Happy, I think I get it. I think I have struggled with a "renter" mindset, I don't know if I want this relationship, let me tweak some stuff and see if I can get it to fit better. Very stuck in reacting, fixing. My well-being, MiL's well-being, D10's well-being is bigger than whether or not I can find a way to force this solution. I will try a calm discussion with H again, before he gets his hands on his first beer tonight <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/blush.gif" alt="" />

My embarassment is from feeling less than equal. Something in LA's post to somebody yesterday popped in, "Equal in being, not equal in role." I can reprioritize and focus on creating a peaceful home for myself and my kids by eliminating the pain I cause in my house.

Thanks!

Glad to help! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Why do you feel less than equal? If you're basing your decisions on POJA, on you two BOTH agreeing on the solution, doesn't that put you two on equal footing?

Don't mean to keep bugging you about this. Just curious where it comes from. I never did trace mine back all the way -- one day I just noticed that I no longer felt the need to apologize for making joint decisions or for consulting with my H. Still not quite sure where the need came from or why I don't have it anymore. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

I feel less than equal because this feels like awfully familiar territory. Feels awfully like shutting up to keep the peace. Like walking on eggshells. I check my intent, why do I do this, and think that's where the problem lies. My code says not to cause H harm, but my intent is also to make him want to love me, and stop hurting me. But I see that as out of my control. Out of my hula hoop. Hence the conflict.

I trace this belief back, and I think of telling my brother let's be really good when we get visitation with dad, so he'd come back and live with us again. Didn't work, because it wasn't about us. I feel like I'm still fighting that struggle, only with H now.

Like BTE described, I am mad at myself for not being successful so far protecting my kids from being a witness to these patterns. When we are kids, our family is all we know, it's what will be the norm that they reference their adult relationships with. There are things every parent messes up, but this is WAY too important to mess up, and I feel like I am failing. And continuing to set myself up to fail. There are things that I could have done this week to meet H's ENs better, that I didn't because I goofed off too much. Not enough focus.

I am reacting again. It's all going to be okay. I need to stop punishing myself with fear and dread. Trying to figure out my payoff, I think it is to create empathy for my H's anger. If I feel that I deserve it, if we are in agreement that I deserve to feel shame like this, then I won't have to stand up for myself today. But I have ways to deal with my fear of standing up for myself, I have another option than to keep punishing myself like this.

I think part of the reason I set myself up to fail and build up this pain and dread is that I know people don't change until it's too painful to say the same.

I can stick to I messages, and be aware of progressive boundary enforcement. I am able to step off this merry-go-round if I choose.

I was unable to speak to H in a safe manner about planning a trip up to MiL over Thanksgiving weekend. H didn't stop about the things I didn't get done.

Happy, thank you for your presence. Your patience.

MiL is out of sedation. She mostly is sleeping, but she can be awoken now. We have tried negotiating, no solution yet.

My sister goes in for an outpatient laparoscopic proceure Tuesday, but she is really recovering so well.

My brother came for a visit from across the country. I've seen him daily, and I am so grateful for that.

Things have been rough with H. I have been spending way too much thought and effort and focus on him compared to just being the best wife I can be. A lot of tools are really helping me: thinking of separate and equal, listen and repeat, I messages, respond instead of react, progressive boundary enforcement. It is still a struggle, the boundary enforcement. I got to 1) "stop, you're defining my thoughts and my actions, that's abusive" 2) separate for a few hours 3) go away for the evening. It doesn't stop, and I didn't have a plan for 4 and 5. I didn't AO, but I broke down crying. I am practicing HEALs, but I still feel extremely sad. I went for a walk, but had to come back because I just kept bawling. I weeded the yard, and that was better.

I think 4 is sleep away from the home, but I don't know how to do that with kids. Do I bring them? Isn't that confusing for them? Do I leave them with someone who is already acting out? This didn't seem good, either.

When I went to visit my FOO, I dreaded driving home. Friday night, H was gone when I came home, and my siblings and mom came home with me to visit. I was so grateful to have a buffer for when H came home, he visted with us all and then went to bed.

