Before anybody is mislead, if you are new here and/or your WS is still in an active affair, then they are lying every time they open their mouths. But there may be times during recovery or even in your memory of the recent past when you are trying to figure out if something was a lie or not.

I stumbled across and article via yahoo and I thought it might serve some educational purposes, as well as prompt some useful discussion. The article on how to tell if he's lying is meant for people dating but it does have a good list of useful tips on how to recongize it and draw out the truth. The article is here: http://dating.personals.yahoo.com/s...ing-101-how-to-tell-if-your-guy-is-lying

For the record, my WXH lied chronically in the manners decribed in the examples they used in the article. If I asked him if he paid a bill or did a specific chore, he would say it was done and I would discover later that it hadn't been (or I would catch him doing it). As annoying as it was I never dreamed it would serve as training for his waywardness which requires highly toned lying skills. Nevertheless, I certainly learned to read many of the cues described in the article.

When he became wayward those clues disappeared. He lied as naturally as he breathed. So long as the lies were about his affair. He also lied about everything else, whether it was to his advantage or not, and these lies produced many of the telltale cues.

See, the affair-related lies were all predetermined. There wasn't a question I could ask that he hadn't already thought of and prepared an answer. But other things - little mundane and unimportant things - he would be caught unprepared. But being so wayward, he was incapable of telling the truth. I mean seriously - he'd lie about the most trivial little things - even to say he didn't pick up milk when he had (so I picked it up as well and we had 2). He lied like this to everyone as well, not just me.

I'm not sure if he's still lying or not as I haven't had any contact with him other than small claims court procedures, though he did lie on both his defense and his claim there as well. I suppose I can "forgive" him for that as he did have something to gain. But I suspect he's still at it. And I suspect he will until the affair crumbles, if it ever does. It makes me wonder if OW has noticed this habit of his or not. I know she did her share of lying to OWH and others and I suspect she's still at it as well. I don't know if liars recognize each other as in it takes one to know one or if they only fool themselves.

Anyway, I'd be curious as to others' experiences with lying - especially those whose WS's earned (or are trying to earn) their "F".

I thought it was a great article....this one rang true re: my WHX..


<<Details: Truthful men tell you the truth and answer your question, not tell you the whole story behind the truth. Deceptive men load up their response with more details than are necessary to answer your question.>>

My XH would go on and on about details until the meat of the story was lost. It was weird even before I knew how much of a liar he was.

Ai yai yai

Just helped confirm a few things for me. Thanks!

Hi Tabby, I read the same but they missed the most important one.

How to tell when a wayward is lying? When they open their mouths.

Thought it was obvious... they are communicating with you in some fashion.

In all reality though... I believe that the LIES were what did me in. I could have worked through the neglect and continued on with MB principles for a long time. But I couldn't take the LIES. Stupid, inconsequential lies or BIG WHOPPER lies... they caused me to have no trust in her what-so-ever. Then she would get mad at me for 'not trusting her' or 'spying' on her by putting a keylogger on my OWN computer. It was amazing the degree of disconnect which went on, her blaming me for 'thinking' I was doing EXACTLY what she was ACTUALLY doing. 'Hiding money' 'cheating' etc etc etc.

And she couldn't/wouldn't apologize when directly, no holds barred CAUGHT in a lie. She would just lie harder, try to deflect, verbally attack, etc etc... anything to get me to back off. I just couldn't do it... I couldn't MB in the face of the lies.

I hate to admit this, but I am a former liar. And one of the big keys to STOPPING is taking full responsibility. If someone says "but" or "it's just that," they aren't taking responsibility. When someone really really gets that they are wrong, they don't have to explain to you why they did it. They know to say and mean - I was wrong. I did the wrong thing. There is no excuse or justification. Feeling bad when caught is not the same as changing or truly being sorry.

Oh, and most liars have heard the old "look to the side when lying" thing, so if they stare you down right in your eyes the whole time, they are probably trying to beat the game. Ditto about too many details.

I was thinking about this further...I am seeing a man now....we talk A LOT and he tells me lots of stories from his life and I really like the details he provides me with...and I love when he accidentally tells me the same story again---with the same details. The thing is he does tell me LOTS of details. But he does it all of the time. It is his style of chatter. I am the same way. It has often been said about me that I use 100 words when 10 would do. Anyway, there was one piece of his life where he didn't tell me ENOUGH details and I had the 'high alert' sensation of knowing I wasn't getting the whole story---insignificant as it might be. Eventually he TOLD me the whole story....and I was like 'ah...I was right, there was more to it than he first told me.' Now, in THIS case, it wasn't a lie...it was simply info he doesn't share with everyone and when he and I got to that level he shared it completely. Know what it was over? He dropped out of a private high school his senior year, took the GED and started college before his classmates even graduated high school. He's ashamed of that. Embarrassed.

Anyway, WXH didn't tell me lots of detail all of the time. Selectively. I learned to listen closely to those times because some part of it was a lie or designed to throw me off in some fashion. And I've also seen him look me dead in the eyes to the point it felt unnatural.

I have a good BS meter...I'm never again going to ignore it.

My XWH was so ethical that I never thought he would lie.

He enforced into both of our girls about honesty, integrity and if you lie then no one would believe you again. You did not want to shame your family name.

Never questioned anything he said when the A started and he started acting odd. Thought it was a nervous breakdown but it was living with the lies. He became an expert at being deceitful to this day and no longer has any tough with reality.

I am similar to how your husband WAS! I really don't lie. I work to NOT lie and to keep myself from the position of lying. I am SO BAD at lying that I can't even play poker, because I can't 'bluff'. You KNOW if I have a good hand or bad hand simply by what I do, because I just can't even TRY TO LIE well. Its not that I don't TRY... its just that I CAN'T lie. My family thinks its funny, and my wife even recognized it, until it didn't jive with what she wanted, then she accused me of lying about all sorts of stuff. Usually about what she was lying about at the moment. Which for ME was a good give-away.

My friends just take advantage of me... which is fine, because I would rather lose and be truthful in life, than lie in life. Just can't make the switch to poker though...

Something that used to just irritate the living daylights out of me was when my lying WH would say, "I hate a liar!" when talking about someone who lied to him.

I finally told him that I was sick of hearing that from someone who was actively lying to me. I haven't heard him say it since then.

My XWH had this obvious thing he did when lying, so I could always tell. He would try to act like he was being "normal" by doing kind of a fake "yawn" thing. I don't think he ever knew he was doing it and I certainly never told him.

So if I could see him, I could catch it.

But yes, lies turn into more lies which turn into more lies and on and on.

My DH is an evasive liar. He is a man of few words to begin with and he does not consider witholding truth to be a lie. When I ask him a question, he responds with as little information as possible and if I want the whole story we play 20 questions. He still does not see how this is a LB for me but it keeps my antennae up continuously.

God's Blessings,

Say

I have an interesting one - WH visited the kids a month ago and I asked him finally for the house key back (my son has lost 2 of my keys and we are now using the side door so WH's key is the only one left) - and he says he doesn't remember where it is and then immediately also told me that his brother gave him a key also and he can' find that either.

I think he lied by the way but I don't care as I get the locks changed.