BB, have already thought of contacting the medium myself but if she is as reputable as she is supposed to be I don't think she'd agree.

Orchid, I completely agree. I emailed WH before I saw your reply and said much the same as you suggested with a few other things thrown in. Wh then called me and said that my response was not what he expected but couldn't say what he thought I would say.

For several minutes he just listened as I calmly told him that I could only go by what I saw with my own eyes. That I don't think he's happy, that if he was that sure of his choices why does he need to see a psychic? Oh and I also threw in the comment about yes I wanted him to be ecstatically happy so that I knew it was worth all the pain.

Also restated that I'm as stubborn as he is and I'm not prepared to give up that easily on our M. Wh just listened, didn't argue back at all.

He sent me another email yesterday saying that he wants to talk about DD's (as their behaviour and happiness has seriously been affected by all this) and money. Apparently DD's are his main priority but I replied obviously not as if they were he would never have left.

I think he's going to ask again about letting DD's meet OW, how many times have we got to go thru this? It is seriously pi$$ing me off! I will give him my usual answer, I mean, how can meeting the person who has caused them and their mother untold sadness be helpful to them?

We need to get the money issue sorted tho. I think he is going to have to give me alot more than he expects. Our mortgage has just gone up by about 25%! Plus a large chunk of it was taken out for WH to start his business. And the money I receive in benefits is not a lot. He's going to have a bit of a shock!

We'll be able to renegotiate once I've finished training and can start earning money but this may prove difficult as I'll be well into plan B by then. I guess I'll cross that bridge when I come to it.

I've often read on other posts about how you'll know that your ready for plan B as your heart and your head will be in sync. Well, I think I finally feel like that today. I've felt very calm and almost serene and even said out loud "I do not need him". I don't know where it came from and surprised myself so had to say it again and I still felt OK.

I think I've had a breakthrough (hooray for me!).

Well, am off to see a friend to share a bottle or two and have a good girly chat.

Tarnsy

Went to my friends on Thurs and her H was there for the 1st part of the evening who is also a friend of WH. He was ready to not have anymore to do with WH but I asked that he keep in contact with him as WH talks to him and it's a way for me to find out whats going on in A land.

Friends H told me that OW is giving WH lots of earache over not being allowed to meet DD's (what a shame!!) so I expect thats going to be brought up again. I'm going to keep saying no so hopefully she'll LB more and more and dig herself a nice big hole!

How's this for a laugh?! WH dropped off DD's on Fri just as I'd got out of the bath to get ready for a night out. WH knew that I had been out the night before and that I also had a friends hen night on the sat. He said "three nights out on the trot? Anyone would think you were young, free and single!"

I think my jaw hit the ground! He's the one who has walked out on his family responsibilities to shack up with OW and he accuses me of acting like I'm single! Replied that yes, I suppose I am but it wasn't thru choice.

I also got the where are you going, who with and - get this - what are you wearing?! Told WH that he never asked me that when we were together, he said that was because he would be going out with me. He didn't drop the subject and said "are you wearing something nice then?" to which I just said "yes". I'll let his imagination get to work on what I wore but I definitely scrubbed up well!lol

As he left he kept looking at me and smiling and then he laughed to himself. Asked him what he was laughing at but he just mouthed something which I couldn't work out. DD8 then came running out to give WH a kiss before he left and I'll probably never know what thought came into his mind that was so funny.

Am finding each day this week a little more difficult than the one before as what would have been our 17th anniversary on sat looms closer.

I know its to be expected and I've already been thru other 1st anniversaries but this one is a little harder to bear. Knowing that WH will be with OW on our special day tears me apart.

Myself and DD's will be at a wedding of all things so at least I'll have an excuse to be in tears! My (gay) friend was coming with me but he has let me down so I'll have to rely on DD's to help me get thru the day.

Anyway, WH told me on sunday to make sure DD's would be ready for him to pick up at 9.30 on monday. Replied that it wasn't his day to have them but he'd assumed that as it was a public holiday they would be with him as he's had them all the other holidays.

Reminded him that this was not the case, he has only had them for 2 public holidays this year and 1 of those was the weekend he was here and was also the day he broke up with OW. Also said it would be nice to be asked instead of told but agreed to let DD's go with WH as it was to see family who they don't get to see very often.

When he came to pick them up he asked me what I had planned so told him that I was going shopping to buy myself a drop dead gorgeous outfit for the wedding as there was going to be lots of single men there! Then I looked him in the eyes and said or perhaps I'll be a b*tch and go for a married man instead! (Of course I would never do that!) WH didn't have an answer for that. I've been waiting ages to say something like that and he handed it to me on a plate. Everything comes to those who wait.