What about temporary separation? I don't know how to work that, either. I think there would be some intermediate steps to try first, intermediate boundary enforcements. Any suggestions? Is this discussed in any of Dr. Harley's books?

Hi EO!! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

I think today is your first day at your brand-new job.. Good luck! I know you'll knock their socks off! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />


I read this, and I just wanted to reach out and give you a big ol' hug! Poor baby EO, trying to be good so she could get her family back. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/teary.gif" alt="" />


Wow, and then this one.. I can't tell you how much I admire you for tracing this back.

Why would you ever deserve to feel shame like that? What is so shameful about you?


I don't like this part... Did you guys agree that there was something you would take care of that didn't get done? Or is it more along the lines of, there are always things that don't get done, and this just happened to be one of them (the in-box is never empty, is it?)? What do you mean you "goofed off"? "Not enough focus"? Is that a DJ to you? Are you shaming yourself?


Hmmm, see I'm still wondering about the things you didn't get done. Did you have an agreement to do them? Or was this the first time you'd heard about them? And what do they have to do with taking a trip to visit your MIL?


You are so welcome! I am thrilled to be here. I am talking to myself as much as to you when I post, and I am grateful for YOUR presence as well. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

I just saw your second post, about the boundary enforcements. I think maybe you could insert a few more steps between 1 and 2. Have you read Al Turtle's page about boundary enforcements and cats? How cats use just enough of an enforcement, not too much, not too little, and how they increase them in very small increments? Well, I thought it was interesting. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Anyway, maybe after stating that the behavior is abusive (way to go on that, by the way!), your next step could be moving to the other side of the room (if it's a big one) or leaving the room for 5 or 10 mins, then 30 mins, then leaving the house for 5 or 10 mins, then 30 mins, then a few hours, then the evening.

If you do feel the need to sleep away from home, I would take the kids with you, although I'm basing this just on my own instincts and not on anything I've read from an expert. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> Is there somewhere you can go with the girls if you need to?

I don't know anything about a temporary separation. I wonder if Harley has articles about abusive situations on the site? Can you call them and ask for advice?

I'm glad to hear your sister is doing better, and that you've been able to visit with your brother, and that MIL is out of sedation. That's all good news!

(((EO)))

Hi, Happy, the new job is great! I used to always wish I could have asked my last manager for less complex projects, and now I took a job with smaller projects. I like how it turned out. Everyone's really nice there.

"Why would you ever deserve to feel shame like that? What is so shameful about you?"
Feels less bad, more normal to me, to feel ashamed about not keeping house better than to look at all the power I handed H. The fear that I have that it may be too late. That H may only want to be happy with someone who 'does it all' well, not someone accepts their limitations. It helps to look at these fears, see where they don't mesh with reality. I think this is something we can resolve in a way that brings us closer together.

"Did you guys agree that there was something you would take care of that didn't get done? Or is it more along the lines of, there are always things that don't get done, and this just happened to be one of them "
I was careful not to set a time limit, in case I didn't meet it, but H wanted it done by Friday. The laundry again <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/blush.gif" alt="" /> I got it all done Saturday morning. Friday I took the kids out to play, my last weekday with them.

I read Al Turtle's page, and will give that a shot. Maybe I am capable to be in the room longer now, I'll see how it goes. Also, I plan to call the Harley's now that I'm working. I think they can help me direct my efforts like you all have been <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Hugs!

I'm so glad to hear that!!!! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

I had a job interview myself this week! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/blush.gif" alt="" /> And another one Friday. So we'll see how that goes... <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />


I hear you, I've been here, too! Amazing, isn't it, how feeling ashamed can feel less bad and more normal than feeling empowered? <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smirk.gif" alt="" />


Is laundry ever really all done?? <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/tongue.gif" alt="" /> Our hamper's never totally empty, as soon as I get it all washed, here's H, with more dirty clothes. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

So how do you feel about H wanting the laundry all done by Friday? How do you feel about getting it done on Saturday?

