You are fine otherwise?

SS

Milk, nice to hear from you. The limbo can be great for your Lattisimus Dorsi and Glutius Maximus ,but it can be a pain in the glutius Maximus, too.

Thanks SS and Silent to stop by. I'm fine, SS, I'm worried about my job (because of the pending acquisition and uncertainty about our job security) and a bit nervous about the finality of our marriage, but in general, I am doing pretty well. And Silent, ha ha, you are right, the limbo can cause quite a bit of pain <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

To be honest, I wonder if I would feel better after D gets finalized because I can 'focus' on my new relationship - and it may turn into something very serious and long-term...., but I am also quite frankly nervous when I think of my future, which will be COMPLETELY different from what I thought it would be when I married STBX once D is finalized and I establish a serious relationship. A part of me says "wait, should marriage be THIS easy to lose and gain? I dated STBX 3 years before we got married, and yet there were things I did NOT know about him....., how would I know that my new b.f. would not have any serious issues like that, only after dating him for a short while???"

It's kind of scary.

Milk

You are in a better position to "see" what a new person really is. You didn't know what to look for the first time. I realize you don't know everything now either, but you know much, much more.

I also recommend prayer. God knows things that we do not know. My W was going to tell me "no" but she says after much prayer, she felt she should marry. It has worked out well over time.

SS

Hey Milk ! Saw your note to me on Eav's thread and finally have a chance to say hello and "catch up" with you.
Haven't posted for awhile but am trying to get updated on some of the threads I always followed, especially friends and "kindred spirits" like yourself !

I'm still doing the travel job, working from home, and it's been going well. There's been alot of "turnover" lately in the company, causing us to be short-handed and busy, but I was pleased that my boss (the owner) has recognized and thanked me for my extra efforts and I received a bit of a raise a couple weeks ago. Still not terrific pay, but it certainly helps !
I've really enjoyed my singing group and my friends there, and will miss them over the summer. This has been a busy week as we are preparing for a concert this weekend, so have two dress rehearsals in addition to our normal night of rehearsal. After the concert, we will be "on break" until the fall.

My house is still for sale (5 months now)and I still have very mixed feelings about it. On one hand, I know it is bigger than I need resulting in higher utility bills, taxes,
more maintenance and cleaning ,etc. On the other hand, I love the house, the floor plan, all the work and effort we put into it, the area, and the familiarity of it and my neighborhood. If I could afford it, I think I'd try to stay here for at least awhile, but just can't swing it unless I get a higher paying job or second job. I do feel some real resentment towards WH, sitting across town in his "fancy"
house, buying another to "flip" (renovate and sell for a profit) and not a worry in the world about money, when I'm
on a tight budget and can't keep my home. He does have to pay towards the house expenses until it sells, so at least I am not being drained while it's for sale.

My ankle is doing well. I got out of my cast in Feb. and did some home physical therapy. Went back for a follow up i March and the Dr was pleased with everything, releasing me from further visits unless I have a problem and "clearing" me for all activities except "high impact". I've resumed walking the dog, have ridden the stationary bike, and do feel like it's stronger now, have a little bit of swelling but no pain.

The D was final about two months ago. Was glad WH was at least reasonable in waiting a little longer than he wanted to to turn in the final paperwork in order to make sure I had insurance coverage for my surgery and afterwards, as it only took FOUR DAYS after it was filed to be signed and finalized ! I was expecting a couple weeks or more, so it was quite a shock to get the paperwork in the mail so soon.
Our state is "no fault" and basically "50/50", so with no kids and our property already divided (done back when he moved out last year) there was little to do and no court- it was just signed by a "magistrate". Very sad that it is over and done so easily. Do have to say WH was reasonable and actually more "generous" than he had to be, although
I'd guess that was partly due to guilt or him trying to act like he's not a "bad guy". (That, plus he makes about 5 times what I do, so not that hard on him).
I have bad and good days, definitely feel sad, and still have those moments wondering "why" or "how" this happened,
where the wonderful times and person I married went to, why my life is like this and so far from what I wanted or ever expected. I think that's the hardest thing- feeling like I
have really gone "backwards", rather than forwards in life.
It's very frustrating to realize I had a better job, more
money and a much happier life years ago, and that I'm now in my 40's, making a small income, not able to afford a nice home, didn't get to have any kids, and have nothing to "show" for the past 15 years of my life. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

I had to deal some with WH in the final paperwork and since we still have the house and some other joint financial issues but don't talk to him much and see him rarely.
I believe he is still seeing OW and that they are still in the same pattern of "breaking up/making up" every few months as they have been all throughout the A. He finished the court ordered counseling (from the DUI last year) but says himself it was "a waste of time" so sounds like he just went but didn't make any effort. He is also still on meds and seeing the Psych for his bipolar, but don't know how well that's going...

