If you know he spent some time with your WW last week in Midland, then it is time for a re-exposure. He flipped the last time, he'll flip again. Everytime he makes contact, make life hell for him. That is your best bet because you aren't withdrawing love units from your WW by exposing to his side and making him feel the consequences, and he starts love busting your WW. Make OM's life hell until he leaves your WW alone.

(((((Pat)))))),

Ok, I'm back. I'm sorry for not getting here sooner, but I had some personal emergencies to attend to.

This is HONESTLY the very BEST THING you can do. All of us here can tell you what you think, guide you with the principles that the Harley's outline, but really getting the word from the horse's mouth is really the way to go. They are the professionals after all....

Who are you talking to, Steve or Jennifer?.....Jennifer may end up being the better option for your wife, but I truly think Steve will be more helpful for YOU at this point.

I know you have stated that you want to save your marriage (I never actually doubted you had changed your mind...so I was never confused on this part.....), but what do YOU want in the marriage?......what is it you would like to see accomplished through all of this???

What I mean, is you are going to have to define your OWN boundaries. THIS was the turning point for me in Plan A. When I finally wrote down what it was I wanted, what I would tolerate and what I wouldn't, then it became very easy for me to defend these boundaries. See, I had gotten to a point that I was not a "marriage-at-all-costs" kinda girl. Of course, things WERE a bit different for me. My H had moved out after Dday. The problem was he wanted to come back home, but not wanting to do the work to rebuild our M (INCLUDING getting rid of OW...). I knew for me that that wasn't an option. Besides, after the inital shock of him leaving wore off, the kids and I found we doing OKAY. Didn't mean we still hated what was happening or that we didn't want him home, but that if he didn't come back, we WOULD survive. And that was the BIGGEST wake-up call my H received....him WITNESSING us surviving without him and even thriving at points (while he was drowning in "Affairland" muck.....).

Anyway, I will put my thought on hold, since you are getting help from the experts about how to go forward with WW.

In the mean time, I will continue to pray for you and the kiddies,,,,,and for good measure I will even throw in your WW.....

not2fun

Okay. Talked with Steve for about 1.5 hrs today. Great he took the extra time. His suggestion was I approach her and ask what the "ideal situation" would be for us. If we could have a loving marriage and be in love, happy and keep our family together, wouldn't that be ideal? Keep showing that we can make it if we try. If she responds positive, let him talk to her and work on breaking the OM. He said try this approach and see what she says. Don't get off track if she says I want a divorce, go back to the question. He said try this for about a week. If after a week she is still negative, tell her that if she is not willing to try and move forward, she should move out. He said keep that message for a couple weeks and if she dosen't, then maybe it's time to file and force her out. Then explain to her what a divorce is. Messy, nasty and not something she should want. We will lose the house, family and our lives will be upside down. She will lose her family and everything else. Maybe that will have to happen?

Forgot one thing. He said absolutly I should help with the charges: that will show I still care.

.......doncha just LOVE the Harley's.....

SO, what are ya gonna do?????....hopefully do what Steve says.....

And how do YOU feel about the session???

not2fun

then do what he says.......

not2fun

Somehow I doubt he advised you to help with those particular charges...but I digress.

Did you explain to him the FULL nature of these charges?

Karma,

I totally agree with Steve's advice to get the charges dismissed / reduced. If he helped get the charges to stick, you can kiss any chance of reconcilliation or an efficient divorce good bye.

I agree with advice of PSUBiker and what was counseled by Steve H.

Interesting tactics he advised.

Pat - you have your marching orders. That should give you some more energy in addition some peace because you have plan.

I too agree....THOUGH, I will say that contradicts my previous advice, I do defer to the professional, which is not what I am.....

So, how did the session help YOU, Pat???....

not2fun

Great you call the Harleys. What about re exposure being OM broke NC?

