wow - what a day. cant talk - he's still here! OMG! It's 1am!
I know he 'does' want to leave, but he doesn't.

Hmmm. He talked to the kids tonight about how he is staying with a 'friend' atm but will still be here too take them to school etc.

he didnt tell them about our cancelled trip o/s...yet.

He is coming back tomorrow (if he leaves tonight, i have to go to bed soon) to take DS4 for a haircut and so I can go to the movies with my friends.

Oh - I HOPE HOPE HOPE I am doing the good wifey things, the good ENs.

I haven't tried to 'invade' his space - as much as Ive wanted to! lol!

I did talk to him this morn about his responsibilities and my boundaries - re ROOT - and he agreeed.

Ive not given him my letter yet..

Must run, dont wanna get caught on here.

Jus
PS - will update in morn

Hey Juzzi,

Slow down. Ask yourself, why would you ever want to meet the EN of a WS? EN of your H is fine but NOT the WS. Ok?

Don't work sooo hard. Just be yourself and go figure out your boundaries. U R making this harder than it has to and it will take it's toll on you soon. So slow down. When he comes don't fret. Be more casual and a bit nonchalant, especially if he is being a WS jerk. Btw, temporary period of being a dad, don't count.....he gets no extra credit for that....it's his job. Don't show unecessary praise, just short simple thanks when he is being good. Don't have to pat him on the head or give him a bone biscut. LOL!!! But if he begs...tell him to 'play dead'. LOL!!! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

L.

Hi Orchid,

Many times yesterday it was H, not WS. It was weird. We took the kids to the park in the afternoon and it was just like old times (cept he still wasn't touching me - and I didnt try to touch him).

At the end of the night he put his arms around me and gave me a kiss.

HURTS SOOO MUCH.

I gave him my letter and told him that I wanted to talk about it today.

Oh - found out why he wasn't in such a hurry to get back there. She was out visiting friends last night - surprise surprise. I really did think that deep down as he was in no hurry to get back to her.

A friend of mine said this morning that now that he is 'living' with her it isn't an affair any more - it's a relationship.

That really SHOOK ME UP. Is that true do u think?

I did say early on 'are you staying with her' (knowing full well the answer would be yes) and he said 'atm, yes'

What I tried to do yesterday is the same kind of calm, nonchalant juz that I was on Easter Show day, when he wrote and said 'it was a step in the right direction for us'. So I thought, as everyone has said here, I can't BREAK the affair but if I show a nice calm controlled home and me, that would be what he remembered.

I know I have to slow down - it's so hard to.

Still can't eat either -and he said 'Im so worried about you not eating'

I said 'well, come home and be my loving husband and I'll start eating!'

Hmm - no answer to that one!

Yes, Juz, even if they are living together, it is still in A, so long as the two of you are still married. An affair is when you are married to one person and having an emotional/physical involvement with someone other than your spouse. Tell the friend who told you that to go pound salt. With friends like that, well...

Regards,

BB

Why yes, it's a relationship. A black, malignant, infected, oozing, pus-encrusted cancer of a relationship. Do you have any true friends who will stand with you on this? Besides all of us. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Enjoy the respites where your H briefly reappears. This "relationship" <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" /><img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" /><img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" /> will have to run its toxic course, and at times he may be unrecognizable as your H. Doing the good things you are doing and helping remind him of his duties as a father can help the course to go a little faster. (Not that it will seem that way.)

Relationship, bah!!!!!

Thanks BB and Neak. And this friend IS a good friend, I think she is just trying to 'prepare' me for the worst - but it really didnt DIDNT help!

He arrived here at 2pm and the kids were down at mum and dads so I got to talk to him. I said 'have u read my letter' he said 'not yet' I said 'geez, glad it meant so much to you' he said 'sorry, i just fell into bed when I got home (HOME! GRR) and then when I got up had a shower and came here, I will read it tonight'

Anyway, I couldn't help myself from giving him a hug and I had been lying down (bad night, still in PJs) and he said 'aren't you well' (had his arms around me) and I said 'no, not really' he said 'in the tummy' I said 'no, in the head! he said 'welcome to my world'

I said again to him what ive said before, how I just find it hard to take because there was no warning whatsoeva. And he said 'i know' (his famous answer)

I said 'Can us see a future for us' and he said 'sometimes yes and sometimes no'

I said 'Are you attracted to me at all' and he said 'sometimes yes and sometimes no'

Then he starts rubbing my back and sides but up under my PJ top and IM thinking PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE!!! But bloody KIDS arrived back [censored] [censored] [censored]

So before I answered the door we kissed, a big kiss and then I went and opened the door and let the ferrals in, and now he has taken DS4 for a haircut and I dont know WHAT to bloody think.

