nabohio:

Thank you so much for that post. It makes me feel better to know that others have been very much in my shoes. Thank you for sharing your situation with me. There are a lot of similarities in our situations.

I just want to make sure I do the right thing and that I am executing Plan A correctly. Moveforward reminded me that Plan A does not mean that I should be a doormat and I think I'm still struggling with that. I did make personal changes before I knew the truth. I started making changes in June, I think. Should I consider the start of Plan A from June or October (when I found out the truth) or November (when I started exposing). I'm guessing I should consider the start of Plan A being November when the exposure started?????? Would that be right????

My Dad and I had a conversation last night and he is furious. He has lost all respect for my husband. He wants me to throw him out. He said I have been making life way too easy for him for way too long. He is right, I guess. My Dad has listened to me cry since June. He is so mad. I asked him to talk to my husband. I think he will, but he said he's going to end up blasting him. It may not be just a talk. I told my Dad that I was getting advice from a discussion forum from people who have gone through this. I didn't tell him the site or anything, but I did tell him a little about Plan A and Plan B. He told me I was just looking for things to continue this. He said after this, I'll find something else to try to make the marriage work. He wants me to get rid of him and move on with my life. He said I've suffered for way too long. He kept telling me that I can't live like this and I shouldn't do things for him (his laundry, etc...). My Dad is just really tired of seeing me suffer. I can understand where he's coming from.

But, I would really like to take the advice of all of you for now. So, if I count the end of November as the beginning of Plan A, I should give it 3 months, right?

The confrontation with my husband will be tonight. We'll see how it goes. I'm sure you will all hear from me tomorrow. I'll probably be a mess.

Thanks for listening. This got much longer than I wanted. I started to ramble on.

IP,

I am afraid I am not a good one for advice on the Plan A/Plan B stuff as I found MB after D-day #2 and after WH (claimed)said he wanted the M and wanted to work on it. I hope other with experience will jump in soon.

I can tell you that it only got better for me after I said here is what I want/need agree or you can leave. I've had to reinforce this a couple of times since and am getting ready to further stand up for myself on some financial issues we have. In other words, this whole recovery thing, whether it is yourself or the M, is a process, a journey. I'm not so sure about not telling people about this site. I am not a proponent of keeping secrets. You could mention it in passing that your are finding some outside support here. Most WS's, especially males, wouldn't spend time reading through the forum to try to figure who you are.

Hang in there, be calm and strong, you are a great person with or w/o WH. Don't let him tell you differently!

bump

I missed your husband's reaction.

Hi In-Pain- I'm posting your post here to save you the trouble! I've been waiting for your update:

<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Okay, the confrontation with my husband never happened last night. I got home very late because I was dealing with an unexpected situation back at my Dad's house. My Dad and my Stepmom were fighting (their marriage has been a little rocky) and I was watching my neice (who lives with them) and my son while they fought. Anyway, when I got home, my husband was already sleeping. I wasn't about to wake him up to talk. This morning before work he acted pretty normal. He talked to me, but not a whole lot. He left for work with a "C-ya" and that's about it.

When he comes home from work tonight, I'm sure we'll talk. I'm going to let him bring it up though. I was surprised by how I felt last night though. I was not nearly as nervous as I thought I was going to be. I found a little bit of confidence in myself. I have all of you to thank for that. You are the ones that are building up confidence in me - for now anyway. My feelings seem to change constantly. I hit rock bottom over the weekend and now I'm feeling okay. Not nearly great, but okay. Because of this situation, I have lost all self-respect for myself. My husband drained it out of me. I feel so weak. Today is an okay day though. Maybe it's because I saw my counselor too, I don't know.

Anyway, I'm rambling...I have some questions for all of you and I basically would really like to know if anyone else experienced the same thing, if it's typical behavior, if I should do anything about it, etc.....

My husband is so distant and cold to me. We show no affection to each other at all. We barely even touch each other. I feel like that is causing us to drift further and further apart. Should I be trying to give him hugs and kisses? I realize the timing is pretty bad right now because I'm exposing and he's angry, so maybe this isn't a good time to ask that question. The reason why I haven't been hugging and kissing him is because he is so cold and I'm afraid to. I'm afraid of rejection, I guess. I told him before that I wanted to do all of those things, but I told him I was afraid. I guess he understood. He just nodded.

