KG, reading your story and substituting "boat" for "parked car" and "seasickness" for "conscience" I could be reading my own story.

I and my bride have fully recovered our marriage and it has been a source of joy to me (and I HOPE to her) every day since.

I am going to give you some words to prevent you from making some mistakes I made, that you appear to be headed for.

Whatever it takes, get 1000% satisfied that you know the full extent and content of her affair. Firstly, get her to write out a timeline, from first feelings of attraction to last meeting. Have her fill it in with as much information as she can recall. Then tell her you will be requiring her to undergo a polygraph on the salient points. You'll know by her reaction exactly what you're facing at that point. Anything except "Yes, dear, to help you heal!" means she's lying about the details.

Whatever else you do, you must contact the OMW with the information you have. This is vitally important, and serves several purposes. It may be that this is not the first affair OM has had. (Won't your WW enjoy hearing THAT?) It may be that schedule comparisons about "business trips" or "conventions" might reveal deeper illicit involvements. If nothing else, it will put another set of eyes on the illicit couple's future actions.

And, pending the results of the poly, you may want to refrain from conjugal pleasures with WW until she undergoes a full STD screen.

And lastly, dude, you obviously have not fully internalized what OM tried to take from you, and his contempt for you as a man. "Go on double dates?" You might convey to him that if you and he ever meet, he would be fortunate if you were not carrying a horsewhip. Of course after you have your (mandatory) chat with OMW, he might not be so amenable to socializing with you.

Excellent post, NG.



Should be carved in stone for all newbie BHS.

Contempt is right.

I also found the contempt for his BW in this 'double date' suggestion, quite breathtaking.

But then, my H took me out with my supposed friend many times so that I was unknowingly on a couple of sick threesome dates with the OW. So I may feel it more.

The level of cruelty here is high. I really feel for both you and the BW.

If he can casually suggest something as cruel as this - what else has he done to you both?


Follow NGs tips to the letter. He's been where you are and drove the bus out of the ditch.

You need to schedule a pploygraph test. WW's never tell the truth. First they said it was just talk, then met just for coffee, then just a kiss, to just necking, to in the words of Howard Cosell she went all the way.

You also must expose OM wife.

Get a key logger on the PC to find out if WW is breaking NC. Even looking at OM's FB page is breaking NC and will keep WW from defogging from the affair.

My wife and I spoke extensivly the other night. I told her I wanted the affair totally exposed. She said it was and insists it was wrong....it did escalate to the point where they kissed and she stopped it...said it wasnt right, and he said i dont want to make u do anything ur incomfortable with....the affair was discovered shortly after. She insists that I am trying to get her to admit that it was more. We go over and over this....she finally said....what do u want me to say..."i slept with him" then I slept with him....now she consistantly says she is upset and hurt that we r trying to move forward in a lie. I didnt sleep with him, it just didnt get that far. Then she told me after i advised her of some of the things i read here. "Your probablh right...if the affair continued i probably would have slept with him.....the pain is bad...i just want the truth....

Thus, the polygraph.

I never had to threaten the PG test. My W spilled her guts on the goings on of her affair over a 6 or seven day period after her dday. Sure, I got more questions, but the top 50 were answered to my satisfaction. They were gory and completely humiliating to her to have to re-live but 100% necessary to move on. She did well. And, most of it was way less that I would have imagined.

Anyway, you will need to make the polygraph a required component of your recovery.

Really KG? Did you read anything on this site about exposure and arguing with a WS????? I am always willing to help a BS but you need to get your head out of the sand and stop talking to your WW about such things. You are shooting yourself in the foot. You need to verify info that is not per your WW or the OM. You want the truth but you don't want to make waves and tick off your WW to get to it...that's your biggest problem right there. Stop talking to your WW!!!!