*sigh*

I felt really strong last night, and I think it was because he was here, because today I have felt bloody awful again <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

Ive gotta make myself get through this SOMEHOW.

The WS & OP would like it t/b an R but he is still married, so at best it is an A. You know the fog can't spell A, so they spell it R-o-l-l-a-i-d-s. LOL!!! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

Yea, and it smells 2. The stench goes from the mothership.... like passing the garbage truck on a hot and humid day. LOL!!!

As to your remark about your H coming back and then you can eat..... well I said similar way back when.

L.

Juzzie - why don't you go on the trip to Germany with the kids regardless of this A. Just because he'd changed course, I don't see why you should all have to sacrifice the holiday. Just my thought for today. TT

Juzzie..

did you give him the letter yet...if you haven't it is my opinion DO NOT DO IT

it might be a lovely list of rules that if he meets it makes his affair OK...
Juzzie says if I do x y z then this other 'stuff' is OK..
as long as I do these things...

don't make it easier
don't protect HIM from the kids....

Get your house in order,..we all know with young kids how hard it is...and how even harder when in emotional distress and doing it by yourself......

focus on those type of actions that keep you busy busy busy...

do things that help organize and decrease the chaos it will make you feel much more calm...

think about enlisting the help of good friends and rearranging some things in the home....
changes that he will notice and you would have usually gone to him for his opinion...cut him out of some of the loops...

when he is coming over...have the home be a haven..
have it be tidy and neat...

when he is coming over fill the house with things that smell good...throw something in the oven that smells great...

the sense of smell is an extremely powerful memory...

make his favorite brownies cookies..and have then out BUT don't offer them...unless he asks....

If you know the time he is coming over engage the kids in some awesome activity..

bubble blowing
dancing in the kitchen..
charades...

let him walk in to a home full of laughter and life with him where he chooses on the fringe.....

give him both full and side views of what he is sacrificing...without words but actions...

NO
NO
NO big relationship talks...he wants to drag in to philosophical flotsam about his need to

FIND himself
his NEED to be HAPPY..
blah blah blah blah....

be sexy....
smell great
flirt a little with no real overt advances,,.
throw lingere over the shower curtain when he's coming over...

be done with him before he is ready to leave...
heck dear sorry to scoot you out but I got get the kids ready ...

fill the house on the weekends with family and friends..
have cook outs and people over...
good friends of him and yours....gather them to you and leave him on the peripheral...always welcome ...but not quite IN anymore...

If you can't be upbeat on the phone
don't call or talk to him..
tell him..ohhh too busy right now gotta go...call me later though....

get a male friend of the family to take over a chore of your husbands...

hubby.
don't worry about mowing the lawn this week....jeff said he'd do it....batt your eyelashes and change the subject....

juzzie you have lots of things you can be doing filling your time...

QUIT asking if HE'S attracted to you...just be ATTRACTIVE to him.....and get his attention...

no more asking him anything like that...!!!!!!!!!

he is sooooooooooooooooooo unattractive right now via his actions...that you should get a medal for not hurling when you see him.....

if nothing else juzzie..
no more relationship talk..it's all foolish babble...

ARK

Thanks Ark!

That is a great post! I HAVE given him the letter unfortunately.

I mean, i was glad to give it to him, but I can see where you are coming from - especially because of how this long weekend has been.

It has been good.

We did laugh and I did flirt a little, but nothing more than that.

The kids were wonderful

And STUPID STUPID STUPID me thought that meant that things were cracking over there.

Cept....

I found his phone unattended today when he was playing soccer.

All the time he was msging her about how much he missed her

oh and last night I went out with friends for coffee. We weren't meeting until 8pm and his words to me were 'dont hurry home, it doesn't matter what time you get back'.