About Al Turtle... I thought that page was really neat, and now I'm always watching my in-laws' cat to see what he does when he's annoyed. LOL. Just helps to think that there are many many little steps we can take, rather than having only 3 or 4. I tended to go straight from a minor enforcement to a huge one, because I didn't really have anything in between, and H would look at my like I was NUTS for blowing things out of proportion! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/blush.gif" alt="" />

Glad you will be able to call the Harleys! I look forward to hearing what they have to tell you. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

hugs!
HTBH

"So how do you feel about H wanting the laundry all done by Friday? How do you feel about getting it done on Saturday?"
I feel that it is valid for him to have wanted it done during the week, to have the weekend off. Was it valid for me to rather wait until Saturday? It seemed so all day Friday, but when that feeling of dread sunk in Friday afternoon, it seemed like a big mistake.

I've been listening to HNHN on CD, and my fear is that calling the Harleys, that the answer will be for me to really get on the ball in a big way about the housework, when I've never been able to be consistent with it as much as H or whoever else I've lived with over the years would like it done. Even as a kid, my mom used to rail on me about not getting my parts of the housework done on time. She used to tell me, you better stay in school and get a good job, so you afford someone to come in and clean after you.

Maybe that fear is unfounded. But we've been to 3 other MCs already who have reinforced to me that if a clean house when H walks in is what he wants, then I should be able to provide that. Even when I work outside the home full-time. Only one suggested outside help. It feels like setting myself up for failure. I feel like a failure, in that I don't see other people in so much agony over this, they are more capable to "do it all."

Hi Ears <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

This is probably trivial in light of all the other things you've mentioned, but...regarding the housework bit, maybe this will help. I was taught how to do cleaning by my mom, and grandma. Both had very high standards. So when I clean, I really clean. Trouble is, with working and doing a graduate degree I don't have the time or energy to clean as well as I would like.

Hubby works full-time on a very draining job, and only has time to clean on the weekends, but then he's also doing the outside stuff, so he can't be much help.

I whinged about it for a while, and last week I hired a cleaner to come in. It was great!! The entire house was spotless. We know that she is coming again in two weeks, so we're both doing our best to make sure that it stays reasonably tidy.

It's made me so happy to know that the house is clean to my standards, but that I have the energy to give to other things, like keeping my husband happy.

If your husband truly needs a clean house to be happy, then hire a service. If you have the money and yet he still complains about it, then that means that its not having the house clean so much but having you slave over it that matters. That's a big difference to my mind.

Hi EO!


Uh, that's not a feeling. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> I hear that you believe his viewpoint is valid, which is lovely. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> But how did you feel when he said he wanted it done by Friday? Annoyed? Scared? Nervous? Ticked? What did you feel?


When you decided Friday morning to blow off the laundry til Saturday, did you know that you were going to get that icky feeling of dread later in the day? Did you set yourself up to feel this dread, or did it take you by surprise?

(I'll do this, too, sometimes. Used to do it at work, now I do it at home. LOL. I'll put off doing something that I don't think is that important right then, so I can, say, spend all day on MB, and then all of the sudden I start feelling ill over not having done what I was supposed to do -- and the thing is, I KNOW in advance I'm going to feel that way. So I'm wondering if it's the same for you, if you know that dreadful feeling is coming.)

If you DO know that feeling is coming, why do you set yourself up for that? Why do *I* set myself up for that? I have no idea! LOL. I read somewhere that a lot of folks are conditioned not to be *too* joyful, not to be too happy, and so a lot of time when we do something fun, like you spending the day with your girls, we feel like we need to have guilt or dread or something go along with the good feelings, because we shouldn't get *too* happy. Wonder if that's what we're doing? Purposely tainting our happy experiences so we don't get too happy?


This jumped out at me, your inner child talking, as LA says. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />


Yikes! No wonder you feel more confident at work than staying at home! This feeling of dread goes way back for you, doesn't it?

Can I ask you something? When you were a kid and didn't get your housework done on time, why was that? Was it because you were working as hard as you could and just couldn't do it all on time? Was it because you spent time playing before you got to the housework, and didn't leave yourself enough time to finish? Was it because you needed help but were expected to do it all alone? Why didn't you get your housework done on time (and don't tell me because you were lazy! LOL. No judgments here!)?


