Welcome to the
Marriage Builders® Discussion Forum

This is a community where people come in search of marriage related support, answers, or encouragement. Also, information about the Marriage Builders principles can be found in the books available for sale in the Marriage Builders® Bookstore.
If you would like to join our guidance forum, please read the Announcement Forum for instructions, rules, & guidelines.
The members of this community are peers and not professionals. Professional coaching is available by clicking on the link titled Coaching Center at the top of this page.
We trust that you will find the Marriage Builders® Discussion Forum to be a helpful resource for you. We look forward to your participation.
Once you have reviewed all the FAQ, tech support and announcement information, if you still have problems that are not addressed, please e-mail the administrators at mbrestored@gmail.com
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Page 4 of 131 1 2 3 4 5 6 130 131
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 3,862
M
Member
Offline
Member
M
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 3,862
Quote
If he stops reading before the end, he'll miss what it's really about. So you have to keep it reasonably short and snappy. BTW, is he used to reading your handwriting?

TA

Which is why I think the first sentence ought to read, "This might be the last letter I ever write you."

It grabs his attention right away.

I wouldn't rephrase it to say, MY HEART BREAKS b/c this might be the last letter I ever write...

I'd state it as is.

You moved me to tears again when I read your letter.

((((LS))))

~ Marsh

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 2,155
L
LilSis Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
L
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 2,155
I changed the assumption part about driving him further away to a variation on MEDC's suggested text.

I changed the first paragraph to this...and it makes it long, but I want to keep it in. It tells him why I love him. It may not use the specific words of "admiration" or "affection," but they come through (and those words might sound funny coming from me...if you know what I mean? they might sound stilted.)


I loved you on the first day I met you. I loved you when I married you. I love you still. I love you because you worked a horrific schedule to be home with Nick. Because you held me after my dad’s first surgery. Because of the pride I felt when you were named Officer of the Year. Because of how reverently you regard Memorial Day. Because you worried with me over Jake’s bowel problems. Because you gave a beautiful toast at my parent’s last anniversary together. I love you because you will marvel with me at the dappled light on the Pierce Stocking, at the sound of the first red-winged blackbird in the spring, at the first cicada buzz in the summer, at the growth of our maple tree every fall, and the movement of Orion’s Belt across the winter sky. I love you because you introduced me to camping and boating. Because you would take me for rides on countless back roads just to explore. Because you love to skip rocks at Point Betsie and collect petoskeys at Torch Lake. Because you took me to Pentwater, and because you also took me to Ludington. I love you because you know me, inside and out, what makes me beautiful, what makes me human, what frightens me, what pleases me. I love you because you know me more intimately than anyone has ever known me.

Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 3,474
C
Member
Offline
Member
C
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 3,474
I never went to Plan B, but I learned why Plan B is so critical. If I were to sum it up, Plan B is not about removing yourself to convince your spouse to care for you. It is not about getting your spouse to change at all. It is about protecting yourself.

I'm almost to 3,000 posts, and what I can sum up from my long and very painful relationship with my husband is this: If you sacrifice your dignity to save your marriage, you lose both.

LilSis, you are NOT giving up on your marriage. What you are doing is reclaiming your human dignity. Congratulations.

Cherishing

Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 15,310
M
Member
Offline
Member
M
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 15,310
Quote
This might be the last letter I ever write you."


Let's think of something else to GRAB HIS ATTENTION...something more on the "I LOVE YOU" end of things..

That subconscious issue that TA mentions is CRUCIAL...

My H had parts of the PBL in his MEMORY that he quoted back to me...

I do think he read back over it and kept it...

Saying, "this might be the LAST LETTER" makes her start out as if she is not HOPEFUL...he needs to HEAR LOUD AND CLEAR that she has CONFIDENCE in HIS ABILITY TO END THE AFFAIR...


I made it happen..a joyful life..filled with peace, contentment, happiness and fabulocity.
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 1,466
M
Member
Offline
Member
M
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 1,466
This is growing so fast so I don't know if this has been covered.

