It's been so long since I've been here, I couldn't figure out where the reply button was on your last thread. Until I figured out it had been locked. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" />

That is the point. When this board started, there weren't moderators. And we had no where near the level of stuff going on here. It's just not conducive to saving marriages...


1. Darn good---thanks for asking! I'm doing different, interesting stuff at work. It's been over 10 years since I first gave Steve H that call asking for help. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> Hard to believe... Mentally, I haven't aged a bit. I wish someone would tell my hamstrings that...

2. Family is great. Oldest starts college next year. The youngest is soon to be 9... Time flies!

3. Tractor is great---had fun scraping ice off the driveway last night. Gotta love the rural life. We've collected livestock since we've last chatted (goats, horses...)

I guess your point was well taken. 2x4's---how's that working for you??? <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/pfft.gif" alt="" />

K and DeWayne,

I hope you'll allow me to jump in here and wish you both a VERY MERRY CHRISTMAS and HAPPY NEW YEAR!

I'm not around here much and I heard about JL, so wrote on his thread in GQ...

... my mistake was taking a look at other stuff going on... and BOY OH BOY... I sound like an old fuddy-duddy, but dang, things sure ain't what they used to be around these parts, are they?

Anyway, I only logged in to say howdy... Take care, men!

Merry Christmas to you too---NB. I hope things are going well for you.

And yes, I'm feeling very old myself...

Tractor rides all around!

Wow K, it's so good to hear from you. I hope things are well at your house.

In all the important ways.

You sound happy, and that at least is good.

SS

HP, K, NB, SS,

Wow, I'm starting to feel like a newbie again. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

Howzit? Miss you all. Got a few scars....blazin' battle wounds. LOL!!! Healing ok. You guys and MB taught me to be tough.... or is that just old age?!?!?! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/eek.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

So K's got horses and goats? Kewl! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" /> We've got geckos, centipedes and wild boars.... what a combo. Guess that's better than the snakehead fish.

http://www.dnr.state.md.us/fisheries/fishingreport/snakehead.html

<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/eek.gif" alt="" /> Found this in the news.... spooky.

I went back and read some threads from the year I signed on..... wow..... so much has changed. Wish you all could come back and help again. Ok, just wishful thinking but a girl can wish right? <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

all the best,
L.

Hey K,
Yeah, part of the problem is that the drive-by troll thing is a real problem. It's gotten worse in most of the internet communities lately. There are a lot more people here now than the early days, maybe that's also part of the problem.

Anytime you gather folks, the larger the gathering, the more doofuses show up, and trolls, too. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> Also, the longer people stay here, a significant percentage starts to develop ego problems. That's not good either.

I'm very glad your life has settled into a "happy", hectic pace. You certainly deserve it. Everytime we see the alpaca commercials on TV, it spurs me a little more to give it all up and move to the country where I was born and raised. I'm not a very good city feller.

I think there were a few replies on my thread that gave wings to my thesis. Bob Pure had just discussed how when he was disagreed with, miscreants started trying to stick him with false attributions...then a few replies later, someone attempted it on me...Pretty funny in a way.

==================
Hi NB(HB-II or NB-The Sequel)!!!

When I was thinking about JL yesterday, I remembered that time when you challenged him as to why he was here! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> I think it was back in '99. It all worked out in the end wonderfully, but looking back it was humorous!

I believe your assessment of the current state is accurate! Hope life is treating you well, or at least, fairly.

================================

Hey Orchid,
There's a treasure trove of info in those archives for anyone with the initiative to look. Glad you're doing well.

I don't see a real need to come back in any continuing sense. There's a enough savvy vets here now. The 'noise factor' of the self-inflated can cause reception problems, but adding to one side or the other will just increase the white noise.

=========================
Merry Christmas, Happy Holidays, Happy Hanukkah or whatever applicable to y'all!

It's always nice to see the old gang show up...

Merry Christmas to everyone!

Merry Christmas to you too !!

And to everyone else !!!

K, I hope you have worked through everything, and that you have smoother sailing these days. I always admired your willingness to work on it......... and I hope God has blessed you with the help you needed.

SS

SS---

I know what you're hinting at, and the answer is "d'oh." Some streaks are too good to end <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/pfft.gif" alt="" /> But God has blessed me in so many ways, I wouldn't dare complain (much)!

I wouldn't dare complain (much)!

You never did complain much - not since I came on board anyway. Thanks for coming by and saying "HI". It's good to hear from you.

......... words fail me. I have been sitting here trying to think of what else to say..... but the right words won't come.
The thanks is genuine though, you were an inspiration to me. I still think of you from time to time, and hope things continue to improve for you, and yours.

SS

It's good to have been a help and inspiration. We've all done some good work here over the years. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Orchid is still at it, and just as good as she always was. I have been slacking off lately.

Come round from time to time, and tell us how it is. I (for one) would love to hear from you.

SS

Aloha Peppermint!!!

