Well, that's pretty much what I thought - lots of fog.

I figure she wants to move out so she can avoid being accountable to anyone.

With multiple affairs, clear self-esteem issues, and an infatuation with romance, I sometimes wonder if this person has what it takes to be in a mature relationship (maybe she always lives in some sort of fog).

You're right on every point, Mark. I know I will be just fine without her. It took a while to get to that point, even though everyone tells you that all along. She, however, won't be. That is both satisfying, and sad.

Well, plan B is definitely harder than I thought.

Pretty sure the affair has been all but dead for awhile, but she is on this kick where she has to be hanging out with her friends every night...going to concerts, swimming, movies....like a high school kid.

I finally took the kids on a 10-day trip to get away from her while she was moving out. She made a few token calls to speak to the boys but all just a facade. Now they are with their grandparents for a couple more weeks and I guess I just don't understand how a mother can choose concerts, and vaucous friends over her own children and go a month without even seeing them.

It's like she's in some sort of midlife crisis where she wants to act like a teenager. She calls it independence, but there is no responsibility - she just wants freedom to go and do what she wants, when she wants.

I don't have much optimism that the woman I married is ever coming back or that Plan B is going to help in that. I think her selfishness and sense of entitlement is engrained in her. A big part of me just wants to move on without her and I won't do that as long as I am married (even as broken as the marriage is). I am just sick of the limbo.

Sorry, I know I didn't say much, just needed to vent.

Well, you signed on for it, ark. Like Dr Harley has said "Plan C is the most likely to lead to divorce."

If you choose to be a conflict avoider, you have to also be willing to suffer those consequences. This the natural result of your conflict avoidance: an entitled wife and a destroyed marriage.

OK. so what now?

If Plan A was good, exposure has (I think) pretty much killed the affair. Now she's moved out and I've started Plan B..... not sure what else there is.

When did you go into Plan B? Did you send her a letter? Who is your intermediary? How are you handling visitations? Are you in a completely dark Plan B?

I've not seen her in 10 days. I did talk to her once during that time on the phone when she called me. I did write the letter. I could get darker, since I did answer the phone that one time.

I know I havent done everything right. But last year I was dang near perfect. Great plan A, killed the affair, she recommitted. The ONLY thing wrong was I did ask questions about the affair which was a Love Buster. And even then, she took the easy road of striking up a relationship with a guy on FaceBook from her work computer. Now that I exposed and killed that affair, she still is interested in herself. I admit, it took a long time to get her to move out. But, its done.

She took some money from our account to get moved out, but now has no access to any of our finances. And she makes minimum wage.

That is plan C. I would try Plan B and go completely DARK. Change the locks and name an intermediary.

She knows she can contact you at her whim. That needs to be changed if you want to have any hope of yanking her off the fence.

OK.

I know that Dr Harley says that Plan B could go on for 2 years and then the betrayed should file for divorce. But, what is the realistic timeframe here?

I ask because if this separation lasts very long, I'm not sure I am going to be willing to work on the marriage after a certain point. And that point is probably not very long. I just think that I will always wonder what she did while we were separated, and she's done enough already.

Unless you were a complete jerk when you asked her questions about her betrayal and adultery, asking questions is NOT a love buster.

I honestly don't feel bad about that. I was not a total jerk. She said that talking about the affair made her feel ashamed and built a wall between us. My opinion is that was a requirement from her. It's the very least she could do to help the healing process.

But, in hindsight, I think it was all a lie. If she felt ashamed for having an affair and talking about it with me made it more embarrassing, then why did she start another one a couple of months later. I'm sure she didn't want to discuss the details, but only because she didn't want me to know what she had done (it may come back to haunt her in court or with OM's wife or her family).

If you wanna go really dark...

change the locks

block her cell number

block her on FB so she can't see pix of you and your kids

I'm really sorry that you have to deal with this, and two years is a long way away, so don't focus on what SHE is doing, actually in plan B you shouldn't be even knowing what she is doing, just focus on yourself and your kids, have fun, I know this will be hard but what other choice do you have other then be miserable?

Keep going! Don't give up, remember that you have 2 handsome sons to take care of

What he says is don't let it go longer than 2 years. The timeframe is up to you.

It is amazing how many entitled WS there are. Some cases are really bad. I m sorry for you. I know the pain ... and the feel that these WS are really into something so selfish so much "about their hapiness" that we can only get hurt by them again and again....
blessing

Well, I'm not sure this Plan B is going to bring about any reconciliation. I feel a change happening. One that I really don't want, but probably need. There are times when I think of her and see her as a complete stranger. That battles with the desire I have to preserve my family.

