I am sorry that things didn't work out for you. I know how hard things can be. My H now is actually my 3rd H.. The first two ran around and cheated (just like the current one did) and eventually left me and my children with nothing. <P>I can tell you, though, that it does get better. If it wasn't meant to be, then you have learned what not to do when you are ready to try again. I know that you may think that you will never be ready to try again. And that may be true right now. But eventually, you will want to feel love again. <P>My H and I have had some hard times too (He's had an OW too and a baby on the way that's not mine) But we plowed through it all and are doing better now then ever before. We are probably a one in a million couple but it's true. <P>The only advice I can give is to take one day at a time and do the best you can with what you've been dealt. Things WILL get better.

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by camarinick:<BR><B>H and I went to court yesterday and the judge granted our divorce. This just proves my point that when it really comes down to it, these betrayers don't have the emotionally maturity or common sense to look their spouse in the eye, admit what they have done wrong and try to change it. My H is ambivilant toward the OW (whom he is living with)and completely unhappy with himself. It obviously is not the "pie in the sky" mentality that is seems at first. So, those of you who are sitting around, begging, pleading, waiting for your wayward spouse to reject the OP and come back to you.....don't bother. Those kind of people are only going to drag you down anyway. Do yourself a favor...stop being the victim and stand up for your rights. You can't MAKE a person want to be married. It is only a desperate last attempt to hold on to something that obviously was flawed from the beginning.<BR></B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>I have skimmed some of the other posts and see that you are in a great deal of pain. I am finding in my search for the peace you refer to in a later post that it is only found in Jesus. If you are not a Christian, please don't be offended. If you are focus on Him and He will let you know what to do.<P>If you know that God intended for you to marry your spouse then you know He will give you what is necessary to heal your marriage. We all must be cognizant of Satan's desire to tear apart families because that is how he gets you caught up in the blame game. He wants us to do that because it takes our focus off God. When that happens we end up all alone and wondering why.<P>We also must remember that we are where we are in our lives because of the choices that we make regardless of how others react to those choices. We all have to accept responsibility for what has happened to ourselves.<P>As for me, if my W wants to divorce me, it will be because she wanted to do what was solely best in her eyes as defined by the world which is under Satans influence. When you look at it from God's perspective then she would be able to see that it is not His plan that she do so. My life has mirrored the life of Hosea the prophet. God asked him to marry a harlot. Yes, I know that is a hard word but it is accurate. My W falls into that category because of what she has done and is probably continuing to do. I have chosen to do as God has directed me to do as He did with Hosea. <P>The little bit of pain that I endure for doing as He wants me to do pales in comparison to the riches He has instore for me when I get to spend the rest of eternity with Him. As for the other crowd, the pain that is experienced in this part of our existence is nothing compared to eternal torment that will be endured by those going there.<P>MONDO HUG RACHEL!!!!! I really feel your pain and go through those moments when I am in my car usually. Then He tells me that I should pray for them that they may get to know Him.<P>Besides what you have done is okay Biblically. You are the betrayed. I haven't developed a hard enough heart to leave. I go through my hard moments usually when I am by myself and sometimes when the boys are being boys (out of frustration from her telling them to do things that she doesn't do.)<BR>------------------<BR><B><I>God Bless,<BR>Rob</I></B><BR> regilmor@swbell.net <p>[This message has been edited by professorg (edited February 03, 2000).]

