Good point, especially with the current distortions. I hadn't considered this as a tool for the future.

Nobody in your situation can think of everything. This is why this web site is so important - others who care watching your back and helping.

Larry

The wife was AWOL this afternoon. Unfortunately for my 15 year old (who was convinced there was no affair and I was to blame for the divorce just two days ago), my wife lied to her and my 15 year old is mad, unhappy, angry, and confused.

I must admit, I shared a few things with my daughter including: mom is behaving like an alcoholic or a drug addict; her lying is a symptom of the addiction; only when the affair stops will her lying stop.

I'm not sure if I went too far with my 15 year old.

HWW

15 years old is old enough to handle the situation. It will be a good life lesson for her on infidelity. And remember, you are not subjecting her to this, your WW is. She is the one destroying your family. My W still has issues from her parent's D, and that happened after she graduated high school.

I agree with Jim. Your daughter is likely old enough and mature enough to handle this.

My kids were 15 and 17 at d-day. When I confronted WW(at the time), she informed me she was going to go live with OM, whom she'd never met. I told her that this was HER decision...so SHE could explain it to the kids. When they got home from school, she sat them down in the living room and told them what was going on...they were LIVID.

NONE of them supported their mom with her choice...not at all. She'd hoped that they'd come visit her at OM's starting that summer (d-day was in May), they point blank told her that it wasn't happening, that they knew that there was no way that they'd leave me like that. They told her that the EARLIEST that they might see her would be the following May, after school let out...so she was now facing living without her kids for a whole year!

They were GREAT for bringing the reality back to her. When she tried telling them that they'd 'love OM', my oldest son told her that he'd "love to kick OM's @$$".

Don't try to 'win your daughter over', but also let your wife learn how to face the reality of her daughter's anger and upset over the whole thing. Make it clear that this is standard fallout for your wife's wayward behavior.

Hang in there.

Owl and jmwc95, thanks. Well, Marriage Builders, HNHN, and SAA has been very helpful. Last night's blow up was very interesting.

My wife became very angry at me after my 15 year confronted her. My wife was fuming, but I've gotten through my emotional flooding and I did a really good job Plan 'A'ing her anger. I think you all would have been proud. After letting things cool a bit, and also letting my kids see what a mature dad they had, I went to my wife's room to talk to her.

Boy, was she fuming. The first thing out of her was how tired she was of this whole thing. But I sat down on the floor and just talked to her. For forty minutes, I talked about things except the OM. I did ask about the OMW. My daughter told me that the OMW's cancer was back and she was dying. I asked my wife about this and my wife said, 'well they found some spots and she's in for tests'. My wife went on to say that my daughter is 'really into drama'. I chuckled to myself, but agreed with her. I hope my wife, deep down, sees the irony in that comment.

But for forty minutes, I met my wife's biggest (I'm assuming) need: conversation, and it wasn't long before I had her laughing. I couldn't believe how I could get her from absolute hatred to laughing with me.

This morning, my wife actually called me from work to just talk, and tell me some funny stories that happened to her.

I'm not reading much into this other than how MB shows how predictable the behavior is. My wife's fog is as thick as ever. I'm still working on breaking up the affair. I know we won't be able to start the rebuilding process until that happens.

One thing that I wish MB would spend more time on is the period between discovery and the end of the affair. The message board has been helpful regarding this period, but Dr. Harley's books are a little light in discussing this really tough period. I wish Dr. Harley would talk more about Plan A and Plan B than he does.

HWW

Big day. A lot has happened. After last nights strange happenings, the wife took the checkbook and started removing her financial information from the paid bills file. My attorney recommended and we obtained a status quo restraining order; that all happened while my wife and I met with the kids psychiatrist.

At the end of the discussion, the Dr. prompted me to say what was on my mind. I said, talking to the kids about the separation was difficult because of their age. The kids have a hard time understanding transitioning from a single parental unit to two separate parents. I told the Dr. in front of my wife, upon divorce I intend to separate myself physically and emotionally from my wife. I told them both that I've been talking to family, friends and my psychiatrist about this issue, and I do not intend to have any contact with my wife at all upon divorce. I told the Dr. that my children were assuming my wife and I would somehow continue to be some sort of family. The Dr. said he saw the same confusion with the kids himself. At one point, my oldest daughter started talking about planning a family vacation.