Howzit? Were your ears burning? I was reading through some real old posts and thinking 'bout cha the other day. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

Aloha,
L.

Hi Peppermint,

I hope you and Firestorm are well. Wishing you joyous holidays.

Jo

Wow! 31 years! "Thank you" to the Harleys!!!!

Please give Firestorm my best hon.

Love,
Jo

Hi all!!

What a great get-together! So nice to see old familiar names. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Yes, I'm STILL here,,reading alot but seldom posting. I can't help it. I love to see the miracles happen and they still do--so many of them. Goes to show, that thanks to the Harley's, this is still the best "infidelity" site around. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Glad to hear you are all doing well. We are married 38 years now and looking at retirement.

Thank you MB!!

Hi K, Heartpain, all y'all.

When I arrived here (May 1, 2002) the board had already split into the various forums. I remember folks talking about it being "different" then, rather than just one big board to go to. I also remember some talk about the "old board" getting too big and unwieldly with everything being on one board.

All I know for certain is that I agree with what you said; "That is the point. When this board started, there weren't moderators. And we had no where near the level of stuff going on here. It's just not conducive to saving marriages..."

It's not, it would seem, "many boards" that is the problem, it's the sheer number of people, all with divergent views and beliefs, and no different that in real life, some folks are "liked" better than others and some "gravitate" to others of similar viewpoints.

But that's also a strength of the board. People CAN find others who are willing to try to help who might be more similar to themselves. Even "lively" discussion gives a lot of "anonymous" readers things to think about too, especially since nothing can be done for them until, or if, they choose to sign up and seek help for their situation.

On the "troll" front, they've always been around. There have been several attempted invasions from the TOW board over the years. The "difference" right now is that I think several folks identify them earlier and are no longer "patient" with them because they have learned the "futility" of trying to "nicely say you are wrong," and in some cases they may even "overempathize" (obviously in MY opinion) with other members that they think could be emotionally harmed by the trolls, OP's, divorced and remarried people, etc.

So it's difficult to lay "blame" on folks for "changing" the atmosphere of the system. Each person who does choose to participate and post, beyond just seeking help for themselves, is doing so as a volunteer of their time and what they believe is important in the process of ending and/or recovering marriages blasted by infidelity.

But it DOES get a "bit much" at times because it does take up a lot of time and it is easy to get one's "feelings" hurt when others disagree and begin to "take on" a "opposing" view to what we might be offering.

"Tolerance" of, and "discussion of," divergent and sometimes opposing views is healthy, in my opinion. But all too often it devolves into a shouting match (have let that happen myself over the years, especially beween WAT and me) as we allow ourselves to REACT to the feelings we have. Once that happens we lose discussion and drop into angry argument and no one benefits. Not at all unlike the reactions to infidelity that wind up "controlling" what comes out of "our" mouths. Emotion takes over reason and "wars" break out.

What, again in my humble opinion, is going on more than anything else is "restraint" and "selectivity" in posting. With as many people and threads as there are on the system, "in depth, long-term" discussions and help often wind up getting sacrificed for "blurbs" and "drive by" posting. The sense of "family," of a caring cadre of helpers, gets "lost" in the mix somewhere.

Then people leaving the system enters the mix and THEIR expertise, experience, and posting "style" is lost to the system. I understand leaving the system, I have "left" a number of times for various reasons (from not having enough time to feeling it just wasn't worth "fighting" with others anymore). But it IS loss when others, especially those who HAVE made it through recovery and successfully recovered their marriage leave the system. It's sort of like when the old professor, or group of professors, leave and their "place" is taken over by the younger firebrands. The "knowledge" of the subject may be similar, may even be the same, but the "style" and the "application" is different, perhaps even "edgier" than what "had been" before the retirements.

The "net result" of things is that the "ratio" of "older" to "newer" members has skewed and there just aren't enough of the "older" ones to go around. It's no longer the "small college" atmosphere, it's the huge "university" atmospehere. Not "good or bad," just different.

But it sure is good to see so many "oldtimers" stopping by for a visit! I miss many like HGBrawner, Lostva, SKM, Oswald, Cali, Twyla, OscartheGrouch (may he rest in peace), Twyla, TwoofaKind, Just Learning (who has just recently pulled the plug of his participation), and yes even my "arch nemesis" WAT (he and I were like oil and water too many times and contributed to the changed "tone"), and too many others to list and I apologize to any I may have failed to name, and many many more that were in my own "class of graduates to be" that I would need to list also.

They have all left, and with them the tenor and wisdom they had they offered to the "system."

There once was even another board called the MBReunion board were a lot of "old timers" gathered who were winding down their participation in MB, but who had made friendships in their time here and just wanted a place to talk that wasn't "focused" on infidelity. It, too, gradually faded away. It still exists, but very few ever visit it anymore when once it had dozens of participants, all former "MB'ers."

MB has been a wonderful field of help for so many. But as with most successful things, the field has grown in size and the "harvest" is so big, but the "workers" are so few.

