My court date isn't until Aug. 2. We are in Cape Cod in July. My neighbor has a key to the house, so I could work out access thru her. Does WH need to have access, or just the appraiser?

I went back and read Bugs thread where this conversation took place, but I still don't get it.

Are you suggesting...that I just put off the appraisal til the 11th hour, i.e.; "sorry, just didn't have time, what with working so many hours now, caring for the kids, house, yard, cats, garden." forcing WH and his attorney schedule their own? Then at the settlement conference (Aug 2), when we have different values, it just means more time? Yet another sticking point, another detail to work out...

My understanding was that if a settlement can't be reached at the Aug. 2 date, that it will go to trial.

I don't know what that means, either. Does that mean the judge decides? I don't even know who to ask. I don't know anyone who's had a messy divorce.

I feel so clueless. I have a feeling that my A is one who just wants things to go smoothly...let's all get along, this is difficult enough...he's a highly experienced D attorney, but I prolly should have gone with the bulldog. I just didn't feel comfortable with her...she was very crabby...looking back, that's good.

That's why I hate those darn envelopes. I always end up feeling discouraged and in over my head. I'm not used to not knowing the rules of the game, etc. I'm usually pretty smart.

Anyone...is is okay strategy to just wait for the A to call? I guess I assume that he'll call me if there's something that NEEDS to be addressed, right?

Why is it a PIA in MI? Because of how we do assessments?

THANK YOU, K, for the lovely gift.

I was so very touched. It was perfect. And the timing couldn't have been better.

Thank you so much...I hope you see this...

((LilSis))

I hate those creme colored envelopes also. Right now all I'm getting from attorney is my bill. Ouch.

And I think in your conversation with God He was right you are helping others (like us)

Still

Sis,

I wanted to poat here to be sure you read this.

IT0TALLY understand caring, not alwyas visiting or posting on each other's threads! I have thought about this Many times!

I am sure it is hard/painful for you to read many Plan A threads right now

I don't keep up as much with yours at times because I am not yet in Plan B. I don't want to get 'off track' of PlanA yet,,,and reading too much Plan B stuff is, at times, too hard

So, thanks for stopping my thread, and thanks for caring!

I have Many friends who I do not have daily contact with,,yet they are still great Friends!

You will always be Kate to me,,, my fellow Angel!

If it doesn't settle and goes to trial it will be either heard by the Judge (bench trial) or a jury (if one was requested). A Judge is more likely to look solely at the law whereas a jury is SUPPOSED to do the same but being that they are people just like us, they tend to bring their own experiences to the table. Your WH does NOT want a trial. Not only is it expensive, everything he's done would become public record. If you do go to trial, then you DEFINITELY want to make sure your attorney asks for your attorneys fees.


Yes, it's okay to wait on the appraisal. However, if you really want a play by play of what to expect so you can prepare, call your attorney and tell him that you want it explained to you (in layman's terms) about how this process will go if... He works for you Sis.

One more thing, if it doesn't settle on August 2 and goes to trial, chances are the trial date won't be set for a few months down the road. Once it's set, chances are GREAT that it will be continued at least once. That's just the nature of the beast.

You might want to go over to the "Divorcing" forum and pick their brains.

Start a new thread that asks things like:

What tactics work to delay the D?

What mistakes did you make during your D?

What was/is the one (top 3) thing(s) about D that you wish you knew going in?

Stuff like that .... go ask the experienced.

Thank you for posting your pic in the MB Album, you look exactly like I pictured (no pun intended <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />-- cute as a bug.

Sis, since you were brave enough to do it, I decided to do it too. Post my pic that is.

Have a great weekend!

A LADY bug, b/c she's a LADY.

uhh huhh, that's right

Now I HAVE to dial in from home and check out all of the pics!

No doubt Sis is a lady! But, I have a question, if Sis is the Lady Bug, what kind of Bug does that make me?

Bugs:

It makes you the best bug: BUGSMOM!

LG

I’m having a hard time, guys.

I’m at a conference, stuck here for three days with like 150 teenagers, trying to be "on" all the time. When I get home on Sunday, the boys will be home. So I’m really wishing this thing would be over. I feel really anxious.

Yesterday was no better, feeling tired and irritable with a big smile on my face. I was contemplating why it is, what it is about me that allowed not only WH, but MIL to make the choice to hurt me. I had a long talk with my sister about it.

