Yes Neak, I am going to have to speak to the children tonight. DS said again tonight about missing daddy and when was he coming home because he loved him.

DD said a similar thing this afternoon when I dropped her at ballet.

So, I think that it's time for me to sit down and talk to them. Not fair, but as you say Neak, they may see it as their fault (like i see it as my fault, even though I know it isn't). I am thankful that my youngest DD is too young for any problems, except that after she sees him she walks around for the next few hours asking 'where's dadda'

My darling Mum made dinner and brought it down tonight, and is staying here while I go out and teach at 7pm. Normally I would have the kids, the youngest two in bed before I started teaching, but I haven't had to do that today. Mum bathed them and everything. Isn't she wonderful!

Tonight, when I come in from teaching I have to ring my MIL and tell her what I did last night. I didnt have the strength to deal with her last night, tonight, with mum here I will be better.

No msg from him - he is respecting my request...... <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

zuj,

I found it best to direct the children so the WS to answer some of the questions. I encouraged my son's freeness of speech (w/in reason of course) and when I felt his father needed to explain his waywardness, I directed my son to his dad, assuring him it was alright to ask his father what was on his young mind.

That direction led my then 6 year old to compose a 4 letter sentence to his father. I asked why the letter and his reply was that he was too embaressed to speak to his dad. I asked him to clarify and he said something to the effect that his dad wasn't being his dad and it embaressed him to see his dad act that way. WOW!!! Out of the mouths of babes. I made sure H heard those words and it did make it, right through the fog. The letter was short but the impact was big. I was very proud of my son having the skill to write such a touching letter.

Mind you all the while the OW was trying to convince the WS that children do better with only 1 parent. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" /> Go figure....only a numbskull nut would fogspeak such nasty thoughts. Good thing that was too much for even the WS to swallow. LOL!!! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

L.

What an awesome mum!

Now don't be letting yourself get bummed because he "respected" your boundary. Soon enough he will be messaging you, and reading between the lines you will correctly read, "Zuj? Are you there? Answer me please! I'm having a really hard time right now because of what you did. (<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" />) I really really wanted to have both of you fawning over me, adoring me, competing over me, and maybe once in a while you could each rub one of my feet at the same time while I try and decide who gives better massages. And now I can't! WAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHH"

Ok, now you're done thinking about him for the day. Firmly steer your thoughts somewhere else. What are you going to do with your children, to spice up their lives? I would recommend playing Tornado with them, where you let them whirl around the house picking up their stuff.

I still haven't found a method that works really well, but so far the best results have been from working with one child at a time so they can't escape so easily, then in half hour or so, trade them for the next one. Try to convince them this is a game. (Older children are not fooled, so you are fortunate to have younger ones.)

What nice thing are you going to do after the kids next go to bed? Start planning early so you are not sitting there moping at 9pm.

Baby steps. You are having a much easier time of this than unnamed people that we won't even mention. Which is as it should be.

Thanks Neak, I needed that laugh this morning!

I had a very graphic dream last night that he was in bed with me hugging me, so much so that I woke up thinking he was there <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

Hoping it was an omen that he WISHED he was there and was thinking lots and lots and lots about me at that point too.

I went to bed fairly early last night (for me) 11.30, so have woken fairly refreshed for the first time in a very long time.

DD7 has her cross country race at school today so she is very excited!

I am going out to buy a nice diary.

I have decided that each day I am going to write in it the thoughts and things that happen with the kids, you know, every day stuff like falling over and bumping heads or funny things they say.

So that WHEN he comes home I can give it to him and let him know that he hasn't missed those special things that I would have shared with him.

Must go - gotta get ready for school

hugs

Zuj,

You are doing great. Take this time to get to know yourself. A journal is a great idea. Keep yourself busy and do things you have wanted to do but never got the time. Eat the things you like. It is amazing to find out how much we women arrange our lives around our families like and dislikes. This is your chance to do what you want for a short time.

It will be very hard to resist the urge to call him or see him. Hang in there!

My thoughts are with you.

Nkay

Best wishes and good luck

I think OWomen get a a power surge from the impact (actual or potential) of the a on the w .These 20 somethings are out of the teen dating loop and are regarded by that age group as being rather ancient and past it.

Having a relationship with an older man is a big boost to their self esteem it keeps them feeling young. No matter that their father figure is someone elses daddy.

The less she knows about your state of mind and your intentions the better.She is waiting for you to stack on an emotional scene to make her look like the sane one----------- keep her guessing!!!

I think you are doing all the right things- I am sure it will pay off

And so it has begun.....