I do still go to my IC and for the most part friends and family have been pretty helpful and supportive, although as is probably common, people have sometimes not know what to say or do and have made some comments or suggestions I felt were inappropriate and a little offensive- like saying I should have a big party to "celebrate" the D and "being rid of WH", and even suggesting I should get out to meet men and find a new person (this before I was even divorced !)
There's definitely NOT anyone I'm interested in, and I have
NO desire whatsoever to "get out", date or get involved with anyone anytime, or at least not for a LONG time, but I know people meant well and didn't get upset, just said "NO thanks!" My IC suggests healing after D takes about 1 year for each 5 years you were married, which in my case would be about 2 years, so maybe by then I will change my mind..!

I've not got to read all your recent posts, but thought that you were sounding strong and hope you and D4 are doing well. I'll keep an eye out for you and post again -
Just realized I'm still using "WH" rather than XH. Guess that's just still a little too tough.
Slammed

Thanks SS, I do hope that I have 'learned' something through this horrible and painful experience and I am a little bit wiser when it comes to relationships and 'people' in general. Although a part of me still screams from time to time - "but WH WAS a nice guy, he DID act like he was totally in love with me, and he still IS not a bad person....., yet our marriage did not last. How on earth can I tell that I can now build a better / stronger relationship with someone with whom I don't really have any history???" Yes, I did lose quite a bit of confidence in my 'intuition' or 'six sense' or 'gut feeling' or whatever you call it, when meeting someone new.

Slammed, I am very happy to hear from you again. I am in the same boat - I do have bad days still sometimes, although now much less. I do get sad when I start asking 'why' and 'how' like you do. So usually I try to stop it right away. No one - even STBX - probably can answer this in a way I would understand.

Yesterday I spoke to STBX and he was telling me that he had a job offer (he did tell me several times recently that he wanted to change his job...., yes again). Then he said "it will be a little more money, so you will benefit from that".

He could have hidden the fact that he would be making more money - since we have our agreement, if he didn't say anything and it gets approved (and thus D being finalized), the only way for me to get more money from him would be to file another petition for adjustment for his salary increase, which will cost quite a bit and probably won't make sense to get just a tiny bit of increase.

See, so I tend to look at things like this as "WH is not a bad guy, after all, he is NOT that greedy....", which of course makes me sadder about our D being finalized....

Although I have decided NOT to look back anymore....., whatever happened is in the past and I will try my best to leave it in the past. I have learned quite a bit through this experience, and I do not want that to be wasted...., besides people keep telling me that things do happen for reasons....., so our marriage not working out must have some kind of reasons too, which I can only find out if I keep moving forward with confidence.

So yesterday I was feeling a bit sad again, but tried to pick myself up again.....holding my head high......, at least I know that I did everything in my power to save our marriage, just like you Slammed. So I am very proud of that, and I do not have regret in that area. I do think that will make a BIG difference going forward....., that we did NOT run away from it!

Milk

I had a pretty good Mother's Day. DS4 gave me a flower plant he was growing at school and a card. He also wraped about everything and anything he found around the house (my book, photo frame, candle, etc.) and gave them to me saying proudly "Happy Mother's Day!". He also insisted that I buy jewery when we were out shopping, saying "Mama, you NEED to buy this, it's beautiful, it's very beautiful for you" - I said "thank you sweetie, but I don't need it", and he kept putting it back in my shopping basket, so I finally told him "no, I don't have money", then he said "ok, I will buy it for you then". That was very funny. Then he put it in my basket so proudly. He has some real currency from overseas - left over from my and my friends' trips - as well as fake million dollar bills. I had to pretend buying it - I winked at the cashier and she understood and played along. Later he asked for the box of ring, and I said "oh, it must be somewhere but we'll find it later". Then he forgot about it. Hew.

I just checked my voicemail from the weekend in the office this morning, and there was one from STBX. He wished me a happy mother's day, and said "you are a very good mother to DS4...". That was nice.