Ok...i'm getting it..just hard not to care when so hurt. I stopped afguing with my wife..told her that in order to get some closure and the truth verfied i wanted her to take a polygraph. I told her this would confirm her details of the affair and be the first step to fegaining trust. She was a little apprehensive but said she would if that was what i needed.

Good, now that she has agreed to it, get it scheduled. Google polygraph (your zip-code) That's likely all that's required. Book it in about two weeks time, and develop the necessary yes/no questions that will give you what you need (about eight is recommended). Give her the questions about two days before the session. Develop the sanctions that will follow if she fails, and give them to her as well. If she cancels or postpones for any reason, call your lawyer. If she fails, implement the sanctions. If she passes, say a silent prayer of thanksgiving, and get to work on the MB Program.

Its very common for waywards to agree to a poly while inside their heads they are screaming
'Nooooooooooooooooo!'

They are usually hoping that that simply agreeing will reassure the BS and they will drop it.

Book it, and tell her that she is expected to reveal all between now and then. Have her write out a timeline of events - every flirty word, how things progressed etc. Any other As.

I fear that in a day or two she is going to pick a huge fight with you and claim that 'even agreeing to a poly isn't good enough' in a bid to make you needy and compliant. Prepare for that. Say 'No it isn't - I also expect you to take it. I also expect you to pass, having told me everything'.

Stand firm.

Oh and NEVER ever ever threaten exposure or ask permission to do it!

Get your exposure plan ready and just do it. Do BW first then everyone else. Don't tell WW a thing. She is supposed to see the reaction of others while unprepared. That's how it will work on her.

Exposure is a must. Done right.

You really must stop following your runaway emotions and follow a logical plan.

If you stop and listen, much less act on, all your pain and fears, then you'll end up under the dining table rocking on your heels with your pants on your head.

Follow a LOGICAL plan.

Up till now you've been asking a proven liar for an unproven version of events, while keeping it a secret from people who may very well be able to fill in the blanks.

Stick to logic.

If your wife is really repentant she won't mind proving herself and ending the secrecy which keeps you trapped and in the dark.

The truth will set you free.

Okay. Your wife is setting off alarms in my head, dude. LISTEN TO WHAT THESE FOLKS ARE TELLING YOU. Here's what can happen if you don't:

Your WS confesses to an EA and cuts contact.
You don't expose because hey, they ended it, right? And besides, that would really hurt them and make them upset. You don't poly because it sounds kind of nutty and extreme.
You try to recover and start building something good, but things don't feel right or ring true, so you keep asking questions, pleading for the truth.
Your WS waffles between mad and sad that you don't believe them. You hear things like "I feel terrible. It probably WOULD have gotten physical if you hadn't caught me in time", and "You just won't listen to me/let this drop! You're prolonging our pain! I feel like I should just MAKE SOMETHING UP so you'll drop it! You WANT me to tell you I did something, but I didn't!"

Weeks drag by and your WS finally admits it DID get physical, but ONLY twice, or only oral, or only once, or whatever lie they choose to downplay it. You are doubly crushed, because not only did they do something nasty with someone else, they've been LYING TO YOUR FACE for weeks.

This time you bring up a poly. They reluctantly agree, and that pacifies you somewhat. You drop the issue before booking a test because surely they wouldn't have agreed if they were lying, and you can't really afford it, and your WS makes it sound like you'd be crazy and cruel to make them do something so degrading after they already confessed...

Your WS is still acting BAD. They tell you it's because of you, but really it's because they're still lying and trying to keep you off track.

MORE WEEKS of badness go by. Eventually you discover something else, or they let something slip, and it's like an atom bomb in your brain. MORE LYING?! After all they put you through?!

You grow a pair and draw a line. You won't put up with this ANY LONGER. You book a poly. They agree because NOW they've told you everything anyway, they're still insisting. The days leading up to the poly, they confess more and more. The last secrets. You feel like you'll die.

They pass the poly, and you're faced with utter betrayal, personal devastation, and the LIES UPON LIES UPON LIES. That's so much harder to recover from than anything else.

