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Originally Posted by Fainne78
Originally Posted by Lady_Clueless
Plexie, I'm pretty severely hearing impaired, although not totally deaf, and I think your WH needs to grow up!

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Being deaf just means that he can't hear, and maybe can't speak as hearing folks do. It shouldn't keep him from growing the heck up!

Lady_Clueless, while I do appreciate your feedback for Plexle, I feel the need to respond to these.

When we say we are deaf, what we mean is we are not just physically deaf, but also culturally deaf. We already know we can do anything except hear, that infamous quote.

I'm not sure what you mean by "culturally deaf", unless you are talking about the isolation that many of us experience....sort of being on the outside, looking in, because hearing people don't think to make sure they speak/communicate so that we can understand. I have great difficulty in noisy and large group situations, where others are talking and have their heads turned away from me. I've also experienced my family treating me like I was oh-so-fragile when I was younger. Employers tend to think that I'm not as capable of doing some things because of my hearing loss...until I outperform those without hearing loss.stickout I tend to have an "I'll show YOU a thing or two!" personality! laugh I also find it insulting when people treat me as if I'm emotionally fragile and tiptoe around so as to not hurt my feelings, simply because I can't hear well. Being deaf/hard of hearing/hearing impaired is NOT for sissies! laugh

I don't think your intent was to offend, but it seems like you relate being deaf to not being grown up. I don't think anything Plexle or I said indicated this at all. We know many fine strong 'grown up' deaf adults. We're pretty grown up ourselves too.

An adult not being "grown up" has nothing to do with whether or not he/she can hear. Plexie's WH is an adult who needs to grow up, regardless of his hearing capability.

Also, I do take issue with the words "hearing impaired". Why do you accept and use that label? It's like saying you are broken or not normal, and that is wrong. Why not "hard of hearing"?

I'm not a person who is into being politically correct. Sometimes I say "hard of hearing"; other times I say "hearing impaired". "Hearing impaired" does not mean that I am impaired; it simply means that I am hearing impaired. My hearing IS impaired, even if I am not. No offense is intended toward you, Plexie, her husband, myself, or any other hard of hearing/deaf person. I hope this clears up any misunderstanding.


"Your actions are so loud that I can't hear a word you're saying!"

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Culturally deaf: we already have our own language (American Sign Language), we have our own mannerisms, we have our own idioms, we all have common experiences, we have a deaf history, some of us even come from deaf families. We're proud to be deaf.

I know that things are easily misinterpreted or misunderstood, and that's why you have to be careful in what you say. What if I was an African American, for instance? Would you be saying things like that, using the word "black" for "deaf"? I don't think you would. In these statements, I detected a hint of Audism (discrimination against people based on their hearing level). And I've dealt with a lot of audism in my whole life so I don't think I'm imagining things here. I don't believe I am being overly sensitive here, I believe that I am seeing things for what they really are, in this case. Just like with affairs, when you see hints, symptoms, behaviors, certain wordings, you can identify it for what it is, which is someone's having an affair period.

"Hearing Impaired" is not politically correct. It's not like we haven't tried to change this. Some organizations on our behalf have put a lot of effort into getting the media and what have you to change this label. It's a horrible label, whatever you may think. No one is an impaired person. The fact that it's not really "impaired", it's "hearing impaired", just makes it worse. So we're lower than hearing people just because we don't hear like they do? It's the equivalent of the "N" word for African Americans or the "C" word for Asian Americans.

Hope that makes things more clear.

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Plexle Offline OP
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Hi Guys,

H has asked for his blackberry to be transferred to his own name/account.

H has counseling Monday.

I'm stupefied....


BW:34
WH:37
M 4 years, together 8 years
D-day of third EA with a coworker 1/6/10
PlanA 1/7-16/10
PlanB 1/17/10
~starting 16 months of grad school 1/9/10-will require class attendance 9-5 on 2 Saturdays and 2 Sundays every month
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He is going to tell his "comforatable to him" counselor whatever suits his conscience.

I hope it goes well for you. I also hope he will be told to work with the Doc H by his monday counselor

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No, in his temper tantrum letter on Wednesday (in response to my planB letter)he said that we BOTH need individual counseling.... In order to understand each other... I'm not going there because OW has him convinced that time I took his pager (because he locked it) was 'emotionally abusive'... She convinced him that my comment that should be able to share with me, the dialogues with her-means I am too 'controlling'. I cannot see where my H ends and she begins... Which says to me, he's probably still talking to her, he's still brainwashed... *sputtering*

Aside from this mucky muck, this counselor he will see is quite skilled-- I used to work with her for years and I've met people she's counseled. In fact, this counselor wrote a recommendation for my graduate school application. Immense respect--both ways, she and I. Besides, I've already filled her in... there's no getting anything by her...

I anticipate he'll look for validation and justification for his EA relationship from this counselor and when he doesn't find it he will not continue his counseling.