His actions just seem like he's out of the marriage already. Has anyone else experienced this? Is it normal? He left Thanksgiving vacation early (Saturday @ 2:00) to go "hang out" with the OW. I think I posted that on this thread. If not, I did on my other one. Sorry! What I pain. He just won't stop being "friends" with her and I'm hoping my exposure is working.

I think he's unable to make a decision on what he wants because he still has 2 women in his life, kind of. He sees my personal changes as a good thing, but they're not making him want to be with me because he still has her in his life.

I can't remember if I posted this already or not, but right now we are living like friends or room mates. He said it's not too hard for him to live like this because he said we've lived like this before. He's probably right. We had some issues with sex, etc..in the past. He said things are actually better now because of the personal changes I have made. Anyway, he said that that is another thing that worries him though. He said he was hoping that would make a difference for him, but it didn't. I think it didn't is because he is still having contact with her.

Also, because we are not being physical, he has no idea how I would change my ways in fulfilling those needs. He really has no idea what it would be like to live with my with all of my changes because he's not allowing me to really be a wife to him. I don't think that can really happen until he gets that OW out of the picture.

By the way, my counselor loved the saying "your marriage can survive anger, but it can't survive an affair" Sorry to whoever I stole that from, but I used it today. I just told her that I was trying exposure and I was so worried about him being mad. She loved that saying. She said it was going to be the saying of the day! It's so true though.

Everyone on this site got me through the weekend, I just want you to all know that. If it weren't for all of you, I reall don't know what I would have done.

I look forward to getting some advice, suggestions, similar stories, etc...

THANK YOU TO ALL!

Thanks Mrs. Rob.

In-pain - Good job!!! Now follow up the exposure to her parents with a letter, stating that you want to save your marriage, and your family, and any help from them would be appreciated.

Your husband is acting like they all do - very cold and uncaring. That is just the way they are, and he will continue until there is no contact with the OW. Right now he sees her as perfect, because she is just a FANTASY.

Hang in there. Stay in Plan A. This stuff takes time. When you are going crazy, come here and rant. We understand.

MrsRob:

Thank you for straightening this out for me. Urgh! I'll figure these threads out one of these days!! I had a miscarriage in Nov 2002 and I was a member of a forum like this, but it was just arranged differently and I'm not used to this!! I'll get it sooner or later.

Thank you!

Thank you for responding believer.

It comforts me to know they all behave like this. It just feels like he's already out of the marriage and I'm spinning my wheels. Should I show affection (or try)? I'm not sure how to react to this at all.

Showing affection will probably be a waste. But you can try to be upbeat and cheerful (I know, very hard), and get your own life going good.

The biggest problem is that they almost all come back to the marriage, but you may be so hurt, you don't want him anymore.

Another problem is that the OW may try to hold him by getting pregnant. That happens a lot too.

Yes, this whole situation has been very hard. I am trying to focus more on myself and my son. He has just been such a big part of my life for so long. Some days are better than others. Today, I seemed more mad and stronger. Other days I feel completely weak and defeated. Today, I was focusing more on how much he has hurt me over the past few months and how much he continues to hurt me. He has been really cruel to me. I've been trying to focus less on all the good memories we have had and the old husband I used to have. This new person is not very nice. My old husband was a caring, sensitive man. I don't know what happened to him. I do miss him a lot though.

The OW just sickens me. She's a pathetic excuse for a human being.

Like I said before, I just don't know how to react to this no affection thing. We used to always at least give each other a hug and a kiss before leaving the house, with an I love you. I miss hearing him say I love you. I just feel like no affection is making us drift further apart. I have to keep exposing, I guess. That OW has to get out of the picture so I can try and get this marriage back on track. It just feels so hopeless.

It is like they are abducted by aliens. They completely change, and are no longer the person you once knew. This is NORMAL.

