Good for you Hyacinth! See Mehr? You CAN get the ow away from your kids. And if you're in a state where there's alienation of affection YOU SUE HER TOO.

The child psych can help you with that. You find one who is able to give court testimony and you also ask for the information to be sealed only to you, unless YOU SAY IT IS TO BE PUBLIC. That way no matter the psych's outcome, you control it and whether the court sees it or not. Does that make you feel better?

There are attorneys who will fight for you. YOU tell them what to do.

If you have the name of this OW, I'd be exposing her left and right and re-exposing her too.

You might have to bring them to the court w/you or have a friend GO WITH YOU and watch them for a few minutes while you get your information. YOu do what you have to.

AGAIN, YOU DO WHAT YOU HAVE TO DO. Things rarely fall into your lap. In beating a wayward who is ahead in the lying and cheating category, you have to wake up a bit earlier to go to war with them. You see you have to out connive them. YOu have to out smart them. And the waywards think they have the market cornered on the espionage department.

YOu show the WS that you aren't to be messed with. And that the affair CAN be broken by hard, cold, facts and a darn legal judgement that slaps the affair across its' ugly face.

Okay. Today I went to an interview to try to get aid $$ (with all kids of course), then took the kids to the store. Then I came back here and was in a dark place.

Tomorrow I have to go to the doctor and the daycare to get things squared away and then I must call a new lawyer. Before tball. Okay and I should call the pastor I saw and see if he has a child psych recommendation.

I must do this.

Good Luck, Mehr. I have my boys for three full weeks (happy about that) My WH has to be at a trade show in New Orleans with OW. He does not realize he will only see the boys for one wknd this month, he did not ask me to switch. Again, lack of responsibility or wanting to be with his kids. Document everything, I am, so when I go in front of a judge they can see they see them. Hang in there. I the end of my rope to with little hope of reconciliation. I still pray the husband I knew will come back!! I think we all do...

Good Mehr! You're making steps ahead. Good for you! Keep on going. Little steps ahead. YOu can beat the alien wayward! You can beat this affair!

Just focus on:
being good mommy
staying healthy
KEEPING FOCUSED ON THE PLAN
securing full custody
securing good financial settlement in sep agreement from the wayward

You know..once the affair Is LEGALLY established in the sep agreement hearing, GETTING THE ALIENATION OF AFFECTION SUIT AND GETTING IT WON SHOULD BE A PIECE O' CAKE

That's a good point peachy... today I talked to one lawyer, he said that it would cost more if I switch lawyers but I could still do that, and that keeping other women away from my kids is generally not imposed .... I spent 7 hours driving around getting birth certificates, filling out 4 sets of forms at the day care, getting these forms signed by friends to witness that the kids live with me.... it was busy.

Now I am wondering if I just shouldn't bother with a new lawyer for the legal separation.....

I didn't always do so well today. I feel like I can barely keep going. I have a doctors appt tomorrow and counseling if my friend can watch the kids...

Well that's good, but seriously, if you took some of the steps I told you about, the ow AND THE AFFAIR would be kept away from the kids.

I'm not the only one who has done this. Many here have. You're not keeping the WAYWARD PARENT FROM the kids, just the kids from the emotional abuse and trauama of their selfish and evil affairs, which are not condusive to being a good environment for a child to be around in anyway.

If that lawyer won't work with you, then you FIND A LAWYER WHO WILL FIGHT WITH YOU, side by side. Call around. And btw, you ASK FOR ALL YOUR LEGAL costs to be paid for by your wh. Also, the alienation of affection should be a slam dunk. A lawyer who wants to win a second suit and get paid for that too out of your winnings, would love to have you for a client.

Peachy, I am sorry but I need to step in here a minute.

I don't know what the laws are like where Mehr lives, but I can tell you that where I live there is NO WAY to keep my children away from OW. If I denied visitation to WH because he is with OW, I WOULD LOSE CUSTODY. I definitely don't need my children around OW MORE than they are now. The only possible way that I could keep OW away from my children would be immediate PHYSICAL danger. No judge is going to let me keep my children away from my WH because his A is emotionally damaging. I would risk losing my children and being put under investigation by CPS. I am NOT going to risk that, and if Mehr can do some investigating to find out if it IS possible to keep her children away from OW, then I would say go for it. But telling her over and over again that she needs to do it, when she has stated that she has spoken to more than one attorney and they say it isn't possible, isn't helping Mehr, or other who may be lurking and also can't do anything about it.

I envy the fact that you WERE able to keep OW away, I wish it could have happened in my case, but it couldn't.

Mehr, what did you do TODAY for you? What colour are your toe nails? Mine are painted BLACK and I think it's kinda cool.

Stepping in here too, but IT CAN and is done all the time. She needs to TRY. There is NO HARM IN TRYING.

If they MARRY then keeping the ow away from the child is even harder.

