WE ALL had money stress when we went thru this. LOTS. Sometimes you have to ask your relatives or friends to help you out when it comes to something as crucial as securing sole custody and keeping ow away from kids.

I'd contact a PI and have not only her but her trailer-ish family investigated if it were me. You might get a mother load of information.

The only other way free is to go to the courthouse, and see if they have any documents (court or judgement related) against her and her relatives. But you must pay for the copies (but like a few cents per page to have them printed). Go to every courthouse. Family law court, superior and criminal court. Get names and if possible, addresses and or birthdays on all of them. Go after it. YOu have to do the work somehow.

Okay so as expected he took the children to their smutty rutting lair. Should I send any messages to him about this through the IM?

They hung out with her and her kids in their two bedroom apartment.

I read your last two posts. I am not sure what you could/should do. Just wanted to let you know I read them.
Try to ride the emotions about it but transcend above them this evening to a calmer place and we will all sleep on it and try to collect our thoughts and give you input on it tomorrow.

Breathe.

I have no clue. What has your legal counsel said about your position here? You have none? If you don't, I think I would reiterate through IM, a nonemotional statement of "Mehr supports you spending time with the children but requests that you do not expose them to (OW name) in the future. She requests that you find another way to spend time with them and nurture your relationship with them during this difficult time ".

Have her put it in an email and make sure she is keeping copies for future reference should you need to show that you are allowing him access but also, respectfully putting the children in his hands.

He is trying to make it that you are the wicked witch having the kids diss OW. That you are a biotch. He is going to try to goad you and paint you as such for the forseeable future. Do your best to be matter of fact with the legal system and through IM, do not be baited into breaking plan B (I think he is kind of trying to get you to do so).

You are a woman who is his wife and the mother of his children.

Someone,find the 'red cape' post for her.

Yes, that is the kind of message I want to send. I do have a problem though -- WH does not have email so it would need to be a text message. Those get deleted. I guess I could save my copy that is sent to the IM ... ??? In this case, she could forward my exact words you think?

You stick to your guns and you say that the kids are having issues with his adulterous affair and the emotional harm it is causing.

What I did were:
1)get info and background on the skanky ow
2)not tell A SOUL but get the kids to a child psych to get them to SHOW and DOCUMENT that his affair and exposing them to adultery is causing EMOTIONAL ABUSE. This can be easily done.

The whole "integration" phase of getting the affair partner around the kids is DANGEROUS DANGEROUS and shows the affair going off in a different direction potentially.

What if daddy found out his skankho had a dui? Would he consider marrying somebody like that wondering what would happen if she strapped those kids into their carseats with her driving? What if he found out skankho had an arrest record where she had some kind of violence or domestic violence record? Would he feel safe if he found out she was violent or had those tendencies? What about if she had done drugs in the past?

Not only will those things MAKE THE WAYWARD THINK TWICE about putting the kids around them, but THE JUDGE WOULD THINK TWICE about putting the kids, YOUR KIDS around the affair partner. This is why I say go go go find out about her past! Beg borrow and get money for a PI or be prepared to instantly begin the legwork to get this done.

Also, get the kids to a child psych right now! Get it DOCUMENTED that the affair is causing emotional harm and damage to the kids now. It is. They may appear fine around skankho and daddy, but they're truly not and WE KNOW THAT. This MUST BE DONE.

If that is done also, the JUDGE WILL THINK TWICE of having the kids around ow ever or the affair. And also gives you SOLE CUSTODY.

They are trying to paint the picture of everybody being ok, it's just that daddy is with a new lady now. That is the scary dream of the waywards and they will work together to try to force this down everybodys' throats.

Your job is to further expose the ow by digging out her shady past. They pretty much all have them in one way or another. My old lawyer once said this.."You know, women or men for that matter, who are so deeply involved in an affair that they will be okay with breaking up a family with kids, HAVE TO HAVE SOMETHING SERIOUSLY wrong with them."

I found out my xwh's affairage wife HAD A PAST OF DOING DRUGS. My xwh had instantly married her after the divorce and the info came in 2 weeks before it was final. He later recanted and said had she not been pregnant, he wouldn't have married her KNOWING SHE DID DRUGS in her past. It truly freaked him out and we threatened further modifications, so she was never left around my son alone ever when over at the affair rut lair house.

I am SURE 100 percent this is one of the KEY PIECES which led my xh to eventually want to dump her. Apparently he tried to divorce her the following summer. But the outlaws (my x inlaws) talked him out of another divorce.

When they're this much dug into the affair, when they're IMMUNE as it would seem to HARMING THEIR OWN KIDS AND FORCING THIS DOWN THEIR THROATS, and WHEN THEY ARE NOT SUPPORTING THEIR LEGITIMATE FAMILY, YOU GO TO EVERY AND ANY LENGTH TO STOP THIS!

You stop this now. You do the least, which would be to take every effort known to man and womankind and SECURE SOLE CUSTODY. First step in breaking the cycle.

