Tony,

You haven't answered anyone's questions about where the chidlrens' father is. How come?

Because there are three kids involved, that you have been living with, and this girl sounds like a mess, the posters here might be willing to help you repair this relationship.

I would be if you were willing and able to bring some stability into these kid's life...because I love kids, and she sounds like she is a very poor mom, at least right now. You say she said she is in pain and partying is the only thing that numbs it, or something like that. My first reaction is tough chit! You have three little ones relying on you, and guess what? Your pain doesn't matter anymore. But it is what it is, and she appararently was raised different than me. Maybe she is in pain though, but why?

What I want to know, is are you any more worthy than her to be in these kids' life? How so?

Why do you want to be with this woman, and how would it benefit her kids if you are?

There is such a thing as responsibility. You are an adult and you have a responsibility to not cause more harm. You have a responsibility to kids just like all of us do.

Are either one of you responsible adults? Usually around here we are dealing with the stable one, but in this case, I really can't tell if it is you or not. You are talking like a very young guy, not someone who is almost 30.

Those are all justified questions, i just really havnt had the time to really sit down and try to answer them.. i'll try to shed some light on it now

the children, they are 11, 7 , and 4 . the 2 oldest are boys , the youngest is a girl . there are 3 different fathers involeved here.. ( i know red flag) ,but i have chosen to just judge her on what happeend in the past. my girl has freely admitted to me she made mistakes and didnt learn from them.

the 11 year old.. his dad has primary custody of him , but he is still with his mother quite a bit too. his dad is the most active out of the 3 , and isnt really a bad guy at all, sends him to private school , and gets him what he needs, they both admit , they were young and dumb ,and they have tried to work together for the kids sake

the 7 year old. his dad doenst have custody. but gets visitation when he wants it.. but the kid is generally with mom, his dad isnt really that great , and doenst put that much effort into the kid, and generally doesnt keep up with his child support payments

the 4 year old.. she is the toughest one of all , has some mental issues ( diagnosed with PTSD, and ADD, and extreme separation anxiety) her father is not in the picture ( he developed mental issues after her birth) , and has since been in a psych hospital most of the time. the little girl is currently not living with her mother on Dr's orders untill they can try to work on the lil girls mental issues, she is staying with a family friend,but still sees her mother at least once a day , they tried brining her home recently , and it didnt work , so she is back with the family friend

she is a good mother.. she does things with the kids.. even though it might leave her without things she wants , she does her best to keep the kids happy.

im not going to say im father of the year or anything.. im still very much learing how to deal with the kids.. they all like me a lot , and from what she says its a very good thing. i try the best i can to do things with them/ for them . and try to cultivate a good relationship with them.

I know that if the both of us are commited to working together , and keeping us together.. that the kids would be able to have their needs met , and exceeded , and have a loving family structure right now

as for why she is drinking like this.. i dont know.. i think its partially she doenst like what her life has become (this she has told me) , she has again lost her daughter living in her house ( through no fault of her own , it just wasnt working) lost me living there, lost a job that she needed .. thats a lot to deal with in a short time span. without somone to be there with her through this , i can see how drinking can be an attractive option, though it is not the right one for her or her kids.

when she wants to go out and do this.. usually the boys are at their dad's , or with a babysitter friend of hers. again not the best for the kids.. but its her choice right now , and i believe at the bar is where this possible affair of hers started.

i hope this answers some of the questions.. i'll do my best to update when i can .

The - escape...drinking because she doesn't like how her life is going - is a very poor reason and one I would also say points to an affair even more.... Maybe she has guilt for lying to you which is helping her to feel badly and want to escape...run away from her problems with alcohol.

She is not being a good mom by going out drinking so frequently and she is certainly not marriage material for you.

If I was your mom I'd be none to happy with your choice of girlfriend. You can do better. Actually, with all her excuses you seem to be buying....I'd say you need to take a good look at your priorities in life so that when you do meet a nice/good woman you will be Mr. Right...a man of honor and character who knows right from wrong. You current girlfriend is ALL WRONG.

I feel sorry for her kids....having her for their mom. Sad.

Ouch, the white knight syndrome. Yeachhhhhhh.