Keep a copy of the PBL so when WH asks what you want from him or breaks contact with you you can give him another copy.


M2L

ME BH 36 - FWW 33
2 kids
DDAY May 06


Sometimes waywards can be like Laxatives ..... They irritate the crap out of you.
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 15,310
M
Member
Offline
Member
M
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 15,310
Come to think of it, I started with something like...I WILL NEVER LOVE ANOTHER LIKE I'VE LOVED YOU..YOU WILL ALWAYS BE MY FIRST LOVE..Implying that I LOVE YOU NOW but I CAN LOVE AGAIN...


I made it happen..a joyful life..filled with peace, contentment, happiness and fabulocity.
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 4,140
M
Member
Offline
Member
M
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 4,140
If you open with that very long "I loved you on the first day I met you" paragraph, WH is only going to yawn and think "blah blah . . . more LilSis begging and groveling . . . yawn."

But if you open with "It breaks my heart to know that this may be the last letter I ever send you" - okay, *now* you've got his attention and you've let him know right off the bat that THIS letter is about something else.

As the others have said, I think you need a short and to-the-point one-page letter that will get through to a WH, not to an H. (That's why I've further broken down the paragraphs.)

And you need a letter that you must assume will be read by The Turd.

So, FWIW here's what I would suggest:

********************************************
It breaks my heart to know that this may be the last letter I ever send you.

(I am so sorry for showing you such ugliness and anger a couple of weeks ago and so many times in the past. My frustration at my sheer helplessness only resulted in driving you further away. I know intellectually that only you can save you, but my heart wants so badly to keep you from losing yourself, losing me, losing the boys. I believe in you, in who you are, in the heart and soul of man that I married. I will never believe that man is gone forever. Goodness always prevails.)

(I would take out the entire paragraph above. Don't apologize for fighting to defend your family. And don't give the two of them one single drop of encouragement to think they were justified in any way letting YOU go to jail for trying to defend your family. Remember, The Turd is going to read this too.)

I wish that I could go back in time and give you all that you needed to be happy: my undivided attention, my affection, my whole self with no holding back. I wish I had made “us” my top priority. I hope that one day you will forgive me for the mistakes that I made and give us the opportunity to create a new marriage.

I have worked to make positive changes in myself. In the process I've gained an understanding of who I am, of how deeply I love you, of how much I need to make a place for God in my life, and of what it takes to make a marriage work.

Over the past couple of months I have attempted to show you these changes. I want to share those changes with you for one reason: because you are my husband.

I believe with all my heart that together we can overcome all of this and begin a new and better life, one in which both of us are happy and deeply fulfilled. I want this more than anything.

But the past couple of weeks have made it clear to me that I must protect myself from the pain created by this situation. Seeing you with another woman is simply agonizing. I can no longer endure it. It is tearing me apart.

If you decide to give our marriage a chance, I need my love for you to be as strong as it is today. So, unless and until this situation changes, the only way I can hold on to my love is to end all contact with you.

Being without you is not what I want.

What I want, more than anything, is a committed marriage with you. I promised my life to you — to you and you alone.

I cannot and will not share you.

I cannot and will not ever be your “friend.”

I can only be your wife, in every sense of the word, in the way that I promised to you and to God. That is the only type of relationship with you that I can accept.

Out of respect for my position and my need to protect myself, do not call, send e-mails, or leave messages.

Not unless and until you agree to permanently, forever, and for life cut off all contact with Amy.

Not unless and until you decide that you want to work on building a new relationship with me.

Any necessary communications may be sent through Lisa. Her cell phone number is xxx-xxxx and home number is xxx-xxxx. Her email is xxxx. She will get a message to me.

In terms of the boys, I will assume that you will pick them up from school on “your” Fridays and drop them off around 6:00 on Sundays. During the week, we can continue with the same arrangements we have had for alternating Tuesdays and Wednesdays, with you picking them up from school and bringing them home around 8:00.

When you drop off or pick up the boys, please do not come into the house or attempt to speak to me.