So I didnt'

The shop closed at 11pm, we got kicked out and then it was a half hour drive home, plus I had to stop for gas.

Anyway - I rock on in around midnightish and he leaves about 12.50. But it was a 'good' leave. I was in an upbeat happy mood after being with my friends and I even sent him a stupid MMS photo which he wrote back and it was all good

Cept today on the phone I see a message at 10pm that he sent to her that said 'I think she thinks if she stays out really late I wont come back to you - it aint happening'

I just feel soooo betrayed (stupid i know - more betrayed over the other ****** but he SAID stay out as long as I like)
and it just hurts that he was badmouthing me to her when I wasn't doing anything wrong.

Anyway, i was pretty quiet at soccer, cause I had discovered these msgs at the start of the game.

He came and put the kids in my car and said goodbye to them and then came around and gave me a kiss and said 'I'll speak to you soon, ok.'

And I said 'ok'

and we left.

TheN I get a text 10mins later that says 'I know you disapointed i dint come home. Just hope the last couple of days shows I am trying? Mark'

Its like WTF. You are trying when U want to try and then she calls and off you go running.

GRRRR. Yes - another little bit of my heart froze today <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

Jus

PS TT - Can't afford to go to Germany. Would really love to still take the kids. Was soul destroying telling my 7 year old - she screamed in anguish <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

Juzzi,

U ready to yank his chain? How?

Send him when he thinks he needs to stay and get him to stay when he wants to leave. Yea.....that is one way to mess with a WS. Change the time on their watches is another trick. LOL!!! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

What wil that do? It will make them off balance and you how much fun an off balance person in an A c/b to the OP?!?!?! LOL!!! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" /> Oh....it could ruin their evening, weekend, life.... Awwhhhh... <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/pfft.gif" alt="" />

L.

YOu know, this is what Im having more trouble dealing with. That he KNOWS I KNOW and yet he keeps going back there.

That is my biggest gripe from today. That he spent the day with us, and had fun, i could tell, and yet HE WENT BACK THERE.

And he msged her -from here (although I didnt realise it when we were home) to say 'Im leaving for soccer in 40mins'

Oh and my DD18mnths said (because she's seen daddy today, yesterday and Sunday) 'dadda dadda dadda' and went into every room of the house before bedtime <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

That sounds like a cute little anecdote to message him. "It was so cute...she just kept saying dadda dadda and looking all over for you. Daddy's girl for sure <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />"

Your WH truly is not in his right mind at this point. Don't take his garbage personally. I know it's hard not to. If you just assume the worst possible EVERYTHING about him, you're probably right, and at least you won't be disappointed. You may even be pleasantly surprised once in a while.

{{{{Juzzie}}}}}} because you need a hug before I tell you that it will take more than this before his fantasy busts. A good day with you does not mean that things are breaking apart with them, at best it shows that there are some cracks in la la land. So please do not pin your hopes on a single good event, or have them crushed by a single bad event. It takes time, but nearly all of them regain their sanity eventually.

Keep your eyes on the goal.

OHHHH MY GOD!

Guess what just happened.

OMG OMG OMG OMG OMG

I just got a text from Mark, I was just going to bed (midnight) and I heard my phone beep.

It says 'If u wanna have any chance with me then u gotta stop all texts and calls to Ruth! We'll talk about it but please leave her alone? That's not right!

OMFG

I HAVE RUNG HER ONCE - that was when I didnt know it was an affair and it was the day he went there to 'sleep on the couch' HE gave me her number.

I have texted her about 4 times. The first week I did 3 times when he was staying there (didnt know about affair) to see if he was ok.

Then once, on my DD7 birthday when she wrote to me and said 'I just wanna know if Mark's ok, he was gonna be back here and he's not and I was worried about him.' I wasn't going to msg her back but I did and I just said 'he's just left'

That was the 1st April.

I have NEVER written to her since. I have given her number to NO-ONE.

OMG OMG Omg!

I just tried to ring him - no answer. I sent him 4 text msgs telling him i NEVER did such a thing and he KNOWS me and knows I wouldnt waste the money doing that. And to PLEASE ring me, anytime tonight about it. And to ask to see her phone because it isn't me writing to her.