My friend, whom he chose to be the intermediary received this msg from him yesterday...

" S, do you mind being the go between for me and J? There's a few things we need 2 sort out? Mothers Day this weekend. I need to get gifts from the kids for J. Also need to organise money matters. I need money to live on but dont wanna leave her and the kids short as well as covering the bills! Also need to organise contact wtih my babies! What a sh!tty mess!"

My friend just wrote back and said 'yes i will.'

Then today she rang me and told me she got this msg.... He is using her like a conduit to me - it's like he thinks she will fwd msgs to me (which she does of course!) and it's almost the same as he msging me. I got SO upset when she read this one out to me, just because 'he doesn't get it'. MY sis thinks its a good thing. She has 'good' feelings. I have learnt to trust her feelings before - but then again - sometimes they are wrong! lol!

This was the msg to S today..

"S, I need to know what's gonna happen on Sunday with Mothers Day? It's v strang not being able to just msg J and just ask? I'm off to BB and the school that she used to visit out there are having a sports carnival! So tiny cause such a small school. Cheers"

??????HUH?????

She got that about 10.30 this morning, but didnt actually read it until after lunch as her phone was in her bag. She didn't respond until about 2.30 this arvo, after she spoke to me. I said to her how I didnt want her to be 'an interpreter' and that is how WH sees her.

She was writing back something along the lines of...

'M, I dont think anything can happen this Sunday, this is from me, I can't ask J about Mothers Day, that's not fair on her. You may have to sit down and organise access visits if this separation continues.'

I just started crying and crying when she rang me and told me. And the thing is, as much as I love her and am glad that WH has chosen her because she is a good friend, she is also very negative about the relationship, as her xh had an affair and she left him straight away (many years ago - no children, together 3 years). So she often says little things, like she did on the phone today about 'I dont know how long it will continue like this while you still pin your hopes on him coming home'. And I was just in no mood to say to her 'he IS going to come home, he IS IS IS.'

Anyway - feeling miserable now and so badly miss him <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

Zuj,

He can't get to you but will try to use your S. U 2 must be strong.

If u r strong enough to hear the messages and not respond, then fine. It w/b her release valve and she will be yours as the go between. Then it w/b hard for him to blow either of you up since u both have release valves. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

He wants her to organize stuff 4 him? Ha! Typical WS style.

Let her lead him on so that when he drops it has a greater impact.

Ex:

Ws: SIL, I need you to get me presents from the kids for J.

SIL: Ok.

WS: Make it nice.

SIL: Ok.

NOTE: SIL does not comply, just says OK. Mother's day comes, no presents for Zuj....you gotta be strong for this. Children will ask their dad....where's our presents for mom? Guess who will get egg on his face? What's he gonna say? I told SIL to get them for me? What a wheeny. LOL!!! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

Another example:

WS: I need you to tell Zuj.......

SIL: Ok.

2 days later.....

WS: Did you tell Zuj?

SIL: Tell her what?

WS: TEll her what I said about......

SIL: Oh.

WS: Will you tell her?

SIL Ok.....

....and on it goes.... until one day, he gets it. Plan B!

Now for the legit stuff she needs to tell you and you need to reply but you both need to know what is legit vs an excuse. Reemmber each time he makes contact you have filled enough of his WS need to keep him as a WS.

NOTE: WS' need to feed on the misery of the BS and family.

Last example:

WS: SIL, I need you to help me organize my $$.

SIL: Ok.

WS: When?

SIL: Whenever... but I'm busy right now.

WS: Tomorrow?

SIL: No not tomorrow.

WS: Sunday?

SIL: Maybe.... call me later.

The WS needs to see no one is going to accomodate his schedule.

JMHO,
L.

Thanks Orchid - I just copy and pasted your post to S, to let her know the kind of thing. She doesn't mind being the intermediary she just doesn't quite know what to do - I am sure your post will help her.

THANKS.

Still feeling yucky but chatting on msn with my sis so at least my mind is occupied whilst the kids what the cartoons!

If M is feeling this way about Sunday already - and it' only Thursday, how is he going to feel BY Sunday....

He'll feel like a heel.

Good.

....and they call me mean!?!?!?! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/pfft.gif" alt="" />

Btw, let your sister know the objective. It may guide her actions better.

Objective:

1. Don't engage a WS in a convo. It's confusing and gives one a headache.

2. Don't agrue or attempt to reason with a WS. They don't have ears.

3. Take his info and let him leave....if he leaves thinking he's bowled one over you....that's ok. Why? 'Cux we all know that's not true but the WS does not believe anyone but his but.

