She came home sometime last night, after all of us went to bed.
I knew that she would feel entitled to that.
She was acting all nice to me this morning, like nothing had happened.

I guess tonight I will continue to push to get her out. And go file next week if she doesn't. Unfortunate timing, though. It's my son's birthday tomorrow.

Well, a lot of love busting last night.

She won't leave. She did call her lawyer when I told her to not come home. She insists talking to "her friend" is not an affair - although they have told each other they "care for each other deeply" and she refuses to stop talking to him.

She was furious that I am seeking sole custody. She wants to "do it right" and share the boys.

Arkhawk, stick to your guns. "Talking" to her lawyer is a lot of bluster and game-playing. I have read advice here to others saying "change the locks while she/he is gone, and let the lawyers handle it after."

She is intimidating you. If you're ready for Plan B, don't let her bully you. If she goes out, pack a suitcase and put it on the doorstep with a Plan B letter. While it's true that you can't legally deny her access to the house unless you have an agreement in writing that says otherwise, why not make her do some of the legwork? Make her lawyer earn his fee.

You're either in Plan A, Plan B or Plan FU/D. And it doesn't really matter which -- you have to gain some control over YOUR life and not let her run all over it.

Last night she agreed to move out.

I assume that this is probably it.

Ark-You wanted her to move out. It will be easier to do PLan B. Just because she is out of the house, all is not lost. Just look at my siggy. My WH has been gone for 4.5 months and he has been living with POSOW ever since. I don't feel like it is all lost. I am just working the Plans. I have faith in MB and DrH's concepts. Keep your head up. Do this the right way and you will live with no regrets no matter which way this turns out.

You're right. I did want her out if she was not going to commit to NC. The reality of doing it is somewhat sobering, though. I know it will be better.

She is saying she just wants independence. Part of me thinks there may be more than just the affair going on here. Like maybe she was so scarred by me not showing her enough attention, or that she just isn't the commitment type.

Last night my little boy made us a card. It had a picture of a boy smiling and said "me if you stop fighting" then Mom and Dad I love you very very much. I wish you would stop fighting. love ya so please stop fighting that causes lightning. I love you mom. I love you dad. I hope you love me back.

I do have some plan B questions:
-How is the best way to handle joint decisions on the children without actually talking? Is it possible?
-What type of mindset do you go into this with? Is it a "I'm getting on with my life and preparing for the worst" because there is still a little part in there that is saying "this may be the reality shock she needs to make her wake up" - I am not sure which is healthiest.
-Should there be agreed upon time limits of how long this goes on before divorce
-are short emails/texts ok to commuicate things (like I'm dropping the boys off now, etc)

Anything else I should be prepared for?

What kind of joint decisions are you talking about?

You go into it with this mindset, "I need to protect myself from my WS and their A. I will make a GREAT life for myself. I will only talk to WS when these conditions are met."

The time limit is YOURS and YOURS alone. Do not tell your WW your time limit. Just set it in your own mind(DrH says 2 years of PLan B because anything longer and the chances of M R drop dramatically). It is really up to you though.

NO SHORT EMAILS AND TEXTS. That is CONTACT. If it was an A, would it be okay for a WS to exchange short emails/texts? It is NC in Plan B.

Do you have an IM set up? Have you told them what is expected of them? Have you written a Plan B letter? You should post it on here so others can chime in to help you.

Does your WW know about MB? Has she read anything on here? I am just wondering how much info about Plan B she would already have.

Ok, thanks, good info.

WW knows about MB forum but doesn't know the concepts, except exposure . I have asked her to post her story on here, as she has said she is confused, to ask for advice. I doubt she will.

No specific joint decisions in mind, but mainly about the kids. Keeping them longer to go on a vacation, allowing them to go to camp, play a sport, etc.

I do have a plan b letter that I plan to give her as she walks out?

I guess I will help her move. Thoughts on that?

Anything other than the "usual" visitations, etc, would be done through the IM.

What do you mean by helping her to move out? Packing, putting it in the truck, etc?

Would you be willing to post your Plan B letter? It seems that a first draft is usually not always the best. I used the one from SAA almost word for word and posters still suggested changes.

Yeah



Yeah, I'll put it together and post it later.

I don't see why you shouldn't help her pack and stuff as long as you can keep yourself in check. Your one last Plan A hurrah.

Make sure you are pulling off a SUPERB Plan A right up until the last moment. Make her last memories be those of a GREAT husband.

Plan B letter.....feedback welcome.

xxxx,

I wanted to tell you how much that you have meant in my life for the past 14 years. I will fondly remember all of the wonderful things about you. I'll remember the one-of-a-kind experiences that we shared, such as celebrating St. Patrick's Day in Savannah, etc. But most of all, I will remember creating and raising our two wonderful children, the precious memories of their births and the special things that they have done.

xxx, I have always loved you and believed in you. You have forged a place in my heart that will last a lifetime. I apologize for any part that I may have played in your unhappiness. I realize that I did not provide enough emotional support to you. As you have witnessed over the last year, you know that I am willing to go the extra mile to support you and meet your needs.

