LilSis,

The wolf in cops clothing thinks he can keep all of his retirement? HAAAHAAAHAAA!!

Me thinks not!!!!

Good for you! It sounds like you did very well!
Buy that great friend of yours a nice latte!

PGA

LS:

This evening at the Rat Hole:

WH: "Can you believe it, LS didn't even come in the courtroom!"

RT: "Why are we talking about LS?"

WH: ????

About the pension....

WH gets 1/2 of the value of the home equity now. And that is a fixed amount. Determined as of the filing date of the Plan D or other date as determined by the parties. Appreciation in the value goes to you.

However. The pension will go up. Seperate the two. 401K/403B are one part and and his Pension Benfit from the union/City is another. The 401K was amounts given up during your M to grow for YOUR future. So you are entitled to half of that balance at some future time, which could be substantial, or go for 1/2 now, via the QDRO process, that will form the base of your future retirement. The City/Union part he can't get until he retires/turns 65, whatever. This amount is harder to seperate. However, you could get a chunk of that amount monthly as well when he retires. Address them seperatly with your Attorney.

Make sure that the FOC is collecting the CS payments.....

Remember:

Marriage is for Love.
Divorce is for Money.

Drag it out....Just bleeds him more...

LG:

Who wanted to have post 1000 in your thread....

LG and all:

My thinking exactly on the pension/retirement...as well as the house issue. Half the equity at current value, payable after DS8 turns 18. I can save that up in no time, or (since the house will be paid off by then) I can take out a home equity and pay him off.

It will all get sorted out, but I think I'm in a pretty good position.

WH didn't go in to the courtroom either (my A told me)...it was pretty much over before I knew it started.

Off to party with the girls from work.

Wine....

In WA State, CS is based on how much you make now, and have made over the past X (2?) years. It cannot be speculative based on how much you COULD make (unless that's a factor in your existing income, e.g. commission sales). If you have worked 30 hrs per week, and it fits with transportation of the children, and that is the lifestyle/sitch you all have been accustomed to, than that is the bar that is set.

In my sitch, we laid it all on the table and cut it 50/50. I didn't want to deal with any games. (But, truth be told, I lead with 70/30 so 50/50 would seem like a win for her <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />).

Yeah, my sister's CS was also NOT figured on her 40 hr/wk potential earnings; she works 20 hrs/wk. Her XH attempted to have CS figured on the 40hr/wk benchmark, but the court wouldn't go for it; my sis did all the running around and transporting...it was the standard, the precedent.

I can't imagine a court essentially penalizing me for working 30 hrs/wk as opposed to 40 when working 30 allows me to drop off and pick up the kids everyday rather than putting them in afterschool care, which I (and WH) would have to pay for. It seems burdensome and not in the best interests of the kids.

Maybe there will be a tiny bit of justice. MAYBE.

RE: the pension. It is a defined BENEFIT plan...if that makes any difference in consideration of how to factor it...LG? I'm going to have to talk to my financial guy and get a professional opinion.

I will be able to manage on my own with CS, my additional hours...even making the house payment. I'll be cutting it a lot closer than I ever have except for the days when it didn't really matter (college) and I could survive on ramen noodles and Tuesdays were quarter drafts.

I like my A's idea of having WH's potential spousal support come in the form of making the house payment for the next couple of years (assuming I get spousal support).

So, frankly, I'm hoping that is more the norm here in MI, too. Truly, it makes sense, especially when there is such clear fault (even though technically that can't be used).

LS:

The City/Union pension is a Defined BENEFIT plan. Because the employee does not have to contribute to the plan.

The 401k/403B plan is a Defined Contribution Plan. Because it is money contributed by the participant. And the participant has some control over these funds, you can make investment decisions as to where to allocate the funds etc. You stated that the two of you were "stuffing extra cash" into the plan. This is where it should be.

There can be other investment vehicles, but these are the main ones for a city/union job in MI.

And LS: about this: "going to talk to my financial guy and get a professional opinion." Ouch!

But I am just a guy on a bulletin board....

Sorry we had to meet this way....

LG

Oww...sorry, LG. I knew you were involved in the whole taxes deal because April 15 is busy for you, but I didn't know you actually DID that stuff. Advise away!!!

Sorry!!

I get the difference between the two, but I don't know what the advantage is to staking my claim on one vs. the other...or either for that matter...?

His is a 457, if that makes any difference.

LS,

Advise your attorney about the cottage get-away planned for just after the court date. See if you can't find a way with this much time ahead to delay that hearing by two weeks - that way he's not divorced by the time that little "vacation" is planned - and it stays just WS and his boys.

Good point, Kayla, but it was my understanding from my A yesterday that the Aug 2 court date is just another hearing like we had yesterday...each of us presenting counter-offers to the other.