I’m quite certain that I will get blasted for saying this stuff, but I need to get it out of my system. Clearly, WH hurt me. He betrayed me. No matter how many emotional needs I was not meeting, he did not have the right to have an A. For better, for worse. If I had been in a horrific car wreck, or diagnosed with cancer, or we lost a child, he vowed to stand by me. Forsaking all others. No where in there was there a opt-out clause when our ENs weren’t being met.

So that’s a huge blow, right? A promise broken.

Then MIL. I don’t know if I’ve expressed here how deeply hurt I feel. And this may be unfair, my expectations unrealistic, but the outcome is the same. I am hurt, I feel deeply hurt.

Over and over, she told me that she loved me like a daughter. That she would always love me. That I could trust her. That there was nothing that I could do that could change that.

But it did change, or at least, it sure feels like it. I haven't spoken more than a few words to her since she defended WH's "usurping" of the cottage. Again, I understand how this could happen. She’s in an untenable situation. Her son, her flesh and blood. Her husband, who has controlled her life for so long. The hurt that she feels.

But for me, from my selfish perspective….she just left. After the promises—commitments?—that she made to me, she just disappeared.

Our relationship was not worth fighting for. Our relationship was not worth being honest. Our relationship was not the priority.

Just like WH.

So whatever the underlying reasons…whatever MIL’s struggles…from MY POV, it feels very, very similar to what WH did. He decided that someone else was more important. He decided that our relationship wasn’t worth fighting for. He decided that an explanation wasn’t necessary.

He decided that I wasn’t worth loving.

And then MIL did the same thing.

So what’s wrong with me? What’s so horrible about me, what’s so awful about me, what’s so despicable about me that I’m not even worthy of an explanation? Why am I just so easy to walk away from? What is it about me that makes it okay to hurt me? What is it about me that allows people to choose others over me, even if they SAY that they love me…even PROMISE to love me? What do I do that drives people away?

My sister said that I shouldn’t focus on that…that I should focus on those around me who do love me, who haven’t made those choices, because it is WH/MIL’s own flaws and vulnerabilities that have led them to make those choices…not me.

But part of me really needs the answer. If I don’t know the answer, how can I ever trust anyone again? If I don’t know the answer, how can I ever really give myself to anyone, or make myself vulnerable? I know there will be pain in life…but why should I ever set myself up for THIS kind of pain? Especially when I may have some sort of sign over me, “sucker.” Especially when abandoning me—without explanation, no matter the pain it causes me—is preferable to whatever the alternative is.

Two people have done this to me now. Twice. It just makes me really wonder if there’s something about ME…maybe they are on to something.

What I was saying to my sister is that I would really like to hear—directly from WH and from MIL—what it is that makes hurting me okay. What is it that is SO much more compelling…so much more significant…that causing me such deep pain and unrelenting pain is LESS compelling and significant?

Sorry, guys...contemplative here in my few moments of solitude. Gotta suck it up and go be Happy Sis, Professional Sis, Nothing-Bothering-Me Sis. Oh yeah...Role Model Sis. HAH! If they only knew...

Blech.

print it out and put it in your "God Box"

God thinks you are special enought to give your two darling sons .... how wonderful is THAT?

I used to think "What's wrong with me that I cannot get pregnant?"

worry-worry-fuss-fuss
I wept during every movie or TV that showed the joy of childbirth (waaaaaa)

then, we adopted 2 siblings

I felt good

I became closer to God
I got baptized in my 40's !

then my H had an affair

I felt terrible and wondered why God blessed us with 2 kids that were going to live in a divorced family

then H and I recovered .... which was HARDER than infertility, but I had become emotionally stronger because of the infertility

and my relationhip with God became stronger because I relied on Him

then one child became mentally ill

it was terrible
I felt broken

I leaned on God

the trials and tribulations of the previous years had strengthened me

we endured

endurance is UNDERrated

I learned to self-soothe when I was uncertain if my son was dead or alive or in jail somewhere

and I learned to quiet myself when I was shouting "THAT"S NOT FAIR"

so I could pay attention to God's voice

and I guarantee you
God does not think LilSis is"something-wrong" or "something horrible"

you will endure

and whatever gets you through this mess

WILL be necessary for your future wellbeing

that's how it works

Sis ~


It just isn't about you. Children often take incomprehensible hurts and make it about themselves. That's what you are doing here.