Really? Your H wants a clean house, and he wants you to do it all, and they said you should just do it? Is there more to the story than that (anything he was expected to do in return, or did you get to specify how many tasks you thought was reasonable to do, or something)? Or did they really say that you should just do it all?

Have you read what Harley says about DS (ie, the person who wants it done the most is the person who should do it -- and then, as a way to meet his needs, as a treat, you can do some of his chores for him occasionally)? I don't think their answer is going to be for you to just do it all unless you enthusiastically agree to do it all.


Quit reading Pieta's posts! LOL. Seriously, I am in AWE of that woman. She's amazing. I, however, am not her, and you're not either, and there's nothing wrong with us for not being her. Although I have to admit, that when I grow up, I hope to be a combination of LA and Pieta. LOL.

Would you like me to share some housework agony with you? <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> Well, I'm not really in agony too much anymore, but I've had my share. Chores/housework was a major battleground for me and my mom in my teenage power struggle years, and I came into my marriage hating housework. And I told my H upfront that I'm a slob, and I wasn't intending to change, and if that was a problem, he shouldn't marry me. LOL. And he was fine with it, and willing to do his share around the house, and yet I still felt like I *should* be doing more.

So I was all twitchy and weird about the housework -- didn't do much of it, but felt guilty and defensive (and, yes, dread) when it wasn't done. He would go out of town for work and I would totally trash the place and then spend the last few hours frantically trying to put things back together. It was MARVELOUS. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" />

When we bought our first house, H was worried about spending so much money on buying a home and then having me trash it. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/blush.gif" alt="" /> (It's not like I broke things or left food out to rot, it was mostly a problem of not putting things away, so there'd be books and papers everywhere, just everyday little messes left to multiply, nothing hazardous or unsanitary). That's when I decided I needed to get real with the housework.

Now, my house ain't perfect. In fact, at this very moment, I have a couple piles of junk in pretty much every room of the house (except our living room! It looks great!). I do get a lot more done than I used to, and I no longer agonize about it. I do it, or I don't, and then I just keep on going. Like I planned to vacuum Tuesday. Haven't yet, but I think I'll get to it today. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> Or tomorrow.. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/tongue.gif" alt="" />

The thing that has changed the most is not that I clean more but that I no longer see the housework as this albatross around my neck. *I* like a clean house, too, maybe even more than H does! I like having it done, so I do it. And then it's done! And I love my house because it's comfy to be in! This attitude change has done wonders for ME because I no longer feel a need to rebel against housework, KWIM? It's just something that needs to be done, and I do what I can, and then I get to play. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> And yeah, sometimes I do play first, and then get around to the housework later. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/blush.gif" alt="" />

I'm with Webfootgirl, it sure would be easier to just hire it out! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> The problem for me was that *I* didn't want to hire a cleaning service. We certainly could have afforded to, but I believed that I should be taking care of it, so while hiring help would have solved the messiness problem, it wouldn't have fixed my guilt problem. I had to work through that on my own, you know?

Hugs!
HTBH

EO,

Thinking of you today. How was your first week?

LA

My first week at work was great. The work itself is very interesting and challenging, and the environment is great. Everyone gets along, and there is no overtime. The morning commute is easy, as I leave just before 6am, but the afternoon is stop and go, even leaving at 4pm. I am trying alternate routes and hope to find a better one soon.

I've been listening to HNHN on CD this week, I've made it through 3 CDs out of 5. I'm lucky you've shown me to not get mad at myself for what I didn't know, because I'm learning so much. I had read HNHN for parents a while back, and thouth it was the same material, but there is so much more about ENs in this one. I alot of information sunk in in a way it hadn't really before.

I finally understand how an H could have a need for AS and DS without it being a need for control.

I really understand, too, why I'm still here. Not out of guilt, or fear of the unknown. But because there are many needs that H has met, without me even realizing that they are big ENs for me. For example, family support. I have always discounted it, because H doesn't do all that for me, he does it because it's part of own core value. So I didn't realize how much deposits he was making in my account. I heard that chapter, and reflected on how secure it does make me feel when he reads them stories most nights. I am really relieved to look at all this, hold it up to the light, and see that it's not fear.

