ok, if you really want to continue this...

i see no discrepancy Melody. The question to MrsW was not about you. It was about my perception to a situation that did in fact include you.

i hope that clears things up for you.

editted to attempt to make it even clearer for you.

Did you read your question? Let's read the question together and see if it was about me or not:


Perhaps you meant someone else named Melody on this board? Was that question about this OTHER Melody?

FLT2H...

If you'd like my opinion on this...


Here it is...

The way that question was worded it certainly *seemed* that you were trying to mitigate your behavior based on the behavior of another...NOT a good idea, IMO...In truth, it reminded me of what I used to do as a kid about my brother to my mom or dad...as an attempt to take the "heat" off of me...In all sincerity and honesty I do think that warrants an apology from you to ML...Again, just my opinion...

Mrs. W

Humbleness, IME, is very healing and good for the soul...

Mrs. W

i left computer for a while to hang with kids....

the question you and Melody are quoting, did not stand alone, it was coupled with another very important followup quesion. am i not being objective?

why is it that the second question gets overlooked so much?

Mrs.W. i respect your opinion, however, in this case, I do not share it.

I did not ask you to explain to me why her behavior was any better than mine, i.e. 2 wrongs therefore making a right or anything like that.

i was seeking an opinion, an objective opinion. one to hold up next to mine.

i said exactly what i meant to say. it was a sincere question. and the concluding question "am i not looking at this objectively enough" says EXACTLY what i was focusing on.

i have tried to clarify myself, she continues to want to judge me as she does. not under my control.

I do believe not making DJs is something Dr. Harley higly recommends.

Yes, but Dr. Harley is refering to filling someone's lovebank when he talks of DJs...ML is NOT trying to fill your lovebank or anyone else's here FLT2H, and I know that you aren't either...That really is moot...

As for the other deal, I guess I'm just not following you then-I seriously don't understand what you are asking...<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" />

Mrs. W

oh, did someone DJ you, FLTH?

"i seriously don't understand what you are asking"

if by that you mean, the question "why is it that the second question gets overlooked so much?"

what i was saying is this. I did not only post the question asking you what you thought of melody's behavior, i also asked you, "am i not being objective enough?"

true or false??

and yet the first question, what do you think about melody's behavoir, is what is being soley focused on. even after i try to continue to comunicate that i was looking at myself and my perspective and wondering if i was not being objective enough.

if i followed up the question about melody's behavior with something like, "how is mine any different?" or if i had asked the question about melody on it's own without saying/asking anything else, then it would of been understandable that for someone to conclude i was trying to defend my behavior by trying to compare it to hers.

but that is not what i did.

i don't understand why this has been such a difficult series of post here tonight but at this point, it so does not matter to me anymore.

editted to add:
fyi, i am off to bed, i have to be to work early. good-night.

What in the world did she just say? <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/crazy.gif" alt="" />

*scratches head and shrugs* Perhaps I'm dense, but I still don't get it...No kidding...<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" />

Mrs. W

I have to admit when I first started reading this I was a little chicken to post here, I don't want anyone to think I am taking their thread or getting in anything personal here.
I have not been on this forum very long and everyone has been wonderful and helped me so much.

Since there are some WS's here I would very much like to ask some questions since it was brought up on this thread.

My H does feel like he wears the scarlet letter and everyone is looking at him.

I am really not sure how to handle this, sometimes he is so distraught about what he did that he just hangs his head. I don't want to hug him and tell him its ok nor do I want to rub it in.

H say he is sorry constantly, almost to the point that I don't want to hear it anymore. I feel like I am moving past it and H is stuck.

Is this something that WS's do in the begining?

He has been told by the counselor that he is no longer allowed to use victim statements, and also no longer allowed to use "bad boy" statements.

H is on anti-depressents and seems more distraught then I am about things, I really am doingfine.

I hope I am not intruding on this thread, I really am sincere with my questions.

DF- In my experience with my wife, it took her a long time to get over the whole "scarlet letter" thing. I think the more they strayed from their values, the harder the time they have of it in recovery eventually when they really do get it.

WHY do you not want to comfort your husband? That is just punishing him. He doesn't need your punishment does he? Is he doing everything possible to repair your marriage? If he is then you need to cut him some slack.

OR will the beatings stop when morale improves?

DF.. I agree that the severity of the infractions has a lot to do witht the ability to forgive oneself. I also want to point out that my ex was not able to forgive herself until she came fully clean about her deeds...and I wonder if those that remain stuck in this self loathing do not still have some horrible secrets that they are holding on to....for mine it was the fact that my then 7 year old walked in on her persorming a sex act for her "friend."