Two failproof ways are to 1)get kids to child psych and document legally that they are being emotionally harmed by their fathers' abandonment of the family. You see by daddy bringing them to the rutting lair, HE IS TRYING TO GET OUT OF THE ABANDONMENT charge, so you STOP THEM from going over there. It's all strategy from here on out
2)You get the background and all negative information you can on the OW and USE IT AGAINST HER. You go after her with everything you have. Borrow or do whatever you can to get a PI to help you or line up your options and search thru the court house records for everything you can find.

The biggest chance of this affair ending is that real life intervenes and does so SOONER rather than LATER.

We teach people how they can treat us. My lawyer once told me "YOU teach that cheating husband of yours to treat YOU AND THE CHILD with RESPECT and you do that by slamming hard down on him legally right now giving him not one inch and bringing hell on earth to his mistress."

How can you accomplish this? I told you how.

I suggest this to EVERY BETRAYED SPOUSE who may be fighting for their kids.

The affair then has a good chance of breaking up if daddy (or mommy if she's wayward) finds out he/she lost the kids because the AFFAIR IS SHOWN WRONG by the judge dude. And if their RUTTING PARTNER is found to be UNFIT to be around the kiddies, courtesy of something in their skanky past, then a RE-ASSESSMENT of their situation goes on almost immediately. Probably will then kill off the ever-entrenched affair where they are living together.

In our last court appearance, right before the divorce, before we ended up in a last minute settle (we were ordered back), my lawyer got the ow on the stand and her roomate, which was AWESOME. The roommate told the judge that yes, they together had done drugs in their apartment (her friend she lived with).

What happened at that same time, was when the OW'S EX FIANCEE AND DAD OF HER CHILD found out about what our PI FOUND OUT, he went to court, got an emergency hearing and HE GOT SOLE CUSTODY AWAY FROM THE OW and to this day, he has sole custody OF HER SON.

Because of me Because I was GOING TO PROTECT MY SON AGAINST MY XWH AND OW. Thank God I found out and got a PI.

Anyhow, you should have seen the look on my xwh's face in court when my lawyer called the friend into the court. Her roommate had been (PI found out) busted for drugs. OW didn't think that this could ever come out. But I found out.

My xwh had a look of sheer horror and turned to look at ow in row behind him with that same look and one of DISGUST when the judge was questioning her roomate (ex room mate b/c she was now shacked up with my husband and her child).

REALITY had hit my then wh. He had sitting in the row behind him, his mistress who was almost 8 months pregnant, and he just found out she was involved in illegal drug use.

SCARED MUCH? Oh yes he was. He looked at me like "OMG. What have I done?"

THIS IS WHY YOU GET DIRTY AND FIGHT. Odds are you'll find something out. That and the info from a child psych is PRICELESS and will secure custody.

Look, the OW is neither Beaver cleaver's mom nor is the OM Mr. Brady from the Brady Bunch.

They are evil, conniving, lying, cheating, and STEALING people who have no second thought about hurting or harming kids, breaking their hearts and homes forever, muchless the hearts of the betrayed spouses, whom they'd run over with a heartbeat.

You fight back with intelligence, knowledge, and with sometimes getting some professional help (child psychologists and PI).

You put the proof of the affair being bad (all knowledgeable psychologists can tell you it hurts kids period) BACK UPON THE WAYWARD AND THEIR AFFAIR PARTNER. Never ever let them shove the "brady bunch" scenario down on you if you have kids. Never.

I am so overwhelmed by this.... I am afraid that instead a child psych will tell me that I am upsetting them by telling them that dating while married is wrong.... what if it backfires against me....

Also I have no money for a PI. I have to eat and pay bills and I can only do that for another month because all I have is all I have, and its going to be another month before I get any CS.... possibly more. What if I shell out $300 just to find out she has absolutely nothing in her past??? It could be a waste of time and effort and I will feel stupid. I guess I could pay the 35 dollars for all these sites online that want me to pay.... they may not be efficient though and show me anything either... I don't know how they work.

I cleaned out my text message box.... so many "I love you's" from WH from just 2 months ago... or he sent "I can't wait to see you" while living with the other woman.... these were during Plan A of course. And now.... ??? How can you go from THAT to THIS?

I know it is overwhelming. It sucks majorly to deal with. I am so sorry.

Have your IM keep your emails and try to keep her text messages to WH in her phone. I know there are ways to print them out but having them on her phone is a record.

Send the message through her that I noted earlier AND try to press your lawyer to make a stance for the children being exposed. Or, call around to see if any other lawyer is game to give it a go.

I understand about the PI being expensive. I never hired one but got real good at finding out stuff here and there on my own.

Now that you are in plan B.....I think it best to ride the train and stay focused on you.

It is awful that the kids are being exposed to the OW but know that the fantasy romance is not as lovely with six kids in the mix (alas.....kids mess up romances) Read the part in surviving an affair where Sue and her OM ignored the kids for each other pre- plan B and did vice versa post- plan B.

