Weaver,
Some things it's hard to know how to say, or even if they should be said, but here goes.

Remember that God has rules. They are not for him, but to protect us. The better we are at living HIS way, the more protection we have from heartache, and the more help he can give us.

I don't know the extent of your relationship with Dan, but if you were outside of the bounds God sets, then I wonder why you would be angry with God for the pain you have. Remember again, his rules are a protection for us. A safety net.

I can't feel the depth of your pain, I can't say "I know how you feel." All the same, I feel for you, and I wish it were otherwise.

I do know that the more closely we live Gods laws, the easier it is to find that elusive joy we all seek.

Not sure why I am saying this now, it doesn't make sense to me. I would rather be sending you a song or poem. It's just been on my mind. I hope I don't add to the hurt.

I'm sitting here for a while wanting to say something that will help, but I doubt I have any magic words.

I so much want you to be happy.

SS

I was not living outside of the bounds God set. I was very much committed for the rest of my life. I was very much married in every sense of the word, I was faithful and true. I was also faithful to God. When I found out Dan was still married I ended it & told him to go back with his wife. He came back three or four months later divorced.

In the bible there is no legal ceremony for marriage SS. The act of SF bound a man to a woman for life in the bible, only adultry could sever that bind. I lived with him yes, but I accept no blame for living in sin, as I was not. My heart, my love and my intent were true.

And if what you are saying is true, then what about the people who married before they lived together, and still they are broken and alone? Should they feel anger?

Anyway I am not angy with God anymore, I just wonder where he has been for me in my life.

I am more angry at the people who would minimize my relationship and love, and the validity of it.

Weaver,

My feeling is that the Jewish people had a very formal ceremony. I suppose I would disagree with you about SF being the binding tie.

Can we agree to disagree about that part?

I do agree that you were committed. I know it broke your heart.


I also agree that many that married first are now living as if they were single, with little hope that their marriages will surrive. I realize it is no sure thing.

I know that when I do as God asks me to, I get more help. I was trying to encourage you in that direction, but I am not trying to be your judge.

I can't be Dan's judge either, it's not my place, but I do feel it is not right to keep the kind of secrets he kept from you.

Can we start over?

Why were you angry, and what made the difference that you are not angry now?

Is it fair for me to ask that?

SS

Post deleted by weaver

Weaver,

I think your relationship with Dan, like the A’s exposed on this forum, started out in lies and deceit. And, JMO, as with the average A it had only a 3% chance of long term success because of the way it started. It does not matter that you feel guilty for rejecting his lies and maybe, or maybe not, made it hard on him. He lied big time! It affected you! You deserved, and you knew this, someone who did not lie to you just to get his way with you.

I suspect your R with Dan would have burned out pretty much the same, because of his issues, even if you were a living saint.

I don’t know this for sure, but I have been told that nowhere in the Bible is it promised we will be happy in this life. Nowhere.

We are promised joy, however, if we follow God’s purpose for us.

Have you read The Purpose Driven Life? If not, I recommend it. Not all your questions will be answered by reading this book. They can't be, even the author cautions against this. But it is a good starting perspective on what your life is supposed to be about.

I don't, and never did blame you for his marriage problems.

Please forgive me if I added to your pain. I never intended to do that. Please don't feel you have to defend your feelings to me. I accept you, and I love you. (the proper MB kind of course, sometimes I hate political correctness.)

I do think you could have been good for him.

I still also feel unless he changes a lot, he would not be good for you. This, from a distance, with few facts. It's just a feeling I have, and probably because he hurt you so badly, and my wish is for that not to happen to you again.

I'd like to give you a reason to smile tonight. Will this work for you?

SS

Hay Aph, is it you that lives in northen mountian time?

I'll be in Yellowstone next week, it it even close?

SS

Hey. I grew up maybe 75 miles as the crow flys from Yellostone NP. Attended undergrad maybe 50 mi away. Used to ride my Motor Cycle (a different kind of MC) all over the park in the summers - back when they didn't care so much if you just pulled off the road any old place to camp. (Remind me to tell you sometime about hot-potting. Just not on MB.)