I loved you on the first day I met you. I loved you when I married you.

I loved you when you worked a horrific schedule to be home with Nick, when you held me after my dad’s first surgery, when I proudly stood beside you when you were named Officer of the Year, when visited the farm and the cemetery every Memorial Day, when we worried together over Jake’s bowel problems, when you gave the toast at my parent’s last anniversary together.

I loved you when we marveled at the dappled light on the Pierce Stocking, when we would listen for the first red-winged blackbird in the spring and the first cicada in the summer, when we would document the growth of our maple tree in the fall, and when we would watch Orion’s Belt move across the winter sky.

I loved you when we went camping at Brimley, when we drove on countless back roads just to explore, when we collected rocks at Point Betsie, when we found petoskeys at Torch Lake, when we had “great days at the lake,” when we spent those incredible days in Pentwater, and when we went to Ludington.

I love you still.

Please come home. You know the way.

******************************************************

Remember that you will get many suggestions here. Just edit together what seems to work best for you.

I do think that the shorter, the better. If you can get it on no more than two pages with plenty of short paragraphs, that would help a lot.
Mulan


Me, BW
WH cheated in corporate workplace for many years. He moved out and filed in summer 2008.
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 2,155
L
LilSis Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
L
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 2,155
I'm having trouble keeping track because I go back to make changes and in the meantime a bunch more posts have popped up.

What if this:

I loved you on the first day I met you. I loved you when I married you. I love you still.

I love you because you worked a horrific schedule to be home with Nick. Because you held me after my dad’s first surgery. Because of the pride I felt when you were named Officer of the ....yada yada

That way, he can pretty much skip that paragraph until he's at a place (if ever) that it will enter his foggy brain.

I kind of like Daze's bullets, but I am almost of a mind that those "requests" would be THE buzz...I can see him thinking, "what the heck is she talking about?? Why would I even consider any of that, doesn't she remember I'm D-ING her??? What an idiot."

I honestly believe he'd be more offended and put off by what he would see as DEMANDS than by "why I love yous" The "why Is" are wistful, the demands are, well...demands. And even as an H he was S-T-U-B-B-O-R-N.

Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 10,044
M
Member
Offline
Member
M
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 10,044
Letter beginning...
XXXX, it breaks my heart that unless there are some real and profound changes, this will be the last heartfelt letter that I ever write to you.

and go from there. It sets the tome for the letter...it lets him know that CHANGE is expected from him and that it will need to be sincere.

Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 5,247
L
Member
Offline
Member
L
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 5,247
Good for you Lilsis!

Letter is coming along very nicely.

Have you told MIL about Plan B? Does she understand and support you in this? Does she understand you will not want to talk to her about WH, but you still want contact with her?? And that this is an act of LOVE and HOPE?

Have you thought about how to explain to the boys?? IMO they should also know this is how you are trying to save the family...

Is your intermediary on board and ready to go?

Are you prepared to AVOID his calls and attempts to break your silence? A LOT of times the BS goes to Plan B then sabotages it themselves being hurt that WS seem to LIKE plan B, so therefore contact them to find out why the WS isn't contacting them....(...???...strange but true....)

I sincerely hope you consider moving. Rather soon. Because you simply can't avoid the visuals like this morning. And you just don't need that.

(((SIS)))

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 2,155
L
LilSis Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
L
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 2,155
I am really beginning to see the point of an attention-grabbing first line...somehow setting THIS letter apart from ANY previous communication (not just the letter two weeks ago, but other I have given in the past)

What about something like, "I deeply regreat that find myself in a place that I need to write you this letter. I hoped it would never come to this."

But if it begins that way...the ILY stuff needs to go to the end...as in Mulan's suggestion. That was where I had it initially...so I'm open.

Dang...lots of differing opinions again. I wished everyone were on the same page.

If it's handwritten, it will not fit on one page, there's no way.

Mulan, I like the shorter paragraphs, but even as you did it, it's still pretty long. And I think I do need some kind of "I believe in you" statement in there. That's what I've been saying to him all along, so to leave it out of this highly significant letter would be...not right somehow.

Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 754
B
Member
Offline
Member
B
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 754
I love the suggestion to end it with your usual saying,
CY, LY, Bye. It brought tears to my eyes, that says, I believe in you, this isn't just a "tactic", it's real...IMHO

Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 10,044
M
Member
Offline
Member
M
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 10,044
Change the house phone number... the locks(check with your lawyer about this)...change your route so you do not pass by the coffee shop...consider moving...

Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 4,140
M
Member
Offline
Member
M
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 4,140
Quote
I honestly believe he'd be more offended and put off by what he would see as DEMANDS than by "why I love yous" The "why Is" are wistful, the demands are, well...demands.

Sis, listen to yourself - OF COURSE any WH is so far gone that he will hear his wife saying "Stop Seeing Another Woman" as an unreasonable demand.

Of course he will.

But they're not "demands". They are Boundaries that YOU are setting for YOURSELF.

If you want to make that clearer, you can make the letter say something like, "I cannot and will not be part of your life as long as Turd is in it. Since you have chosen not to remove her, I have no choice but to remove myself."

See the difference?

"Get rid of her" is a demand.

"If you keep her, I will remove myself" is a Boundary.

The B in Plan B stands for Boundary.
Mulan


Me, BW
WH cheated in corporate workplace for many years. He moved out and filed in summer 2008.
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 928
I
Member
Offline
Member
I
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 928
This was my opening line from my first draft.

It is truly sad what has happened to our marriage and us, and the path that I must take now is not one of choice but one of self-preservation.

Just and idea.

You are definately getting lots of opinions, just take your time and sort through them.


None are more unjust in their judgments of others than those who have a high opinion of themselves.
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 928
I
Member
Offline
Member
I
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 928
Quote
Quote
I honestly believe he'd be more offended and put off by what he would see as DEMANDS than by "why I love yous" The "why Is" are wistful, the demands are, well...demands.

Sis, listen to yourself - OF COURSE any WH is so far gone that he will hear his wife saying "Stop Seeing Another Woman" as an unreasonable demand.

Of course he will.

But they're not "demands". They are Boundaries that YOU are setting for YOURSELF.

If you want to make that clearer, you can make the letter say something like, "I cannot and will not be part of your life as long as Turd is in it. Since you have chosen not to remove her, I have no choice but to remove myself."

See the difference?

"Get rid of her" is a demand.

"If you keep her, I will remove myself" is a Boundary.

The B in Plan B stands for Boundary.
Mulan

Exactly. When FWH got me to break plan B the very first day, I actually kept stating that over and over again. I was't making him do anything. If he wanted to continue his relationship with her that was his choice, but my choise was to remove myself from that situation. I was no longer willing to share my H. So if he wanted her in his life he would no longer have me in it, not even as a friend.

Last edited by InADaze; 03/02/07 12:01 PM.

None are more unjust in their judgments of others than those who have a high opinion of themselves.
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 35,996
P
Member
Offline
Member
P
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 35,996
[color:"red"] send a copy of your final letter to your in-laws [/color]

Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 928
I
Member
Offline
Member
I
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 928
Threadjack:

Pep, LOVE THE NEW TAGLINE!!!!!


None are more unjust in their judgments of others than those who have a high opinion of themselves.
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 326
J
Member
Offline
Member
J
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 326
(((LilSis)))

I've been following your thread for quite some time, lurking, praying, and pulling for you. I think you have done a fantastic job with your Plan A. I think you may have doubts in the coming days about what you are doing, but I think it's the right thing to do.

Quote
LilSis, you are NOT giving up on your marriage. What you are doing is reclaiming your human dignity. Congratulations.


That's exactly what it's about. Would you settle for this unpleasant WH or do you want your H back? It's both of the quoted items to me: You are NOT giving up on your marriage, this IS a way to save it, and while you are it you are indeed reclaiming your dignity and self-respect. Everyone hear already respects you for the things you have done - your WH, when the fog lifts someday, will respect you for your Plan A AND Plan B - your stand, your willingness to regain your self-respect and retain your dignity.