"But how did you feel when he said he wanted it done by Friday? Annoyed? Scared? Nervous? Ticked? What did you feel?"
I felt like, sure, I can get it done, no problem. But then, I left other things take priority instead. And I'd done other things in the house, ones I like doing better, I mopped and vacuumed and dusted and did the bathrooms, etc. so I felt pretty good, until I realized H would be home before I would get the laundry done.

Happy, how you descibe your past with housework is really similar to mine. Not ever filth, just not putting things away when I was done with them. I'm good with that now, (relatively speaking <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />) but not as good at other maintenance, like getting the laundry done, or reminding the kids to put their shoes away, or their plate in the sink. Mine goes in the sink, though.

I never fought with my mom, she always asked me to do things that she knew I could do, so we were cool. I procrastinated a lot, but got it done. Like for my little brothers and sister, I boiled their bottles and their water until they were a few months old or a year, I forget how long. My mom worked 3 to 11pm, and I could have gone to bed early when we put the kids to bed, but I'd still be up when she got home instead, and the bottles and water were still hot, so she knew I finished them just before she walked in. That was fine for her.

But my stepfather, that was different, he gave me a ton of chores, and would get mad if I was sitting down, even if I'd done what he'd asked. He was always punishing me for "not taking initiative" to do things they hadn't asked me.

I was nervous and anxious about the laundry Friday night, and I held onto that fear and dread, even well after the laundry was all away. After WFG posted about a cleaning person, I asked H about it, and he said the place is fine. What a disconnect! I was still reacting to what I thought he was upset about, and he wasn't even upset about that anymore. I didn't get mad at myself, I did the HEALs, and reassured myself that I have tools to help me seek to understand.

To help me get ready for calling the Harleys next week (because I still was nervous as to what it would entail) I did the whole house cleaning this morning. I was done with everything, even the laundry put away, by noon. I think I can do this. My brother, who is underemployed, comes over every afternoon to take care of the kids until I get home, and reminds the kids tidy their shoes and toys, so it looks great when H comes home.

I have been really struggling with acceptance, to accept that H "doesn't love me for me," rather he has positive reactions to me based on whether his needs are being met. Listening to Dr. Harley, though, I understand how we are controlled by biology, that it isn't because H doesn't love me enough.

Also, I shared my RH about his drinking last week Saturday. My brother was visiting from out of town, and the whole extended family went to the movie. My mom and stepfather's movie got out after everyone else's, and H was impatient, and said he wanted me to drive him home and come back with the kids, after previously we'd been all planning to go out for dinner together after. I was nervous, fearful of provoking or judging him, but I asked him, is this about needing a drink? He said no, just drop him off at the casino close by so I don't have to drive all the way home and back to the theater. I asked again, in a gentle way, not sarcastic, after checking my intent to make sure I was asking from wanting to understand, and not wanting to provoke. "Do you feel like you need a drink?" He said no, let's go to the movie theater to wait. My parents came out 5 minutes after we got there, we all went together for dinner, and H was himself again.

He didn't drink for 4 days at all, and slept through the night all four days, unlike when he drinks and it disturbs his sleep cycle. This is after a few months now of bad sleep every night, which makes sense to me with the empty beer and wine bottles. He's drinking again, and his sleep is disturbed again. I want to ask him if the four days in a row is related to my question Saturday, but we finally have had a peaceful week, and I want to enjoy it a little more before I risk rocking the boat. Also, I'm not sure if it's healthy for me to be inquiring about his thoughts on his drinking, not sure that I am safe to talk to about that without stabbing myself with it.

Another important thing I picked up in HNHN. We meet needs for our spouses as a gift, not as a responsibility. Again, helps me separate out the control aspect, when I get confused and it all feels like control that I need to rebel against.