But I cannot do that unless you decide to stop pursuing relationships with other men. You must understand the pain and suffering that I have endured because of your continued contact with them, the behavior that you have demonstrated and the choices that you have made that have affected us both and our family. I simply cannot be around you any longer knowing that you continue to do these things. Therefore, I am going to avoid seeing or talking to you. If you would like to communicate with me about the children or other matters, please contact my family or your family and they can contact me directly.

I ask that you respect my decision to separate from you this way. I still love you, but I cannot see you under these conditions. I would like for us to rebuild our marriage someday. I would like for our family to be whole and provide our children with what we've always wanted for them and what they deserve. I want us to be able to meet each other's emotional needs and avoid doing anything to hurt each other. We need to build a new lifestyle in which everything we do makes
us both happy. I want to be your best friend - someone who is always there for you when you need me. And I want you as my best friend.

I loved you when I married you and I continue to love you to this day. I just cannot be around you as long as you continue your behavior.

Well, it took quite a bit of time but she is finally moving out.

I sat her down one night few weeks ago and told her if she was going to continue talking to the other person then she had to move out. And since she refused to move out, then she needed to go and file for divorce. She said "I need to talk with my attorney...I said why, your attorney shouldn't tell you to divorce or not, just facilitate the process.

I was getting nowhere. So I asked her to write down what she wanted out of a divorce. She said why. I said because you just might get it. She refused repeatedly. I started asking questions like "Do you want your vehicle" "Is 50/50 custody acceptable"...and writing down her responses. She quickly stopped the conversation when she saw what I was doing.

She said "I think I just need to move out and separate for awhile" (Yes, I know what that means, but Plan B has to start).

She set up her own bank account and I started taking her off my stuff. She got her own credit card. After doing the finances, she will need to adopt the Ramen noodle lifestyle, which is completely different than her current way of living.

Good job. Time for plan B.

I'm pretty sure I know the answer to this, but I'd like for you folks to help decipher (since I'm probably too close to the situation).

OM lives 100 miles away. He got another girlfriend 6 weeks ago. Contact didn't really stop but slowed way down. WW says the contact is usually argumentative.

WW says she needs to move out (not because of me but because of her). She says she isn't in love with me (and that's the most important thing in marriage) and she probably never will and doesn't know if she wants to. She says she needs to move out to help her sort through it all.

She says she has a lot of anger toward me. For not meeting her needs in the marriage, for exposing what she did, and for ruining her relationship with her family by exposing.

She had a horrible childhood (divorce, sexual abuse, death of only parent when 18, rape, eating disorders). She frequently gets "signs" from her dead mother. She believes she talks to her mother through psychics. She is addicted to romance movies and falls in love with and is friends with everyone (except me).

She tells me moving out definitely has nothing to do with the other person. It's something she has to do. She's always lived under someone else's rules and she hates it. She has to prove her independence to herself.

She said she is able to communicate easier with me but there is still nothing there. But, perhaps maybe, just maybe that moving out will make her want to start dating me again.

Anyway, since that last conversation I just put my best foot forward and waited for the apartment to become available. Now that she is moving out, I plan to do Plan B - no talking, no helping out, no friends, etc.

What do you need to know? ALL FOG BABBLE. Is that what you were expecting?

You wanted her out so you could start Plan B, right? Well, she is moving. Do you have everything covered? Are you prepared? You are going to be DARK AS NIGHT, right? IM set up? Plan B letter, etc?

Blah, blah, blah.

We'll see if marriage is the problem. We'll see if independent life is better than marriage. Let her hit rock bottom, and then we'll see how she feels.

I concur with the others. We'll see what will happen when she finds out that your aren't the problem and that reality is the greatest task master of all. She should look great with after a little while on the top ramen diet. LOL.

Typical wayward fog babble, alien speak...

Your wife is right about not being in love with you. That is what MB is supposed to be all about. That is what Plan A is supposed to accomplish, giving the wayward some reason to fall in love again.

When Plan A doesn't accomplish that, then Plan B lets the betrayed spouse gain some traction at living a real life again and ignore the daily pain and suffering that go with having a wayward spouse till the wayward spouse has an epiphany.

Dr Harley is clear that the best hope for a marriage that is blown to bits by infidelity is a short, intense, highly motivated Plan A followed by a sudden and dark Plan B. If Plan A lingers for too long, then the Love Bank of the betrayed spouse becomes the biggest obstacle to recovery once the affair burns out, which nearly all do within a couple of years.

Those who continue Plan A too long usually believe that at some point that epiphany will come to the WS and things will suddenly turn around. They attempt to educate the WS into doing the right thing. They try to coerce the WS into doing the right thing. They try to manipulate or leverage the WS into doing the right thing. It almost never does what Plan A followed by Plan B can accomplish and by the time the affair is over the BS has decided to move on without the WS.

ALL waywards say "It isn't about US or YOU, this is about ME." (They got that part right; it's ALL about the wayward)
ALL waywards say that they can't see any way to love the BS again.
ALL waywards say that this is their one big chance to be happy.
ALL waywards say that the affair partner has nothing to do with the problems in the marriage.
ALL waywards say the same things, Arkhawk, ALL OF THEM...

It's the very definition of waywardness.

Those who learn to ignore what the waywards are saying and devise and stick to a PLAN are the ones who stand the best chance of a normal life...

WITH or WITHOUT the wayward...

Mark