This is your fear - coming from your childhood - that something is wrong with you and you are not perfect. "If I was a better child, Mommy and Daddy wouldn't fight and get a divorce." How many times have we heard that reality?

If you were perfect your H would never betray you? Do you really believe that?

I think you are a bit too hard on your MIL - but for the sake of this discussion I'll let that be.

You were betrayed, not because of something wrong with you, but because of something wrong with HIM.

You just are not that powerful.

Sis,

You are a wonderful human being, who has many people that love her. It's in these down times, when we have so much time to THINK, that we focus on all of this negativity.

Sis, there is nothing WRONG with you. The decisions that your WH and MIL make are not about you, they are about WH and MIL. There is nothing awful about you, you do not have the power to turn people away in this manner, Sis. They CHOOSE to turn away, for their own reasons, not about you, about them. You never have the power to actually TURN people away.

Never rely on what people say, unless and until it is backed up with action, and for me, this even includes my marriage vows. *I* stayed for richer, for poorer, in sickness and in health, through the good times and the bad; PWC chose to leave, I didn't make that choice. Yes, now we are both paying for the consequences, but, again, *I* choose recovery. Even if PWC chose to attempt to contact me and recover, I still have a choice.

I may not be describing this so well. I just want to drill home that they make these choices for themselves. You don't know what good or damage these choices have done to them, not yet, and you may never know. Just remember, they are their choices, for themselves, not AGAINST you. There is no conspiracy to hurt you, their choices just do hurt you. Unfortunately, when a choice to leave the family is made, everyone reaps the consequences. It's called the infidelity FALLOUT.

Think of an nuclear reactor shutting down, releasing toxins into the air, releasing radioactivity. At ground zero, utter devastation; people die quite quickly. As the radioactivity dissipates and spreads, the devastation continues, just at a slower pace. You were at ground zero, Sis, when the marriage reactor failed, and that infidelity-slime, well, it slowly, subversively seeps out, and covers much in it's path. It kills friendships, hurts the relationships with the children, not to mention the finances going haywire, and the IL's make a choice, too.

This is the fallout of WH's choice to become wayward. You can't do anything about that, or what happens to others' as a consequence. There will be losses, surely, but you will become stronger, and you will KNOW who is really there for you, you will know what people choose to continue on with you.

LilSis, you've mentioned this thing often enough that I'm prepared to take it seriously. Let's assume that there IS something about LS that causes people to betray her.

What is your fear? What do you think it might be? Is it that there's some ugliness in her soul that others can sense? Is it that she's not worth as much as she seems once you really get to know her? Is it that she's not important enough to keep faith with?

Let's be clear - I'm not suggesting at all that any of these things are true. But you can't work through your fears until you identify what they are. It's part of the self-inventory that the growth process demands. If you explore the darkest parts of your shadow, you'll know the worst about yourself...and chances are that it's much less black than your subconscious fears.

However, in taking that inventory, be very realistic. This list of betrayers is short - WH and MIL, two people strongly related by blood and a shared attitude to life. If this is the extent of the 'list', then it's hard to draw conclusions...so condemning yourself on that basis is hardly sensible. But on the basis of these two, it's worth asking yourself some questions. Are you attracted to people who over-promise? Is there some hidden payoff for you in over-trusting people who are likely to let you down? Do you, in a subtle way, make it hard for people to tell you what they really feel about things?

These are tough questions - not the ones to worry about during a tiring work weekend - but perhaps to take up with your IC?

And you know what, you don't have to smile all the time, even at work. You don't HAVE to be 'on' all the time. You simply have to be operational. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

TA

When you talk this way, I always wonder like others what makes you think that you were singled out? What makes you think that you are soo SPECIAL? Yes, you've been treated HORRIBLY and you've been terribly BETRAYED..but so have WE ALL, SIS. There's nothing ESPECIALLY GOOD or BAD about you. You are ONE OF THE CROWD. Worse things have happened to some of us..worse things WILL happen to some of us and WORSE things may even happen to you..

FOCUS on YOUR BLESSINGS and you have oh so many BLESSINGS to be thankful for. ..

We all have to take THE BITTER WITH THE SWEET....

EMBRACE YOUR PERSONAL GROWTH..how much you are learning about the RAWNESS of life..the way that it REALLY IS...

I'm thankful for the loss of my NAIVENESS...

Some folks experience me as TOO REAL now..SO SORRY if I am offending you...

