Mimi?

I thought you were in Plan B, Hon? Maybe I need to catch up, are you in Plan A?

Jo

no. Still in Plan B. WS calls on VoiceMail.

Mimi, Mortarman is right. Your WS now has a harem. Who could ask for more??

I'm feeling beat up on. You are scaring me away. There's nothing else I can do now. I guess he has to eat his cake. I'm not being involved with him. I have no other choice than to move into the house. I'm doing everything on my own. I don't understand what you guys are suggesting that I do?

There's no way that I could have lived in those rented houses or apartments. I guess that's the way I am. To me that would have been like living in hell, increasing my depression. I am not depressed at all right now. So be it. This is the way that I am.

<small>[ July 30, 2003, 11:06 PM: Message edited by: mimi1254 ]</small>

Well, okay then. How I look at Plan B is you ask yourself "am I meeting ANY of my WSs needs?"

And if the answer is "yes", then you should know what NOT to do. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" />

I know it's hard to do, I really do. But like the others have said, you're enabling him to fence sit.

Most WS's get angry with the on-set of Plan B, and some try to manipulate it, test the waters to see how serious you are. You need to illustrate you are serious, but in a loving manner. Just like your Plan B letter has stated.

Best,
Jo

Please don't feel beat up, Mimi. You've done such a good job. None of this is easy and that's a fantastic understatement.

I think perhaps you just need a boost. Moving from your home would be very hard, I can't imagine having to do that and go through all you've gone through.

You've been so strong and your husband is lucky to have you. Hope he unfogs swiftly. He may miss out on a wonderful new marriage with you.

Jo

What everyone here says sounds real good. However, I really don't know what else I can do right now. The other options sucked worse than the position that I am in now. I think I made the mistake of selling my house too quickly and then found out I had no other place to live.

I'm sorry that I let everyone here down. The deal is cut. Like I said before, there's nothing else I can do. He has me where he wants me, I guess. You're right, like the OW waiting for him to leave the wife. WOW!! That's sad.

There will be no more SF although that's tempting. There will be no more contact. We'll see what happens.

I don't know what else you guys are expecting me to do.

Maybe I misunderstood, I apologize sweetie. Please don't be stressed.

Here's a couple things you should do:

1. Take excellent care of Mimi. Treat her like your very best friend, pamper and love her.

2. Do not meet any of your WS's needs. ZERO, NADA, NONE!

That's the MB short list and I think it pretty much covers it.

Love,
Jo

<small>[ July 30, 2003, 11:24 PM: Message edited by: Resilient ]</small>

Mimi, I think you are doing really well. I'm far too impulsive. You seem to have learned patience, something I'm still working on. I know it's frustrating, but it WILL be worth it.
Thinking of you
Jackie

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by mimi1254:
<strong>I'm feeling beat up on. You are scaring me away. There's nothing else I can do now. I guess he has to eat his cake. I'm not being involved with him. I have no other choice than to move into the house. I'm doing everything on my own. I don't understand what you guys are suggesting that I do?

There's no way that I could have lived in those rented houses or apartments. I guess that's the way I am. To me that would have been like living in hell, increasing my depression. I am not depressed at all right now. So be it. This is the way that I am.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Mimi, I am sorry I am making you feel bad. It truly wasn't intentional. {{{{{{{{{{MIMI}}}}}}}}}}

The only thing I am suggesting is pulling away from him and going back into Plan B. He seems to think he has you all lined up now waiting patiently for him unless I have misunderstood. He is calling and talking like everything is normal and it is NOT.

I just think its important to reiterate Plan B with him and tell him there is going to be no discussion about anything [no more voicemails] until contact with the OW ends. Until that happens you are moving on with your life and will make plans for your home ALONE.

Because you really are ALONE until he ends things with OW. And as long as you keep allowing this contact - this false hope - he has no motivation to end things. Hopefully, the timing of such a message will have a huge impact given the SF he had last weekend. I just think its a huge mistake to let him think a repeat is possible unless he dumps the OW. See what I mean?

I can remain steadfast to not repeat what happened over the weekend.

I don't know how to change his normalization of things. That's a mindset that he has taken on himself. He has convinced himself or has a plan that he will be living with me in the house soon. I am assuming that means that he plans on meeting my conditions. Planning and thinking about the house seems to be a huge part of his day. He is self-employed, makes his own hours. Should I have an extended conversation with him about this? He knows very well that a NC letter is required.

