F-26,

Is there a thread of yours I could read? I searched your name but nothing came up.

thx

Tarnsy

I never did do a profile.

I just did a search on myself (faithful26) and found my old post.

I didn't know about Marriage Builders while hubby and I where seperated but found it after he came home.

Is it worth it all? Is HE worth it all? Can we ever get past all of this?

These are all valid questions, and you are wise to think them through carefully. It IS possible to recover, fully, and have a better M. Many people have done that very thing. There is hope. Now is the time for YOU to decide what you want. Often times we spend too much time worrying about what the WS wants, and how can we make sure that he wants us.

Take time, now, to consider that you can decide what you want to do with your life.
For me – when my WS first left, I was devastated and would have done anything to bring him back. Absolutely anything. nice he said that OW liked to swear. You name it.

But as time went by – and he showed no signs of returning, I was able to look back over the 18 years of our M and recall that he was never a great H. I admit that I was not the perfect W – but I wasn’t all bad either. I certainly wasn’t the demon he made me out to be. Whiel we were M, I knew that I was putting up with a lot of his bad behavior, but I would have stayed with him forever, because that is what you are supposed to do.

But as time went by, I began to realize that I was better off without him. My home was peaceful. The boys and I were enjoying ourselves more.

So I never went to plan B. I stayed in plan A until I was finally done with him – and then I filed for D. I have NO regrets. I did what was best for me and my boys.
BUT – I do wish I had done a plan B. Not necessarily to save the M – I don’t know that it would have in my case. But it would have given my WH one last chance to see what life would be like after the D. He honestly thought that we would get a D and everything would be just fine. We would be friends, and we could both go to Christmas dinner at his parents home, and everything would be fine. He would marry OW, and some day I would find a new H, and the 4 of us would be great friends. But that is just not the case. When you have been through all of this crap – you do not maintain a friendship with your Ex. He did not understand that. I understood it, but didn’t really verbalize that to him until after the D. I guess I tried to be nice until after the D was final, and then I let him know that we would co-parent the kids, but we would not be friends. (when I started dating my new H, my ex even tried to invite us to go out to dinner with him and OW#2)

If I were going to say that I had any regrets – it is just that I could have done a plan B, to show him the reality of what he was asking for. He wanted the D, kept talking about it. I could have shown him the reality of it, just to give him one last chance to change his mind. But I waited too long, and I had no love left for him at all.

If you are ever going to do Plan B, it has to be now. You are losing your love for him, rapidly. You will start to hate him after awhile. And then it will be too late.

One other thing about plan B – he needs to see exactly what life is like, without you, so he does not do any of that fence sitting crap when he does return. The poster above says that she never did plan B. her WH returned and sat on the fence for a year. You can avoid that – if you give him a swift kick in the pants right now. Do a solid plan B, and do not budge until he meets ALL the requirements. That way, he will know what will happen to him if he does not give up this crap for ever.

I guess what I am saying is this:
1. search your heart. Is this the man you want to spend the rest of your life with? Why? If you were meeting him right now, for the first time, would you be interested in him? OR, do you just want him back because it seems like the easier way. You don’t want the OW to have him, and it would be easier to stay with him.

2. If you decide that he is the man you want to be married to – then take the necessary steps NOW to build a good foundation. Letting him come and go as he pleases is destroying your self esteem, and respect. He will do that forever if you let him. Is that the role model you want to show your girls?

Tarnsy – it is time to make a decision, and stick with it.
His A will NOT last – not a chance. So please quit worrying about that skank ho, and get to work.

WoF

Hey while I do agree with alot of what you posted above and perhaps you are right that if I had given him a "swift kick in the pants" he may not of fence sat for a year, but you do not know that neither do I.Things are rarely that black and white. Each person and relationship is different. But I did know that in my situation a true hands off plan B would have not worked. As a matter of fact in my case that would have been the end of my marriage.

There is no formula, no one size fits all when dealing with an affair. Each person has to find their own way, I just wanted to add my 2cents as support to Tarnsy and not to try to tell anyone what they should or should not do. F-26

WOF5,

Wise words as ever!

You have given me much to think about and lots of questions that I need to look deep inside myself for the answers to.

I will go over all the posts again at the weekend. DD14 and I are now about to have a girly night in front of the tv as the new series of Ugly Betty starts here tonight. We both loved the first series so we have looked forward to it starting again for a while!

Have a good weekend

Tarnsy

Plan B was for ME!
it helped me figure out what I wanted.
it gave me peace of mind.
my FWH says he thought we could be friends too...till I set him straight about NOT remaining a part of his life.
give him a dose of reality to clear out his fogginess.
at first, he may enjoy the distance, but eventually, there will be cracks in his & OW's relationship due to her inability to meet those needs you are now meeting.
it took a couple of months, but my FWH realized what he would be losing and tells me that he missed me so much and could not imagine life without me.
give him a preview of the consequences of his choices.
it will be the eye-opener he needs.

hugs,
cgw

Tarnsy

I'm not here to give advice, just perspective.

My D-day was 4/8. Was in Plan A until 6/27 when WH announced that he was leaving to move in with OW. He has been there ever since.