My family is still mostly all back there. We just got back from two weeks there and Glacier NP area.

Alas, I now live on Puget Sound.

Aph,

I read the first seven chapters of "the purpose driven life" because that is what is available on the website. A girlfriend was reading it and asked me to read along with her.

And no we were never promised happiness, although we were promised that if we ask, we shall receive.

Aph, thank you for saying that no matter how good I was, he still would have left because they are his issues.

Just having a bad day, that's all. I really know all this stuff, but as you know sometimes we forget and all those regrets come back full force.

SS,

Thanks, and yes I know you are not judgemental in the slightest, and want only the best for everyone.

Thank you, that's all I can say.

Hope you and Aph can meet up, how fun!

"And no, we were never promised happiness, although we were promised that if we ask, we shall receive."

You, Weaver, are promissed you personally will receive whatever you ask for in Jesus' name.

I have been taught this means you will receive all good things you need to fulfill your purpose, to find and follow God. Not necessarily any old bad for you thing you want.

Would you give your five year old a sharp knife to play with no matter how much she pleaded, reasoned or otherwise begged? A teenager carte blanche to stay out all night and party?

Post deleted by weaver

I want to share something, Weaver.

About 20 years ago, while I was single, I became involved with a man who was separated from his wife.

I had misgivings about it, but his marriage was over, and I was crazy about him.

Various people told me that: it was wrong/ that it was wrong but if he divorced his wife and we got married it would be okay/ that so long as we loved each other God approved etc...

It was a close call, but in the end I broke it off simply to have peace of mind.

He reconciled with his wife shortly after.

The point of this is that in hindsight, knowing the woman I have become, and seeing him from a distance of 20 years. I am sooooo thankful that I did not marry him. I know now that it would have been a terrible mistake, and that we would have been miserable. (More miserable even than this marriage if that were possible..)


I don't know if my husband is the 'one' God meant for me, (or if there is such a thing), perhaps not...but I feel like I avoided a life time of regret by the skin of my teeth.


Maybe God has someone better for you, and you are the one getting in your own way...

Sorry for sounding so preachy and cliche.

Love,

Shul

Well you already know what I would say to that, in my present mind, but I am so glad you posted.

Glad you are still reading Shul. Was beginning to worry about you.

Won't even ask of your sitch and how things are. Of course if you care to elaborate, that would be cool.

Just glad to know that you are still reading, and up and about.

Weaver... do you feel obligated to the flower man? That's okay, if you do. But if he's as compassionate as the anonymous flowers (which even now I don't get) suggest, he will be understanding if you want to back out.

SS, about your warning to me in your post to SLH... thanks for getting it.

Okay, our drummer didn't show tonight, and the other two were not into playing music. We had a beer or two and chatted on the porch. My friend, our singer, whose attitude toward me & my troubles has for a long time been, move on, to hell with her, etc., surprised me. I told her I saw my doc and went back on ADs. She said she's glad, that she had seen that I was not doing so great. I asked why didn't you say something, and she said I'd have disagreed. Maybe so. I fight a little too hard sometimes. Lots of the time. I make people work before I'll agree with them. People without the inclination for a debate don't bother. This is often a bad feature of my personality.

Night all... Viva el fuego!

GC

SS, not much to tell about last night except it did not go well. He has been so mean to me the past couple days and I would have been better off canceling. I got an earful of websites, book, counselors cannot fix everything. blah, blah, blah He did read it though, I guess that is a start. Wanted to know why I think the infidelity is the only thing to work on. I told it is not but we have to deal with it first!

I admit to LBing a few times last night. His bad behavior toward me really triggered some bad stuff in me. I have got to get that under control.

Anyway, we still have tenative plans for lunch but I leave it in his hands.

I left him this morning with I am not the same person I was 1 or two years ago. I will no longer tolerate being treated badly and if he sees this a "cycle" of his then he needs to stop the cycle.