My wife became very agitated. Her fanatasy has been a big happy family fantasy from the start. She's based this fantasy on a friend of ours. She's under the impression that the friend, his new wife (OW), and his xwife all get together for family functions. My wife brought this up in front of the kid's psychiatrist. I was ready.

I said, no that's not correct. I spoke to M*** about his divorce and he has told me something very, very different then what you think has been happening in that family. M*** says that they rarely get together, and when they do, it is very painful. My wife was very angry. The Dr. began to calm the situation and the meeting ended.

After the meeting, my wife confronted me about talking to M***. She said, what are doing talking to M***. I said to my wife, you've based this divorce on what happens in that family. I wanted to understand what really happens. You should talk to M*** and find out for yourself.

My wife and I went our separate ways. At some point, my wife will be informed by her attorney about the restraining order.

The rest of the night the wife was fuming. She would not speak to me. I think she will now try to ignore me. I have been candid with her and calm. My attorney sent me the response to the divorce complaint to review. We will begin to start moving the process and asking for my wife to move out of the house (Plan B). I've also been advised to put my out-state job search on hold.

More to come today, I'm very sure.

HWW

Things are really happening fast. I spoke to my older daughter about breaking up the affair. I shared with her why mom is still in the affair and how we will be able to tell when the relationship is truely over (we'll see depression in the wife).

Need advice please. I feel like I need to write my wife a note. I feel like I need to tell her something like this:

"Wife,

I know you are not feeling any love for me. I know you feel as though it is impossible to set aside your resentments toward me and rediscover love for me, but I want you to know that I believe otherwise. I believe this because the difficulties we are having in our marriage are difficulties that many couples have experienced.

Despite the hopeless feelings, the impossiblity, and the resentments, these couples in fact have been able to learn how these things have happened. They have been able to learn how to meet each other's emotional needs, and from that fall more in love with each other than at any time in their life together.

I want you to know that I love you and I continue to want to recover our love and our marriage.

HWW"

It sounds like you handled all of that perfectly!!! WTG!

I wouldn't write her the note tho...in her current state of mind, it will do no good other than make her angry. Simply remain CALM for the next few days. As a matter of fact, be HAPPY. Be loving and kind and caring, and act like nothing's going on at all. This is HER stress right now, not yours. Let HER feel it...and let her see YOU as the calm spot in the middle of the storm.

Its likely to be a good way to attract her back to you in a way. That calm, 'got a plan' demeanor is something that many women appreciate. Even when they don't want to.

Owl, thanks. In SAA, Dr. Harley talks about sending notes and talking on the phone (pg. 77 Plan A), but I agree. It's probably a better idea to let some time pass.

The wife is so certain it's over and unrecoverable.

Oh, also this morning the wife couldn't ignore me. We traded a few "housekeeping" comments back and forth then she stormed off, only to turn around and come back to say one more thing to me.

It was, "it's up to you whether you want to make this easy on yourself or not".

Not much I could say to that threat. I just thought to myself, 'go to work; talk to your attorney; you've got a restraining order waiting for you'.

REALLY MEANS:

Which is what she's REALLY asking for here...she's wanting a 'get out of jail free' card. She wants to end your marriage because she doesn't see any way for her to remain married after what she's done...because she thinks that you'll never forgive her.

My wife felt much the same way. I continually told her that things WERE recoverable, but it all hinged on her making the choice to DO it. She insisted that things would never be the same between us again, that "too much has happened". She was RIGHT...things aren't the same. They're a heck of a lot BETTER now that we've learned all these lessons.

Simply reply back to her that "easy isn't always better, or right". You love her, and you're going to fight for her, and fight to save your marriage. It might not be easy, but its better, its the way you want to live, and its the kind of person you are. You're not giving up, on her, on yourself, or on your marriage. If that's 'harder', well, that's the way its gonna be then.

Feel free to steal any of that that you need in your response to her! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

I think she's more full of accumulated resentments than this fear; that's my wife's problem.


Thanks. I guess it's also a matter of timing too. As my previous post indicated, I was thinking of writing her a little note, but I think I'll wait a bit.