So, perhaps he is stuck for a reason. I would just flat out ask the question. If he has come totally clean I would say that your taking a somewhat neutral position might be okay...but it could benefit him to know that you have forgiven him and that he needs to do the same. Let him know that his continued beating himself is keeping this affair alive in your lives...if it is truly time to move past this into recovery, you cannot accomplish that with your H living in the past.

DF,

I am a FWS who was stuck for a very long time and felt I deserved to wear a Scarlet letter. That all changed for me when I accepted the fact that even though I did a really bad thing, I am NOT a bad person.

I felt the A would define who I was for the rest of my life, what I forgot to think about was I was a really great person for 38 years and that wasn't all erased by one bad thing.

Since your H has had multiple A's it will probably be harder. Has his therapist introduced him to Cognitive Behavioral Therapy? Once I learned how to apply CBT to my life I became unstuck and was able to move forward.

From you signature it appears his A's were long ago, is that correct? If so, secrets take a toll whether people believe it or not. He has a huge hurdle to get over if he had kept a secret for that long. Keeping the secret for 15 months almost killed me, I can't imagine keeping it as long as he did, if that is the case.

He did this to himself it is his responsibility to work his issues out. Therapy is a great place to start that process.

LC

BK, No, I am not about repeated punishments. I did move out with every intention of filing for D. All I wanted was the truth after all these years. I knew of one A, but did not know about all the others. I always knew something wasent' right. I am not discounting 17 yrs of H being a decent H, although H can and has been very spiteful over the years about many things and I never understood until recently when I finally called H out. I just don't want to comfort H when he is so sad for what he did, I do tell him that it dosen't make him a bad person just that H had no boundries and was selfish. H seems to no longer be that person. H is working harder then anyone I have seen to "fix" the hurt he has caused. I just think that there should be a happy medium on the comforting. The MC said that one day H would realize all that he did and H would fall apart and that is what is happening. Just not sure how to comfort without saying its ok, or walking away and saying ha ha told you so, there must be something I can say that dosen't completely let H off the hook about how hurt I am.

MEDC,
H swears he has come clean, infact he swore on my kids lives. Believe me I do not for a moment think that if H is lying that something will happen to my kids, but at the same time if there is a lie I am liable to beat H into a bloody mess if he is. H has done nothing but lie with every step of the way. H has never ever had a confession only admissions with interrogation, coercion, and threats. H constantly shoots himself in the foot every step of the way. has an admission then takes it back.

Lifechoice,
Yes this was a long time ago. With the last gossip of an A years ago, never was I sure until recently, I told him that he could go on like it is and be single or do things my way, (quit playing music in clubs) and stay married. I tried to do the counseling thing years ago, he lied there to. With the last change of events we went to counseling again, he lied for 6 months. I gave him a choice back in Jan. tell the truth or I will leave and H can be single, he continued to lie, and I knew it to the core of my soul. I left, H has now come clean,maybe? will I always be leary?, still, not without lies the whole way.

Its been very difficult to say the least. I ask myself daily why I am doing this? why did I come back. I did, I came back because I do love H, do not want to throw away 25 yrs. H is not an evil nasty person. H has lots of friends, people that look up to him, H is smart and generous, H now sees how selfish and disrespectful he has been to me. We still go to counseling, as far as I know h is truthful there and here.

FLH,

I understand your post to mean that why is it MrsW and Mel won't answer your question, and yet continue to ask you theirs?

Don't answer. It's gaslighting. Understand this. Read Larry's threads on it. Your honest question as to your own perspective, because you understood ML doing what you were doing, only you got edited.

You own what you did...seems to me you're saying that's not in your code. You don't do this...name call...put down others in an effort to control...mock, define and bulldoze over.

I say that's a fine code. What you won't do to others, you won't do to yourself.

Understand that others do not have this in their code. And understand, what they do to you, they do to themselves.

Own just your half...if ML doesn't get it...that's her half. If MrsW thinks she's dense, then understand that's hers. Doesn't mean you aren't communicating clearly.

And remember there is projection...where we see in others what is in ourselves...catches our interest, our attention. And what we see may not be in the other person...just in ourselves.

You can't make someone else hold to your own code. Even those you admired, respected, gave great weight to what they advised...because like FCF said, we don't really know them...they don't really know us.

You can ignore their questions, too, FLH. My post, anyone's. Doesn't make you bad or wrong. In fact, I think that's what MrsW was advising from the Capitan's thread...ignore ML. She has her own advise, her own way, her own code. We can't change it.

LA

Edited to move my question to DF's thread.

LC

DF, I started another theead as to not TJ here.