In reality--I'm quite aware that without counseling for his issues, our marriage doesn't stand a chance. Changing the blackberry to his name is symptom of his deeper issue and to be blatantly honest, I cannot ever really see myself trusting him again. Least not as it stands now, he's so disturbed on a deep level, I know within myself I will see a change in him when he has a genuine shift in consciousness and understanding of the gravity of the situation and his behavior....

I think we have so much less chance for recovery than normal affairs :o(


BW:34
WH:37
M 4 years, together 8 years
D-day of third EA with a coworker 1/6/10
PlanA 1/7-16/10
PlanB 1/17/10
~starting 16 months of grad school 1/9/10-will require class attendance 9-5 on 2 Saturdays and 2 Sundays every month
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where's melody? :-(


BW:34
WH:37
M 4 years, together 8 years
D-day of third EA with a coworker 1/6/10
PlanA 1/7-16/10
PlanB 1/17/10
~starting 16 months of grad school 1/9/10-will require class attendance 9-5 on 2 Saturdays and 2 Sundays every month
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Hey Plex, how are you holding up, friend?


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

Exposure 101


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Originally Posted by Plexle
...Aside from this mucky muck, this counselor he will see is quite skilled-- I used to work with her for years and I've met people she's counseled. In fact, this counselor wrote a recommendation for my graduate school application. Immense respect--both ways, she and I. Besides, I've already filled her in... there's no getting anything by her...

Yay for you, I thought I remebered that you said she was sharp. Thats good news

I anticipate he'll look for validation and justification for his EA relationship from this counselor and when he doesn't find it he will not continue his counseling.

Thats ussually the pattern. I hope that it won't happen but its to be expected

In reality--I'm quite aware that without counseling for his issues, our marriage doesn't stand a chance. Changing the blackberry to his name is symptom of his deeper issue and to be blatantly honest, I cannot ever really see myself trusting him again. Least not as it stands now, he's so disturbed on a deep level, I know within myself I will see a change in him when he has a genuine shift in consciousness and understanding of the gravity of the situation and his behavior....


You rock Plex. clap Happy that you are so able to understand and know what you need.

I think we have so much less chance for recovery than normal affairs :o(

Believe it or not this is part of why ppl have relationships outside of marriage. Even though your H is a diffent type of personality he could find a way to deal appropiatly with his emotions and with women.

Well thats my hope anyways. But you just keep taking care of Plexle

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hurray HI Melody Lane, It's so good to see you!! :o)

I went out dancing last night for the first time in years. It was SO GREAT to dance all the frustrations away from this week. It was a perfect evening with a pal. dance2 It helps that I had new jeans on (smaller size) and some new style... I felt cute... considering... lashes

I wanted to say for anybody in planb and having an IM-- if you're reading here that I had to 'coach' my IM. I had to explain that its best to give me a warning message before dropping me a line from my H. I told her to say " I have a message, please let me know when you're ready". It helps alot and I'm not caught unaware when I pick up the blackberry.

As for Saturday, I felt I needed to dance off the separation, (1 week ago today) H's request for 'permission', (I already emailed explicit directions for him to transfer his stupid blackberry to his own name on Friday, but Saturday according to the IM he wanted 'permission' * I paid for the blackberry and i'm guessing thats his issue*) Then, on top of that, came the stupid request to come here to my home and do laundry on my favorite day to stay home--Sunday! That was met with a swift and resounding 'NO'. Grrr, he still doesn't get it.... I told the IM "he needs to accept that fact that we're separated and this is not his home anymore, he can't just come in here and lay around for a few hours" the iM understands. He'll be coming tomorrow for ONE HOUR with the IM because I will already be at work, to get things. I left a message that I wanted to know about the neglected $900 oil(heat) bill. (He took 2 bills the last time he was here and I think he paid them, oil and cable) but I want details.

Inside, I have this hollow ache... This soft echo, if you will, of where the H and the pain associated with him used to reside...

I'm good generally speaking. I'm resigned to the fact that I will be alone for quite some time. That's never been my fear. I'm proud of myself for drawing a line and saying "I will not be disrespected anymore".

I feel good knowing H's counselor has all the facts going in... It's going to be hard to explain away 3 EA's. That's another thing, there's 3 in all, and he doesn't think the 2nd one was a real EA. Honestly I hope he doesn't even try to waste time justifying his wayward behavior... but in reality, I think he will.

flirt I want to thank you ML, for your help back then, when we thought we were dealing with a standard situation and you explained to me about not allowing my emotions to drive the boat. You saved me. You got me thru four FULL days of Grad school classes. You know how everything is bigger in Texas?! (I lived n Waco and happened to find God there) I'm telling you ML, your spirit is just so big, it guided me down the right path. smile

Thank you Sort, for all of your support. I really look forward to seeing you here often. I know my thread isn't interesting anymore but I really have developed this excitement of seeing ya'll around in here. hug


BW:34
WH:37
M 4 years, together 8 years
D-day of third EA with a coworker 1/6/10
PlanA 1/7-16/10
PlanB 1/17/10
~starting 16 months of grad school 1/9/10-will require class attendance 9-5 on 2 Saturdays and 2 Sundays every month
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Originally Posted by Plexle
Thank you Sort, for all of your support. I really look forward to seeing you here often. I know my thread isn't interesting anymore but I really have developed this excitement of seeing ya'll around in here. hug

twoxfour You will allways be interesting to me silly.