HOLY [censored]

I was actually tired and now Im wide wide WIDE awake.

GOd I hope he rings me.

God I hope she has been caught out in a BIG FAT HUGE LIE.

FARRRRRRKKKKKKKK

I just got THIS ONE....


"I'll go 4 a walk in a while, ok? I believe u when u say u didnt, but please dont in the future, ok. Long story but will explain another time!"

Well I wrote back and said ' ring me on HOME OR MOBILE, IM not sleepy now!! U have totally freaked me out Mark. You would u accuse me of that? And to put it like that to me 2, like an ultimatum. I dont know what tales she's spun but I hope u know me better than U KNOW HER.'

OMG OMG OMG

ARE THESE CRACKS OR IS MY WH AS DERRANGED AS THE ROOT!!!

HE still hasn't rung - damn it! here I am wide awake at 1.45am waiting for call to find out what the h+ll this is all about!!! GRRRRRRR

Juzzie, They are both totally wayward. So don't get freaked out by it. That is normal behaviour.

They are cheats. They are liars. Adultery really is not just about the sex. It brings out the very worst traits in a person.

And I would keep your text messages back to him really brief. To his last one, I would just have typed back 'ok'. I think you might seem too needy. Might give yourself some peace if you block his number for a while. He won't have anything positive to say anyway. He's feeling very important right now. Two women WANT him. What a dilemma. The testosterone is pumping and he is HOT. He's playing you against each other because it suits him. He wants a finger in both pies.

One of these days, and it may yet be a while off, he will cool down, wake up to his actions and realise what a complete and utter twat he has been. He has so much to lose but he just can't see it at the moment. So Juzzie, I'd just leave him alone. Ark's post was brilliant - go back and read it again, and then in the morning, and even every hour, just to focus and keep yourself on track. Take care Juzzie. TT

Maybe write Ark's post on a 3x5 card and keep it in your pocket all day and all night.

You remind me so much of myself a year ago. Trying so hard, and a wreck when, in spite of everything I did, he kept going back to her. Happy when he was happy. Sad when he was cruel.

You will find this much easier to get through if you find some emotional distance from the filth. This is where the alien idea really helped me out, once I heard about it. (Lemonman thinks some of the people here believe the WS's really turn into aliens. Maybe he is right. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> So just for the record, they don't really turn into aliens; it just seems that way.)

But once I heard that they all act like they have been taken over by body-snatching aliens, it made it easier for me not to take everything so personally. When he would attack me and try to blame me for everything bad on the planet, instead of letting it get to me like before, I would just (mentally only!!!) roll my eyes and think "Alien, blah blah blah." It added enough humor to make the situation almost bearable. My calm was maddening to him.

He admitted shortly after it ended that some of the bad behavior had been on purpose to try and drive me away, and upset me to the point where I would end it with him, and then he wouldn't have to be the one to decide.

What he (and she) did last night was bad, but does not change the outcome of this one whit. You may feel at his mercy now, but before this is over you will be the one deciding whether or not you want to stay married to him.

Stay strong.

Well I gott his at 7am this morning (after being up all night)

Sorry I fell asleep. Had had a few beers. Didnt mean to be accusivelast night. Just wanted to keep u 2 apart. Just me being me. Didnt mean 2 freak u out!

Alien being alien hey!

So i got a msg half an hour ago to say he's gonna ring me soon, just on work call.

I am so cranky about this (and my lack of sleep - i had things to do today and all ive done is mope around hte house Im so damn tired)

To accuse me of something SO SPECIFIC. It is so specific. Its 'STOP ALL TEXTS AND CALLS TO ROOT...PLEASE LEAVE HER ALONE'

Im not the one touching the woman! LOL!

Then in the next 'i believe you when u say u didnt ut please dont in the future.'

What the.......???

"WH, what you are doing is hurting our family. Please leave that woman alone."

<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Any time you can turn his words around on him it is a good thing, IMO, as long as you do it nicely.

I sympathize with moping around the house, so as the pot calling the kettle black, don't do it! Get busy! Do something!

If your WH is like most, he will be back and forth like this, yo-yo style, and would go on looooooooong past your ability to tolerate it, IF he were allowed to. And that's why Plan B is such a crucial next step, when the time comes.