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Originally Posted by confusedandtorn
I just feel Ill.

He wants to come talk to me in 1.5 hrs

Can you stay focused on your plan? Don't get distracted. Expose his affair and move forward.


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

Exposure 101


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I don't know. I haven't sent the letter. I haven't called anyone.

2 hours ago he was going to quit his job...now he wants to come to my work in 1.5hours to talk. I'm anxious and tell him so and I said "if you are going to say you want her/your job/ divorce just say." and he said he doesn't know what he's doing.

I hate everything.

Hate and anxiety and pain. I can barely breath.

I wouldn't even know what to say to his family. And there's a ton. Mom dad 7 aunts cousins ugh.

I'm so lost. My therapist also said 2 mistakes are not a mistake


Me: BS 25
Him: WS 24
Dd#1 5 years
dd#2 18months

My story here: http://forum.marriagebuilders.com/ubbt/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2551691#Post2551691

DDAY 10/30/10 (affair 2/10-10/10)
FR Reveal 10/5/2010 (affair 4/29/11-10/5/11)

Plan A 10/11/11
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What if the plan is wrong? How do I know what to do


Me: BS 25
Him: WS 24
Dd#1 5 years
dd#2 18months

My story here: http://forum.marriagebuilders.com/ubbt/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2551691#Post2551691

DDAY 10/30/10 (affair 2/10-10/10)
FR Reveal 10/5/2010 (affair 4/29/11-10/5/11)

Plan A 10/11/11
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And I don't want to make him stay of it will be a lifetime of this. Fml


Me: BS 25
Him: WS 24
Dd#1 5 years
dd#2 18months

My story here: http://forum.marriagebuilders.com/ubbt/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2551691#Post2551691

DDAY 10/30/10 (affair 2/10-10/10)
FR Reveal 10/5/2010 (affair 4/29/11-10/5/11)

Plan A 10/11/11
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Originally Posted by confusedandtorn
I'm so lost. My therapist also said 2 mistakes are not a mistake

What is the "mistake?"


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

Exposure 101


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confused, I am going to take one last shot at this and then I am giving up. You can lead a horse to water but you can't make him drink.

I want you to think about something. Your "therapist" does not have the slightest idea how to save a marriage and is giving you reckless advice. To tell you to help your husband hide the affair will only serve to ENABLE the affair.

Dr Harley, on the other hand is a clinical psychologist, the founder of MArriage Builders who SPECIALIZES in infidelity. He has saved thousands of marriages using these tactics. Your therapist has saved none and knows nothing about how to save a marriage.

Those of us who are posting to you have saved our own marriages using these tactics. Dr Harley is not lying when he says:

Originally Posted by Dr Bill Harley
In my experience with thousands of couples who struggle with the fallout of infidelity, exposure has been the single most important first step toward recovery. It not only helps end the affair, but it also provides support to the betrayed spouse, giving him or her stamina to hold out for ultimate recovery.

Now, if you would rather take the advice of an unqualified, inexperienced "therapist" over a clinical psychologist with a long successful track record, then there is nothing more I can do to help. I feel like I have wasted my time here today. I gave it my best shot.


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

Exposure 101


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That's really mean. I don't know what to do. I'm lost and confused and scared. I'm afraid of more damage than good. I can barely breath.

I'm not saying Im not listening, I'm just confused. I think that's reasonable to be confused and lost. And I'm getting advice from every which way and I'm scared.


Me: BS 25
Him: WS 24
Dd#1 5 years
dd#2 18months

My story here: http://forum.marriagebuilders.com/ubbt/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2551691#Post2551691

DDAY 10/30/10 (affair 2/10-10/10)
FR Reveal 10/5/2010 (affair 4/29/11-10/5/11)

Plan A 10/11/11
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I gave it my best shot. It is up to you to take it or leave it.

Good luck.


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

Exposure 101


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He's coming here...and I don't know what to say. I made my list. I know he must quit. My chest hurts and I'm afraid.

And I just keep thinking "I can't MAKE him stay" his wishy washy hurts.

If he won't quit today ...or says he isn't sure...I'll tell him to Pack up. Or I'll do it once home


Me: BS 25
Him: WS 24
Dd#1 5 years
dd#2 18months

My story here: http://forum.marriagebuilders.com/ubbt/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2551691#Post2551691

DDAY 10/30/10 (affair 2/10-10/10)
FR Reveal 10/5/2010 (affair 4/29/11-10/5/11)

Plan A 10/11/11
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I think that's horrible. I thought this was a place to come try to get support and help and feel like I'm not crazy. Just the opposite feels to have happened. Just because I haven't sent a letter yet


Me: BS 25
Him: WS 24
Dd#1 5 years
dd#2 18months

My story here: http://forum.marriagebuilders.com/ubbt/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2551691#Post2551691

DDAY 10/30/10 (affair 2/10-10/10)
FR Reveal 10/5/2010 (affair 4/29/11-10/5/11)

Plan A 10/11/11
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confused, I believe I have supported you. I have spent hours today posting to you. Was my time and effort "horrible?" There is nothing more I can do except wish you luck. Now it is up to you to take it or leave it.