Even if there IS agreement at that point, then it's still not final...there MUST be more steps....(Mr. W?)? I can't imagine that she (the judge) would just say okay/bang the gavel/you are done. Final papers would have to be drafted, etc. Besides, my attorney and I will make sure that there is NOT agreement at that time, so it will go to trial, which will take another 2-3 months.

I think I'm good for the summer. I am just so relieved that I have three months of peace. I am going to email my attorney with my reactions to WH's offer, but I want to get the financial advice first. The retirement, pension, QADRO stuff is waaaay out of my league.

Guess what came in the mail today from Friend of the Court (the CS collection arm of state gov.)?

A notice that WH is in arrears to the tune of $2400 in child support and thus will be reported to the credit reporting agencies unless he pays up within 21 days.

Everyone duck and cover. This could potentially be a rather small nuclear device.

WH is a HUGE stickler for credit. He would get his report frequently to make sure it was all up to par and crow about his score (mine was always a bit higher for some reason). He's going to be F U R I O U S !

The only way for WH to contest it is if there is a court order...nothing else will do unless they have the wrong social security number or some such that totally doesn't apply.

I ASSUME they figure he is in arrears because FOC didn't start collecting until Feb. and he filed in October. WH was making random deposits into our joint account, but it wasn't anything official. Since WH considered that "support," then I guess he figured that everyone else should consider it that way as well.

Everyone should just take him at his word, right? Him being so honest and all.

I'm about ready to go put on DSs helmet, knee pads, elbow pads, etc. just waiting for a storm to come crashing in around me.

Remember, *I* started this when my attorney filed the expected paperwork with FOC upon receiving the divorce papers...D papers that were filed by WH.

Remember that RT's XH and she worked it all out privately, because XH is an attorney. Remember THAT is the civilized way to destroy a family.

Remember that WH screamed at me that *I* had better learn about D before my attorney files paperwork that might $crew things up for him.

I'm thinkin' that WH hasn't really thought this through much.
I'm thinkin' he thought this would be a piece of cake, that he could just jump right out of this frying pan and NOT land right smack dab into the fire.
I'm thinkin' that he believes that he will be able to just write off any claim to the house and that will be good enough for LilSis; that I won't be able to get my grubby fingers on his (cue the heavenly chorus) PENSION.

(I've done some checking and the common thinking among the union folks at the PD is that the pension is a golden goose. Expertly managed; it has done very, very well.)

So mom and I went to the mall tonight; I got two new pairs of pants, a pair of cropped jeans, and a cute little black top that I plan to wear when LK and I and another friend go see Billy Joel next weekend. (I know, I'm dating myself, but we kind of go for the classics when it comes to concerts).

LilSis,

Oh myyy Godd you're seeing Billy Joel <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/eek.gif" alt="" />

I love Billy Joel, I would give anything to see him...can you sneak me in.

Still

Good for you Sis, sounds like yet another small victory, and that nuclear bomb will be landing smack in the middle of infidel castle, where they will have to deal with the fallout, not YOU.

I (heart) consequences......hehehehehe

LS-
Great job with everything!

See, what comes around goes around....

Beautiful, isn't it?

LOL!

Sadmo

[b]ROFLMAOPIMP

LS,

Good job. I sense a war t/b wagered for those 'wages' the WS is attempting to horde. What a shame but not surprising since GREED is at the root of all this mess.

Keep up the good work. Looks like the WS is still babbling.
<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" />

Your attorney is doing a good job.

Does your local support group know about this turn of events?


take care,

Oh...I'm sure I'll have to deal with the fallout...I just don't know in what form it will take yet.

He'll get me back somehow.

I'm thinking that he will get me back by bringing the boys around RT this weekend, or at least around her kids. He'll get me back by pushing the big red button that says DO NOT TOUCH EVER.

If that happens, I will have to breathe easy and call my attorney. No yelling, no screaming (to him or anyone remotely related to him), no going through the intermediary. Go right to the big guns.

I'm mentally preparing myself for that possibility, but he may think of something even more devious...Where is my H when I need him? (I say this with a sad smile)

Go right to the big guns

[b]amen sistah

Orchid:
Yes...my mom, sister, best friend/intermediary, and neighbor have a head's up. They are there for me if I need it. I am a tad bit anxious.

Certainly this is not something that will be communicated to any of the ILs. I am essentially dark with them as well. Things are too tense right now...I need a good strong buffer zone. I don't want anything getting through.

On a side note, a little thing occurred to me. If WH asks the boys why Grandma came on Thursday night (after the hearing) they will truthfully tell him that I had a party to go to. I even brought the mango black bean salsa! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Hopefully they will forget to mention that she also came on Wednesday because I was a sobbing mess who made them eat frozen pizza for dinner...

Oh well.

eta: I'm out to mow the grass for the first time! Mr. Neighbor checked the oil, the blade and added some gas (I'm out). It started up the first pull! I also weeded and feeded the other night...I feel like such a stud.

[color:"red"]$2400 [/color]

when this $$$ comes
put it aside

your war fund