Tarnsy,


That is really tough. During his A, my FWH spent our anniversary at a romantic B&B with OW. I just didn't know it until d-day since I was out of town on a business trip. We still don't celebrate our anniversary and things tend to be just a tad tense around the date.

Are you still planning on starting your plan B soon?

Who

Who,

It never ceases to amaze me how thoughtless WS's are! How do they justify it to themselves?

Yes, I think everything is in place for plan B, WH will be here later to discuss monies (if he remembers) but I think I need an extra kick up the butt to give me the push I need to go thru with the PBL.

I keep seeing glimpses of H and it just makes it tougher to take that final step and end all contact with him, but I guess I just have to look at the long term benefits, either a recovered M or a more peaceful, happier me.

Tarnsy,

Well they certainly stop thinking with their brains!

I think some WS are just plain stubborn too. If they admit to themselves just how absurd their own behavior is, then the FOG starts to clear and you get the glimpses of the real person in there.

It is a double edged sword for WS though, because if they allow themselves to really see how horrible their actions really are, then the guilt hits them hard and fast.

Like I have said before, I have no personal experience with Plan B, but it makes perfect sense that it brings some peace to the BS. In know that it was mostly hard just to look at my FWH after d-day without thinking about the betrayal and what he had done. At times, I actually felt bitter hatred towards him, and he wasn't even actively in an A by that point.

Stay strong. You are going to get some resolution....one way or the other.

Who

Well, got thru what would have been our 17th wedding anniversary yesterday fairly unscathed. Being at a good friends wedding and having to listen to the vows was difficult and the tears came then but I managed to not fall apart completely.

DD's were well behaved and supportive as I had warned them that mum may be a little emotional and tearful, it helped to just have them with me.

Received a TM from WH before the wedding saying "just wanted to say to you and the girls to have a good day at the wedding." No mention of our anniversary (not that I was expecting it but it would have been nice) and I decided not to respond.

WH TM'd again at 10pm saying "hope you and the girls are having a good time, give them a kiss from me." Showed the message to DD13 who replied to WH, "shouldn't you be the one giving mum a kiss since it's your anniversary?! She would if she wasn't busy with the bar man!" To which WH replied, "that's good. Are you and DD8 having fun? Hope so."

I'd just like to make it clear that I was NOT "busy" with the barman altho he was very good looking and just the type I go for looks wise but I was only looking and definitely not touching! But it was nice to know that I am at least still capable of fancying somebody other than WH!

WH tm'd on sunday to tell me that I hadn't replied to his tm's the previous day! Did he really expect me to?

Yesterday (monday) I'm pretty sure I saw him drive past on his way to work altho there are other routes he could take. He also sent a tm before 9am to tell me his plans for DD's. At 9.30 he knocked at the door but I didn't answer as I was about to get in the bath. He then called to say he had tried to drop off some pic's for DD's.

I called him back to tell him why I didn't answer the door and he said "I nearly came round the back, good job I didn't then." Asked why and he said that he'd have given me a fright.

We spoke about the wedding I'd attended and asked why I hadn't responded to his tm's. Told him it was because I didn't want to. He said that the tm's were a subtext for other things he didn't know how to say. He didn't elaborate on what the subtext may be so once again I'm left wondering what he meant.

Apparently he had a terrible weekend, didn't go out and kept himself to himself and played a computer game to keep his mind off things. I said "to keep your mind off reality" to which he replied "yeah, I didn't want to think about stuff."

He then came round to drop off the pic's for DD's altho he could have waited till he picked them up later as per schedule.

When he came to pick up DD's later he informed me that our mortgage is going up even more than we thought and that he doesn't know where he is going to find another £200 a mth. Told him that he knew this would happen and that if he didn't have 2 houses to pay for it wouldn't be so much of a problem. Wh wouldn't discuss it in front of DD's so he is coming round tonight to go thru our finances.

My question is this, should I give him the response of "see my solicitor, I only talk reconciliation" or do I get this sorted myself as I am so near to plan B?

Plus, why does he keep giving me glimmers of hope that he may be regretting what he has done (from the tm's and phone call we had) and then take it all back hours later when the consequences of his actions (financial) start taking effect?

tarnsy,

Just checking in to say hi. Sounds like you are doing well. Better than your WH actually. IMHO, I think plan B is going to kick him in the shorts becasue he really appears to NEED the connection to you. Whatever OW is providing, she obviously isn't covering all his most important needs.

Take care,

Who

Hello tarnsy,
About whether to settle the money matters before going into Plan B, my guess is to do it, so that your Plan B can be more effective. When you discuss the payments, tell him you are not giving up on the marriage, but that you want to square things away "for now".

To tell him to talk to your solicitor would run up a large bill; those guys are expensive. However, I WOULD say "Once we have discussed this I must run it by my solicitor for his opinion." And do it.