Don't blame yourself for his cheating - that is squarely on him. However, you can make changes in YOU. That will often change the other person.

Look back at any complaints he had BEFORE the affair, and try to work on eliminating those. I know sex was a big one, but you probably can't work on that now. I would advise AGAINST it, because he could have caught a disease from the OW.

What I did was clean the house spotless, cook good meals, rearranged the house, joined a women's support group, fixed up the yard, organized, detailed the car, etc. It kept me busy, and made me feel better about things. My self-esteem was in the TOILET.

IP,

The way your WH is acting is very normal, at least in my experience. My WH didn't want to have SF, when he did (if he could, if you know what I mean), it was over very quickly w/o consideration for my needs. This didn't change until I told him he either ends the A with NC e-mail (that was his idea to prove he was ending it, pre-MB), and works on the M. It was at that pt that he started to push to be affectionate and SF, although it was hard at first bc I knew he still didn't want to, was doing it on the advice of some of the books on recovery from A's. They, I can't remember which one, says to if you wait to have SF and to be affectionate with each other until you have the right feelings, it will be too late. I think it is in After the Affair, you may way to read this book it is good.

Another site that may help you is www.dearpeggy.com, as well as www.break-free-from-the-affair.com, both are helpful.

I understand about the ILY and kisses/hugs. It is a long road to recovery, so try to be patient. It is hard, but try to almost put that part on hold and concentrate on breaking up the affair. One step at a time. I try to look at how I want my M to look like as a goal and I also try to put the other part in perspective, if we are D'd, then there wouldn't be any affection/SF/ILY's anyway.

I am very glad you didn't have a long talk when you got home late, I'm sure it will go better today/tonight.

Good luck and you may want to review the reverse babble language, bc your WH most certainly will sound like a WH tonight and not your husband.

Well, he didn't bring it up last night either. I know he knows that I called the OW's parents. I know he's going to talk to me about it. I can't believe he didn't bring it up last night. I thought for sure he would. He asked me if I wanted to watch Ruduolph with our son, so we did that and then we watched a couple of shows that we had recorded after our son went to sleep.

I almost wish we would just talk about it already because the anticipation is horrible. I know it's not going to be pleasant.

I also hope something else isn't brewing. I hope nothing else is going on to make him wait. I don't know. I'm always on guard, I guess. I hope I'm not in for some more bad news or something.

I got this e-mail from a friend of mine, who is also a co-worker of theirs:

****I can assure you that neither of them is comfortable or happy to be in the office. They have both been “shunned” by almost everybody because of what they are doing. I have tried to be a good friend and be there for them when they need to talk, but I’m not sure they feel comfortable talking to me. I’m not sure how things will go but hopefully this pressure will help them wake up and realize what they have done and are doing is wrong.****

I guess that's good news.

One other thing about his work though. Let me know what you think about this. This morning I was IMing with a friend from Alabama. My husband came into the room and my friend told me that her husband had to take a new job and he had to accept a 55% paycut. I told my husband this and he said, "that might be me". I said, "what are you talking about" and he said "I can't work there anymore. Everyone hates me". I didn't say anything, but I wanted to say, well maybe if you start working on your marriage and keeping your family together and staying away from the OW, people wouldn't hate you. But, I didn't. So, he knows that everyone in the office knows and he's not happy about it. I guess it's hard for him to be there. And it should be! How does he expect people to react? I wanted to say to him - everyone knows affairs are wrong - I guess people aren't happy about it.

If he did get another job, that would be good because then he would no longer work with the OW. I would be happy with that, even if he did have to take a paycut.

I have something else I need your opinion on. Sometimes I wonder if he is still with the OW because he feels quilty. He's made the comment to me that "he brought her into this". He has also said that "everyone is on your side, she (OW) doesn't have anyone and I refuse to abandon her". I guess it's just me being hopeful to say that's why he still "hangs out" with her. But, what do I do about that way of thinking?

One more thing and then I'll quit. I posted here a little bit ago with a question about when my Plan A began. It's on this thread. Did my Plan A begin when I started exposure? Could you look back on this thread for that post and let me know what you think? Technically, I started making personal changes back in June before I knew abou the affair or this site. Let me know.

