Right now what he lacks most is willingness. And that has been my problem too. I'm working on my willingness.

Thanks for the verbal sparring. It's good for me

He's not a big fan of any conversation that would involve me crying. I think that's kinda a male thing though. I get that.

He is also not a big fan about talking about himself, and never has been. He will state the facts of what happened, but not the emotions. I get that too. We can only talk about what we CAN talk about, and if there's something that makes him uncomfortable with his emotins, then I don't want to force it.

He has a very hard time expressing any emotion except anger and numbness. He doesn't trust the feeling of happiness. This is not something that is my fault, just something that has been there since before we dated. He doesn't like it, but he also doesn't DO anything to change it.

Has anyone read Dr. Harley's articles on religious differences:

http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi5039_qa.html
http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi5039b_qa.html
http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi5040a_qa.html
http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi5040b_qa.html

I find his approach really appealing.

He does believe it is possible to have a good marriage with religious differences.

For what it's worth (I'm no expert), I think I agree.

Which is closer to the way you feel about your husband:

1. I wish he loved spiritual things as much as I do.

2. I wish he would spend 50% of his time and energy on religion like I do.

3. He goes to church but it is worth NOTHING because he does not go for the right reasons. He only goes because he loves me and that is no good reason.

4. I want to talk two hours each week about the Sunday messages we hear.

5. I give up, he is never going to be as deep or as spiritual as i am therefore I am going to get my spiritual needs filled from other people.

6. Religion is everything to me and he does not understand it is the most important thing in life.

7. I love the church more than I love the idea of having a good close marriage.

8. I feel that if I am close to my husband and happy with him, I will not be able to be close to God.

9. I feel if I am close to God, I will not be able to be close and intimate with my husband.

10. I cannot have both closeness with God and true intimacy with my (sinful corrupt heathen) husband.



5.

For Bubs:


You know, I was probaby being a bit overdramatic myself with this one. He HAS said that. But it was probably an AO in response to his own frustration with being unwilling/unable to engage in coversation. I probably took that out of context to make a point, which is not really fair to him.

He believes that if he is not able to meet one of my needs that I should find someone who can. He would like first right of refusal though. I go get my needs met by family all the time, sometime to the detriment of marriage, because I do so without checking with him first. This is disrespectful of me and I have stopped, and it makes a big difference.

Now I don't think he would send me out to have sex with another man if he were not "in the mood." And I don't think he really wants me to have intimate conversations with other men either. But he'll let me call my dad if we having a plumbing problem that is over his head. And he would rather I find somebody else to do all my intellectualizing and philosphizing with. So luckily I can do that here, and also with alanon friends. Especially my Sponsor. She is wonderful and has a great mind.

Right now what he lacks most is willingness

Willingness do do what?

Willingness for what?

He believes that if he is not able to meet one of my needs that I should find someone who can.

Allow me to try and translate this:


Your husband means this:

"You have told me for years how I do not meet your needs. In many ways. In fact, you have never told me that I EVER HAVE MET YOUR NEEDS at all. You have made it clear I do not and never will meet your needs. In fact, you have made it clear that you have given up on me ever meeting your needs, I am so frustrated with this and you telling me this all the time, hurting my feelings when I love you so much,,,,that I am ready to tell you to find someone else. I am at the height of frustration and hurt because of you telling me and everyone else in detail how it is that I dont meet your needs"

Woah. You are taking things WAY off course here, and saying things that are utterly unfounded based on what I have written.

Yes, I wish he would love spiritual things as much as I do. I would love if he would be just a bit more open to them. That would be enough. Going to church ONLY because he loves me IS a good reason, but I do want more, and there is nothing wrong with that. It would be nice to talk about the saunday readings. Nice but not necessary for happiness. All the rest of that stuff is total BS.

Here is another possible translation:

"I love you and have given up my whole life to support and love you and the kids and here you keep telling me I do not meet your needs! It is hurtful but I will not express that to you, it is terribly hurtful to know that I am NOT ENOUGH as your husband and it is clear as day that you want another type of man to be your husband and you regret the day you married me"

Yep. I was DJing BIG time. Which is why I don't talk about our "failures" anymore unless absolutely necesary.

Truthfully for the first several years of marriage, I said NOTHING to him. I stuffed it. So when he was finally hearing from me, I was incredibly emotional and not really caring what I said or how I said it or even if it was true. I was venting on him. It was before MB. I know better now.

He felt your rejection of him even before you said it though,....... people feel spousal rejection deep inside thier psyche even if it is not expressed openly by the other (the rejecting) spouse.

Just like a child who feels his parents are about to divorce years before they actually do. People know and feel things and are hurt by things. Even if these things are unsaid.

Why did he marry me if he felt that rejection inside?

Because if that was happening, if was happening WELL before we said "I do."

What if those years you rejected him without saying anything affected him and started damaging your relationship with him. Then, he turned to porn a little and other things to escape your rejection. Then, you rejected him even more.

See, in a marriage, the things we do not say fester and cause way more damage then if we let them out. These things we do not say are really like "invisable damagers".

He felt the rejection from you, but it was no different than the unsaid unexpressed rejection from his own parents and family so HE DID NOT RECOGNIZE THE REJECTION FEELINGS FROM YOU AS BEING ABNORMAL.

Well, according to him he has had the porn problem since he was a kid. his dad was into it, was a serial cheater until his second wife put him on a tight leash. his mom was very "anti-sex" as a result. He has a lot of confusion in this area. He thinks it's best to forget it and leave it in the past. Maybe he's right.

I definitely see the cyclical nature of all of this. But I don't see how any of that offers any solution, other than just to STOP, which I am doing, have been doing, etc. What I share here in this forum is for me to see the falacies in my past and present thinking. But I aim to be very accepting and caring and kind and respectful in my relationship with my husband. Because I don't like the alternative that I didn't know I had been doing.

Hey that is all you can do! You have to look at the actual problems and the mechanisms in order to find the best solution. At least, that is what I try and do with my relationship when it had problems.

This is a STRONG statement. What is the word you would use???...

I would think it would be WIFE...but that's me....

not2fun

ps...I don't know much about your story, but there is a link out there directing me to that post of yours, which is why I commented on this....

Stop what you are doing?

What do you mean by that? What are you doing now that you feel you might have to stop?

That logic goes both ways. I thought that being in an unromantic, self-sacrificing marriage was normal. So I bought it.

Guess I totally ruined my life and his life, huh? i don't think anyone or anything is beyond redemption if we are willing to recieve it. Problem is that with a marriage, both need to be willing to recieve. And it doesn't happen overnight.

No nothing is overnight, healing a marriage and both spouses within the marriage is a (long) process but one you wont regret.