Because it is better to find anything that might cost YOU money in the short or long run ahead of time, rather than bring the problem to solicitor once it has come up.

There also might be tax implications; you need to discuss that with your solicitor.

Once that is worked out, you will be ready for a Plan B that will remove one big excuse for him to be contacting you, and one big headache from whomever your go-between is. You want to make their job easier; so as not to impose on them or burn them out.

No hints to him about what is coming. SLAM. He receives your Plan B letter. Shock and awe. [post drafts on the Boards for input]

Then, as you turn out the lights and go into a dark Plan B, you won't be hassled for instance when you are at a neighborhood gathering, sitting in church, or playing board games with your girls. HE on the other hand will be pacing the floor, frustrated as heck that you are holding firm. Your go-between can tell him "The matter of the mortgage etc. is settled and tarnsy will not call you or speak to you. Read your Plan B letter. It spells out for you the way back home and back to your marriage."

The OW will have to be his venting board. It will bore and irritate her not to be the center of is attention. OR, she will forbid him to talk about it, and he will bottle it up.

She won't meet his emotional needs, and you will be completely dark. Sounds like a good path. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

Well WH came in when he dropped off DD's and asked if he could take his collection of game cards. I'd packed them into a box with more of his belongings months ago which is still sitting in my bedroom. I'd previously told him that I wouldn't help him to collect any of his belongings as I didn't want to facilitate his moving out so WH offered to get them himself. I declined the offer as I didn't want him in my bedroom when I have almost managed to exorcise the memories of it being our bedroom.

WH pointed out that he only wanted his cards, nothing else.

WH was about to leave when I reminded him that he'd wanted to discuss our finances. Told him that I was willing to contribute to household bills but until my training is finished I can't afford much. He is of the opinion that I should be willing to take on any job so that he can decrease the amount he has to pay each month.

I told him that I was not willing to change my plans and that it's up to me what job I take. I spent most of M life doing a job I didn't enjoy so now I'm doing what I want.

WH has been more than generous with his money but as I told him that is all he has been generous with. We'd rather have him than his money.

He spouted a couple of things that I believe came straight from OW. Apparently he knows someone who only pays £*** a month, from his description this is not someone I know and the situation was different to ours. He also compared us to a friend of mine who left her H for OM but yet again he chose to ignore the different scenario.

WH has been talking about reducing the amount he pays for months now but seems unwilling to do anything about it. He arranges times when he says we will discuss it and then forgets about it. This is also true when it comes to talking about DD's, he will say in an email that the sitch needs to change ie: meeting OW and then not mention it. My guess is that OW gives him grief about sorting these things out.

Tarnsy,

Well, FWIW, he is already demonstrating how much he can afford to give you. I believe that he may not be successful in reducing the amount when he has cleary been able to pay so far.

Who

Yep, yep, he is going along in classic cakeeater style. He leaves out crumbs for you to keep you begging for more, and probably does the same with the OW. Why would he want anything different in this situation? He has the love and attention of two women!

My word, hinting that if you tm he back he was going to say more...puhleeeeze...it probably would have been more vague comments, inuendos...he is not ready to commit because he's got it too good...a wife and a girlfriend...

Yes, Plan B will shake this up.

Please promise you will move to Plan B before he gets too entrenched in this lifestyle, and you lose too much more love for him...

Can you do it? No, but you can't afford NOT to do it...unless you are willing to live this existence for the next few years...

The A WILL end...do you want months of hurt before this happens to the point where you are bitter, hurt, and angry? Or do you want to remove yourself and let the A die a natural and ugly death without you getting dragged into it, and take care of yourself for the next few months so you have energy left for recovery?

Ok, WH just brought DD's back home and again complained about the cost of taking them out and not being able to take them to OW's house.

Went over the same ole stuff about DD's not wanting to meet OW and that he needs to find things to do that don't cost money when he said "I don't know if this will put your mind at rest but this is probably going to mean the end of my relationship."

Replied that I hope he isn't blaming me and DD's.

Wh also restated that he will never marry OW. Asked him what he wants to happen in the future and he couldn't reply.

He will be here again tomorrow to take DD's out so I suppose my question is should I say anything more or let the subject drop? Should I still continue with plan B or hang on if his R with OW is already on the rocks?

Tarnsy,


Well, I guess that depends on your state of mind right now. What if he goes back and forth for several months trying to decide what he wants to do? Can you afford (emotionally) to have this torment in your life for much longer?

Honestly, something to remember is that ending the affair and getting WH back home is important, very important, but it is just the FIRST step toward recovery.

IMHO, you need to save some love and get some peace of mind because the roller coaster will continue to some degree even after he comes home.

