p.s. Vittoria gave you excellent advice! Don't get dragged into any fights and don't react to her anger. If she is raging at you, simply tell her: "I am sorry you are so upset. Would you like a potato chip?"

It is sad to hear how people let things and work in the way of maintaining the most important relationship in their life. People settle for so little in their marriages.

Funny, now that I know the back story, I would have to agree with Mel and the Harleys. This is definitely a plan A scenario. Why? Because for all intense purposes, they didn't have a marriage. BHFF basically has to court her like b4 they were married.

The fact is that men are the initiators of affection and love. And women are the initiators of communication (generally). Both partners have to be receptive to their roles in this. Men have to know when to respond to their wives need for communication (which brings them together emotionally), and be willing to talk, listen and engage their wives. Wives need to respond to the husbands need for physical love, as this is how they judge the condition of their marriages.

If I were BHFF, I would start writing her letters......Everyday. I would focus on what he likes and loves about her. The first few may be thrown in the trash. But I think eventually, she would start to look forward to them. I wouldn't even mention infidelity in the letters. They should be a refuge to deal with the hard work of counseling.

I would tell her the same thing. Write him letters. Not about infidelity but of his qualities. No bitching or complaining. At first it may only be a sentence or two. But eventually the connection would increase.

But alas, most couples are to lazy and self centered to do this.

Actually we both spoke to her, she called when we were together. And it is not that I was not working at our marriage, I just put my efforts in the wrong place, being provider, dad, etc and lost focus on the marriage.

Screen the counselor-unfortunately there are 6 in our area and this is number 2, so screening is difficult. I wanted to be in some counseling because she does talk there and I didn't want to much time going by.

Bhff, this is what I wrote on peppers thread regarding some marriages. Read the bold, italics and underlined. This was on ouch-that-hurt thread. You are my proven point.

pepper wrote in response to one of my posts, where I said some people settle.

Her question Are you including yourself into this sad group, or just others? confused

This was my response


I guess, I have to put a disclaimer like

**The author of this post recognizes his own flaws and when writing is often including himself in with others who are also married. The opinions put forth are those of the originator and do not represent the opinions of any other, and should not be attributed to anyone but him.**

We have been to counseling several times over our marriage. Our first time was about 3 years after we were married. And as a matter of fact we are in counseling right now (empty next, midlife crisis, reconnecting). We both recognize when one or both need a tune up. And we go when we want to resolve issues. Because we want more for our marriage.


Originally Posted By: Pepperband

And when you say "people settle" what precicely do you mean?Do you mean settle for what their spouse brings to the marriage, or do you mean people settle for what they themselves bring to the marriage? Or do you mean something completely different?


As marriages have two people in them, it would be both settling. Most often it is the men who don't live up to their end. They believe if they work and put food on the table, they've contributed their part. I am speaking about those who settle for a "room mate" situation when they want so much more. And yes either partner can torpedo the others desire for a better marriage.

Originally Posted By: Pepperband
Having myself been married since 1981 , I know a thing or two about long term marriage difficulties.


We had our 29th anniversary last Sunday.

Should we move this to Plan A/Plan B?

Update-Plan A is hard when everything is so fresh. I have lots of good moments, but this AM when she was getting ready for work, the cuts were reopened in my mind. What did she do? Nothing just knowing she was going there hurt. Sometimes I feel like there is no remorse, no empathy for how I am feeling. Yesterday after OMW called (WW answered) WW and OMW talked, (this was also after counseling) she seemed better more willing to talk, more willing to try to open up. She went shopping with a friend after that, (I can account for her whereabouts) she came home in a horrible mood. But the moods are not fighting, I would prefer that, they are they silent treatment. So-Plan A is hard when you are on the roller coaster.

Have you considered my suggestion on writing each other? If you start, she may follow. She is in a fog right now. She sees her marriage like a prison sentence. You need to connect with her. You have to eclipse the OM in her mind. And she needs to get a different job. Think about the writing.

BHFF,
Does this mean she is still working with OM?

If this is true, this is the first of a thousand cuts you will suffer and eventually die from.

There has to be a radical change in your WW's behavior and possible her job.

NC must be enforcible and real. If it requires your WW to quit her job, so be it. There is no " in between" here. You do understand that, right?

Please tell me that your WW is not still working with OM!!

All Blessings,
Jerry

They work together??

BHFF was told that WW needs to quit job.
Has this happened ??

You are in Plan A, no where close to Plan B yet. You can't just carry out the carrot of Plan A, and some parts of the stick. You have to do all that the stick part requires. If you commit to this you may not need Plan B.
Plan B is where your WW moves out and there is NC between you and her. There is more to it but concentrate on Plan A right now. BTW ... this all really confused me too at first.

There won't be, as long as she is in contact with OM. You can't go thru withdrawl if the source hasn't been removed. Exposure is the best tool to blasting the A apart. NC between them must follow. No exceptions.

And yes Plan A is hard.
Read the carrot and the stick again. Print if off, keep it in your pocket and read it as much as possible. Remember it is a secret from your WW.

I think he was asking if this should be moved to the Plan A/B forum. If that is the question, I would say NO. That forum is very slow and you can get more help over here.

No, she has not quit her job. But evidently things are not roses their today. I think OMW finding out has put a big crimp in things.

ooooooh kay, that makes more sense, they really did confuse me at first.

BHFF .... that was just me rambling then

A crimp is not enough. It will never be enough BHFF.
Contact with OM is M suicide.

You are screwed. Telling the OMW was a FIRST STEP, but this train is not moving until she leaves that job.

Have you exposed at work?

Can I ask why you think the OMW finding out would put a crimp in the affair when YOU finding out did not? Are you hoping that she won't be a conflict avoider too? Are you expecting HER to do the heavy lifting you wouldn't do?

How's it going BHFF? Has your wife or the OM quit yet? I know that the first week is the worst. Hope you are hanging in there. It does get better.

How have you been? How about updating us.

Sorry about my absence-
Update-I think my last post was Sunday. Trying to avoid LoveBusters and doing all right there. WW is still way mad. I asked her about it Sunday night and she says she feels trapped. She is also mad about the confrontation. She says I was trying to ruin his life. Funny huh? However Monday night she used the laptop and got on facebook and was chatting (not to him) and that brought back all of my hurt and I got pretty mad. She knew I was mad and reached out to me. That was the first time in a while. I was still mad wed morning she asked why and I had a chance to tell her why and that started an ugly day. But things cooled a little by Wed evening, no more LoveBusters, had a pleasant visit with some of my family and things were better by that night.

I still struggle with the fact that I get very little empathy in this. I think that is still part of the fog, and she is figuring out how to proceed. She is focusing on what she thinks she lost, not what she could lose. She hasn't put a lot of effort into the counselors suggestions, but I hope for change.

Interesting thing-I find anger to be a better emotion have than the others. It is more focusing, easier to keep moving with anger than all of the others. May not work for some but for me it is a better motivator, and makes for a clearer head than loss and sorrow.