Always difficult to glean enough information from the posts and then add from your own experience. Its a good thing to bring in several perspectives and let the poster pick some ideas.

add: eventually after the drama of exposure, the A moves on, and BS is hitting wall and not sure which way to go - getting professional advise and coaching will get him/her going again This is where our support is best and makes MB different. Not going to get much external support from an IC

Last night she woke me about 1:30 out of a dead sleep to talk. We spoke until 4:30am. It was acually cordial, not raised voices and all. She said I can get over the arrest, but not exposure to family and many other things. She said she does not want a divorce "yet". I tried what Steve said and offered her a "perfect Sinario" which she didn't reject, but was not all into. I asked her about OM, which she denied there was any intamicy which I know is BS. She said she texted him and such, but I found a Valentines card from him, which means she met him last Sunday whan she was in Midland. Steve told me not to push that, so I didn't. But let me tell you, it's very hard.

This morning, for the first time in I would say at least 6 weeks, I got a hug! Her travel schedule is completly crazy over the next three weeks. Mon-wed next week in OK. Then Mon-Mon in Ca.Then Tue-Wed in West Texas. So almost three full weeks away.

Translation: she's trying to manipulate you into not doing any more exposure.

I've always loved the reverse babble line of: "I figured that, if what you had with him was so great, you'd want the whole world to know about it!"

It might not, however, be a good thing to say to her at this point. The next time you talke to Steve, Pat, ask him what your response should be to her saying that she can't get over the exposure.

Again, glad you have a Harley coaching you.

Exactly. This is half of what damages marriages in the first place.
"Married people are second class citizens and are missing out on real fun" or " Marriage and love are not the same thing really, I'm not in love anymore so..." attitudes..

When we expose we are willing to hold up our marriages as important, so important that we are willing to do everything humanly possible to protect them. Yes we might have made mistakes too but who doesn't?

We are supposed to be proud of staying together and loving each other. We sometimes have to learn how to repair and forgive. Why should we be ashamed of fighting for our marriage?
Waywards ussually come from a place of manipulation as they think they can live outside the rules.
We have such high expectations when we marry and a master plan. Everyone tells us how difficult marriage is but we know more than they do, we are "different". We swear we will get help before anything ever gets bad and it seems that "Of course we will".
But our pride, ego, and sense of entitlement so often leads us down some path to "fufillment" because after all, We have "A Right to be happy" So we never counted on the tears and sacrifice it sometimes takes to love. You can count on the fact that those things will be present in a marriage. Whether twp people suffer together or separate has a direct connection to the principles used by Doc H and MB. Running away and blaming others for our mistakes automatically puts us in the losers catagory.

She is eating cake or trying to Pat. You are sharp enuf to see it Im sure. Exposure is saying that you are not willing to live like that and are man enough to deal with whatever cosequences she wants to hand out from within her playpen. You are saying "I don't play that game" when you expose.
When she is around you its a stand you won't back down on but....you love her anyway with a cool confidance that what you have done is the right thing for you and any other emotionally healthy adult. Smile, play nice, and cover your butt untill she sees the light or runs away, it doesn't matter what she thinks or feels while she is acting like that. Life is too short.

Response: "I know you are upset about the exposure, but if I can get over you sleeping with another man, which I think I can in the future, then I think you can get over exposure one day. I know you may not want to believe this, but I did it to try and keep our family together by removing OM from our lives. I did not do this to punish or humiliate you. If I didn't want to save our marriage, I would have done nothing and filed for divorce. Frankly, I will not accept a third party in our marriage, so I will do everything in my power including things you may not like to rid that threat to our family."

"I know you are upset about the exposure, but if I can get over you sleeping with another man, which I think I can in the future, then I think you can get over exposure"

Great response.

Your response should be....

"I am doing everything I can to save our marriage and our family..."

then drop it. This is your mantra. EVERY. SINGLE. TIME.

"I am doing everything I can to save OUR marriage and our family...."

Stick to your convictions and be consistant. When you change the response, it confuses her. She's doing enough to confuse herself (case in point, she's changed her opinion about the arrest..... NOW she can forgive that, whereas two weeks ago she couldn't....).

You remain the constant.....

Her speech the other night was not really about her convincing YOU that this will never work. It was her trying to convince HERSELF. She has so many doubts about what she is doing......it's really rather sad. So don't fall for this and remain consistant ......when you do this it chips away at her own convictions.....

Not2fun