4. Don't fret. Ws' for the most part, spew and then have to apologize. Be strong enough to stand your ground and don't let him see that he is getting your goat. Give him bull instead. LOL!!! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

5. Like the way you have to turn into the spin to slow the car down.....make the WS think u r on his side just a little, enough for him to let his guard down. When he does, the real H might get a chance to peek out.

6. If your sister can learn to reverse babble, she w/b one powerful allie.


JMHO,
L.

L.

Okay, we're coming up to 2 days of NC and I'm feeling it <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

And that's with KNOWING he's contacting friends of mine too.

I found out today that the night I read him my letter he went to the pub and then started msging a friend about how it we were 'very separated' now and he didnt know what to do. She is a good friend of ours and she didnt know what I had done so she thought that HE had decided this. Those texts went back and forth for 2 hours. Then the next day (yesterday) he msged her to apologise for his drunken texts so she rang him (again, not knowing what I had done, i didnt speak to her until today and explain, and thats when I foudn all this out). So when she rang him she said 'so this is it, it's final' and he said '....no' so she said 'well the break is necessary then, but it wont work whilst you're still living with the OW.' and he said 'I know, Im just taking it day by day atm' (babble babble)

This is so damn hard <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

I mean I DONT want what I had - god, I couldn't cope with that, I know it, but the withdrawral is so shocking.

Sorry to ramble, no-one to talk to atm and so here I am to chat to you all!

Yes Neak, he WILL feel like a heel! But not enough of one to de-fog I reckon!

How long was AJ in plan B?

Thanks orchid for those points, will pass them on

zuj

zuj, from reading your post i am very hopeful for your situation, stay very very dark. I know its very very hard for you right now. But i believe with all of my heart, that in your situation it will be oh so worth it.

He cant stand it not hearing from you, he is getting more and more miserable, and when he will finally hit bottom, he will know what to do.

Whatever you do, dont contact him, dont break down and message him or write him. Then you will be back to square one. Stay strong, we are all here with you. You are doing a great job, stay focused on the goal, and it will give you the strength to keep staying in Plan B and staying dark.

sending you a big hug

D.

Man oh man oh man

Just got a ph call from his brother. His bro tried to talk to him today, Wh ended up hanging up on him because BIL said 'for gods sake just ring mum and say hello'

Anyway BIL is going to ring the OW tomorrow at work and say 'look, i dont know who you are, or if you realise what you have done, but you come over here from another country and not only do you break up a family with children, but I nnow can't talk to my own brother - he is changed since you came into our lives. Do you realise what you have done.'

My poor BIL was crying on the phone to me he said 'we are so here for you J, we think of you every single day and are praying for you.'

So - EOTR - how right you are about him getting more and more miserable!

Time for everyone else to put more pressure on and for me to be DARK DARK DARK.

HUGS AND THANKS

Juz, do you think he has read MB at all? I am amazed how quickly he has stopped contacting you and is using an intermediary. It's like he knows you're doing Plan B!

Stay dark, keep busy, don't drink too much! I can't tell you how much this reminds me of my WH when he started with OW. He also didn't contact his family because he was ashamed of himself and didn't like their judgment. In fact he just flew to England for the first time in nearly two years. Of course, everyone had plenty of time and sympathy for him now because he's got kidney failure. That has taken over our marital situation.

STAY DAAARRRRKKK. TT

Hi TT,
I don't think he is reading MB, mind you, I was worried about that a few weeks ago because I forgot to clear the 'history' and he could have checked that.

I dont think has contacted me yet because remember, my going dark was a very very very dramatic emotional conversation. I was hysterical, as was he. It was truly appalling. I was in sobbing tears explaining to him that I COULD NOT continue this way, with the constant contact and that although I would miss him terribly, I needed to break all contact with him so that I can get well, and get the kids well again.

And that although I would probably want to call him a million times a day, I wont be able to because it's not fair on me - and it's not fair on the kids and if he was feeling so much pressure with the kids and with me then he needed no contact too.

I then emailed him the letter so that he would ahve a copy, because I didnt know how much he would remember of our conversation - it was so upsetting and draining.

But - he could well be reading MB....

Im not drinking at all! LOL! I only drink recreationally and haven't been out to do that - no - tell a lie - had half a glass of wine when I went out with M on FRiday night - he finished the carafe.

He is the one that is drinking terribly.

I hope that my WH doesn't take as long as yours has to wake up though TT - I may be like you by then, and not sure I want him back at all..