It has been inspirational to see you deal with this important and personal issue in your life with such clarity of mind.

Proud to have been of help and will be around for sure.


Me 56 Former BS
Widowed 5-17-09 --married 25 years.
4 children
DS-35 previous marriage--18-22 DGrandSons 6 and 4
Me former BS
DD-29 with DGDs 5 and 1yr
DSs 26 and 23
Teilhard de Chardin..“We are not human beings having a spiritual experience. We are spiritual beings having a human experience.” ...Sounds about right to me.
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Originally Posted by Plexle
Then, on top of that, came the stupid request to come here to my home and do laundry on my favorite day to stay home--Sunday! That was met with a swift and resounding 'NO'. Grrr, he still doesn't get it.... I told the IM "he needs to accept that fact that we're separated and this is not his home anymore, he can't just come in here and lay around for a few hours" the iM understands. He'll be coming tomorrow for ONE HOUR with the IM because I will already be at work, to get things. I left a message that I wanted to know about the neglected $900 oil(heat) bill. (He took 2 bills the last time he was here and I think he paid them, oil and cable) but I want details.

Hey Plexle! Glad to hear you got out and had a good time!

A few suggestions about Plan B. Please ask your IM to read this thread Intermediary Training School.

The most important thing about Plan B is that it should mimick DIVORCE in every way. That means the WS does not ever come in the house. Letting the WS in the house gives him a "FIX" which allows him to stay out even longer. It also defeats the purpose of plan B because it keeps you triggered and drawn into his web. The locks should be changed if you can't keep him out, but he should never be allowed back in your house again until he ends this affair.

I think your IM is giving you way too much information. She should not be passing on any of his messages unless it is critical information in accordance to your Plan B letter, such as the news that he has ended his affair and is recommiting to the marriage. OR, critical financial information. She should act as a SPAM filter and phrase everything in her words. About 90% of the messages a WS tries to send through, should never make it through.

If he attempts to reconcile, then she should not tell you unless she has determined that he is sincere. It is her job to protect you from any false attempts.

As far as finances, I would set this up so you can eliminate as much contact as possible. Instead of communicating about each and every bill, think of a way that can be avoided and have your IM communicate this. For example, figure out how much you need from him each month and ask him to send you a check every month on the 15th. That will wipe out the need to communicate over bills.

Because here is an important thing to remember, Plex, the more contact he has with you, the more assured he is that you are sitting on the sidelines waiting for him while he has some fun. Your odds of reconciliation go UP the darker you are. Please become OBSESSED with staying as dark as possible. And train your IM to not pass on anything to you unless it is crucial.

I am an IM for 2-3 people and even in my highest maintenance case, with 2 children, I am only passing on ONE message every 3 weeks. Anything more than that indicates a leaky Plan B that is not effective.

If your IM has any questions about what to pass on and how to deal with him, have her email me, Plex!


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

Exposure 101


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Originally Posted by Plexle
Then, on top of that, came the stupid request to come here to my home and do laundry on my favorite day to stay home--Sunday! That was met with a swift and resounding 'NO'. Grrr, he still doesn't get it.... I told the IM "he needs to accept that fact that we're separated and this is not his home anymore, he can't just come in here and lay around for a few hours" the iM understands.

In this case, the IM could have told him he can't come in and just not tell you about the communication. This way she acts as a SPAM FILTER and protects you from any contact. I only tell my BS' when there is pertinent information or sometimes I will just tell her/him that the WS has tried to get in contact and leave it at that.


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

Exposure 101


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Thank you Melody, Now that I have a healthy dose of your support here, I think I'll finally feel like I'm on the right track. hug

I cannot believe how far I've come and I feel so much better standing up for whats right... It's all you wonderful people here... I can never repay you all... There isn't enough words for my gratitude... When I'm in pain I find myself recognizing every single positive and I ooze with gratitude and love... It's odd but its true. I'm very giving, even when wounded....


BW:34
WH:37
M 4 years, together 8 years
D-day of third EA with a coworker 1/6/10
PlanA 1/7-16/10
PlanB 1/17/10
~starting 16 months of grad school 1/9/10-will require class attendance 9-5 on 2 Saturdays and 2 Sundays every month
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Hope this bumps my thread so Arkhawk can see it.....


BW:34
WH:37
M 4 years, together 8 years
D-day of third EA with a coworker 1/6/10
PlanA 1/7-16/10
PlanB 1/17/10
~starting 16 months of grad school 1/9/10-will require class attendance 9-5 on 2 Saturdays and 2 Sundays every month
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{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{Plexle}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}] you are a dear, dear person. smile


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

Exposure 101


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Thanks Mel. would you go over to Scotlands thread and splain the role of an IM to her? It might just be me but it seems that she has to deal with WH way to much. and he keeps hitting her with emergency demands. I think she might need to coach her Ims a little bit

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Hows it goin plex?

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