Look, you cannot save someone from themselves. Yea, I know, guys really wanna try. It gives us a woody saving damsels in distress. Well, lemme tell you, the broad you are dealing with is distressed because of her choices and she will continue to not learn from her mistakes.

You can't save her. Don't even try.

Run.

Larry

I'm giving you a whack upside the head for getting involved with this woman in the first place. I, like you, was a "fixer," always attracted to women who were flawed because I thought I could save them. Trust me, it's a lot easier to find your own woman without all the baggage. Here's a newsflash. You have self esteem issues and think that you can't get any better. Wrong. You are a good guy and will do just fine. Be a little smarter about who you involve yourself with next time.

If you were old enough, you would get this allusion to a Nancy Sinatra song.....

These boots were made for walking
And that's just what they'll do
One of these days these boots are gonna
Walk all over you

Right now, it seems like that's what your wgf is doing.....

Now, you should pay attention to the last line of the song. Get out your own boots, put them on, and say to them....."OK, boots, start walking!!!"

Then, tell her she has 1 month in which to get the utilities and apartment into her own name. Then, tell her she has one month to get the car in her own name.

Then, get follow the the advice from "Forrest Gump", [color:"red"]Run, Forrest, Run!!!![/color]

I think this says it all. Are you looking to become father # 4 if she gets pregnant? How would you know that YOU would be the father or perhaps its the OM.

You better start listening to everyone who is providing you with advice here. Emotionally it sounds like its hard for you to give up. Stop thinking with your little head and start thinking with your real head. You will regret not getting out of this mess if you do not do it NOW.

I feel sorry for her because she IS messed up but its YOU asking for help in this forum, NOT HER.

AB

well i did finally take some advice from the boards here.. basically told her last night (after she blew me off to go drinking yet again) that i just cant do this anymore.. its taking a huge emotional and mental toll on me , esp. when im wondering when im gonna get that phone call that her drunk driving has killed herself or someone else.

after talking for a while, i did realize that its not that she is trying to push me away and out of her life , its that she is so messed up right now , says her life is falling apart around her, and the only time she feels somewhat good , is when she is drunk. and with no one around her telling her what she is doing is wrong, besides me, she sees no harm from her actions . beside the fact she is blowing what little money she had saved at the bar every night.

her life is spiraling out of control right now , and i cant stop it , ifeel bad for her, and the kids, but there is nothing i can do. looks like she is goin through a nervous breakdown and just not caring what the results are at all.

its just sad as ****** when you see someone that you care about so much , so out of control , and knowing its only a matter of time, before she gets herself a DUI , or gets herself or someone else hurt or killed.

Hey Razor,

Yes, this is a very sad situation. But there is something you can do... You can get your car back, you can turn off the utilities to the apartment, you can cancel your lease, and you can run away as fast as you can!

You are financially tied to this woman and she is going to bankrupt you if you let this continue. You will be paying for a car that you no longer have because she's either wrecked it or stopped making the payments on it and it's been repossessed... you'll have $300-$500/month cell phone bills every month (I'd LOVE for someone to pay for my cell phone bill with no strings attached!)... Your credit will be trashed because you failed to pay your utility bills... the list goes on and on.

I know that at one point you cared for this woman and probably still do... but if you don't wake up and smell the coffee, you're going to be in a world of financial hurt... And I haven't even addressed the social/moral issues with her three kids... that in and of itself is saddest part of this story. You don't need to be "Daddy #4" to these kids.

Get out while you still can and let this woman crash... until she crashes on her own, she's going to continue to find men that will 'support' her and will not learn from her bad choices.

Semper Fi,

RIF

call the police nd discuss her drunk driving before she kills someone.

The kindest thing you could do for her is what MEDC advised. Call the cops and tell them she goes drunk driving. That way they can pick her up and toss her in jail for drunk driving. Jail is great medicine for a drunk. It also protects society. Maybe that will motivate her to sober up and start being a real mother to those children.

If you do in fact love her, Tony, you will do what these people are advising. It's called tough love, and it often works.

You have put your self on the end of of a crazy making puppeteer. And then you wonder why you are doing the crazy dance.

