Thanks again for all the support, this experience has been life altering for me. So far I think I have learned this:
1. The meaning of life (for me at least) is to be involved in the people I love lives every day and to be an asset to them not a liability
2. Patience (this one i'm still learning)
3. Selflessness (also still refining this one)

The only chance she has to conduct an affair is on her company laptop, I'm considering calling her company IT/Ethics group and asking them to investigate any illegitimate activity... what are your thoughts?

In the mean time, patience and Plan A.

What is your evidence that you do have?
So are you saying you're 100% sure there is no affair right now?
You couldn't expose because you don't have enough evidence? What about the two month EA she had with her exbf? Why can't you expose that?

If you're trying to figure out how WW think you may make yourself crazy because they aren't rational people.

If your WW is still talking about D most likely she is in an affair. Most WW don't leave unless they have OM lined up.
Carrot and Stick of Plan A

Right now the only evidence I had was some texting she did with another guy. She flirted with him, he was nice to her, she flirted again he said he was not interested in her... end of texting.

I'm not 100% sure there is no affair but as much snooping as I can do I have not found any more evidence. I'm considering contacting her company ethics department and ask them to confirm any communication with her company laptop.

The two month EA with her EX BF was more than 2 years ago and it was exposed

My wife has her own income and could provide quite well for herself so she is not dependent on another man.

Another thing, I was served the divorce papers today and in discussion with the lawyer I made mention that I still hoped to work things out. He mentioned this to her and she flipped her lid, she called me and was incredibly rude and bitchy condescending and insulting. These are the times when I question if she really deserves me. I'm sure some of these comments are DJs but it is just so demoralizing.

I am a human, I have made mistakes, I have learned from my mistakes, I'm a better person for having made mistakes. She has commented multiple times that she absolutely can not understand how she could negatively effect our marriage. She states "I don't understand how he could have any problem with me, because no one at work ever has a problem with me".

End of venting

To you or to the lawyer, RCX?
Remember, you are threatening her little fantasy world. You have to be ready for her to "flip out." It's normal behavior for someone who does not currently have a LONG TERM approach to marriage.

She does deserve you. She also deserves to have a man who is not willing to give up on a dream of having a loving caring wonderful family. She also deserves to have the discomfort of not getting whaqt she wants at the expense of others includign her own daughter.
I hesitate to offer advice about how to handle the "exposure" or "investigation" of her work situation with the aide of the IT guys, but this would be a GREAT quote to use as an opening with them.
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I have also been considering talking with her parents and apologizing to them for the way I have treated her in the past. I would explain that I never physically hurt her but I also did not support her as a good husband should. How this whole process has shaken me to my core, and now I see my mistakes and have corrected my behavior. I would not ask them for anything but their forgiveness, if they offer their support in trying to repair our marriage I would accept it.

I would really like to deliver this message in person however they live ~3hrs away.

what do you think

Also the quote about how no one at work has any problem with her is her saying that I shouldn't have any complaint about our marriage (her performance as a wife) since her boss doesn't have any complaint about her as an employee. She doesn't see the difference between a marital relationship or a business relationship.

RCX, I think contacting the IT/ethics department is a great idea. But, since you do not know who is her sweetheart from work, it might be one of them, so it is 50/50 chance to get anything from them. But it definitely is worth of try.


To whom exactly?

Do not sign the papers. Her boss is not her husband and there is actually no point in engaging yourself in this argument. State very calmly that you are interested in making your marriage work and not to divorce and you won't do the opposite.

What exactly does your daughter know about her mother's past affair and now this situation?

Steve Harley advised me to "Plan A" her parents, especially my MIL. I would make it a brief conversation if possible and then prove your intentions with actions in the next months. You could always start with "I don't want a D with your daughter, I want to be a better husband and SIL and Father to your Granddaughter than I have been in the past. Here are some of the changes I've been making..., but I don't expect you to believe my words, I intend to prove it to you over time if you'll be willing to work with me..."

I've heard Dr. Harley say that it's no wonder so many workplace affairs happen as we tend to act TOTALLY different to people we work with. It's really frustrating that your wife wont recognize this, since it seems so obvious. But people really don't get it. They just don't.

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Weekend Update:

Saturday was fine, spent the first half of the day cleaning. In the afternoon I took my daughter to have some daddy - daughter time, we met my sister and her family and all the kids played for the afternoon. When I arrived back home we put my daughter to bed and my wife said she wanted to talk. She told me she missed me this afternoon and was sad she could not come to be with my family and how much she will miss my side of the family. She was sweet and loving and sincere.

During the night my wife developed flu like symptoms, in the morning she could barely move. I took care of everything (shopping, cleaning, cooking, laundry and my daughter) while she just rested. I took care of my wife better than anyone else could have, she noticed and was very appreciative. At one point when I brought her a snack which was prepared exactly the way she likes it she looked lovingly into my eyes, grabbed my hands and told me thank you in a way I have never heard before. She was pulling me close and arching up like she wanted to kiss me?? The rest of the day was like we were back to normal, a loving married couple.

I'm not sure what to think of all of this, she hasn't wanted to talk about divorce in a few days and I have been making LB deposits like crazy!

Only new discovery from snooping was that her workout partner at the gym is a fairly white trash divorced woman about the same age as my wife. She put my wife in contact with her lawyer. I can imagine her telling my wife how much fun it is to go out on dates and meet new people. How divorced life is so great and you can have so much fun and freedom... never mind our daughter who is an innocent passenger in all of this. I hate that my wife surrounds herself with people of poor character.

Any words of advice?

RCX, any chance for you to spend this recreational time together?

