Ok i just need some input. As you know, yesterday was a bad day for H in withdrawal. He kept saying stuff like he is never happy bla bla. So, I told him that we had to start doing things together- FUN things. He came home last night from ball hockey and was kind of "zoned out" but said he would do whatever I wanted, he was tired but he would try.

I suggested playing a board game together, and we did. He did, he said "whatever you want to do" in a flat tone. He didn't seem to enjoy it as much as he does when our friends play too..

is it supposed to be this hard to get the WS to spend quality time with you? I think one of our biggest problems is that we stopped doing those things together- just the two of us. We hardly had date nights, on weekends we always hung out with other married friends, etc. So when we are together it seems like all we do is watch TV. We do shop together and stuff like that, but nothing that can estabolish a deep connection.

Any ideas? I suggested we go for an ice cream today but his hockey team is playing and he can't miss that. UGH!!!

OMG! H just left, he said he didn't want this anymore. I asked him to leave and called his parents to tell them what was happening. I guess I am in Plan B now. Do I respond to anything he writes? HELP! Need some Plan B info ASAP!

be calm hopeful... be calm.

i just started plan b this afternoon, hardest thing I've ever done. There is some good info on plan b in SAA and in the notable posts thread in the notable posts forum...

hang in there. I'm on here and will be for a while....

{{{{{{HOPEFUL}}}}}}}}

Okay, so he is gone. Good. Not the MB plan, but we will work with it.

You need to write a Plan B letter tonight so that you have it ready next time he shows up (and it will probably be soon).

Thanks! He is gone because I asked him to leave. He told me he doesnt' want this anymore. I called his parents as soon as he left, the are EXTREMELY supportive. Even wrote OW an email.

What do I say in this letter? He is obviously super pissed at me for writing his parents, sent me a text thanking me in his sarcastic way.

I explained to them that he needs to be told that what he is doing is wrong. They are fully on board.

Should this be a hand written letter? Also if he texts or calls should I not respond?

You are right- SOOOO hard!

Someone here has an example. Let me look for it. The letter should be a love letter, letting him know that you love him, but to protect that love, you will no longer have contact with him.

Don't give it to him until you have had it vetted here.

Ok so this weekend held some major events. Let me try to break it down so its easy to read. I really need to know where to go from here because I feel this is my last attempt at this.

H has been in withdrawal for the last few days as you can see from my posts and I really felt they were in contact. Finally on Saturday he looked at me and said "I don't want this anymore". So, I looked at him and asked him to leave. He wasn't going too, so I started to pack and then he said he would leave. I called his brother and he FLIPPED at me for it, saying that I was turning them against him.'

Here's some background: He has not seen OW in a year in person, they talk on MSN. He creates new email addresses and that is their method of communication. I found out last year, when he saw her last. I did not find MB until recently and exposure was gradual. (First a few friends months after I discovered, then his brothers.) I did not tell his parents. I KNOW. BIG MISTAKE.

There were reasons for this: 1) HIs mother suffers depression and we were not sure how she would react. 2) She would cut ties with him. (she would, her family is known for letting stuff like this come between them) 3) A part of me thought we could get through this without them having to know.

So, this past week that has been on my mind. (that I didn't expose to them). So, Saturday when he left, I called them. It was horrible. They are completely supportive of me, and LOST it at him.

So back to Saturday night- he text me and asked if he could come home to change and I said yes (I wasn't home) but kept pushing to talk to me. He started talking about dying so I came home and talked to him and let him stay downstairs. He kept saying that I was the only person that loved him.

Next morning, he tells me he wants us to work it out. I asked him if he had been in contact with her and he said "YES for a few days" and that he needs help and what do we do. To be honest, I am so fed up with this contact. So, I let him sweat it out and didn't give him an answer about wanting to try with him. But in the end I said I would and we sent a NC email that he wrote and I read.

I want to follow MB to the letter, what do I do from here?

Call the Harleys.

God's Blessings,

Say

H will not participate in that. They can councel me individually though can't they? I know I need to set the bar higher for him. I cannot keep going through this. I really hope that exposure to his parents helped. Right now he doesn't want anything to do with them and doesn't understand how they have no support for him. He realizes what he did was wrong, but he wants some kind of support from them.

H is in no position to bargain. Set the bar high, Hope. Tell him exactly what you expect from him in order for you to be willing to continue in the M. Then write it down. This is a crucial bargaining time and the window of opportunity is small. I wish that councseling with the Hraleys had been my condition to stay in the M.We have R but more slowly and painfully with more setbacks. You drive the R bus. He had his driving turn during the A.

If he does not agree...there is always Mommy's house.

God's Blessings,

Say

I agree he isn't in a position to bargain about talking with the MB coach.

If he wants to work with you to get through this he does it, or he goes someplace else. His choice. You offer him the choice and he gets his choice (talk with them and work with you and them or be gone).