When he did this before, he did eventually leave her? However, as we recall, he did go back to her. Before, he had not had the extended PLAN B and extended time alone with her. Also, before, I was meeting regularly with him which I am not doing now. I guess he is attempting to get me to do that again.

I will pull back again. It's not going to be easy over the next few days. I will need to be in contact to turn off/on utilities, do closing on this house, etc.

About being alone. To be honest, I really don't like the idea of getting on with my life ALONE. I know it sounds crazy but this minimal contact with him over the past few days does feel better than any of those days and months in PLAN B did. That's what I meant about not liking what I have found out about myself. I have no desire to be the INDEPENDENT WOMAN. I was ALONE with the blinds lady tonight and it really sucked. I hated it. I am getting no pleasure from moving in a house by myself and got no pleasure from looking for a house by myself. Like I've said before, I often understand how the women in European countries allow their husbands to have mistresses. YUK!!

<small>[ July 31, 2003, 12:39 AM: Message edited by: mimi1254 ]</small>

Mimi

allow me to be blunt:

1) Overall you are doing an excellent job
2) You could do a really excellent if you take on board the extra advice here
3) Even to get to level (1) is a major achievement and is very hard emotionally
4) Of course contact feels good - you love him, he is your husband. However, you are now in the position of an OW - getting your fix. You need to be strong - you can see him coming round, don't let him backslide.
5) Do not respond to his suggestions on the house - issue him an e-mail along the lines of "Dear H, I am moving on with my life. I have spelt out before the conditions under which I would like you to be part of it. As they are currently not being met I have no use for your input. Thank you for your thoughts. Mimi"

Good luck and keep us posted.

S.

MIMI , I think you are doing great , SOME WS's when ready to make that leap to come back need to feel secure in coming home after PLAN B .

They got "the picture" I am sure he is/was scared
that if he didn't start doing some begging you where really moving on .

I know thats what PLAN B is suppose to do , but now at this stage , I really can relate to what your saying and doing .

Go with your gut , JMVHO $ 2 cents LOL ,,, I don't think your giving in to much .

Just enough to let him know you love him , and will take him back in when your conditions are meet ..

And don't say you don't like the person you found in you ,, this person was able to become independent from what you where in the past .

YOUR ws saw that 2 , I know hering the words , you are letting ws" cake eat and you and letting him fence sit "

can stir up some anger , because you honestly do not feel your doing that .

And for what its worth I don't think so either ..

I may get very flamed here but ok ,,, I know the N/C thing is supposed to be easy in the BS's eyes , just tell the B!tch she is/was a mistake ,, but the WS doesn't see it like that they are scared , guilty ,ect.

AND also they feel they have a life time to make up the pain they caused there S , but they left the OP in turmoil

I am not saying it is right that they care about hurting OP I am just saying BS's can't change the way they feel or the way they have to leave the OP ..

This is just my observation from listening to my H and the wacky way he felt about getting N/C achieved with OW .

Alot of what your H is doing and saying mine did the first time after PLAN B . So I can relate ..

I would just stick with what your doing and once you are ready to take him back MAKE dam sure that BOY knows the conditions and bounderies to reconcile .

And that you will never tolarate contact again .

Stay strong , keep those spirts up . Your doing great ..

MiMi-

I've responded to you over at NW's thread.

The basic jist...he doesn't deserve you. You are beautiful and he should be begging at your feet for forgiveness. Plan_b his A$$ and get yourself strong. You don't NEED that man. YOu don't NEED any man.

Mimi, I think you misunderstood what we're driving at. What I got from the post I responded to is that your WH is in contact with you daily about this move of yours. I know you don't WANT to live there alone, but I hope you realize you minimize the chances of that (and expediate the results you want) by holding firm to a strong Plan B for a while.

I have to disagree with the "go with your gut" post. DEFINATLY not flaming the poster!!!! But as a FWS myself, I'll tell you that it might feel better to inch your way in, but if you really want him to snap his head out of the fog and start REAL recovery (and yes, he still has to get through withdrawl!!) then inching won't do the trick. It took a solid belt to the butt for my head to finally peek its way out. Some can argue that some WS's are different than others, but in my opinion your playing with fire by slighting your plan even a little bit. The more you look ready to move on, and the stronger you appear, the more appealing you are to the WS and the more they want to be with YOU and not anyone else.