I believe that a PBL is an act of love, and could very well be the last love you show someone. I love what you have written.

I know there may be some disagreement on this from the few, but I'm sure the many will agree that a WS WILL READ this letter MANY TIMES. I've seen so many stories where the WS will recap back to the BS parts of the letter they have memorized. KNOW THAT THIS WILL HAPPEN. As the fog comes and goes they will read more or less of it, but THEY WILL re-read it. They will keep it. They will blast it to their lover. They will feel guilty for doing so.

Just my $.02.

My best wishes and prayers for you LilSis, you are a noble person who deserves nothing less than happiness.

Remember: You don't want your WH back. You don't want your WH to hold you and show you the affection he once did. You want your H back who WANTS to do all of these things. He'll have to come to this decision on his own, go dark knowing that.


BS (Me) - 33 WW - 31 Married 14 years, together 17 Daughter: 16 yrs old Separated: 12/29/06 D-Day: 2/2/07, EA/PA With Co-Worker Plan B Started: 3/6/07 D filed by WW: 4/18/07 Olive Branch offered (Plan B resumed after): 8/8/07 R Attempt by WW: 9/1/07 NC Established: 9/4/07 NC Broken: 9/5/07, 9/6/07 Status: Plan B, Pt. II (9/10/07)
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 2,155
L
LilSis Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
L
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 2,155
Quote
Have you told MIL about Plan B? Does she understand and support you in this? Does she understand you will not want to talk to her about WH, but you still want contact with her?? And that this is an act of LOVE and HOPE?
She and FIL are in California...she said she'd be in touch. Previously, I had talked to her about going dark (not using MB lingo) and she said she would support me in WHATEVER I had to do, and that she completely understood. I don't believe she buys into the idea that my cutting off contact will have ANY impact on WH. She told me she thought that he would interpret it as giving up on him. She's a softy...so am I but I can't afford to be anymore.

Can I really not talk to her about WH?? Yeah, I know...that will be HARD. Luckily she seems to be pretty in the dark about him anyway since they don't talk.

Quote
Have you thought about how to explain to the boys?? IMO they should also know this is how you are trying to save the family...
I don't really want to say anything to the boys about this as "saving the family" in case they let that slip to WH, who would use that as evidence that I am manipulating him. I can easily let them know that it is just too hurtful for me to see Dad anymore. They will know that (and will probably be relieved) because of my sobbing mess the other day when I got the letter from court.

Quote
Is your intermediary on board and ready to go?
She's not thrilled but she'll do it.

Quote
WS seem to LIKE plan B, so therefore contact them to find out why the WS isn't contacting them....(...???...strange but true....)
I am QUITE sure that WH will LOVE plan B. This is very frightening to me, and will be very very hard. But I MUST MUST MUST do this for my own sanity. I will BE RELYING ON EVERYONE HERE TO KEEP ME ON TRACK. I AM VERY SERIOUS. I am not that strong.

Quote
I sincerely hope you consider moving. Rather soon. Because you simply can't avoid the visuals like this morning. And you just don't need that.
With the D in play, I can't do anything. And the visuals will be there anyway...every time I see a cop car, I will wonder if it's him. I have to drive the gauntlet every morning from the kid's school to my office...there's no avoiding the stretch of road that goes right through the heart of his patrol area. I CAN take measures to avoid the coffee shop, but I can't miss is completely, it's right at the edge of a bridge...I HAVE to go over that bridge to get to the other side of town.

Page 4 of 131 1 2 3 4 5 6 130 131

Moderated by  Fordude 

Link Copied to Clipboard
Forum Search
Who's Online Now
0 members (), 432 guests, and 66 robots.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Newest Members
Bibbyryan860, Ian T, SadNewYorker, Jay Handlooms, GrenHeil
71,838 Registered Users
Building Marriages That Last A Lifetime
Copyright © 1995-2019, Marriage Builders®. All Rights Reserved.
Site Navigation
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.5