the perpetrators have gone blithely on unpunished...and in the case of the original adult, male molester, unquestioned--even though the police had no doubt that he had done what was alleged. I no longer automatically trust the police. I never will again.

Susan

MMW, this is an anonymous forum. You are as unknown to us as we are to you. I think it's just as much a waste of time for you to get angry at people you see as insensitive--when you'll never meet them, as it is for them to get all worked about about the story of a complete stranger to them.

If you want help, put people on ignore. I've done this to one poster in my 5 years here. You can do it, too, if you like. But if you are, indeed, telling the truth, there is help to be had in dealing with your wife. If, in order to get that help, you have to let some other stuff roll off your hide, only you can decide if that's possible for you.

tl

Speaking of waste of time....

I'm out. Some people are just nicer than me.

There could be psychopathological trolls. Easily. Who derive fun from writing the most outrageous stories and watch people respond in dramatic ways to them.

***edit****what kind of support did you want from this board?

My only question is this, because I have been here since the first post, and I offered you some help but you went around my help by giving me excuses. So my question is...

If we give you advise will you take it?

if not, then I am out as well.

PLEASE!!

If you have concerns about this thread, notify your mods & allow them to check.

If you feel you can help this member using MB concepts & principles,,please do so...

If not, go onto the next thread,,,,,

Ok, I'm out as well.

Missmywife, if any part of your story is true, you and your wife need support WAY beyond what an anonymous internet forum can provide you.

**edit**

I just know that, 42 years after I became a registered nurse, and with decades of hospital experience with a wide variety of patients, there is more weird stuff going on in this world than most people can imagine.

Agreed. I only transcribed ER reports for 2.5 years, and the stories I could tell...

Ok, wait. I counted at least 5 posters who offered you compassion and advice. Two of whom shared their own personal experiences w/ you.

The posters who questioned your story did not do so b/c they lack compassion, they did it b/c they lack faith in you/your story.

If you are sincere in wanting help, why not talk to those who can relate to what your wife and family have gone through...and have offered to help you?

I wouldn't begin to guess whether this story is true or not, but as I've said before, it doesn't matter. (As long as y'all don't let anyone, troll or not, getcha all het up.)

As someone who did hours of lurking myself, I know that the kind and caring advise we give may be of use to countless anonymous readers, and as someone else said, many may be reading who are dealing with abuse who may learn something from our posts. For those who opened up on this thread, I can guarantee you that SOMEONE benefited, whether the OP did or not.

I would also like to say that if I posted everything that has happened during the last 8 years, many of you would think I was a troll, too. It is truly unbelievable. No one outside the immediate family (and law enforcement) knows the full extent of what has happened.

If a person is a troll, what they feed off of is the emotional reaction. Restrain that, even if you feel it, and a troll won't get anything to eat. A genuine poster will still be fed. The lurkers will still be fed.

I'm gonna make a wild guess here, darlin', that you and your sister (I know it's sure true for me!) would be very glad if we didn't know "the full extent of what has happened" either. Life was much more comfortable for us all before we uncovered that mess of human depravity, only to be sold down the river, without apology, by law enforcement officials whose sworn duty was to protect.

tl

P.S. This dog and her squeaky toy are driving me NUTS!! Just wait till I get my hands on your sister!

Tsk, tsk. Wasn't it enough that I edited and proofread both of your books before they were submitted to the publisher? Do I have to do it to your posts now, too?

tl

ADVICE ADVICE ADVICE



grammer polise

Thank you. And now we can quit t/j'ing this man's thread, just in case he changes his mind and comes back to it.

tl

[/tj]

This is so sad, if he really needed help he wouldn't have quit that fast

He may have. Being accused of being a troll when you're hurting only adds to the pain.

He's either a troll (very, very likely), or on the infinitesimal chance that this really happened, needs much, much more help than an internet message board can provide.

Either way, the original poster being gone is a good thing.

Google the story. You'll have the answer.

I am curious, was the deletion a result of finding out that it was in fact a troll? my question here was always why this forum that is supposed to be about infidelity?

Hi Schoolbus, I did google the story and came up empty? Did you find something that I didn't. I tried different writings from his initial post or tried word searches and I did not find anything except some video site with a semi-description of a son having sex with sleeping mother.

A crime of this magnitude (he did say son and others were arrested) does not show up on any news report.