People can and often do change, but sometimes we have to give them a reason to. When we stop enabling them, and dancing on the ends of the strings they are thrashing around, it gets their attention.

She is capable of being a stable, loving mother and wife, but probably only if she hooks up with people who expect nothing less of her.

I was once in a foster home because of drug use as a young teen. There was a guy who was related to and lived at the farm next to my foster family who didn't do drugs, who was an achiever at school and popular with all the kids. He used to stop by and talk to me when I was doing my chores in the barn. I really liked him but he had said right up front and I believed him, that he would never date anyone who did drugs or hung out with druggies. I ended up cleaning up my act, because I wanted to be a part of his life and his crowd. I had had enough of the partying life (already and I wasn't even 17), also because I missed my family so much. My family did the tough love thing on me, plus I had a guy who wouldn't lower his standards to go out with me. I ended up dating him for 4 years and never went back to drug use, also went back to high school and got very good grades, and then college.

Tough love works, Tony. And you have a responsibility, as the others have said.

If she is that bad, you should look on line in your areas for help. Try social services, crisis intervention or something similar. You might be on the wrong track but I bet if you explain your situation, they would make recommendations for who to call. Advice on this board is great but it does not solve the issues you are going through. It's easy for us to sit here and say "cancel the credit card, take back the car" etc. You and your W (especially her) needs professional advice. You need to act before she hurts herself and possibly those who love her too.

Go NOW and do a search for crisis intervention.

Not tomorrow. Not after breakfast. NOW!!!!!!

AB

Alphabeta,


FYI. This woman IS NOT his wife, she is his girlfriend. Her 3 children have three different fathers, and Razor is father to none of them. I don't know if she was ever married to any of them.

Get the picture more clearly now?

Who

Razor,

I read your thread and find it very sad on many levels.

The calls for tough love are dead on.

You certainly have White Night syndrome, just as I did many years ago. Your ex sounds like an ex of mine. Her patter of boyfriends says a great deal. You will never make this woman happy.

My ex went through stages and phazes just like yours. Everything seemed fine, but in reality wasn't. My ex had 2 marriages when I met her, and she was 19. I was going to be number 3. I am a good guy with a good career. Stable. Boring to her.

She left me and shacked up with husband number 3 and an abuser. She left him and sought me out again. I fell for it and tried again. Luckily I saw the light and bailed. She is now on husband number 4. She's unhappy with him and has called me on occasion, fishing for a EN.

This is what you need to do. Sell your clunker and keep the new one.

Contact the dads and let them know you're dumping her and that they need to take the kids. Call her mom or dad for the youngest and tell them what's going to happen.

Once they're squared away and taken care of, throw her out. The apartment is in your name.

You're not going to save or change this woman. She's going to beg and plead when you finally man up and make her face reality. You're the best thing she's got going for her. You're being used.

I have been in your shoes. My life would have been a disaster if I continued to meet women like this. You have no kids.

Don't ruin your own credit. Take care of yourself. You're not responsible for these kids.

She's running around drinking and wasting money on alohol and pot and you're struggling to support her and her family. Seriously, why do you settle for being treated like crap?

So it's been two years, so what? Be greatful you're still young and dump her like a hot potato.

This sounds harsh and in some ways it's tragic. You're being held hostage by guilt but you have nothing to be guilty about. She only SEEMED normal for 2 years. Her relationship history shows she's anything but.

It's never going to get better, not on her own. She likely has a personality disorder. She sounds so much like my ex it's scary. Don't go down this road or one day you will really regret it. Setup the kids to be taken care of and then dump her and tell her to never contact you again.

Yes, it will hurt. Breaking up always does. But you will find someone new and better if you change your pattern of searching for damsels in distress.

Trust me, the very things that make bad girls exciting are the same things which make them bad. Believe me, good girls are exciting as well and so much better in the long term.

Dump her and come back here to learn about relationships and how to make them strong.

Years from now you will look back on this and want to smack yourself for allowing someone to treat you this way.

We speak tough here, but have often been in your shoes. It's almost like being able to talk to ourselves several years ago, wanting to impart our wisdom gained in hind sight. That's where a lot of advice comes from.

Good luck, but bail!