Wasn't sure how to share this with H without him taking it as criticism, which I have no control over, anyhow, and then I read Rinder's thread. She does it beautifully, setting the example in love. I feel so loved and cared for when you.... Thank you. And I relaize that I have been doing this with I messages, too <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

EO,

What helped me a lot to feel loved through DH meeting my needs was me checking my intent, as you are doing, when I meet his...which is where I discovered how much I believed I earned love--which gave me pitiful deposits from DH in my perception...and when I changed my belief from acting from my love, letting go response (eliminating those creepy DJs in my thoughts), that I felt fully loved for the first time.

You're doing this...recognizing first, upping your awareness, and what I sense, is the letting go the response being the most difficult for you...which takes you doing what you're doing right now, cumulative, over time...and that is knowing your acts are from choice, not earning...solidly sure...self-congratulating, delighting in your choice...

Would you consider that you were reared with response-based love? That this isn't something quickly switched over in your life...after a lifetime of believing you earned love? And you're realizing how much your own perception of being loved affects you? The more you validate and acknowledge you love as a gift, the better you will be aware of receiving it as a gift...which ups the deposits mightily...no earning in it.

You caught your own subtle DJs in assuming why DH does what he does...and seemed to me, you fixed that assumption by assuming he does it from his core values...why? Why not focus on "He does this" instead? He just does. For now, the knowledge he is invested in your marriage, in you, the children...he's there...could be enough to know?

"Wasn't sure how to share this with H without him taking" oh, EO! LOL "I've been thinking lately how much I see control where it isn't. I've been staying aware of my choices, my acts of love, and feel much more loved by what you do."

Simple sharing...from what you're working on, thinking about, and letting go response...you, EO, are a marvel, a wonder...sharing you is an act of kindness, connection, a delight and a blessing to this world...let go the response...ferret out all those DJs in your assumptions about people, the world, what is safe and what isn't...discover yourself and share...no right or wrong...just you, as you are, right now.

Get to know how many inner expectations you've made which you rebel against, too...they are in there...come from the earning love belief...they support and maintain it...know rebellion, a resistance, is a signal...trace it...find out where it is coming from. Share what you find and what you don't.

Appreciation...share that for you, your DH, your children, your job...you saw that in Rinder's thread...and I believe your fear of confrontation stops you from sharing that with H...fear of what? Of his response? Lack of response? Share, anyway.

LA

LA, thank you for sharing your journey with us here. At first, they are foreign ideas, I am glad that they work for you, but I see a big gulf in my beliefs, and think, that's okay if I don't get it today, when I am ready, it will make sense. Then over time I start seeing some of what you are describing in my own life, and am amazed that I can understand. Eventually they become essential to me, part of me, like listen and repeat, separate and equal. Thank you for your continued patience and presence. Happy, too, you all blow me away <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

"For now, the knowledge he is invested in your marriage, in you, the children...he's there...could be enough to know?"
Yes.

"I've been thinking lately how much I see control where it isn't. I've been staying aware of my choices, my acts of love, and feel much more loved by what you do."
Thank you. It has taken me a while to understand that the drive by O&H has been for my own sake. Not to catch H when he's willing to listen. To catch me when I am focused to hear my own words, my own honesty.

"Get to know how many inner expectations you've made which you rebel against, too...they are in there...come from the earning love belief...they support and maintain it...know rebellion, a resistance, is a signal...trace it...find out where it is coming from. Share what you find and what you don't."

They are. I will listen for them. And share.

Another thought. You and Happy have shared from Hendrix I think that people heal in relationship. Perhaps that goes for relationship with ourselves, too.

"I believe your fear of confrontation stops you from sharing that with H...fear of what? Of his response? Lack of response?"

It is fear of rejection. Fear of being shut out. Fear of the possibility of intimacy ending, for hours or days. I will share, anyway.

Hi EO!

I'm so happy to hear that you like your new job! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Regarding the housework, sounds like you got 2 messages from your family growing up: your mom saying she hoped you got a good job so you could just hire a cleaning person, and your step-father saying that you didn't deserve to sit down, that you should always be doing chores. Does that sound right to you?

