Bubs, I think you are missing the point.

If someone else makes the food I will eat it, yes. However, my husbadn cannot and should not be my short order cook for breakfast, lunch and dinner. He actually DOES make dinner sometimes, and he also makes lunches on the weekends often. But dinner every night he cannot do, because we have 3 children who are hungry at 5:30 and he doesn't get home until 6:30, and he works late because he goes in late, and he goes in late because he wakes up late, and he wakes up late because he stays up late playing video games or doing goodness knows what else.

Rant over.

The problem is NOT that I need to gain 5-10 lbs. The problem is that I need to learn how to take care of my self in BASIC ways, and I need to do them FOR myself and not let someone else do them, because if I let someone else do them for me all the time I do not grow up and become an adult. And it is important for me, my kids and my marriage that I grow up.

I was not a fully developed adult when I got married in my late 20s. I seemed like an adult, but inside I was still very much a child. What you might call a "late bloomer."

Now I can certainly ask my husband for help. Nothing wrong with that. But it is imporatant for me to change my BELIEF about what being a grownup is. Because if I unconsciously am operating under the belief that being grown up means being emotionally neglected, not only will my life reflect that belief, but I will live it out and pass it on. I know this. I am setting my kids up for the same problems.

Fixing the symptoms is not going to solve the underlying problem, just make it look like its gone, and the problem will go underground and find more insideous ways to manifest itself.

Hi I really do know about the deeper issues here!

I am saying this as just a FIRST STEP toward the healing.

However, my husbadn cannot and should not be my short order cook for breakfast, lunch and dinner.

No, of course not, He could do all the cooking on the weekends however, rather than staring at porn or playing games.


The problem is NOT that I need to gain 5-10 lbs. The problem is that I need to learn how to take care of my self in BASIC ways, and I need to do them FOR myself and not let someone else do them, because if I let someone else do them for me all the time I do not grow up and become an adult.

Of course this is true, but why not let your husband help in this. Every good change in a marriage routine offers some creative .....healing. Again it is a first step. You cannot just leap to taking total care of yourself in one day, you need tiny and healthy steps to get there.


I am glad you are looking at deeper issues here. I am just saying that it never hurts to change things up in a marriage. Or to ask your husband for something, anything. Learning to ask is a part of marriage I am learning to do now since I was never allowed to ask for anything in my childhood years.

So, for me learning to ask my husband to do the cooking is a fantastic step for me. And also for him to be able to give it and be appreciated for it.

Thinkin, if you don't mind, what step are you on? I realized that the reasoning through that I am doing with you may make more sense if I put myself in a more similar point of reference. I was thinking, if you aren't at step 7 yet, it's not time to be speaking to you about actions, like making thoughtful requests, if you're still in the awareness or acceptance stages. The stuff that you spoke about above, with the eating disorder, seeing it's about control, but not ready to make changes yet, I want to respect where you are in your process.

Yeah, asking is a hard one for me too, but I am doing so much better with it. And you are right, I can definitely involve him in the solution.

Still in step one NED, though hoping to move on to two very soon. It's more about conflicting schedules with my sponsor than anything, but I think God has a reason for this, so I'm being patient.

I was doing the step one/two/three waltz for the first year in alanon, but that was without a sponsor. I was pregantn and it was not a huge priority for me at that point. I was so sure I was ready for 4, but she took me right back to 1 and I am so glad!

How would you feel about getting another temporary sponsor, to work the steps with, whose schedule would mesh better with yours?

I've thought about it, but I really do feel she is jusr right for me. It may seem like I haven't made much progress, but I know that I'm in the right place. Prayed about it a lot. I think steps 2 and 3 will probably go relatively quick for me because I don't have any hangups that I'm aware of with 2, and I have been actively practicing 3 on a daily basis. I'm not sure what "exercises" she will have me do for those, just as I never would have predicted the work I would do on step one.

The main reason I've gone this slowly is that I am moving at my own pace, which back in the fall was VERY slow. So it's not just a schedule issue.

I have other friends in the program who think it's better to jump in and just get through the steps, that I shouldn't worry about getting through them "perfectly." Trust me, I had no intention of still being on step one a year ago when I was so sure I was ready for 4! And I'm not trying to get it perfectly, because I know I'll be back again But I'm glad I have a good foundation with it.

My sponsor and I talk about twice a week on the phone, and are at one meeting together too. It's just the getting together in person that is hard, in part because I'm not very good and scheduling things. I am as much of the hangup as she is.

Had a good, brief conversation with my husband about these ideas of changing actions, beliefs, feelings, thoughts, etc.

I asked him, "What do you think is easiest to change? Actions, feelings, thoughts or beliefs?"

He said none of them.

I pressed him. He said that the easiest thing to change is attitude. That it's like a switch for him. I thought that was very interesting. On one hand I agree - attitude is what needs to change before tackling any of those other things. And I DO have control over my attitude.

After our conversation, which lasted about 3 minutes, he said, "So, can we have sex now?"