Good post Brokendreams, very well said, and with such kindness, too.

<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

And do yourself a huge favor; never have SF with her, ever again. If she gets the idea you are about to break up, she will "accidentally" get pregnant to trap you. I'd be willing to bet she has done it before.

A few more thoughts to add:

You need to understand that she will freak if she sees that you're really serious about dumping her.

How do I know? I've been in your shoes.

Look, I had ANOTHER ex that I was seeking to be White Night for. I had this mentality of "can't you see how well I treat you? Can't you see how you don't have to suffer or struggle but simply be with me and all will be fine?"

I did that with more than one woman. If she had a psycho ex in jail, or huge debt, I was there. I had one that was heavily into drugs (I didn't know it) and that I wanted to live with.

It lasted one month. I got wise and saw I was being used. I gave her an ultimatum, thinking it would make her say, "I'm not going to be talked to that way! I'm leaving."

Guess what? She didn't say that and changed her attitude and was suddenly nice.

Guess who is the strong one in your situation? Guess who stands more to lose when you man up?

This isn't to manipulate her into waking up. It's to illustrate how you have much more strength in this than you realize.

You will not save her and can't and she will use you as long as you let her. Don't let it happen.

And for the record, I still dumped her after the change in attitude. We're very good friends now, but she acknowledges she was a wreck then.

Dump her! Go to IC after you do so.

hey everyone thanks for all the info and advice.. the past 24 hrs or so has been prob. the worst that i have gone through. we tried to make it all work out and fix the problems we had.. or so i thought.

about 3:30 am on monday morning.. she called me to let me know she was ok and on her way home. at the same time talking about an orange mustang that i guess was a friend of hers messin with her on the road , told me she loved me and we'd talk later on in the day.

i called her from my work desk (different number than she is used to cause i was at a different site) and she just sounded off.. almost like you can tell when u catch them in the act. anyway at that point i decided to take my lunch and head to my normal site, in the same town that she lives in now.

as i drove by the house ... there are 2 cars in the driveway , her car , and in front of that , an orange mustang.. at this point i know what was going on. i kinda lost it for a while and proceded to drive by again her open kitchen windows and let her know i was there ( my GTO is quite loud.. and its noticble when im revvin the ****** outta it 10 feet away) she calls me saying whats the matter.. and we just yelled back and forth , not really getting anywhere..she swears its just a friend, and nothing is going on.. but i know its more than that.

eventually i left.. but returned again shortly to confront her.. only she wasnt there.. the same mustang was.. but she (and her "friend) wouldnt come back to the house untill l left..

we fought over the phone for the rest of the day..and i left work early.. i just too wound up to be there..

once i calmed down , we text messaged back and forth a lil bit.. she still is adamant about not having a man. and he is just a friend of hers.. just saying her life is so messed up right now , she cant have this intense relationship we had going on , and try to be a mother to her kids and all that..saying she is very sorry to hurt me , and didnt mean to , but didnt know how to do it any other way.. just telling me she couldnt see me suffer while her life is so messed up , that i deserve better .. but she wants to sit down and talk , face to face tomorow . and just work things out and maybe give some closure to this...

i dont know.. i know its a long hard road ahead of me. and its gonna take time to feel like myself again.. i have had almost 2 years of my life of never being alone..now i am.. i need to get my friends back. and my life back..

i dont know what the future will bring.. wills he fix herself and come back after some time away.. or is it truly over and i need to find another... i want the love and companionship of a girl right now.. but i dont even know if thats somthing i can handle right now...

thanks again everyone.. though i had been preparing myself for this.. i never thought it would happen like this..and it still hit me like a ton of bricks.

Hey Razor,

Typical WS psyco-babble... she's definitely giving you the brush off!

What have you done to protect your financial assets and get yourself OUT of this situation???

I wouldn't go talk with her for "closure"... get your stuff back and cancel everything that you can before you're paying for some other GUY to live in the apartment that you're paying for and driving the car that you're paying for and using the electricity that you're paying for...

She's found herself someone that makes her "feel" good and as long as you continue to care for her financially, she's going to let you!

I'm sorry that it turned out this way, but she's using you big time! Run away and don't look back...

Semper Fi,

RIF