That's why I searched and searched and found out the past of ow, and the arrest history of her former apartment room mate for drugs. Got the admission that ow did drugs (when her little boy lived with her too) by the friend of the ow.

YOU get what you can get and try and one point that is TERRIBLY VALID is getting the child psychologist to show that the AFFAIR IS EMOTIONAL ABUSE. That way the court is presented that THE AFFAIR IS BAD, thus the kids are away from THE AFFAIR AND THE OW, but not from the wayward spouse. That way you can limit the involvement and presence of the ow.

In my case, even though my xwh married "it", when he had found out just a few weeks before that she had done drugs in front of her OWN CHILD, he was lectured to NOT HAVE THE OW ALONE around my child and my xwh did do that. Heck I think it scared him to have him (child)around her.

Mehr also is in the unique position to sue the other woman. She lives in an alienation of affection state and I have a friend, former MB'er here, who sued the om and won in his AoA state too.

Not that hard once the legal system SHOWS the affair is fact and a contributing factor to its' demise was indeed THE AFFAIR.

One thing Scotty, legalities are fluid. You can always go back if interesting information surfaces, say on your wh's ow. And in the eyes of a court, certain activities are considered harmful to kids, like drug use, violence, and emotional abuse. So you can renegotiate anything legally at any time you like in the future.

Key is YOU DON'T DENY CUSTODY TO WS because of OP. You deny the EXPOSURE to the affair to the kids because of its' harmful effects, like say asbestos. And it's easily proven that an affair can be emotionally damaging to the kids. If the OW is part of the affair, which she is, then SHE IS DAMAGING TO THE KIDS, not the wayward dad or mom alone. It's how it is presented.

It's presented like a disease causing factor, or a form of emotional or child abuse basically. Like it's something harmful, which we know it 100 percent absolutely IS.

It's so good Mehr that you are seeing a doctor and seeing a counselor too.

In plan B personal recovery is something too that shold be given alot of priority! Good for you!

Do something special for yourself, like Scotty said to do. I'd take long bubble baths at night. That was my "me" thing I'd do.

Tell us one great fun thing you'll do for yourself right now!

You're doing good. You're making steps to ensure the kids are safe, and getting the financials in order, so that's awesome. And I know it's hard with little ones all around. So when maybe they're alseep tucked in bed, you can have a bubble bath maybe or do something like paint your nails/toenails!

I like hot pink for summer. My toes are hot pink right now

Here is something that may be the case, but I don't WANT to accept: Maybe I can't keep her from them. But then maybe 4 kids will be sobering for her, also. If kids mess up fantasies....

Obviously I do not want to use the kids in this way... but maybe God can use it for good...

Thank you for the support.

I wasn't really able to do anything today for me .... this is my busy last week before I start college again and will be even more busy. Ugh.

I know I will feel better once the financials are in order. I want that court date, i want this settled and his income coming this way.

I am not sure what to do for personal recovery... hmm.

Mehr - Something that is helping me cope in Plan B is my ability to look at my WH's infidelity as an addiction, and I was his codependent enabler.

My IC and I have made great progress with me by seeing how codependent I was with my WH all these years. He and I spent many years in the Taker/Giver role; I gave and he took.

It is still hard to let him go, but it is getting easier. Realizing I cannot do anything about his current out of control addiction helps to focus on me, the only person I can control.

That is why Plan B is there because it is your only option to detach from this awful addiction. Dr. H knows that healthy detachment will preserve the love you have, but keep you from emotional scars. You have to treat your WH as a crack addict. Read and research everything you know about addiction. It will help you understand yourself better, how you are not part of this, and how the wayward can only come out of this on their own when they are ready.

Treat OW as the pipe, and dig for information on her, so you can protect your children.

Would you change how you handle the situation if you knew your husband was at a crack house everyday with his pipe?

Cheers Tough~

I'd have a whole lot more legal recourse for keeping the kids away, that's for sure...

I found this and thought it may help you.

Let me explain this in a different context. When I first discovered my WH's affair I fearful for his future. I was plotting all types of strategies to help him.

Our MB based MC was very matter of fact, but not lacking in compassion or faith. She reminded me that I had had a very good rational talk with my WH about infidelity for years. I had also had a second rational conversation with him on Dday. Both times he rejected my advice. There was nothing else I could say. I had to commit my WH to God in a new way, as many times as necessary every day, and let God do His work in His time, even if it meant negative consequences in my WH's life.

The abuser must recognize the consequences of his/her actions. My MC reminded me that God loves my WH more than I do. Not only does God love our kids more than we do, but also His love and ability to work on our WH's behalf are stronger than our love and ability. I am watching that principle work and it is rewarding and humbling to watch.

My MC explained detachment has to be learned by all family members of addicts otherwise you will live your life in an unhealthy and abusive relationship.

Your children are smart and resilent and will know the difference between right and wrong. You have no ownership or control in anything that happens in your WH's life.