I wish there was a "good answer" to the changes and the various "tonal" changes that occur, but I don't think that there is. The forces of darkness (infidels all) continue on, but at least this place offers the victims a possible shining light of hope in the midst of the oppressive darkness, a place where some will stand against the forces of darkness and refuse to "go down without a fight."

God bless all of you "knights in shining armor" who have dared to stand against the "foe."

But now I'm starting to feel young!! 31 years, Peppermint!!! Woo-hoooooo!!! My wife and I will be celebrating our 20th this upcoming year! And 38 for nerly---that's hard for me to conceive, because you were only 39 when I met you on these boards... <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> And of course, a big hi to Jo, who is still active around here (you too Orchid...)

FH---I think you're right with regards to the sheer numbers of people. In the old days, I knew practically everyone's story. Their family. The history of the problems. And I could post to each of them. It was most impressive---there were certainly over a couple hundred folks who I could do that for. Now there are so many more.

Also back then---it seems that the 'counselors' on the board had more patience, and more grounding on what made up the MB material. The internet was certainly a different place when I came here in the late 60's. (OK---maybe it was the late 90's). For example Ebay was a cool, fun safe environment to buy things and meet people. As you mention, the anonymity of the 'net tends to bring out a different side of people---and that side is really harmful on a site such as this where so many people need caring, nurturing, and guidance.


This is a great analysis. Through my years here, there was more than one time where I was accused of being a Harley 'robotron'---spouting the Bible according to Harley, or being Steve H himself. That's exactly the role I chose to play---because I had been recently immersed in the program myself, and knew the material fairly well---I thought I could help those who needed to understand the material and couldn't afford those terribly expensive fees (of $60/hr) for the phone counseling.

We had lots of very thoughtful posters who weren't necessary on board with all the MB materials, but who were respectful and thoughtful and added tremendously to the community---and you listed a bunch of them. I remember one time responding to "Laurie" (friend of HGB)---working her a little too hard, she got pretty upset. I was going though some old email last week---and to my own surprise, I realize that I had emailed her apologizing for upsetting her with some of my "MB insight".

It was more like family then. It was more community focused. And I don't remember the trolls being so difficult to handle. And I don't remember fogged-WS's getting tossed quite so readily as I see these days.


I wish there was as well. I'm hoping that the Harley's come up with a solution to this---because this place does offer so much hope during what is a very dark period in a person's life. I've spent so much time here myself in sheer gratitude for the fact that Steve picked up the phone on a very dark October night, and started me down the path of recovery. Of hope. Of light. And especially during the Advent season, it's seems very appropriate to come back and try to do this for others.

God bless you too, FH---it's good to see you here. And everyone else as well!

I haven't been around as long as many of you old geezers (just kidding I'm probably older in years than most posters)
but when I do post I tend to post in spurts for a few days, weeks, or even months... then wander off again to do other stuff.

I did want to add some more possible explanations for why some posters have higher post counts (mentioned in the locked thread):

some posters don't have to share their computer with teens who spend a lot of time online socializing with their friends LOL

some posters aren't homeschooling their kids who use the computer for educationl purposes

some posters have access to the internet at their jobs

some posters have had uninterrupted internet access (I have moved three times since I first came here and went without internet access at home for long stretches of time over the past few years... and at the library there is a time limit for signing up to the computers)

and last but not least:
some posters keep the same posting name since they first arrived (or tell us when they change their name) instead of coming back pretending to be a new poster

I also wanted to add that I admire the way ForeverHers showed so much respect and patience in his attempts to deal with the most upsetting poster I've encountered here. IMHO the gig should have been up when that poster started accusing even ForeverHers of 'abuse'. Although he was confronting her with the truth he did so in a way that should have been above approach IMHO. I commend him for having the courage to continue to try to discuss things with her even after some posters started demanding that she be 'ignored'. It was clear to me that his intentions were honest and that he was really trying to reach out to her. I didn't see the logic in why some posters continued to defend her and chastise those who saw through her ruse even after she turned on ForeverHers. IMHO at that point it was evident that there were posters on both sides of the troll debate that were more concerned about being 'right' than anything else.

K,

Thanks for posting your story on the Success Story thread.

And thanks for your lengthy post, FH. Not only does it give us Newbies/Rookies a glimpse of yesteryear, it gives me more names of folks whose stories might inspire other new MB posters.


Thanks for those names.....and if any of you posting on K's thread can cut/paste/link your story of recovery on that thread to help give newbies some hope when they first arrive it would be very helpful. Better yet....stick around and make a difference like Miss M is with her "stop your grousing and help" thread!

At any rate, thanks for at least checking in. My DH and I are still riding the rails of the recovery rollercoaster and I will depend on MB for at least another year (must cut back on posting time, however). RIF has volunteered to be the nightwatchman on the 20-90 Something Recovery Vacation thread for at least a year, so that will be helpful.

Again, thanks,
Ace