She's probably the most selfish woman in the world now. I don't know if she's involved with anyone, just that she goes to concerts, etc almost every night with her friend. But I avoid talking to her or snooping.

What I really cant believe is that she went 34 days without seeing her two boys (7 and 9) and barely talked on the phone with them. Her family thinks she has a personality disorder, she certainly fits the criteria. Sometimes, I want to believe that...to help explain her actions.

Anyway, I feel like I am in limbo. For some odd reason, I still want to keep my family together, but have to sacrifice, hoping that may happen, knowing deep down it probably won't. I am a much better dad now, but I sorely miss them when they are with her. That's got me feeling low now, and the fact that she's bought their attention with her dog and a new Xbox.

If you are truly in Plan B, then how do you KNOW that she is going to concerts at all?

You should NOT know what is going on. I know too much, and I beat myself up all of the time for it and I don't KNOW what my WH is doing on even a daily basis. The trickle I get is innocently told to me through myDS10. THAT is enough to throw me in a tailspin some times. If you are going to do a GREAT Plan B, it has to be a WHOLE one. It is NOT just about NC. Take this time to improve YOURSELF. LEarn about relationships and how to be a great spouse.

How have you been filling up your time away from the drama to change who you are? Have you found a new hobby? What are you interested in that you can do now?

Also, get a plan for recovery written down in case there is a chance that your WW will come home. You don't want to be caught without a fully devised plan and be in a false recovery.

What positive changes have you been making in YOUR life? Tell us about it or ask us for help in deciding what to do.

Well, I usually only find out because one of the kids mentions it. Sometimes I am tempted, however, to go check up on her - I tell myself if she is talking with OM, then I'm filing - but I have, so far, not acted on those temptations.

I spend time with my kids being the best dad ever, I work around the house and try to grow myself intellectually and spiritually. So I am fine and will be fine...I just want something better for the kids and it's hard to believe the woman I thought I married wouldn't want that too.

Keep journaling. This will come in handy for the divorce. She's basically just handed you full custody. Heck, she'll be having to pay you child support.

It absolutely is hard to be the one "left behind." We had no say in the destruction of our dreams. We were in it for LIFE. You have to change what YOU believe now and that SUCKS. You will be able to get to the point where it IS possible to be Divorced from your wife(if/when YOU choose).

It is a slow hard process. I keep being reminded that recovery(personal or marital) is a MARATHON not a SPRINT.

Yesterday was one of the worst days of my life.

Here goes. My wife has already had one affair (PA)and I got through that one with the Marriage Builders concepts well. Great plan A, etc. Well, then she started an EA with a high school friend a couple of months later. She claimed that she stopped seeing him (he lived 90 miles away) and he had another girlfriend. But, after some time, I finally went into Plan B when she refused to work on our marriage.

We agreed that she would move out and we would not see other people because she needed time to sort through things to see if she wanted to remain in the marriage (I know, I didnt buy it either but hey, its plan B).

Also, another PA would be a dealbreaker for me. The past few weeks I've noticed that she has given me the kids exclusively. RED FLAG. So I broke Plan B after 8 weeks (I know I shouldn't have, but like I said, a PA would be a dealbreaker) and put a voice recorder in her truck. Although I should be calloused to all the cheating, when I heard talk of marriage and how often they had sex, I was sick at my stomach, just like the other DDays.

I have an appointment to file for divorce today.

Also, a friend of hers called who hasnt been in touch with us in a few years. I told her we were separated and she immediately asked if she was cheating.

She went on to say that my wife never appreciated me, always acted like a boy crazy teenager, flirted with men and led them on, was extremely self centered and shallow, and greatly exaggerated any flaw of mine.

Then she told me:

A few years back, my wife made out with a member of a country music band backstage and that they frequently called each other and talked of leaving their relationships to be together.

My wife was infatuated with her high school crush and, while on a trip home, told him how much she loved him, but she was mad because he never gave her the green light. (My wife says she doesnt think he likes girls)

She was flirting with a songwriter on Myspace about trying to hook up for a songwriting session and perhaps they would fall in love.

She always talked about hooking up with the guy who she is currently cheating with.

Well, I really tried the MB concepts and I believe in them. However, I might be dealing with something more complex. I tried following them. Perhaps my Plan A was too long and I was late getting into Plan B, but I think at some point the husband and wife have to actually be committed to the basics of a marriage and understand a little about long term committment.