According to Dr. Harley, there are 4 most important emotional needs: affection, sexual fulfilment, recreational companionship and conversation. Meeting these needs romantic love is created.

You should get rid of this divorce cheerleader, she probably has hooked your WW up with someone already. Try focus on spending all your leisure time together.

My wife's most important needs are:
- Admiration
- Non-sexual affection
- Domestic support
- Family commitment

The last two have been easy to meet in the last few weeks, the first two not so much. Sometimes she is OK with me touching her or being close to her so I can show her some affection, but other times she wants me to keep my space. This weekend was a good chance to give her the affection she needed in both how I took care of her (showing that I know what she needs to feel better and being a loving husband) and rubbing her back or feet when she felt bad (non sexual touch). I'm working on the admiration as this is the toughest one to work in without it seeming forced. By nature I am not a complimentary person, so this has a negative effect on her. I have explained that in my heart I constantly admire her but I just have trouble putting it into words, I told her from now on I will just speak from my heart.

Domestic support and family commitment do not create intimacy. Intimacy is created by spending Undivided Attention time 15-20 hrs a week meeting the needs of affection, SL, conversation and recreational companionship.

PLease read about Policy of Undivided Attention here.

Try to get her away from her workout partner. Now that she is being sick, it is a good time to turn this around and suggest workout time together.

I see your point, actually we have been spending a lot of time together going through old things cleaning out the house. It has spurred a lot of memories for both of us. We have been eating dinner as a family much more lately talking and laughing together. We have been talking about random things much more lately as well. Generally it is her who initiates the conversation and I just go with it, previously I would have corrected her at every turn or told her how her plan would not work....etc.

I have said I wanted to go to the gym with her but she just got mad and told me "I wanted you to come to the gym years ago and you wouldn't... now you want to". She does do some exercise at home, I have been joining her when does this and I can tell she enjoys it.

So actually we have been spending quite a bit of time lately having conversation, recreational companionship, and a bit of affection (for her) here and there. I will try to maximize these moments and work in some LB deposits during these times.

What did you say back to her when she said this? This a great opportunity to make LB deposits.

I told her that I didn't realize how much it meant to her for me to go with her. I think if I were to go with her now it would be a LB as she would feel that I was crowding her. For now I will find ways to work my way into her other activities, if we make it through this I will definitely join her gym.

Based on the information I have as of today I still think there is no one else in her life. I think she is having an affair with the idea of being single and free. She is in love with the idea of having simple easy relationships and creating sexual tension without the expectation or commitment to have sex. She want't to be chased and admired and have the butterflies you get when you first meet someone. She doesn't want to have to worry about meeting anyone else's needs. She wants to be free to build the house she wants and watch the shows she wants and go to bed any time she wants and not have to worry about anyone but herself.

What she is forgetting is how much I actually do around the house. How without my paycheck she will not be able to go clothes shopping when ever she wants. How she will not be able to go to Disney with our daughter every year. How she will have to pack lunches every day, how she will have to cook every night, how she have no free time.

I know plan B is designed to bring people to these realizations but right now our plan B will be finalization of our divorce.

This is exactly what she wants - privacy!!! The reason she got angry was exactly proving it. She is up to something with this workout partner, and I'm afraid you are loosing valuable time here to find your way into her other activities. You have to come between them, this is your right! You are doing exactly what she wants: doing your duties around the house and giving her privacy when she is without you. Joining her in gym should be your first way right now. Can you actually join her there unexpectedly? Do not worry about her anger, this is to be expected, it is temporary.

She is a freeloader. All WSs are. But be careful not to through that into her face when you feel like it. You are in Plan A.

Order this: Dr. Harley's book "Buyers, Renters and Freeloaders". There is a way to get her back.

You know, RCX, I think you've described the phase my ex was in for the moths prior to the divorce being final. It sounds exactly like her frame of mind after the first affair was broken up. Unfortunately, this "frame of mind" turned out to be more than I could stomach. It was almost worse than the affair for me because I could never really know what was going on. Finally it was too much for me when I came home from work early one day and she was at the other neighbor's (I called him OM#2) "having coffee." It was just simply too much for me. I told her I was being abused and that I always said I could endure anything in a marriage except abuse.

I am confident that you can get through to her before this nebulous but destructive mind-set does it's damage. You seem to have more resolve thanb I did, so I wish you luck.

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Recon, this is where I have trouble with some of the Plan A stuff. Joining the gym without talking to her is clearly in the realm of independent activity, a major lovebuster. My ex called me on it a couple times when I was in Plan A and I wasn't sure how to respond. But then there is no way to reason (or POJA) with a hormone infested wayward. Melody would probably say you don't reason with a druck, you just take their keys away.

The question is that does she secretly want him to show up, join, whatever; to be that strong, Protect the Marriage, Save-me-from-my-Animal-Urges husband? I've heard former waywards say this was exactly what they needed even though they might have railed against it while it was happening.

During my Plan A, I talked to the ex one day on the phone and she said she was in the grocery store. So I happended to be where I could stop in there. I found her and guess who she was with? "Friend"/OM#2. So, now I'm "following her around." ...They're all the same.

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I guess you could say something to the effect of
"I'd like to join the gym and start going with you to your workouts"
"Dr. Harley points out taht people often fall in love wsith their gym partners due to the endorphins and adrenaline and positive feelings associated with it. Since I love you so much I want you to be in love with me, so I'd like to see if he's right."
push comes to shove:
"I also find that you act differently twoard me when you return from the gym - it makes me feel that there is something going on there that I would like to know more about, because this is my marriage too and I feel I have the right to know what things are affecting my marriage."
--no DJ's there, right?

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