Hope everyone had a nice mother's day!

Milk

I think I have already accepted that our marriage is over. I have accepted that STBX will not be a part of my life anymore going forward. It does not make me TOO sad anymore. ALSO, I need to remember that he DOES have many mental issues and they will NOT just go away easily.

I am happy most of the times now. Yet, two things that make me feel sad still.... (1) of course DS4. Whenever he asks about his daddy or seems he envies other kids because they have daddy....., I always almost cry. Then (2) when I feel that STBX does or will soon have a GF.....

There is no basis to believe that (2) is the case. And since most of the time I don't even think about it, I am fine. But when I think about it, I still don't feel good about it. Is this normal?

I don't know what it is. If I have moved on, and I am fine without STBX, you would think I should be fine with the idea of him finding someone else. I certainly want HIM to become happy, that's for sure. I don't want my son's father to remain depressed. BUT when I think of him going to his family gathering with his new GF and possibly with DS4 as well - I don't like the picture. Am I being too jealous? Would this feeling ever go away? Or, because we were married and even had a child together...., this 'special' feeling will always be there somewhere in my heart?

Milk,

I am not sure that this will ever entirely go away. I know that I fought so hard for Ex WW for our children because being the sane one at the time I knew what the ramifications would be and tried to warn her but she didn't want to hear it. It didn't fit into her fantasy. Now she's an EOW mother, my step daughter is separated from her little brother except during ex WW's visitation or when she visits with me. Pain is all I feel when I think that it didn't have to be this way. Plus we had a good marriage and great family life before she went insane and becamse selfish and entitled. This makes it all the more difficult to shoulder.

She will soon marry old, POS, OM (his D will be final this summer). I have had to accept this. BUT, I will not and have told her that I will not legitimize her R with OM so that she can feel better. I still have not seen him since the trial on Aug. 31, 2006 and for his sake I hope I don't. He will never be anything in my son's life but an intruder, that's it. She can have a great R with our son if she choses but OM will never be accepted or legitimized if I can help it.

I am going to post something that I posted on another site about the levels of infidelity that may be fun forum discussion.

Hang in there and love that dear boy.

I don't know the answer to your last question, but something in your tone has got me choked up. Those thoughts. I've had those thoughts. It's just a hard situation to be in. When I hear you mention that you are moving ahead and okay with the D, EXCEPT for when DS asks about daddy, my heart sinks. I know those questions, and the feelings I had when my DS's life started flashing before my eyes, with a part time daddy, it would just break me down.

I know you are growing and moving forward, and i think you deserve a lot of praise for how you have handled all of this. I just wanted to send a little hug your way.

(((((Milk)))))

Thanks HAP and Silent. Your kind words mean a lot to me. I think STBX will always have a spot in my heart. The spot may get smaller over time, but it will not disappear entirely. After all, we were together for almost 17 years (including, though, the shaky past 3 years).

My son is also happy most of the time. I think he has accepted that 'daddy' lives in his apartment. He doesn't ask about that anymore. But I know he wishes that he could spend time with BOTH of us at the same time, rather than one at a time...

Unfortunately I cannot change the fact DS4 will grow up in a divorced family. I never imagined my child will go through this. Neither of us (me or STBX) grew up in the divorced family, and I feel so bad that our little innocent son has to learn to live with something we didn't have to deal with. It's just so not fair.

But I am praying that this experience will somehow give DS4 strength and wisdom, and teach him the importance of commitment. You choose to marry, you WILL make it work. I hope he will not become a quitter.

HAP, I am so sorry for your sitch. Your WW's action resulted in a breakup between a sister and brother. And she doesn't care, because her needs come first. My friend went through the same thing. He is a very kind hearted and dedicated father. He raised both kids (his step son and their son), because his wife was always out playing. Now they are divorced (she had an affair), he was depressed for a long time but luckily, he ended up having two boys a lot more often than he thought he would. Because his wife is too busy taking care of 'her' needs. You never know, HAP, that might happen to you over time. We all have to make the best out of whatever given to us I guess...

I read your recent development Silent. I heard that your FWH is turning around and working on marriage. That's so WONDERFUL. I am really happy for you all. You have maintained your strength, dignity, and most of all, love. I am so happy that all of your work has paid off.