HWW

I'm sure you've seen this around here

remember,

you are sending the message that after divorce you don't intend to be friends or communicate at all with her

Because:

That would be a damaging message to deliver to the children. You need to model to your children appropriate adult behavior...that when someone abuses you, you do not have to stay friends with them. That "THEY" matter. That "THEY" should escape such abuse and remain far, far away from such abuser. Children need to learn right and wrong from their parents. Your wifes behavior is wrong and you refuse to just "get along" so wife can continue living and doing wrong.

You are standing up FOR THE KIDS.


Better angle for any potential custody battle.

Further, be careful involving 15 y/o daughter to much in your plan. I have seen them flipping sides on this website many times. The allure of the cooler acting, no rules, friendly wayward is VERY TEMPTING to an adolescent. Waywards speak with a forked-tongue and can lure in the even the best child. It's OK to tell her things...just don't expect her involvement or discretion.

(I don't know if your wife has done this yet...but, if and when she gets desparate and feels like she is losing daughter...she MAY begin getting really nasty. She will rewrite EVERYTHING you've ever done to her and with her (sexually even with consent) to portray you as a vile vermon. I'd prewarn daughter about that...that as the addict begins to have the feeling of losing their fantasy...they will lash out and do/say anything to restore it. I love you, your mom and your brothers...this family. I've not been perfect but I've always been there for YOU all and will continue to be....just be careful and it is OKAY for you to remove yourself from such situations. I guess the biggest difference is likely, to ME...YOU matter. You won't get that feeling from her...in this current wayward state)

Sorry...kinda rambling.

Mr. Wondering

Thanks. That's a great idea. Things are moving so fast that the above will probably happen soon. I'll have a chance to say these things to her in just a few minutes when I pick her up.

HWW

WOW . . . WOW

The wife was just informed about the restraining order and she is going nuts.

I was calm and careful in what I said to her, but that made her even angrier! If it wasn't for MB, I would have lost it.

My wife is being forced to deal with reality. Phew! That was ugly, ugly, ugly. I hope she can settle down before she comes home. I really don't want this displayed in front of the children.

HWW

Allow your attorney to be the fall guy.

YOU don't discuss divorce, settlement, separation, restraining orders ONLY reconciliation and the family.

You told your attorney to protect your interests and that you wanted as little involvement in the process as possible.

HE thought the RO was a good idea and HE did it.


You can indicate..."Man...I don't know understand why he did that..I'll have to speak with him tomorrow about all this"

You play nice and make your attorney the monster...your attorney won't care.

Then tomorrow you say..."I called him and he just said it was for the best...he was respecting my wish to not be involved by not divulging WHY it was the best...just that it was, he's quite the jerk, I guess...but, I certainly have no choice but to trust him right now. I KNOW he's on my side"

Mr. W

Sounds like matter colliding with anti-matter. or is it fantasy colliding with reality.

Sounds like you are in a better place now. Protect yourself and family first and let the WW feel the pressure. Couple of days ago, she was in fantasy heaven - doesn't sound like she is not as happy now.

This is good btw from Mr W

MrW-

You and I don't agree often, but I REALLY like your suggestion on how to deal with the fallout of this. Smart...very, very smart!

His lawyer won't care one way or another, and it takes the 'heat' off of him somewhat. And STILL lets her suffer the consequences of her actions.

HWW-

You an REO fan? Sounds like time for one of their classics...get the headphones, crank up the volume, and listen to "Ridin' the Storm Out" a couple of hundred times. That's all you need to do for right now. Ride the storm out, protect your family and yourself, and let things go like they need to. It's one more thing that brings the reality home to her that you're NOT willing to let her destroy your family. DO NOT EVER APOLOGIZE for this...simply let it ride and be up front that this is happening as a result of HER actions, and nothing more.

Going nuts is good. It is fantasy clashing with reality, and she doesn't want that to happen. She's pissed that she can no longer manipulate you to get what she wants, and she desperately wants to continue living in fantasy land. She was planning on never having to leave fantasy land while obtaining the divorce from you and being with OM. This was not part of her plan, and she doesn't know where to go from here.