Weaver, hon, how are you today? If all else fails, remind yourself that you're still one hot, sexy, desirable woman and that if some guy is just dropping flowers off because you look down, imagine all the others that aren't brave enough to undertake similar actions! No, they're not Dan, but YOU ARE WORTHY, bay! We love you.

Anyone heard from Kimmy? Is she doing okay, and holed up with the new HP book?

FF, good luck at lunch today. Big hugs! I hope he is a bit nicer and you two can enjoy eachother's company. How much of last night was his fatigue and how much was just him being, well, him?

GC, your post about your singer's comments was valid. I don't think you are trying to be difficult as much as perhaps wanting to explore all of the possibilities to fully understand why things are before committing to them, kwim? "Making people work for them" & "fighting a little too hard sometimes" is just your way, just don't come on so strong, and you can get the same answers.

SS, just wanted to let you know I am not ignoring you. (REAL LOL this time, not a bitter one) I had finished this long response to you last night when Ti got home from work and plugged in his Tablet PC to transfer data from it to his home PC (ggggrrrrr . . . ask me why he didn't use his jazz drive?). At that point, the circuits became overloaded and we blew a fuse. . . crazy old wiring. . . crazy old house. Because all of our 'puters are networked and connected and all plugged in togather, i lost my entire response. All of it. Waaaaaaa.

Boy was I mad.

I guess I am going to have to start opening a document every time I post anything longer than a paragraph. Uh, like now?

I promise to respond in-depth soon. Suffice to say your compassion and understanding brought tears to my eyes. You understood. You knew. All of the hours I spent at the gym to please him, the funny and suggestively romantic web sites I created with photos of the resort and cute little maps detailing this and that, the love letters, the poetry, the beautiful gown I had bought for our ROVs. . . you knew. It wasn't just "a vacation". It was the only time we would have been able to be together all summer, as he had been out of town for almost 2 months. It was supposed to be so much more.

And you owe me no apology, SS. You were merely not in possession of all the facts. If anything, I owe you a sincere, heart-felt thank you, for all of the time and energy and compassion you consistently extend to myself and others, each time you open a post and read it with such careful reflection. The tender responses you post tell of much thoughtfulness and concern for the person to whom you are answering.

Thank you, again.

slh

Well, he just called to ask if we can do lunch tomorrow as today has been shot. In his job he never knows where he'll be and if his appointments run late. I was nice and understanding. Was it fatigue? Possibly, but SLH no more excuses for outrageous behavior. Yes, I hurt him...but he TORTURED and PUNISHED me for ending his first A for two years. I cannot go back to accepting that behavior. Yes, I still lb and I am working on it. I am NOT however the same person I was even a year ago. We spent a year in MC trying to break old habits and cycles, no more.

Yes, I still lb and I am working on it. I am NOT however the same person I was even a year ago. We spent a year in MC trying to break old habits and cycles, no more.

GOOD FOR YOU, FF!!!!!!

I'm sorry if it sounded like I was making excuses for him -- I wasn't. I just know it can be hard just being a PARENT sometimes, you know? You should have seen me last night -- LBs and all. I had to leave the house to get a hold of myself. Yes, even going out in 100 degree heat and cutting the muddy yard was more fun than being around my kiddos one more minute. My poor H.

I came back refreshed, believe that? After mowing our swampy-from-the-rain yard? LOL.

I'm sorry he cancelled, but you handled it really well. I can see you getting stronger, FF, and it heartens me.

Gotta go to the $100 store now, will see you all later.


love,

slh

How is everyone tonight?

we haven't heard from some of our regulars in a while and I am starting to worry.

I don't know, SLH. I'm working on the fireplace and reading here. It's hot tonight!

It's official, car4love and I are getting together for dinner soon.

SLH and FF, while your problems are very different, I never stop being impressed with the efforts you both put in.

What are we doing for fun this evening? Me? Zip. I wish I had some Doritos. I freakin' love Doritos.

Weaver is being very mysterious. Hope all's well up there on the UP.

GC