F-26 is right when she says that each relationship is different and for some situations Plan B may be the fast track to Plan D.

I will only say this: Plan A nearly killed my spirit. I felt like an idiot trying to save my M when my WH made it clear each day that all he wanted was to be with OW without interference from me. So when he left, I was relieved in many ways.

In Plan B I have found a true measure of peace. As much as I miss my WH(or to be honest--the person I thought he was) I'll take this loneliness any day over the agony I felt while he was here with me and longing for another woman, and the rage I felt each time he disrespected me as his wife.

Plan B has also given me an opportunity to look at our M objectively and to see the good and bad parts for what they were. Bottom line: while my WH has many good qualities, at base he was immature, weak, self-centered and lazy. These traits were present long before he had the A, and I saw them clearly but I chose to overlook them because I loved him, because I made vows to him which said "for better or for worse".

But now that it seems I will have my freedom in the summer of 2008 (I don't think my WH will come home even if he breaks up with OW and I don't want him back), I can say that I look forward to the chance to be with a man that I can respect and who wants to share love and life with me as a true partner. And I'm using this time to be a better me -- for the family and friends I have now, and for the relationships (romantic or not) that I'll have later.

When they say God works in mysterious ways, it's true...

Pray and focus for guidance. Then do whatever is best for you and your children. I'm pulling for you.

Smartie

SP - this statement describes what I discovered about my WxH exactly. Especially when you say your WH is weak. I never thought about it before, but when I read this post it suddenly hit me. Weak. That describes my WxH. And I think that is the trait that convinced me that he would never be 100% faithful to anyone. His weakness would always take over.

Well spoken.

Will reply to all the previous posts in a while.

In the meantime, I have become increasingly concerned with DD's over the last few weeks. DD14 seems to be sliding into depression. It's a struggle to get her to go to school and when she is home she doesn't want to do anything other than sit indoors with her laptop. I have tried to get her to start a new hobby (she's done just about everything in the past but has never found anything to stick at) but she says nothing interests her. She even refused my offer of having friends over for a sleepover. She describes it as "not feeling herself".

DD8 has been getting violent with myself and with DD14. It culminated at the weekend with her hitting me in the face with a rolled up newspaper. She gets very angry at the slightest thing (usually when she can't have or do what she wants) resulting in her shouting, screaming, hitting and kicking. I have tried "time-out" in her bedroom, she just screams louder and kicks the door. I tried putting her on the naughty step, only for her to kick that door too.

As I have been struggling with these situations for a few weeks now I decided to get in contact with my C who I saw after Dday and for the next few months. She has much experience in dealing with children of D'd/S'd parents and she has agreed to take on DD's. DD14 will see her first in 2 weeks.

I would just like some opinions on what the effect of plan B may have on DD's at this point. They are both going thru a lot of turmoil at the moment (I believe because of the current sitch with WH i.e him spending time here), will plan B ease that or make it worse?

thx in advance

To answer whether Plan B will stress your DDs more or help them, I don't know the answer.

They are suffering with the sitch your H has created. They are behaving the way you are feeling. They don't have the life experience or maturity to hold it together. Nice of your WH, to leave this in his wake.

Maybe Plan A with its mixed message - Dad is going out with another woman, he's moved out, yet he hangs out here - what the heck is going on? is making the girls crazy. Good Lord, he is selfish!

Tarnsy,

Good to see you still around, I have been on a cruise for the past week. It looks to me like your DD's are suffering because they, like you are uncertain as to what the future will bring.

Right now, unfortunately, your WH isn't really considering how confusing this is for them. I guess if it were me, I would have to just ask him if he ever has any intention of either coming home or just moving forward with a divorce.

I don't know if this is wise, and others here will have more valid ideas, but perhaps you should discuss plan B with your DD14. Explain the reasons for doing it and see if she will support you in it.

Every situation is different, but this lengthly plan A has probably run it's course. Your DD's could be learning that BW's just have to sit back and take the kind of behavior your WH is showing, and that isn't good.

Please take care.

Who

Tarnsy..

How are you and your daughters doing?

I've been worried about you, please let us know how you are doing ok??

F-26

Tarnsy,

Ditto that sentiment. Please check in and let us know that you are OK.

Who

Thx for the concern.

Have kept away from the boards to try to clear my head and focus on myself and DD's. I often find that I get a bit wrapped up in other peoples situations, especially those that are on a similar time frame to me, and it's difficult not to compare problems. Of course this often helps but at this juncture I need to be sure of what I'm thinking and feeling.

DD14 had her 1st session with the counsellor this week and by all accounts it went well. The C spent most of the time talking about DD's problems at school (clash of personalities with a tutor) and her lack of motivation to take up hobbies and to socialise with her peers. She has given her a couple of things to do before she see's her again in a fortnight. I think she'll gain DD's confidence before she tackles more sensitive subjects.

WH has continued cake eating. He has progressed to kissing me on the lips when he leaves and has said that he won't apologise for doing so. He has also stated that I have several feathers in my cap but has not elaborated on what they may be. Altho he did say that it would take him too long to list them. There has also been lots of sexual innuendo.