This is for your emotional well being. It is difficult because we don't want the outcome we have been given. We don't want the crap our waywards just handed us, but there is nothing we can do. It is our reality, and we are either going to sink or swim.

I strongly encourage you to seek help for codependence. It will allow you to learn about the DJ called control. You will find when you change the DJ you begin to forget about the wayward.

Tough

What I'll say over and over is this. YOU DON'T KEEP THE KIDS FROM THE WS. You keep the kids from being EXPOSED TO THE AFFAIR (hence the affair partner too).

You show and prove that the affair is harmful emotionally to the kids. that is NOT USING THE KIDS it is also protecting them! You have to.

If you live in a fault state, have alienation of affection laws in your state, then by golly, I'd bet it's pretty darn common that you have commonly written into separation agreements and into divorce decrees this: "no overnight visitors of opposite sex allowed when children are in the home of the parent with custody or visitation".

That goes for BOTH betrayed spouse AND wayward btw! That simply means, you don't have exposed to your kids, skanky people shagging mom or dad under the same roof when your kids are visiting you or in your custody. IN GA IT IS ALMOST ALWAYS WRITTEN IN as in many other states too. I did NOT ASK MY LAWYER, she wrote it in.

I've also seen the custodial parent get smacked for that too, meaning after sep/divorce, they suddenly "meet" somebody, begin dating them and having them spend the night while the kids are there.

This is a simple way also to keep the ow from at least spending the night in front of the kids.

Fwiw, before my xwh married the pregnant ow, she could not then live with him and had to go out and get an apartment again. For six months. Before our sep agreement, she had left her old apartment and moved in with him. He'd gotten a bachelor type condo in a trendy area of town when he decided to go wayward with her.

But you sure also try for sole custody also.

But there is no reason at all why you do not try to do the above things. No reason.

I NEVER SAID to keep your WH from seeing the kids. Just make it HARD FOR THE OW AND THE AFFAIR to be around the kids. It IS HARMFUL. It is bad for them. And it also is a tool to possibly kill the affair off more. Another way to make trouble for the affair.

You're mission right now, in plan B is to:
*ABOVE ALL PROTECT THE KIDS (but still let them see dad in a healthy environment)
*secure for yourself and the kids a decent financial agreement in sep papers
*make sure you and kids have health insurance provided by wh in the sep agreement
*get any and all negative info on the ow including police reports
*see if you can see a child psych to get it proven that the affair is harmful (which we know it is)
*SIMPLY ADD IN USUAL sep/divorce language about "no overnight visitors of opposite sex under roof while kids are in custody/visitation". You can allow your relatives in same house though. But NOT BOYFRIENDS OR GIRLFRIENDS OR SKANKYHOS. This is commonly written in to protect the children from the affair or immoral conduct/sleeping around wherever they are. It DOES NOT AFFECT YOUR WH. He can see the kids, he just cannot have ow spend the night. See? She must leave the home when it's bedtime. If she breaks the rule, then he is brought BACK to court on contempt charges.
*file alienation of affection lawsuit against the ow because IT IS A FACT they're having an affair and he is living with her because she lured him there. She is stealing your family monies, and now she'll have to pay up to YOU and the kids! I wish this law was on the books in every darn state.

I have TWO FRIENDS who took their x spouses back to court b/c they had girlfriends sleeping at their houses when the kids were there visiting daddy on visitation. Both won the contempt charges too. Their x husbands had to pay legal bills and also got lectured too and one got less custody as a result.

You have so much on your side Mehr! Including the state you reside in.

make the most of it and do what you can. Nobody is saying that he should not be their daddy. It is just that most states DO have some sort of way you can easily keep the kids safe from either infidelity or immoral behavior. And that goes for SEPARATED and even DIVORCED couples.

it was written in my sep and divorce papers too. In my now dh's divorce decree from his xww the same thing written in. In two of my friends in TN it is in their decrees too. All it means is that you can't sleep around in front of your kids. Affair or NO affair. You shouldn't do it b/c it is HARMFUL.

Plus as my family court judge saw it, he said that "when the child is there, you should have as your focus YOUR CHILD."

When the judge read part of the decree about the "no overnight visitors of oppoisite sex" part, my xh actually ASKED the judge how that worked. He was schooled by the judge biiig time! The judge said "It's not good for your son to see you as a negative example sleeping with somebody you're not married to or somebody that is't moral. That's not good parenting." He then went on to say that THIS IS JUST THE WAY IT IS in this state.

Here's a link to a similar scenario where the xw moved her boyfriend in with her and what the response from the family lawyer expert was:
No Overnight Visitors and Live-In Boyfriend

Many times (and in my papers)it is defined as from 8:00 pm until 8:00 am. So they have to get the heck out! No boyfriends or girlfriends in the home during those hours when the kids are with their parent.

Also prevents sneaking in/out of the home late at night or early in am too! This is usual again. Normal wording added in in many states.