He sure knows how to ruin it

I do have a sense of humor about it. But seriously, comments like that DRAIN me of any love. It's just his sense of humor. He thinks he is being funny. And I have talked with him about this before and he just doesn't seem to get that comments like that are at best a turn-off. But if I complain about it, he just says that it is ME who has the problem (lack of sense of humor).

It was a really great little conversation for us. A little more on the "deep" side, which is what I really want, and he actually came up with something that made me think differently, which is what I want. Why can't I just be happy about that and not let his little sex comment ruin it for me? GRRRRRR!

I want another cookie!

Attitude = feelings.

So his view is in direct contrast to the MB principle "Feelings follow actions."

The again, if he can change his attitude as far as being willing to try new behaviors per MB....that would be a good thing.

Chris, are you saying that "attitude" is the same thing as "feelings"?

I'm not so sure that is the case. II tend to think of attitudes as being "proactive" in nature, and feelings/emotions being "reactive" in nature.

Let's take hope. I think hope is an attitude rather than a feeling. I can choose to have an attidued of hope even if I am feeling hopeless.

I brought this up with him because of our conversation here about the need to change my BELIEFS before I can sustain my behavioral changes. Beliefs follow Thoughts follow Feelings follow Actions. But what Mark was saying is that without "Belief" that the actions are right and/or will ultimately make a difference, we will have no motivation to continue if the consequences are not immediate.

So I was left with the quandry: focus on changing my actions, or focus on changing my beliefs?

My husband gave me another option to think about - my attitude! I agree with NED that changing my beliefs is even harder than changing feelings thoughts and actions. And I agree with Mark that without beliefs as a foundation, I will not be able to sustain any changes in action.

But I can decide to have a particular attitude, even if it is in conflict with my feelings, thoughts or beliefs. And perhaps that shift or decision would be enough to keep me on task with the actions until the feelings, thoughts and beliefs catch up.

Think, you and I have more support than most, so we do make a huge amount of progress in our behavior, just by challenging our beliefs. Similarly, if you ever speak to Steve, he goes right to the beliefs, the "why" behind the behavior changes he's coaching you through. But not everyone has this level of support, and that's okay, there is more than one way to get to the same goal.

And speaking of attitude, I strongly believe that I can choose my attitude.

I believe I can choose my attitude too.

Thanks for weighing in on this, and also on my program stuff too. I think I finished step one today. I'll let my sponsor be the judge on that, but I do feel that I have started accepting ssomething that I have up to this point been trying to change - decisions I have made in the past, especially getting married to my husband. I accept that I cannot undo the past. That this is the man I am married to and the family that I have, whether I like it or not, because this is the path I chose. And I don't like it. I don't want to accept it sometimes. So if I'm going to have to accept the consequences of my actions and be able to do so with peace in my heart, I desperately need the rest of the steps, and I need them now. They are the only way out of this mess I've gotten myself into. I don't mean "out" in terms of divorce. I mean "out" in terms of getting out of this terrible dark place that I get pulled into so often. Because as much as I hate it, it's comfortable here and I'm used to it and doing something different seems too hard for me to do, even with support.

I'm PMSing and need to go to bed

Think, you sound so free, even with the PMSing. Is it a mess today? I see how it feels like that sometimes. There is a ton of self-forgiveness awaiting you, too. Yes, there are consequences to our actions, but I think that you'll find a lot of consequences you like, too. You have been building quite some momentum there, thinkin, momentum that is a huge asset as you work towards your goals.

Thanks NED. Momentum is a good thing, and I credit this place, because I'd need to be going to meetings every day and having chats with program people constantly to break through the crap that is in my head. The wonderful mix of people here has done me more good than I could possibly have imagined.

I have a new "problem" which is actually an old problem.

My husband is back out of withdrawl/conflict. YAY! It doesn't take too much apparently. However, I am feeling totally smothered now by his affection. As I said, this is an old problem, not just with him but other relationships of the past . . . the common denominator is definitely me. But I have no idea how to effectively handle this problem in ways that are congruent with MB.

Suggestions?

Feeling ready for some O&H?

Not really NED

But I think it is definitely called for, too!

The other thread helped me tremendously today in working through this mentally. We literally speak different languaged when it comes to expressing and recieving love. We have even used that expression "you don't speak my language" before. And this is a perfect example.

I got my opportunity to address it this evening. I was leaving for a meeting and giving the kids their bedtime hugs before heading out. And I didn't give him a hug and he called me on it. Well, I went over to him and said, "I'm sorry. I'm not much of a physical affection person, and I forget that other people DO want it. I need to do a better job of remembering to do that for you." As I hugged him.

When I got home, I continued the topic a bit. I told him about the 5 love languages, and that from what I could tell, his main love langauges seemed to be physical affection and words of appreciation, while my main ways that I want to receive love are acts of service, gifts, and quality time. Mostly I just left it at that.

OK, so as I'm typing just now, he comes over and combines his "affection" with an "act of service" by giving me a very brief shoulder rub. Nice deposit. Double points because he did it briefly and didn't linger and make it into something more than I wanted.

I guess O&H works, even if it is uncomfortable.

Hi Thinking

My thoughts are with you.