Well I have no advice to add. You will have days that you struggle but you seem to be on the right path.

Hi black,

maybe this will help. I've had a rough few days. A few days ago, after nearly three years of going through the same routine, my wife finally said she was in love with the 2nd yahoo. The first A was short and miserable for her. The second I think was quite a bit different. She was still miserable, but I have been arguing with her on and off for the last 3yrs that I believe everything she did pointed to love. She said no.

Finally, this last week she admits that I was right. Now... I am devastated again. I knew it, but didn't want to believe it. Know and "knowing" are almost always different... Ugh. Now I have another question in my brain... Did she not love *me* during that time? Honestly, I am not sure I want to be married to her if that's true, no matter what changes happen.

I instituted NC in a very unique way (not as Dr. Harley Suggested), but it seems to have worked... The OM has not tried contact in 2.5 years.

CV

So, am I just in a funk or am I totally screwed up?

ok, just to be more clear... Not that she still loves the OM, but did during the A...

cv

No, she didn't, CV. She just loved the reflection of herself in his eyes.

Bliss,

Really?!?! I would really love to believe that, but... I know my story is not unique, but everything she said.... how she treated me... what she told the OM... All lies?

cv

This is a no win question. There is nothing loving about an affair to you or even the OP. APs use each other for selfish reasons. Maybe there are feelings of 'love' but it sure is not a healthy one when you look how twisted the behavior is.

If she loved you but could still cheat, then how could she?
If she didn't love you and cheated, then why is she here now?



You are going to torture yourself. The answer sucks either way...and since the answer is coming from the woman who lied to you and you don't trust...well how do you know if that answer is real or not?

One of the hardest things you will have to deal with is coming to terms with you can't apply logic to crazy.

I agree. It's like being asked the question "do you still beat your wife". However, it's not about winning or losing for me. It's simply about knowing the truth of it. Maybe I will never know... I dunno. I like that you can't apply logic to crazy, but I think I need to understand crazy... At least a little better than I do now. It really helps my brain process things.

Honestly, I have been crazy about this woman since I was 17 and she was 15. Even when she was cheating, I was crazy in love with her.

CV

I didn't mean it in the literal sense of you winning or losing something as much as what will it change in the big picture.


Her answer cannot be proven either way...it will never be a cold hard fact. You will have to take her word for it and considering the craziness going on in a WS's head during the affair...well...


I can understand that. The brain works that way and your thinking is very normal BTW.

Raven,

Thanks for this. I think I know you are right... Now I have another problem. Have I coerced her into admitting something that wasn't true?

You know how they say that a person's greatest gifts are also sometimes his greatest weaknesses? Mine can be to be very convincing in an arguement (can't tell here)... Anyway, I fear I may have mucked it up more


CV
"When I drink whiskey I drink whisky, when I drink water I drink water" Mick-o-line O'Flynn

BTW... What's plan D?

D = Divorce

Ah. Sorry for that... (gingerly removing foot from mouth)

Cv

No need to apologize.

FYI at times you may see Plan FU and that means Plan FU! LOL

So this is a crazy question, as we are waiting for the books (tomorrow I hope!)... Does the "fog" extend to the BS as well? If so, it would explain how I feel a lot of the time... Dazed and confused. Like my brain is running independent of my body.

We learned the hard way that sleep is very important for both of us. Her because of the Fibromyalgia and the eye problems, me because of my wee little brain which never shuts off anymore. When I'm tired I do many more LB's...

CV

A lot of affairees, consciously or subconsciously, need to build up the romantic side of a tawdry affair because they know how wrong it is. See, if they're "in love" it's okay to jump the bones of someone who isn't their spouse. It's a part of the fog, CV. My DH said he was never "in love" with his affair partner - he said he didn't even know why he told her that.

Simple answer: If they were 'in love' the affair would be 'pure' instead of 'tawdry' It permitted them to have sex with a person who wasn't their spouse. So they said it. Next question?

Waywards can be terribly cruel to their loved ones while in the fog - it's the addiction speaking.

I think you're really comparing apples to oranges if you're trying to figure out your "affairing WW" vs. your "faithful wife."

As far as what she told OM, no. They weren't lies at the time. They were part of the construction of the affair. It wasn't that they were lies or truth - they weren't reality. There's an important distinction. It's why you need to focus more on affair-proofing your M. What you're doing right now is dissecting the affair.

I'm not saying that's a bad thing - you do need to have an understanding of that part of your reality. What I AM saying is that understanding whether or not some portion of the fogbabble is 'true' or 'false' or 'questionable', etc., still won't change your game plan for preventing this from happening again.

MB,

I am trying to maintain a healthy balance. Thanks for making the distinction between reality and the affair. This helps greatly I think. And you are right it doesn't change the game plan.

Did you see my question above about the "fog" extending to the BS? Is that possible? All the confusion, etc that comes along with finding out about the A?

CV

I know many of you are talking to my FWW on her thread. Thanks for that. I know I'm not supposed to interact on her thread. Can I do it here?

The last two days have been rough (but good) for both of us. The comment on her thread about rewriting history was interesting, as were the comments about her being generally dishonest.

No, generally she no longer has a problem (used to in a big way) being honest about most things we talk about. I've thought about this a lot in the last 2 years or so... In fact, I think she is generally honest about everything but the affair. Let me clarify... We are not talking about where she was, what she did, etc... We have done numerous timelines and such. Filled in details, made logical deductions when details couldn't be remembered.

The issue we are largely facing is dealing with what she felt and thought. Part of the problem is that she has FM and that causes memory issues. Part of the problem is the whirlwind... I was a nutcase (probably certifiable) after I found out. I did some things to the OM I should probably be in jail for right now.

All that is to say there really has been no contact outside of me having "met" him a few times.

I wonder if in all the confusion, insanity and drama if it wasn't my fww that was rewriting history, but me. I interrogated her on many occasions. I yelled, screamed, argued. We didn't sleep a lot or eat a lot the first year. I slept about an hour a night the first 5 or 6 weeks and then my body gave out. I ended up on bed rest for exhaustion, dehydration and not having eaten in several weeks (I lost 25lbs in the first 2 months and am not a big guy).

I wanted answers and I wanted them immediately. I was a Marine. I know how to turn the Marine on and off. I was in D.I. mode a lot of the time. Is it possible that I was doing this and not her?

CV

It's really not a great idea to take issues on your W's thread and bring them here. In general, you shouldn't be reading, involving yourself in what she is getting help for on her thread.

But to answer your Q, if you could be the cause of the issues of O&H, because of your reactions the first year the answer is no. Because having two As and hiding one of them for years are red flags for having a SSL (secret second life) and issues with PORH (radical honesty).

But OTOH, having AOs, DJs when your W did try to tell you the truth could have exacerbated the problem. Have you read up on the O&H articles under the Q&A section?

For avoid trouble liars or conflict avoiders, it is important that you don't "punish" her for telling you the truth in the future. Because she needs to become radically honest with you about her thoughts and feelings...it is extremely important in meeting ENs, POJA etc.

Anyway, I don't think I have posted to you yet so welcome to MB!

SuzieQ, Et al..

Suzie, Thanks for the welcome! I do see that i have the tendency quite often to punish her for the truth. I have read them, spent the day reading them again on and off. She has bared the grim details of the A. I asked for every detail I could think of. I wonder if my desire to know has backfired.

It was comforting to know that as we read the site, there were many things we did right, even though we did them not knowing what we were doing. Been making and withdrawing deposits in the lb like crazy.

I am finding it very hard to let my wall of self-protection down. I don't want to be hurt again.

CV