Maybe you're dealing both with a feeling of inadequacy when it comes to housework AND with a desire to rebel against the attitude that housework always comes first (ie, you think there are things more important than housework). What do you think?


Wow, what a great insight! I think you're on to something here. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> I agree with you completely.


<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> It's all for our own sakes, isn't it? O&H, meeting needs, sharing ourselves, it's really all for our own benefit, isn't it? <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />


Schnarch talks about this, in Passionate Marriage (I know, I know, here I go with that book again!). He says that the reason this is a problem, is that one day, your partner WILL reject something you have to say. It's almost guaranteed that some day your H will not like something you shared with him, and he won't be able to validate or accept or maybe even acknowledge that you said it. So it's important for you to practice sharing no matter what his reaction is, so that when the time comes and he DOES get upset, you will be able to deal with it. If you are sharing for you, not for him, it won't be nearly so devastating if/when you share something he doesn't want to hear.

Hope this week is off to a good start for you!

Hugs!
HTBH

Thanks Happy, I think you got it right about my beliefs on housework. Amazingly enough, I've been keeping up for now. Maybe it's that prioritizing. The overeating I have a handle on, too, although I had a real urge to eat last night, feeling rejected again.

Thanks for the thoughts on sharing regardless. Checking my intent really helps me with that, too. It's usually RH, and so it makes it easier to deal with the ignoring, because I need to hear my RH regardless of whether it's ridiculed or ignored.

I finally called the Harleys today. I got a voice mail that said the office was already closed. I was nervous before going to Alanon, too, afraid of what I'd learn, but found it helped me find the perspective I needed. So I'll stay on top of this.

I am going to ask about Plan A and B, whether I am ready for that yet, or whether somehting else is more appropriate. I know I have failed to meet H's needs for AS and DS, but really I'm at my breaking point with the drinking and the hostility. I'm at the point that I feel willing to try a higher risk solution with some guidance in the hopes of rebuilding a happy home again.

I think it was mostly a lucky guess, as my beliefs are pretty similar! LOL.


Way to go!! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />


Wow, good for you! Was it scary? I would have been scared(even if I just got their voice mail!). LOL.


You've read the MB stuff about addiction, right? You can't really meet his needs while he's addicted (to anything)anyway. He's got to sober up before MB can work. I think you're absolutely right to ask the Harleys for their expet guidance on where to go from here.

Hope you have a marvelous Thanksgiving, my friend! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />
Hugs,
HTBH

Calling the Harleys was scary. H is very resentful of the amount of time I've spent here online, and it ticks him off when I share about anything I've learned here, how it's affecting me. I'm not talking about trying to preach to him, I'm talking about sharing my own stuff. So I haven't asked H about the call, I figured I'd ask the experts about that <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/blush.gif" alt="" />

I'm doing good today, not getting caught up in the storm. I'm cooking Thanksgiving for my family and FOO at my house, and we POJA'd yesterday that it wasn't going to be a big drinking thing. Right now I'm thinking, as if you can POJA drinking with a problem drinker, what was I thinking? I met H at the grocery store after work tonight, and he left me to finish, but he had put a case of beer in the grocery cart. I failed to be O&H when I saw it. I was nervous to remind him of what we'd agreed. Then when he left, I debated buying it, but I checked my intent, and that would just be out of fear of his reaction, so I didn't buy it. I drive-by told H when I got home that I wasn't okay buying beer. I forgot the part about our agreement, that it was inappropriate of me to agree to cook dinner here with the understanding that it wouldn't be a big drinking thing.

So, anyway, I called my sponsor, to help me feel calm aout tomorrow, that I will be okay if they all start drinking big-time here. I'm working out what to do if I am not feeling emotionally safe. There are open AA meetings that I can go to if I need some perspective, but I can't bring the kids over there, it's for grown-ups. So my Plan B is that I'll call my sponsor or another friend if I need to. Not to ask someone to tell me what to do, but more to help me snap out of the swirl and respond instead of react. I'm glad that I'm doing the HEALs, that has really helped me in situations both with H and when I'm hard on myself.

H went out, didn't answer his cell phone, but I'm okay anyhow.