Easy for us to say but it looks like the logical place for you to be.

That is good advice thanks. Have any of you tried calling the Dr? I am just wondering what to expect?

I am feeling very anxious and scared all in one. These FR are becoming to easy for him-and part of that is my fault- I didn't set the bar high.

I also told him yesterday that he should read posts and info from this site, in hopes that maybe something will reach him. He isn't the man I know anymore. There is a thread here of a WW trying to move forward, I think the info would help him. I have told him about the Wayward ways, the fog, the withdrawal, and a part of him believes it. The OW knows just what to say to him to tear at this heart. He has this new obsession with happiness, and thinks that he has never been happy, bla bla. She text him yesterday after the email and said how he will be missing his "true entire happiness" by leaving her.

I hope that the exposure to his parents will help open his eyes. He said that he did, but I still see that blank look. It also worries me how he is so upset to not have his parents support. He is totally OK that I was their first concern, but he thinks that "his image" to his family was their second. That was not the case.

In the back of my mind I think that its going to come down to me making him leave and going to Plan B. Although, Saturday was the closest we had to that, I never asked him to leave before. I even packed his clothes. Our friends that seen him said he looked terrible, and I asked him if he was hoping I would take him back and he said yes.

He did tell me that while he was in contact with her he was planning to leave me. Even though he said he didn't think he could do it. This is so frustrating. I never thought another person would have so much influence over him. UGH!!!

Hope, it is never a good idea to bring a WS into the forums if they are not totally committed to R. You will lose your best tool to save your M as well as your support system if he comes here while he is still so fogged out.

What EPs have you put in place. He should not be able to get texts from her. Block her #, change his#, swap phones with him but do not make it easy for her to get through to him.

Are you willing to state your requirements for R and then go straight to Plan B if he refuses any of them. If not, you are just setting yourself up for more abuse. Your anxiety is understandable.

I have not counseled with them, Hops, wish I had but from what everyone has said, they are very accomodating and will probably talk only to you first. They do not counsel you together.

God's Blessings,

Say

Thanks- that is so true about bringing him here.

I am ready to lay out a plan and go to Plan B if he doesn't want to follow.

Dumb question ,what is an EP? Unfortuately we cannot block her number with our carrier and he cannot change his number for work.

One requirement that I wanted all along is to fill out the emotional needs survey. Is that pointless to do while he is in this fog?

OMG, he sent the NC letter to OW and she texted back that he is missing his one true love? And then you let him stay?

Please, please call the Harleys even if it is just for one appointment. You are headed very quickly to where I was, I just didn't give a SH*T anymore.

Believer, he didn't text back to her. He showed me and deleted it. She always texts us when we sent a letter to her. What should I have done if I already said I was willing to try? I am just curious so I don't make the same mistakes.

I really want him back, but if he continues to do this I am out. I am planning to go home today with a list of my expectations for R and what I think needs to happen. Here are my thoughts:

1) NO NO NO CONTACt
2) Emotional Needs Questionaire
3) MORE Quality Time together.

Is there something important that i am missing that should be added? Sorry my mind is fried.

Believer, your input is always appreciated please help me figure out where I am headed.

Hopeful, are you sure you cannot block the OW's #? Also, is he communicating with her on a computer at home? If so, the computer needs to be off limits for him.

Is the OW married? Are there any other potential targets who don't know about the affair?

We cannot block an individual number, I work for the cell company. (wish I could block her!) No, he isn't using any computer at home, he was using the one at his work to do this so I can't even install a keylogger.

The OW is not married, she is 24 and lives at home with her parents. The only other person that may not know is her abusive father. Her mother knows everything.

Hopeful, filling out the EN questionaire is a waste of time right now. The first order of business will be to change the environment that led to the affair, ie: cut off his computer access, block the OW's texts, things like that. [frame this in a way that puts the onus on him to affair proof the marriage] Is the OW married? Does she have a facebook page? Has the affair been exposed to her side?

Another condition will be to have him counsel with Steve Harley. I would lay this all out to him like this:

Joe, I am not willing to live like this another day. I would rather be alone than live with your affair. It is too painful. This is what it will take to motivate me to try with you, otherwise, I would like you to leave:

1. affair proof our marriage and ensure that all contact is cut off between you and the OW. That means no more computer time and blocking her # from your phone. You will have to figure this out and ASSURE ME that this is enough to keep her out. Complete transparency and no leisure time apart

2. phone coaching with Steve Harley from Marriage Builders. I am not willing to stay in a loveless, unhappy marriage, so you will have to work with him to find out how to make me happy

3. commit to spending 20+ hours together with undivided attention

That is what it will take to get me interested. I am not settling for crumbs anymore.

I would call her father. Does she have a facebook account? What does the mother say about all this? Have you spoken to her?