I don't know anymore. I could probably debate either side of this issue. I can only speak for myself though and won't presume to judge what others are doing. There is room for many approaches.<P>As I approach 17 months of separation and appear nowhere near either a divorce filing or a reconciliation, I stress the need to set limits. We all may choose to put them in different places for a variety of reasons, but I think they're needed. Whether your limit is two months, two years, or longer, you need one or you life can slip by. I just saw an old boss divorce after an 8 year separation. I can see that happening to me if I don't keep the limit I've set.<P>I am SURE that the dominant mode of thinking for people NOT in the situation of having a cheating spouse that won't stop is "divorce the bum". It's about justice, accountability, standing up for boundaries, self-respect, and consequences. It is also the way that I have successfully lived my life in the business world, where it works wonderfully.<P>Unfortunately, relationships are not business and what counts is the long term, not deviations along the way. The business model is great for winning battles and getting short term performance, but it's not oriented towards long term relationships. In that mode of thinking, the behavior of the spouse prior to the infidelity is critical in how much effort should be expended. In my case, I had a pretty good spouse who was a great father for 15 years. For two years, I've seen a lost, selfish, amoral person who is completely unlike the one I knew before. I've accepted that his behavior is aberration, and have pretty much convinced myself to wait it out, with a limit however. I waver about this constantly, but with great support (from here and friends) I've been able to keep myself safe while waiting. I HAVE NOT put my life on hold. I do everything except date, and I am not unhappy with my life.<P>Rachel, I don't fault what you've done and I'm not entirely convinced it's a worse model. Sometimes, these situations can't be turned around no matter what you do. The problem is, you don't know that it's unsalvagable until after you put in the effort. So for me, I know that when I throw in the towel (if it comes to that), there'll be no question that I did my best. Having that feeling of having done everything may not be as important to everyone. As I said before, I think a big part of my reason for feeling this way is because of what my husband was before. If he were a serial cheater, or a lousy father, or a selfish beast all along, I wouldn't have tried so hard.<P>Now that it's done with and you have closure, I predict your life will get better. There is relief in closure and I don't think it should be discounted. But please try to show more compassion towards those of us that have taken another path. It hurts to read some of the judgmental comments. I know you don't mean to hurt with the words, that you only want us to "wake-up", but that's a disrespectful judgment in Harley's terms. None of us are really in a position to judge.

Camarinick<P>My H is doing the sitting around, the begging, the pleading. He has no contact with the OW except to see the OC that this affair produced. Now the OW is avoiding him because because I demanded that my H have a DNA test done. Now for some reason my H has not been able to get in touch with the OW to see the OC-boy.<P>The bible said that when we get married, we be come one. And the marriage was ordained by God. <P>I am sure that your marriage was not flawed for the beginning. My was not and not in the 15 years I was married. <P>Your marriage was not flawed--the person you married was.<P>I wish you blessing and hope that you develop understanding in this matter.<BR>Keep the Faith, trust and believe in GOD and He will direct your path<P><BR>ITS

Rachael,<P>If I remember right (and sometimes I do get brain dead - so if I'm wrong - sorry) - your plan A was not longer than a couple of days at a time - before a selfish demand (not that it wasn't justified to demand that he choose, but it was against plan A totally) - and a good plan A requires much more than a couple of days before lovebusting.<P>Actually, plan A means NO lovebusting, which meant - NO SELFISH DEMANDS. Plan A isn't about right or wrong, plan A is about doing everything you can to help your spouse WAKE UP in their bad brain period. IT IS ABOUT NOT MAKING WITHDRAWALS.<P>Now, I am not saying you were wrong, at all. In fact, you were right, very right - dead right - er I mean divorced right.<P>We are here to rebuild our marriages. PERIOD. We are not here to be right. Right can get us divorced. <P>Which is better? To be right and divorced, or to be loving/forgiving and married.<P>That is the real question, do we want to heal our marriages or not?<P>You know, Rachael, not only did you discard plan A immediately, you refused to go to plan B as well. You didn't give an ounce of work into the Harley methods - and you don't have a right to tell anyone about how they don't work.<P>BUT, you still have the opportunity to try them. Yes, you are divorced. But, IF by some weird reason, you decide you still love your husband, the father of your children, the man that broke your heart - and want to try now the Harley methods, you will get nothing but 100% support from all of us.<P>It isn't easy to do the Harley methods. But, the FACT IS - that the success rate of restoring the marriage (we are not talking right or wrong, but we are talking about restoring marriages don't mix apples with oranges) - there is better than a 90% chance that your marriage could have been restored.<P>I am not so sure you still have those odds, this late in the game - and with your given track record of so much lovebusting after discovery, but if you still want to give it a shot - I for one, will definitely support that.<P>TNT<BR>