Sorry so long. I would love some feedback.

Hey there, just checking on you.


As far as when your plan A started, it really doesn't have to be a set date. Yes, you were making personal changes but you were not doing anything to break up the affair- that started this week.

For right now just focus on doing a great plan A - all parts. When you start feeling like you might be losing your love for him, then we can talk about Plan B.

hang in there, ok?

Thanks moveforward:

I'm hanging in there, I guess. I got through my birthday. He still didn't bring anything up about me calling her parents. Who knows when he'll spring that on me.

He did get me a card from my son today and also one from him. The one from him disappointed me. It wasn't a "For My Wife" card. It was very generic. All he wrote in the inside was "Happy 31st" and his name. It seemed pretty impersonal. But I guess I can't expect too much. I just wonder if it would have been better to just not get a card at all.

I still have a lot of anger towards the OW. I just want to reach out to her and tell her what I think of her.

He has a Christmas party for work on Friday. Other years, he has always gone out with people after the actual party and made a night of it. Before our son was born, I would join him as well. Tonight he said that he was probably going to go back home and hang out with his brother after the Christmas party. He said he probably won't stay at the party for very long because "no one wants to be around him". So, he's definitely feeling pressure from people at work. These are people he enjoyed being around and now it's really getting to him. He hates that they know what he has done.

I don't know how the OW feels. She probably doesn't care. She's got a lot of nerve.

Plan A is about you making changes for you. Whether the WS or XWS recognizes those changes is not the main factor. You moving forward with your self improvements is what is important. Your H will have a lot of catching up t/d as you move forward.

As for his 'need' to protect the OW. That's WS babble. You better start learning how t/d plan B because him trying to protect the OW will NOT help recovery at all.

L.

Why arent't you instilling great seeds of hope on to his comments about people at work not liking him or not wanting to be around him...

why aren't you saying things like...

I don't think that people don't like you maybe they are just uncomfortable with things that have been done...

say..
ofcourse people want to be around you.....why wouldn't they...

AND

why didn't you say I would love to go to the party with your

OR

what about you and I going out instead of the party..we could get something to eat....
go look at some x-mas lights...etc...

why is it your husband suggesting you do things together..ie watch TV etc...

plan A is about engaging him
easing his burdon
showing glimpses of hope that you know he can change...
and things can get better.....

where and what is your plan A exactly....

it should be subtle in your face I am here you are here...lets get together...

ARK

as far as dealing with anger, why don't you try writing her a letter and no mailing it. It really helped me to do that - several times.

Read Ark's post above on plan A.

Engage him constantly- avoiding him is not plan a.

Thank you everyone:

I guess that's where I'm still a little confused or scared. I'm not sure what to do or how to act. He's so distant and cold that I'm almost afraid to approach him about things.

The reason I didn't suggest going to the Christmas Party is because it's just for employees. They do it on a Friday (which is a normal work day) and they have a luncheon, etc...In the past, a lot of people (mostly my husband and his friends) would continue the party and go out afterwards and make a night of it. Before I had our son, I would join up with them at an area bar and go out at night with them. Because of everything that was going on, I didn't know what he planned on doing. I guess I should have asked. My fault...Another reason I didn't talk about the Christmas party is because of the OW. I was sure she was going and I didn't want to hear, "No, you can't join up with us because ___________is going to be there." I've heard that before.

I guess that has been my question or concern. I don't know how to act or what to do. I guess I need to stop being afraid of rejection and just ask. It's weird, I can't believe I'm afraid to ask my own husband to do things with me. That sounds so ridiculous, but it's true. Did anyone else deal with this or am I strange or something?

When I first knew my marriage was in trouble (around June), I would make time for us as much as possible. I would have someone watch our son for a couple of hours at least one week night a week (even if it was just 2 hours) and I would have my mother in law watch him one weekend a month so we would have a weekend together. I think that kind of tapered off around September.

So, you think I should start doing things like that again and not worry about him rejecting me?

I need help getting past these feelings. I guess I've lost all confidence in myself.