So now the questions. I know I have to gather some hard proof before I confront him. How is an EA different from a PA besides that they're not having sex?

I know the girl is single. I know her name and now I have her phone number. What do I do next?

And what do I do when I hear the inevitable, "Well you did it first," "At least I didn't have sex with her"?

Is exposure the same?

When I have enough evidence and I tell him, NC with her and he says no? They've been friends for years and I see him saying that she's been in his life longer, he's not going to dump his "friend" over his wife etc or something to the like, then what is my plan? What do I do then?

I'm sorry I never thought this would happen and now I'm just thinking of questions as they come up.

I'm totally in shock.

Just wanted you to know you're being heard. The board will pick up as the day goes on, so try to be calm and methodical 'til you get some more advice.

From what I've seen/experienced ( ) a PA makes the adultery much more entrenched. The WS gets even foggier and usually acts more extreme - more up, more down, more angry, more elated, whatever the WS feels at the moment.

I briefly skimmed your thread, so don't know all of the details, but are you sure it's not a PA?

Will post this now and write more as I think of it. I'm sorry you're in this situation.

So. Two ways to break this down.

1) Actions you can take to kill the affair.
*Expose. Contact family, friends, OW's family, any person of influence over your WH. Inform them that your husband and this OW have begun an inappropriate relationship, and ask for their help/support as you fight for your marriage. (There are good verbatim examples of what to say here in other threads, I'll see if I can dig them up.)

*Plan A. You've already been doing this, but now it's w/in the realm of an affair. That means Carrot and Stick. (Again, will find that link, though I think it may already been in your thread...) You put forward the best you and the best picture of what your M can be while not condoning anything A-related.

*Continue snooping. Make sure you have your intel in order (documented, copied, stored somewhere safe/third party, etc.) and plan in place when you confront your WH.


2) What if's and the questions/counter-questions running through your mind. Will try to come back and address these in a bit.

I'm not sure of anything at this point. I am going to keep digging. With this girl, like I said, she's in Dallas-12hrs away so I guess there could have been something at some point if she came here but I just have to keep digging and see what I find.

(((Margie)))

I'm so sorry this is the case. No matter what you did - there is no JUSTIFICATION for his affair. If he couldn't get over your affairs he had the right to walk away, he does not have the right to have an affair of his own.

Get ready cuz you got some fighting to do. You're familiar with the basics right? Plan A/B and Exposure?

Oh and i don't think any of those programs that are posted in the snooping post will work on his phone. It's an older Motorola something. It's square like the Karma but that's not it.

I am familiar. I'd been reading all over the site but more to see what the BSs were doing, since at the time, I "wasn't" a BS. Now I am, I'll be reading everything over again.

Agree w/ Vibrissa. Your actions do not excuse his. We always have choices. If he could not work through your infidelity, he could choose to walk away. He didn't. Nothing changes the fact that this was his choice.

If he starts making excuses or throwing your history at you, I think the best thing is to acknowledge that yes, you own those decisions and are putting in the work necessary to prevent any such situations/choices from happening again. BUT YOUR PAST DOES NOT EXCUSE HIS DECISIONS. You are as any other BS - betrayed and hurt, and you have the right to a happy, fulfilling marriage...with only two people in it. Until there are only two people in it, you will fight this attack as you see fit.

(Not advising you to say all of that, kind of speaking off the cuff. Just trying to give you something to start with before the cavalry arrives.)

Thank you. I really do appreciate it.

I'm still just in so much shock and trying to figure out how I'm going to collect the evidence off of his phone. Still trying to find the model...

Me too!
But hey, I'v been told I'm bitter due to my own experiance

Yes you do, but now it will be much, much harder.
A BS who goes Wayward feels more entiteled and justified in there actions erlier on in the A than most other Waywards


I think the best thing you could do is own that responsability. He's right, you did. In the real world that does not excuse what he is doing, but in his head it is a HUGE jestification.

Don't bet on this just yet, lets see what a little more snooping comes up with.

More plan-A, untill you can't...Then Plan-B
There is no plan-C, if neither A, or B work......Plan-D

Why?

Why did I think this would never happen and why am I in shock?

I don't know. It's like house fires or victims of crime. You always think it's going to be someone else, but not you. I don't know how to describe it. I don't care to. It happened and now I have to accept it.

Forward them to your phone or to your email account. (Delete the forward off his phone when you're done.)

Because you hold others to a higher moral standard than you hold yourself.






Ok, I'll stop preaching and try to help you stop this madness.

Other than her name, what do you know about OW?

You need the following.

Her full name, Address, phone number, FaceBook page, employer
Parents and siblings name, Address, Phone number
Any additional info would be helpful, but not as critical.

Does your Husband have a Facebook page?

You need to find out what his top Emotional needs are, if you cant get them directly from him, make an educated guess and start trying to meet them.



Also, the reason he does not want SF from you is because he feels that would be cheating on the OW...

Yes, that's right, it's Idiotic, but true.

This is also why I fear the relationship has gone Physical.

ML, I am so sorry about this. I can understand your fears. As a FWW, I would have the same ones.

As far as "you did it first" goes, well, yes, you did it first. But in truth, if we believe adultery is wrong, that belief should be based on the moral-ness of adultery, not based on who else does or doesn't do it. So I was trying to imagine what I would say. I would probably say something like, "You are right, I did cheat, and that was so wrong and hurtful. Affairs are always wrong and hurtful." I would want to add a phrase about how he must know how I am hurting because he hurt that way too, but I would be good and hold my tongue.

As far as the other goes, his friendship and NC, you can't make the choice for him. I knew my affair was wrong, but I hung onto it. After it ended, I knew I should confess, but I held on some more. Until I made the choice. And I don't think there's anything anyone could have said that would have MADE me do it. He may very well say he won't end contact, he's been friends with her longer. But that doesn't mean he'll stick to it. People say a lot of things when they are on the defensive. In the clear light of day, they often change their minds.

I have suffered a couple of traumas in my life at the hands of others. I never even got acknowledgement or apology. But I still wouldn't be happy if they suffered harm. So no matter what you did, the fact is that no one should have to go through the pain of infidelity, and I am sorry you are suffering.

ok I sent the messages to my phone, made sure to delete the forward. Checked the phone for anything else-nothing found. Saved and deleted the messages out of my inbox.

Later I'll be able to upload them to the computer and save them somewhere that way.

and yes they both have Facebooks. She's on my friends list. I'll find out all the info on her that I can when he goes to school today.

Ok, wait until you have more on OW.

Do not warn BH/WH about exposure, when it is time, just do it and do it all at once.
(Facebook is an awesome exposure tool)

No need to confront BH/WH about his A, after exposure he will confront you.

Who all knows about your two ON'S?
Do his parent's know, and how is your relationship with them?

The first thing out of his mouth after exposure will be Justification, Justification, and more Justifications.... Exposure targets that are influential on him are more likely to disregard his justifications if they already know of your of your prier infidelity and your regret of that infidelity.

I thought about using facebook. Everyone we know is on there. I can post on mine, hers and his all at once.

My parents and his parents know I cheated. He's also had facebook statuses in the past saying something to the effect of having been cheated on so people do know.

Right now he's not talking to his parents. Had a little blowout a little over a month ago. I'm still planning on sending his mom flowers for Mother's Day. We get along pretty good. I've talked to them on a few occasions and BH/WH has talked to them on a few occasions about marital problems here and there. They try to stay neutral.