Hugs...

Think how baaaaaad this is for him. You miss him, yes, but you have all of us. *modest blush* HE only has her.....and a bottle of chocolate. Now who would you say is better off???

But seriously, the more miserable he is, the easier it will be for your H to poke his head out through the fog, maybe for a moment at first, then longer periods of time as he starts getting so sick of chocolate.

AJ never experienced the 'joys' of Plan B. The closest he got was about 24 hours without me the first time around. The second time I didn't bother leaving dramatically to be out of the way while he packed; I just confronted him hard and after 4 hours of pleading agreed to put Plan B on hold but with my finger still on the button. But that reaction is very rare. Maybe some of the old-timers have seen it before, but I had not, which is why it surprised me so much.

I doubt your Plan B will be very long. He likes your cake too much, and I bet hers is already starting to taste like sawdust.

Keep being strong for your kids - you are right on track.

Morning Zuj - Day 3. Thinking of you. TT

{{{TT}}} thanks! and {{{{NEAK}}}} thanks!

Day 3 - I know - can u believe it!

After I 'wrote' last night re the BIL phone call I rang my friend S to let her know what had happened and she said 'well, have I got a doozy for you' she then sent me thru this.....

"Thanks S, Could u please tell j to tell s to go take a running leap into whatever. He has managed to turn my problem into his - surprise surprise! I asked him to do one thing for me and he won't. I helped both him and my mother through years of ****** and neither of them remembers any of it now because it suits them. So as far as im concerned they can both bo to ******! Sorry S but I'd send to Juz but am respecting her wishes! Ur a good friend and I know you'll be there for jduring this v difficult time in all of our lives! Love M"


She couldn't believe it because when I rang her she had just read my email that I had cut and pasted from Orchid about what he was likely to do!!! She said "OMG It's TEXTBOOK!"

Well, she didn't respond to him, as much as she wanted to write back and say 'I am NOT your relay service M!' She wasn't even going to tell me, except for my phone call.

So, I was pretty worked up last night, but a friend came over for coffee and i spoke to another on the phone so I calmed myself down. Went to bed at 10.30 and slept until 5.30, when I woke with a start and thought "OMG TT is right - he is reading the boards, thats how he knows about BIL'


For 2 hours I couldn't sleep thinking "Oh no - Im going to have to go dark on MB as well, how will I cope with that, I need you guys.'

So,at a decent hour I msged S and asked what time WH msged her thru with the 'doozy' she said '5.36pm' "PHEW" I thought - that is 2 hours earlier than when BIL even rang me, and 2.5hrs earlier than when I posted about it on here - so he can't have read it.

So - yes WH is now thinking he can tell me 'things' through S.

Then this morning the credit card people called wanting him, I knew the account was o/d. I gave his mobile number. 5 mins later the woman rang back and said 'your husband said it would be best to speak to you about payment of this'.

I said 'ok, not a problem, what is the amount due, ok, will be paid Monday'.

I then msged S later and said 'can u tell M that I will be paying $x off the cc on Monday' she wrote back and said 'he just msged me to ask if you could pay them.'

I said 'good! That means that it sounds like Im only answering him, rather than initiating contact - however benign.' S said 'will do,'

So the youngest 2 and I have been out at playgroup this morning and the mums there, who Ive barely seen the past 6 weeks looked at me and said 'OMG the weight is falling off you - what are you doing?' I said 'thats what happens when your husband walks out on you in a MLC!' so I got lots of 'venting' done there, which is always nice - as you know! lol!

Sad though - we played outside today and the little 3 and 4 year old boys were playing in the cricket nets and I thought 'oh, M would be SOOO proud of DS the way he was playing cricket' but - couldnt say it could I! So, that's something to write in the journal tonight.

DD has her school dance tonight, she is v excited. She said to me in the car this morning bout Mothers Day and how she only had the present she made at school cause Daddy hadn't taken them shopping yet. I said 'your present from school is wonderful darling - that is fine! Daddy wont be taking you shopping this year, daddy doesn't live at home anymore.'

"YES HE DOES" she wailed. So we had a talk about how daddy's head is sick atm and that it wasn't her fault or any of our faults but he wants to live with someone else for a while at least. And that she can go and visit the counsellor at school if she is sad and maybe she would like to write a letter to daddy if that would make her feel better. And she said 'yes I would'

So I hope she is ok at school today.

Now - Boy is sitting watching Peter Pan. Gonna put the Wee One down for a nap and then mop this filthy kitchen floor!!

TTFN

x0x0