I do have my own life to live and have nothing more to give. Now, it is up to you.


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

Exposure 101


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perhaps ow will quit and/or get fired?


Me-49, WH-51
Married 02/1983 yrs, Sons - 27, 26, 20
1st PA - 1985, 1st known EA - 1992/1993
2nd PA - 06/02 to 11/04
1st D-day - 09/03, D-day 2 - 10/04 D-day 3 05/08
NC e-mail - 11/04- it wasn't real
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---
And I just keep thinking "I can't MAKE him stay" his wishy washy hurts.

If he won't quit today ...or says he isn't sure...I'll tell him to Pack up. Or I'll do it once home
---

You are right. He has to make a decision. No matter, what he tells you, it will amount to either one of these two things:

1
I want to keep you and our family, but her too

2
I am seriouw about us and am giving op her and the job to save my family.

In case 1, you already know, deep in your heart what to do. Not doing anything hasn't helped. If 1, then you have all the more reason to expose and get his family to help you. Use this power. Let others talk sense into him. You know that is your best shot.

In case 2, you won't have to quit his job for him. Because he will do it freely. But you are stil not there yet. Because he is like an addict. He may want to stay with you and the childen, but he is addicted to her and the needs she meets. That's the sad truth. And to keep many eyes on him, to keep him accountable and to let the light of day shine on the affair, you expose it to people who will help keep the affair dead. Who will keep an eye on him and who will provide moral support to you.

He is living his fantasy life, having sex, having a family, he is having a great time. But if the world is looking over his shoulder, he sees more clearly that what he is doing is hideous. That is what exposure is supposed to do. To hold him accountable.

Look, therapists are masters at keeping everyone happy and causing no friction. But in the case of an affair, the no friction thing is only keeping the affair alive, at least in his head. If his family comes crashing down on him, his mother is disappointed, his friends are asking him why he endangers his family, that is where he starts to see himself through the eyes of others who are not in the fog.

Of course that is not nice for him. But it is neccessary to get some sense into him. The same is done with drug addicts. It is called an intervention, where the whole family sits down with the addict and convinces him to get help. That is what exposure is about. And so that you won't have do act as everything is OK. because it is not. You need support too.

Exposure will do that if it is done befor he gets the chance to spin the story with you as the wicked witch and him as the sad but good-willed husband, who finally for the first time in his life found some love. Beat him to it.

I know Melodylane can be very direct and may not seem to be patient, but she has seen many people just do nothing and freezing like a rabbit in the headlights and doing nothing - and getting nowhere.

Just hear what your husband has to tell, but do not let him deceive you. It is either you and your family or nothing. Not thinking time or anything. He has had long enough to think. Decision time is now and you have a plan either way.

I must be going to bed now. I will pray for you.

God bless,

Happyheart

Last edited by happyheart; 10/11/11 04:49 PM.

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Not that you care ... But he's packing his bags


Me: BS 25
Him: WS 24
Dd#1 5 years
dd#2 18months

My story here: http://forum.marriagebuilders.com/ubbt/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2551691#Post2551691

DDAY 10/30/10 (affair 2/10-10/10)
FR Reveal 10/5/2010 (affair 4/29/11-10/5/11)

Plan A 10/11/11
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And I'm on the phone w his mom


Me: BS 25
Him: WS 24
Dd#1 5 years
dd#2 18months

My story here: http://forum.marriagebuilders.com/ubbt/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2551691#Post2551691

DDAY 10/30/10 (affair 2/10-10/10)
FR Reveal 10/5/2010 (affair 4/29/11-10/5/11)

Plan A 10/11/11
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From my thread:

Quote
Just for review, here was my original list of boundaries.


1. Complete NC, and if contact occurs he must tell me. He thinks this will be easy, but when he gets up I will point him to Dr. H's articles on here so he can be prepared for the reality of temptation when it happens.

2. Honesty - total and complete. I told WH that if there was anything he wasn't ready to talk about yet, to just say that and we would come back to it later, but he has wanted to talk about everything so far.

3. Open-book policy - it was pretty close already, with me having complete access to his bank account and all emails, but there were several privacy fences up; one around his cell phone (or so he thought), and one around his IM. He knows I will be watching those closely.

4. Accountability for time - he offered to take me with him everywhere, and failing that to check in with me often and let me know what he's doing. In addition, he no longer cares if I access him on the GPS.



[And he had already taken care of #5, the marriage counseling.]


For the sake of comparison, here is the new, improved list of boundaries that were to govern recovery #2, if there was to be a recovery #2.