For example, the TRUTH is, as much as I love my son's GF, I know that she will NEVER have the PLACE IN MY HEART that my son has...THAT'S JUST THE TRUTH..that's FACING FACTS..I was with him from DAY 1 ..with years and years of bonding with him before I came to know her... and as sweet and adorable as she is to me...she will NEVER CATCH UP...To me, that's a FACT OF LIFE..that must be FACED...and I am thankful that I am able to FACE SUCH FACTS NOW...

My quote for today: "Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don' mind"...Dr. Seuss

Sis,
I think BR mentioned this, we are not powerful enough to control others' choices. I get the sense that you want to make MIL and WH choices your fault. Somehow that gives you some control over the situation. In reality it is not about you. It is about them. Some things in life we have no control over. Whether people leave us or stay with us is completely up to them. We can't control the choices others make. Your MIL is exactly that: Mother In Law, by marriage. She is WH's mother and there is no way she will choose you over him. I know the reality of all of this hurts but once you fully accept it you will be better off.

WH chose to have an A, MIL is his mother and is making the choice to deal with her son as she chooses...all of those things are out of your realm of control.

Why do you believe you are so terrible that people run away from you? Where did you learn that about yourself? Or do you simply need to hear others dispute your fear and tell you that you are not terrible or awful to help convince yourself? I am just trying to understand by asking these questions...

In reality sis, you are like everyone else who has been betrayed on this earth. Remember, Jesus was betrayed and crucified so what makes any of us think that we are beyond experiencing pain and suffering at the hands of those we love and trust? We all will experience our trials and tribulations sis, there is no way around it. I know, it doesn't seem fair right? When a person makes a promise they should keep it right? That's how things should be but in reality that's not always the case. Acceptance is key. That doesn't mean you have to agree with the choices that others make, it doesn't mean you have to accept abuse from others. It means that you learn and grow from these experiences and you know that there will be pain in life and that people can and will hurt you. You have control over YOU and the boundaries you set in place for yourself... Find the strength to work through these feelings and you will become even stronger. When you learn to trust yourself you will know that whatever life presents to you, you can handle it. Think about it, if someone had told you 5 years ago that you would be going through this you probably would not have believed you could handle it....but you are dealing with this everyday the best way you can. Trust yourself.

Sis

This isn't about you. It's about your WH and where he is right now in his life, mind, heart and soul.

In order for your WH to have an explanation for you, he would have to be willing to see beyond the denial and justification he has created to do the very things he knows in his heart are wrong: to violate his vows, trash his integrity, prove to others his promises are empty, and turn into a failure as a role model to his boys.

That's alot of [email]s@$*[/email] to shovel. Of course, it follows him around everywhere he goes because it's in the center of his heart. He won't be able to deal the stink and the flies forever.

You are not terrible or awful. This isn't yours to carry.

PS-don't worry about being "on" with those high school kids. They are much more responsive to "real" than "on" anyway.

My quote for today: "Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don' mind"...Dr. Seuss


_____________________

i don't know if i have ever heard this before
but i LOVE it.
thanks, mimi.


hang in there, LS.
oh, and i saw your pic...you are a cutie. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

LilSis,

I agree with nia's quote and with BR's thought.

First, nia's quote. If you are exhausted with the 150 kids and putting a "fake" smile on your face, I suggest that you be who you are. Tell the kids you have to deal with "Hey guys, I care about ya and love what I'm doing here, but just so you know, I am emotionally and mentally tired here so I may not be my pristine best. Let's just get through it together, shall we?" That gives the teens a GREAT life lesson in honoring commitments even when you don't "feel like it" -AND- in being transparently honest and that it's okay to let others see the real you.

Second, BR's thoughts. LilSis, she nailed it EGG-ZACK-LEE right on the head. This is not about something being wrong with you that makes you unlovable. You are a smart, funny, beautiful, caring woman and you just are not powerful enough to "make" others betray you. There is no gigantic, secret, hidden flaw in you that "makes" the ones you love betray you--some flaw that you can fix that will "make" you safe from ever being betrayed again. For a number of reasons, your WH and MIL chose what they chose. If anything this is about THEM: WH's and MIL's personalities and character flaws that allow them to betray those to whom they commit.

The thing is this...YOU are displaying a fear that you are unlovable or unworthy of love. What is at the root of that fear, kiddo??

Your mama bee,



CJ