My case is slightly different, I guess, because of WH's personal issues and how he grew up (he was raised by his step mom because his biological mom passed away when he was not even 2). All of his sisters and brother have similar issues (depression, addictions, lack of responsibility, laziness, ADHD, etc.), so my case is not just infidelity based breakdown, it's rather much deeper, unfortunately. So it did not work out the way we all hoped. But if I believe (and I do now) things happen for reasons, this must have happen because in the long run this is best for all of us. WH loves DS4 but is never responsible around him. I think DS4 also has ADHD, and it might have been disastrous to be raised by another ADHD parent. He DOES behave differently when he was surrounded by my friends who are more stable. So maybe this was good for his development. I also have much less stressful life since WH moved out. I don't have to get frustrated about how I do everything being totally exhausted while WH is just playing a computer game all day long.

So I have been reasoning myself lately, whenever I have those 'sad' moments. I wish I was a little wiser and chose a man who was as nice as H used to be, but also who was mentally strong. Then either none of our issues have happened in the first place, OR even if they did, we could have recovered. And there are reasons for all of these events. At the same time, if I didn't marry WH, I would not have had our beautiful boy, so I would not trade it for anything.

Yesterday I received a copy of our final agreement. Once we both agreed on it and signed, it will be entered.

Milk

Milk,

When we meet, when we are young, we don't consider what our backgrounds and upbringing will do to/for us in the future. You couldn't have known that your WH would have reacted as he has to the responsibility of life.

My FWH did not have a stellar upbringing, his adoptive mother (grandmother) cheated on his adoptive father (grandfather) and took WH along with her as a cover story. Eventually, my FWH told his father about his mother's trysts. That's just not a good lesson for a child, not to mention that his parents fought a lot and never really achieved recovery. Then his mother became ill (ALS) and slowly the disease took her life away, bit by bit. His father eventually succombed to lung cancer, leaving him to take care of EVERYTHING at the age of 19.

FWH's natural mother gave him up to her parents because she couldn't handle it, but then proceeded to remarry and start another family (that can't feel too good). His father was absent--gone. He killed himself about a year before his natural mother succombed to complications due to alcoholism (cirrhosis, kidney failure, heart failure).

The reason I tell you all of this, is to show that no matter what your upbringing is, you can overcome that stuff. My FWH had affairs, and I think that part of the reason was to run away from the pain he was experiencing and the down place our M was. Now, WH recognizes that he has problems of his own to DEAL with, that running away is not going to make him happy. I hope that he can do it, for all of our sake, but especially for himself. Maybe your WH will, eventually, see that same light and want more of it. If only for his son's sake...

I know those final papers are weighing heavily on you, but, Milk, you are doing a fantastic job, and you will be able to let go more and more, and you will be happy. I dreaded D for my DS sake, but I knew that I would step up, so I was angry, and worried about his future, but I was ready to do what I had to.

Wow, thanks Silent for sharing your story. That sounds worse than WH's (although he had many problems in the family too it seems - alcoholism, sexual abuse - although he does not remember it, his therapist said WH must have been sexually abused when he was little), and in a way it gives me hope in a sense that people with really hard upbringing can still make a right choice and overcome those issues. WH was always running away from his issues, and while he sounds much better (a bit healthier), he just changed his jobs again, for like 11 times over the past 15 1/2 years. That, to me, still shows that he is running away rather than standing up to 'fight'. He always told me that his 'boss' ticked him off - yeah, as if he is the innocent victim who happened to ALWAYS have bad bosses....for more than a decade......

Anyway, I do hope WH will someday see the light at the end of the tunnel and learns how to be responsible and also to be strong. But I will not hold my breath - if that really happens, I will be happy for him and also for DS4, but I am sure it will be too late for me to want him back, and if that never happens, that is fine, then really our D would have been a good idea in the end for all of us.

You are a very strong person Silent....., your FWH and son are very lucky to have you.

Milk

Just when I thought we will be wraping up our D filing with peace....., WH is MAD, AGAIN, just because he has to share DS4's future college costs. Also, apparently he called a couple of times yesterday but DS4 and I were out..., and when he finally called my cell, I didn't hear it (it was in my purse) and missed the call. He was yelling in his message saying that this is 'Bull sxxx" that I am not answering my phones and he 'NEEDS TO SPEAK TO HIS SON'.