WH came with me to take DD14 to her C session and I took him a lunch to eat as he had come straight from a meeting. This was a deliberate Plan A attempt which WH commented on.

We also had a 1/2 hour conversation on the phone yesterday. WH called to talk about DD's C session which ultimately turned to a convo about our current sitch. WH actually stated for the 1st time that he took 100% responsibility for his decision to have an A. This is a big step for him as he has until now stated it was 50% my fault due to the state of our relationship.

I have lurked here a couple of times over the last couple of weeks and had seen a post (from Mr.W I think) about 31 reasons to end your affair. I happened to mention the article to WH on the phone and he asked me to email it to him! I haven't done so as yet as I'm of the belief that he shouldn't need someone else to give him reasons to do something that he should already know to do. If however he asks again, I will send it.

So, to summise, nothing but mixed messages again from WH and I find my patience wearing thin. I know, I should have gone to plan B a long time ago, but as I approach the 1 year mark I find my head and my heart coming more in sync than they have been before. I will know when the right time is here for me and it isn't far off now.

Well, have a busy weekend ahead. DD8 has dancing in the morning and I also will be there to assist in a class. We are all going to a Halloween disco tomorrow night and on Sunday DD8 has her first dancing competition. I can't wait to see her in her new dress with her hair and makeup on strutting her stuff on the dance floor.

Thx again for all your concern and advise, please don't give up on me!
Have a good weekend

Tarnsy

Hi Tarnsy,

I am glad you have "checked in", and I understand about taking a break from the boards here. I am encouraged that
WH is starting to own his actions. I feel that I was responsible for 50% of the problems that where in our marriage but he was completely 100% responsible for going outside the marriage and having an affair

As you stated I believe you will do what you need to do for your daughters and you. Its a hard place to be.

Hope DD8 had a good time at her dance,, keep us posted on how you are doing ok??
F-26

Tarnsy,

Glad to hear that you are OK. I've been on holiday with FWH to Saint Maarten for a week and the only place we could get a wireless signal was the hotel lobby so I decided it was too much trouble to even check my email.

Just wanted you to know that I'm still here routing for you.

Best,

Who

Tarnsy:

Send your WH the 31 reasons.

What if he reads it and decides to come home repentant? Good right?

What if he never reads it and nothing happens? Status quo.

What if he reads it and gets angry with you? So.

So, two out of three ain't bad.

He asked you to send it, so, send it.

And if you DON'T want to get kissed on the lips, THEN DO NOT LET HIM.

Plan A does not state that you have to give up your self-respect.

LG

"Bump" for Tarnsy ...

Are you still around? Just wondering how you are doing.

Who

bump again, thinking of you and your girls.

Hello everyone. Thought I'd better pop in to say Merry Christmas to everyone here who has taken the time to give me their support and advice over the months. It has been very much appreciated and I have learnt and continue to learn alot.

While I'm here I'll give you an update on the sitch. Nothing has changed. WH is still cake eating, flirting with me even though he still cohabits with the OW. He even admits to fence sitting!

Although I have been asking him for weeks what his plans were for seeing DD's over the xmas period he always replied that he hadn't had time to think about it. Until last week when he went straight to DD14 to tell her that the only time he could see them would be xmas eve IF they went to the ho's house!

As you can imagine I was not pleased! Firstly because he went behind my back and spoke directly to DD's and secondly because it gave them no option to see their dad other than if they went to her house. Also, he knows that we have special xmas eve traditions that we wont be able to fulfill if DD's are not at home.

DD14 came to me and said that although she is not happy that she has to go to the ho's house, she really wants to see her dad and this will be her only chance. I spoke to DD8 who is even more reluctant to meet the OW and she is happy to go for the same reason.

When I spoke to WH about this, it eventually emerged that OW has manipulated the sitch so that this is the only time that WH and DD's can see each other. I told him I was very disappointed in him for allowing us - including his children - to be controlled in this way. I had told him that I was happy for him to have DD's Boxing day as long as she wouldn't be there but she has made plans for WH that day. So, I have been forced into a corner, the children have been used to get to me and to allow a meeting between them and OW.

This has forced me to come to my senses and I plan to give WH my plan B letter on xmas eve. I had previously told him that I had forgiven him his A, I had forgiven him leaving his family and I had even forgiven him moving in with the OW, but I could not forgive him for bringing another person into our DD's lives.

So plan B it is. A last attempt into forcing WH into coming to his senses and a chance for me to get out of the triangle that has become my life. I know that it is long overdue although I have to say that my lovebank has not depleted as much as I thought it would! And hopefully, as an added bonus, because of the timing I think that it will put a damper on WH and OW's xmas! Oh dear, what a shame!

Once again, merry Christmas and a big thankyou to all who have bothered to add their insights especially WoF5, Who, Ace, Bellevue, faithful and everyone else.

I'll start to drop in more frequently as I'm sure that I will need lots of support while in plan B

Many thanks

tarsny

PS thanks for dropping in LG, I have seen many of your posts on other threads and you always have such insight. I hope you'll drop in again.