I didn't experience having my FWH living with the OW or even having the A ongoing while I knew about it and I can tell you, finding recovery was pure He!! for me.

My instinct tells me that if things aren't going well with OW, the added stress of not having those needs met by OW that you are currently meeting might just hasten the end of the A.

JMHO,

Who

"Bump" for Tarnsy.

You OK?

Who

Hi Tarnsy,

Haven't read your whole thread yet or posted to you before....but will soon.

Ace

(Thanks for the heads up, Who...and for caring.)

Thx for the bump Who. I'm ok, pretty good in fact.

Hi Ace, thx for taking the time to look at my thread. I have seen lots of your posts and look forward to hearing your take on my sitch.

Quick update - Sunday (day after WH came out with "this might mean the end of my relationship") WH arrived to pick up DD's looking pi$$ed off. Could have been because of residual feelings from the previous nights convo or something else, who knows?

As I made up a cup of tea I suggested to WH that he put the Grand Prix on the tv whilst he wait for DD's. This caused him to laugh as I loathed the amount of time that WH devoted to the GP. WH commented that I never said that when we were together, told him that this was part of the new me.

He ended up staying for about 1 1/2hrs watching the GP and explaining things to me about rules and such like. DD13 decided that she didn't want to go out with WH and DD8 and she and I had a bit of a disagreement about this as she expects to do only the things that she enjoys (which usually cost £££) and doesn't want to do things that others may want to do.

It was a pretty typical teenage daughter versus mum altercation which got a little loud so WH intervened and told her off for shouting at me. It was good to not have to deal with DD13 on my own for a change and I think I may have scored a few points with WH as we often clashed when it came to disciplning DD's, I thought he was too strict and he thought I was too soft. In fact, DD13 brought this up and said that I used to stick up for her. I replied that she was right but that I'd realised my mistake in not showing a united front with WH and this was something I was hoping to rectify.

Anyway, WH and DD8 went out and DD13 stayed home with me, all friends again.

WH and DD8 returned about 3 hours later having had a good time at the cultural event at the local park. I had recorded the rest of the GP for WH so suggested that he stop to watch it.

WH perched himself on the edge of the sofa looking decidedly uncomfortable and watched the race whilst I carried on cooking a lovely roast dinner and DD's were in and out doing their stuff. I was going to ask WH to stop for dinner but BIL called needing the car (they currently share) so WH left once the race finished. All in all, he was here about 3 hours.

I have to add here that DD13 made a great comment to WH. Somehow we'd got onto the subject of DD13 wedding (a long way off, I hope!) when she said "I want to make a rule about my wedding - SHE is not allowed to come, it's my day and I don't want HER there". Obviously she meant OW. WH knew exactly who she was talking about and just stood there looking a bit sheepish. Yay for DD13!!

Will be back later as WH had his reading with the medium yesterday so have more to tell but got to go prepare dinner now.

Tarnsy

WH had his tarot reading with a medium on Tuesday and told me some of what she said. Overall he gave her 75% for accuracy.

She told him that he had a daughter of 14 (nearly right, she is 14 on Sunday!) but no mention of DD8(!)

She said that he had been through a period of loss and sadness and had let other people influence his thinking but no longer let this happen.

She asked him if it made sense that she could see 3 objects in a triangle. He was one at the top and there were 2 other people. You'll love this bit, she said he was a "fence sitter" and that he plodded along not wanting to make decisions! How spooky is that?!

She also said that he didn't really know me, that I put up barriers, which is true and is one of the things that I have been working on. But she did say that I had changed a lot and that I really loved him.

She told him that although he loved me, he wasn't in love with me but she made no mention of the fact that we were separated. She then told him that the cards signifying his future represented family and contentment.

So, all in all, I'm glad he went. I did have my reservations about it but I don't think I could have asked for a better reading for WH from my POV.

WH and I met up today to buy DD13's birthday present, he was only going to give me his share of the money but ended up coming with me to buy it. I asked WH "what did your adultery partner think about you going to a medium?" he replied "She doesn't know I went." I had wondered if he'd told her, now I'll have to find out the reason why he didn't.

WH said he's remembered some more of what the medium had said but laughingly said that he couldn't tell me. He did say that the next three months is going to be a time of mourning, not necessarily literally, so I'll just hope that that means his withdrawal from OW!

As WH drove me home he commented that he'd had a very pleasant morning, told him I did too. Who knows, maybe the fog is starting to lift!

tarnsy, good progress in blowing the fog away. DD14's comment had its effect, you can be sure, and whatever prompted him to visit a medium would have to do with him not being certain of his path. And he confides this in you, hmm, you, not "the love of his life", but you, mother of his daughters, his Wife! Things in fogland are crumbling.