No one is beating up on you!! We wouldn't bother to post if we weren't sure you're ALMOST THERE!! All of us love a happy ending, and none of us can stand to see someone so close only to have backsliding. Stand strong and re-iterrate your Plan B stance. This move is for and about YOU, not US, until H actually takes action to back his words.

Good luck mimi!!

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by mimi1254:
<strong>
About being alone. To be honest, I really don't like the idea of getting on with my life ALONE. I know it sounds crazy but this minimal contact with him over the past few days does feel better than any of those days and months in PLAN B did. !!</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Well, if you keep throwing him bones and breaking Plan B, you WILL be alone! That is what we are all trying to help you prevent. That is one of the points of Plan B. He has NO MOTIVATION to end things with the OW as long as you keep meeting his needs. We want you to give him some motivation, ok, Mimi? We love ya and want him home! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Hey, I think we're all being a little too hard on Mimi. What do we all know? I think everyone has a different situation and we each have to finetune things according to our own personal radar.

I think Mimi did handle the house situation as best she could. She may have sold the house too quickly- but the house was also a source of pain to her. It may be just as well that she will have the distraction of creating a new house. It is unfortunate that WS thinks she will just be waiting for him to join her in the nest, but difficult to avoid.

It is good that her WS is thinking about the washer and dryer etc. Maybe he is still sitting on the fence, but at least mentally he is throwing some energy her way. Eventually he has to make the break with OW using his own energy. Mimi can only do so much to help him, he has to do it on his own. YES it's true she can't be a pushover- but I don't think she has been.

I think Mimi has to sit tight a little longer. I don't think a strict Plan B is necessarily crucial. You risk getting so cut off from your spouse. I think to some extent contact might be good. It sounds like her WS knows what he has to do. But Mimi, you can't sit around like you are twiddling your thumbs just waiting for him to come home.

This is just me, but if it was me...

I would say, "WS, I love you and I think we could have a great relationship, but we can't really have any kind of a relationship while you're seeing OW. Thanks so much for the washer and dryer, they will make my life more convenient and easy. Have to go, I'm busy fixing the house up and then I have my cooking class. And I'll be away next week on my vacation in Timbuktu, I'll send you a postcard... oh, and by the way, you don't mind if I date a little while you're living with OW, do you? That session we had the other day made me realize I am definitely missing male companionship...ta-ta, dear"

OK the above is not exactly serious. I do think however, that doing the 180 so to speak might be a good tactic for Mimi right now. Not a total Plan B, more of a mysterious tantalizing plan.

Mimi- a question-
IS WS LIVING WITH OW EVERY DAY? (please answer)
Does she still have her place? Has she moved her stuff into the condo? Where is her daughter living?

Re: the house. Is WS buying you a "better" house that he would like too? Did he look at it? Are you happy with it?

Hi Espoir ...

Now 180's are fine and all, but that part about telling the WS that she is dating? I don't think that would be something Mimi should say to WS ... you were just sighting an example, right?

Jo

Espoir still has it! I think you guys will be pleasantly surprised. I have my own strategy that I am using that is somewhat along the same lines as Espoir is saying. I got my washer and dryer today, by myself, with my own credit card,top of the line model. I almost put it on his account. Salesperson gave me that option, not knowing my situation <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> .

Actually, I got a better house than I have now with creative financing. It's beautiful! Another dream house. Will tell you more about that later.

OW continues to live in her dumpy house in a bad side of town. She did put a new hanging flower basket on her front porch. Sorry, I had to do one more driveby just to make sure that she is still there. She still lives there with her daughter. I know WS is probably finding the daughter to be a real grievance.

I am happy for you, Mimi. Doing things all on your own for the first time is very empowering, I've been there.

I understand that you, more than anyone, know your husband like no one else. And I agree that a hybrid version of the Plans can be appropriate at times, but please keep in mind that when Harley developed these Principals and Plans he based it on studying human nature and those associated nuances, intricacies and habits of adultery time after time.

So do what you think best, but try very hard to let your husband see what life is like without Mimi. It's the only sure way for him to make up his own mind. A firm decision with no waffling.

Of all things, I KNOW you certainly don't want a husband that waffles back and forth between you and OW for an indefinite amount of time.

Best,
Jo