Last night then he called like 4 times within 5 minutes (first my home phone, then home phone again 12 seconds later, then my cell, and then my home phone again). DS4 and I were already in bed (it was 10:15pm), but I figured it must be WH and if I don't answer or call back he might just keep calling, harrassing me...., so I called back. He was pissed!

Anyway, then he brought up the issue of DS4's college fund and he refused to contribute. Then he said "fine, then I am going to fight - I will talk to my lawyer and this deal is off!".

How many more months or years do I need to go through this...??? And I also realized how long I have been naive and blinded about WH's true personality...., which made me sad and also feel pretty stupid to be honest. How could I believe in this man for such a long time? He REALLY didn't love me for a long time, yet kept telling me stuff I wanted to hear just because he was scared to be alone and also he needed my financial support. I thought he truly loved and needed me. How naive is that.

So needless to say I wasn't feeling all that great this morning. I might be lacking EQ a big time......

Milk

Just when I thought we will be wrapping up our D filing with peace....., WH is MAD, AGAIN, just because he has to share DS4's future college costs. Also, apparently he called a couple of times yesterday but DS4 and I were out..., and when he finally called my cell, I didn't hear it (it was in my purse) and missed the call. He was yelling in his message saying that this is 'Bull sxxx" that I am not answering my phones and he 'NEEDS TO SPEAK TO HIS SON'.

Last night then he called like 4 times within 5 minutes (first my home phone, then home phone again 12 seconds later, then my cell, and then my home phone again). DS4 and I were already in bed (it was 10:15pm), but I figured it must be WH and if I don't answer or call back he might just keep calling, harassing me...., so I called back. He was pissed!

Anyway, then he brought up the issue of DS4's college fund and he refused to contribute. Then he said "fine, then I am going to fight - I will talk to my lawyer and this deal is off!”

How many more months or years do I need to go through this...??? And I also realized how long I have been naive and blinded about WH's true personality...., which made me sad and also feel pretty stupid to be honest. How could I believe in this man for such a long time? He REALLY didn't love me for a long time, yet kept telling me stuff I wanted to hear just because he was scared to be alone and also he needed my financial support. I thought he truly loved and needed me. How naive is that.

So needless to say I wasn't feeling all that great this morning. I might be lacking EQ a big time......

Milk

Ooops, I accidentally posted twice.....

save all ugly messages

you may need them in the future

and.....

SCREEN all his calls ... NEVER pick up if you think he is pissed

on purpose try and get him to leave voice messages

YOU never leave anything less than adult-calm factual messages on his machine

got it?

Thanks Pepperband. I talked to several friends yesterday and I managed to calm myself down.

I was doing pretty well, by mainly exchanging emails with him, but he just started his new job (this is his 12th or 13th times he changed his jobs over the past 16 years or so), and I don't have his new email address.

Anyway, I left him a message yesterday asking for his new contact info, so I should be getting it shortly. Then I will just document everything..., for the legal reasons but also to maintain my sanity.

Last night WH called to speak to DS4 and he kept asking what we did over the weekend and who we spent our time with. Also STBX asked the 4-year-old 6 times (!) if he loves and misses his daddy. It was amazing how much validation he needs...., in the end, DS4 yelled "Papa, I SAID I love you and miss you already!" Also STBX was telling him how he had a 'long' day at his new job...., why is he telling all this to the little one? We are supposed to protect the little one, but STBX is almost relying on DS4 for validation, support, love, etc. Weird and sad.

Geez!

It's the wayward mentality, as long as everything is working in their favor, and they look good, and can continue to talk to their STBX, well, all is well
Throw that monkey wrench in of him needing to help put HIS SON through college, and WHAMMO--he becomes an alien idiot.

Still on that rollercoaster. I agree with Pep--there is no need to answer the phone when he is in a tizzy, let him leave a message, this is HIS mess, don't help him AT ALL. Do a pseudo Plan B, something akin to what Orchid talks about, talk to the spouse, but cut the WS off at the pass.

The conversations he is having with your DS are absurd. I can't recall ever talking to my DS about my long day at work (like he cares) or asking him if he loves me (bad form). He even frustrated a four year old enough for your DS to stop his dad in his tracks with his statement about ALREADY saying I love you. Sick. Twisted.

Have you considered that maybe your WH is attempting to stall things because he is twisting in the wind? Makes sense to me.

(((((Milkshake)))))