Quote:

What It Will Take

· Another letter to Gargamel, explaining that you will not communicate with her again—ever. No loopholes. No contact for the rest of your life. Period.
· In this letter you will also let her know that she has until the end of July to find alternate employment. I agreed to let her work for us on a temporary basis, and that time has long since passed. [We shortened this time period to last only until the end of the payroll she was currently in.]
· Become completely honest. Our marriage will not survive further deception. This not only includes not lying to me, but means not giving me a false perception of something, as you tried to do with the phone calls. No lies, no evasion, no covering, just the full and complete truth.
· Commit to weekly marriage counseling with me, whether by phone or in person. After all this trauma, we need every possible advantage in order to recover our marriage.
· Keep in close touch the way you have been. I am willing to do the same to reassure you.
· Resign from [the job where the A began]. Your phone calls began again just after you started to work there for the first time since breaking up with her.
· Every possible precaution must be taken to erase her from our lives and make contact with her so difficult that you would have to make great efforts and great deception to even make it possible. This includes, but is not limited to:
o Trade cell phones using the phones from you, [and several other employees], and do not give her the new number.
o Give me your current cell phone (instead of [the one I have now]).
o Block her number from your phone.
o Get caller-ID-blocking blocked so there are no blocked numbers on the phone bill.
o Block all of her email addresses from all of your email addresses.
o Delete her from every possible contact list you have.
o Get rid of anything she has given you, cards, memorabilia, anything at all. (The tools will be paid for, and belong to the company anyway.)
o If you have to schedule her for the short time she remains with our company, institute employee numbers instead of names. [By now the sound of her name is so unpleasant for both of us that we refer to her as A Certain Person so we don't have to name her directly.]
o She will not hold any position in the company except [the one she now holds], and that only through July 31 at the latest. [He had previously been trying to get me to give her more assignments, such as scheduling all the employees. I will try to remember to say more about that later.]
o I will continue to deal with all money issues relating to repaying her loans to you. I will let you know once the money is all paid off, but other than that don’t bring it up. You can believe that I will pay it off as fast as humanly possible.
o Do not mention her in the context of the present. She has no more part in our lives. That means you don’t ask how she is doing, if I have mailed her check, or anything current. It is as if she is now dead, and has no place among the living. (The only time her name will ever come up is in dealing with something affair-related.)
o Tell me immediately if there is ever contact of any kind. If you are honest about this, we will simply find a way to prevent it from happening again through more precautions.

If this agreement is broken, at that point the only way I would even think of continuing to be married to you is if we move out of state, far from this area. (Carson City is not nearly far enough, Westby might be.) And, to be very blunt, depending on the level of dishonesty, especially in the face of all these precautions, I might very well decide to end things at that point.
You need to have some glimmer of how badly this recent episode has hurt me, in spite of how calm I have been in talking to you about it. After I compiled the list of phone calls showing just how many times you had called her, and had her call you right back, and exactly how long you talked each time, I walked quietly into the bathroom. For a little while I thought I might just throw up, but instead broke into hysterical, wordless sobbing. I have no idea how long I cried, but it was a long while.
I will not let this continue. There will be no accidents or second chances. There will be no excuses, and no reasons for any type of contact, at any time, ever. No matter how much trouble it might be to put these things into place, it is little enough to prevent the kind of agony I have suffered, and am still suffering now. I will not risk being hurt like this again. I love you enough that I am willing to try one more time, and I hope and pray you will decide to take that chance.



Whatever else you might think about it, there is no arguing that the second list is far more comprehensive than the first. I also made it very clear that if thought of further precautions, they would be added to the list at that time.

Please take this very much to heart: you can never have too many precautions.

Well, maybe you could, but you'd have to try really hard. Don't neglect this little stuff. The Bible says it is the little foxes that spoil the grapes. Because of how repentant AJ had been at the beginning, I underestimated the hold the A still had on him, and just didn't think all that was necessary.

It is far better to do it right from the start.




A smooth sea never made a skilled mariner.
~ English proverb



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Wow, Confused. You're in a serious Betrayed Spouse fog all your own.

Not much we can do for you when you won't listen.

I wish you all the best with your own plan. You'll need it.


A smooth sea never made a skilled mariner.
~ English proverb



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We care. Tell us what is going on. What everyone is saying is a drug addict took over your husbands body. Of course he was happy for the last year... he had his drug and his family. Drug addicts will say and do anything to get that high. The only way to recovery is to break the addiction.

Many waywards have come here and thanked the board for the advice they gave there spouses but. ONLY AFTER they have been off the drug long enough to see the damage. I will see if I can find some posts for you but please keep exposing.


Me -BS 40
Him - FWH 34 (dtl)
3 D-Days from 12/25/10 to 01/06/11
NC - 01/09/11
02/20/12 done beating my head on that wall.
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Originally Posted by confusedandtorn
Not that you care ... But he's packing his bags

Please please please listen to what Melody has told you. She isn't mean, she is just blunt and she has seen this played out 100s of times....she knows what MUST be done to have a shot at saving your marriage.

Why is he leaving? Did you tell him to go? Did he refuse to quit his job immediately?

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You should read my thread.

You will understand what it is that you have to do to fix this- because wishing and hoping, and waiting for a wayward spouse to do the right thing- isn't a plan.

The people here saved my marriage, and they helped me save me.

They are offering you the same chance. You have to step up and do it. It isn't easy, but nothing worth fighting for ever is.

They aren't asking you to do anything that they haven't done themselves.

I did what they told me to. Will you?


Thanks for all the support along the way.
I wish you all well. I'm outta here.
Peace.
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