(maniacal laugh here)

and

hugs

The idea that it wouldn't be as great of a fantasy with the kids all around has occurred to me.... but what MORE appears in my mind is my kids liking her, or accepting the situation. They are SO little, they will barely remember mom and dad being together.

Thank you reading.... I have been thinking about this. Well, trying not to, but I have been thinking about it anyway. Sigh.

I think I am going to call the doctor tomorrow and see about antidepressants. I feel really snippy with the kids, often on edge...

This morning while getting ready for church I found a letter written from my husband to me in 1999 when we were dating -- he talks about how he will wait however long to marry me and how he knows he is in God's will and it makes him so happy.... along with all the usual mushy gushy "I love yous" ... so sad to see that we have come to this.... please God, I pray he (and she) feels guilt and conviction every waking moment and then has dreams about it at night. Amen.

What about YOU DOING THE FOOTWORK and going to the courts yourself? That is the other option I keep telling you about. It takes hard work though and you need the ow's real name and if you can, her address and names of her relatives or whoever she lived with.

Take that to the courthouse.

Find or get a referral from your church about a FAITH BASED child psych and call and explain to them how it is HARMING them.

I wasn't made of money either, but my then wh was. I didn't have access to alot of $ either. But had a few friends and my grandparents loan me $ for an attny and for the PI.

My lawyer also told me if I went to the courthouse and did that work, it's cheaper that way too. Many of us have walked this path before.

It is just playing smarter than the ws.

To me doing the footwork... yes it is possible... I am having trouble functioning though... and I have 4 kids under 7. Ever go into a courthouse with 4 kids under 7? Or a bank? I take them everywhere with me now because I have no backup.... rarely get a minute to myself...

I really do need to see the doctor.

And tomorrow I am going to the aid office with all 4.... and the grocery store.... by the end of the day I am so so spent.... I cannot tell you how exhausting it is... my husband practically abandoned me when the 4th baby was born, made me do it all myself.... I wish I had 2 kids right now. Just 2. When I have 2 kids it is like a day off.

Do see your doctor. Know that anti-Ds take a while to kick in.
Perhaps there is something you can take that would work more quickly and still keep you functioning to care for the kids and not bother the little one you nurse.

After the birth of a child is a common time men cheat. Do not feel that you are alone in that. It is cruel-er but a time when you were even less able to meet his needs and he turned away from you and not to you.

You are not alone. We all understand here.

Mehr, My husband starting cheating on me when my son was 1. It must be common, he can go for two weeks without calling the boys. He does not want the responsibilty of a family. It is sad how they can turn away from their families. I guess it does break up the fantasy having kids around, you do not have to worry about a babysitteer. I feel for you, I am snippy with the boys sometimes and I only have two. Four kids are a handful, try to stay patient.
If you are going to go on a anti-depressent, ask for some xanax to help, while the AD's take a while to come into effect.

Hang in there. It is a roller coaster for sure.

Definitely see your doctor about an anti-depressant. I had been on anti-depressants and in therapy once before years ago, so on D-Day, before I even confronted WH, I called my doctor for an appointment to get medication and also get a recommendation for a therapist. I knew this situation was going to be more than I could emotionally handle without help.

You have it even harder than me with four kids instead of my only two and your youngest only being a year old. I know I struggle with having the time and energy to do everything I need to do. Remember that right now things do not have to be perfect. Aim for "good enough."

My DS5 is starting with his child psychologist tonight. If you want details about what his therapist says, let me know. I've already met with her twice. Both my therapist and his told me what to watch for to see if the situation is affecting my kids. Some of the big things were regression (like sleep disturbances or accidents) and seeking security/self-soothing (like using a binky more than usual or another security object).

Are your IMs still your in-laws? I worry about that not helping the situation because they won't filter well enough. One of the biggest things that sets me back is hearing ANYTHING about WH. People have a hard time understanding that I do not want any new information. I do not want to hear about him. If I bring him up that's one thing, because it might be I am trying to process something that's already upsetting me. But no one else should bring him up first, ever.

I also fought the battle of not having OW around my kids and for now I seem to be successful (although I worry that his cooperation on that could change at any moment). One thing that I think helped there was having everyone I could confront him about not exposing our kids to that. I had also talked to three lawyers and only one was assertive and aggressive enough to be willing to fight for that, but that gave me the confidence to stand up for it. I made it very clear I was not depriving him of his kids; he could have them whenever he wanted. What he could not do was expose our kids to his A or OW in any way. I know he spoke to a lawyer over this and he tried to bully me into giving in, but eventually he was the one who did. I don't have any idea why because my IM filter is that good.

Are you doing anything to keep a positive attitude, like keeping a gratitude journal? I journal every night before I go to sleep, even just for five minutes. Believe it or not, it really helps. It might not be for you, but there is something that will work for you.