I know this can happen, because it happened to me. Two months of my own personal hell. And I could have stopped it in it's tracks right away, if I had listened. You can stop it from happening to you.

Waywards LIE. Stop listening to your wife and listen to the advice you're getting here. Take control of your OWN life. You can choose not to take the chance that she's leading you into a living nightmare of dishonesty.

Go book a poly.

Take it from someone who knows what can happen when you WANT TO BELIEVE instead of FINDING OUT.

Yes. So agree with this. Her attitude stinks. Almost certainly she is hiding a more advanced PA and/or a greater emotional connection than she has told you.



Yup. Its hard to believe they could repeatedly slap you in the face with lies on top of everything else they've done...

.. But that's what waywards do.

PARTICULARLY ones with bad attitudes.

I would be very, very interested to know what his BW knows.

When can you do exposure/what is your exposure plan?

She has firmly agreed to take the poly...i told her i already did call and am in the process of making the appointment. I am a little afraid i am pushing her to hard when she may ne being up front even though took part in a dishonest affair. I agree with the poly to put me at peace. How should i act around her in the meantime betaeen now and the poly? Act as if we r moving forward? Begin the healing process as if she is telling the truth until known otherwise? She seems very remorseful for this going on and says i am hurting myself by thinking there was much more. I reallu appreaciate everyone help with this. My goal is to get to the bottom of this all and begin to rebuild my marriage. Thanks.

If I were a WW and I had done something SO TERRIBLE and told lies to my Hs face, I would feel q upset that I had ruined my credibility forever. What idiot would ever believe me now? A proven liar?

How FORTUNATE that there is this useful little tool that can RESTORE my credibilty! Can prove I am telling the truth! I have a reasonable, loving BH who hasn't kicked me out and a poly to regain his trust with! What a lucky girl am I!



Huge red flag dude. Its what anyone would think given her behaviour and she is blaming YOUR thoughts instead of HER behaviour! She's a cunning one, I'm afraid. This nifty little 'hurting yourself' catchphrase wraps up a lot of gaslighting in a neat little package. Let's unroll its meaning, shall we?

1) She is telling you how you can 'choose' what to believe and instead of finding facts and having reasonable assumptions and fears based on what you already know you should just 'choose' to believe whatever hurts you least!
Does she coo "you don't really want to know" hypnotically into your ear too? That might be a bit too obvious for her though.
2) The problem lies not with HER behaviour, HER lies, HER adultery but YOU are the person who hurt yourself by not believing hard enough, according to WW.



You need to expose and to Plan A her. Do you understand how to do this?

Not a word to her about this site or exposure.

She has firmly agreed to take the poly...i told her i already did call and am in the process of making the appointment. I am a little afraid i am pushing her to hard when she may ne being up front even though took part in a dishonest affair. I agree with the poly to put me at peace. How should i act around her in the meantime betaeen now and the poly? Act as if we r moving forward? Begin the healing process as if she is telling the truth until known otherwise? She seems very remorseful for this going on and says i am hurting myself by thinking there was much more. I reallu appreaciate everyone help with this. My goal is to get to the bottom of this all and begin to rebuild my marriage. Thanks.

I just got burglar alarms and home insurance.

Am I hurting myself with the fear that someone might want to break in?

Wouldn't I be happier if I chose to believe no one would do that?

Probably. It is q a depressing thought.

But given that I've already been broken into once by taking that 'it'll never happen to me' attitude...

.. I'm ready to face the hurtful facts of life, confront reality, deny happy clappy delusions and get my house in order.

I'm not hearing anything about an exposure plan?

There will be no healing until you have the truth...don't delude yourself. Between now and the poly, you Plan A and expose. Clean up your side of the street regardless of what your WW does or doesn't do. You should contact the BW ASAP. You may get a lot of info that can be useful for the poly. Personally I wouldn't even waste time and money on the poly until after exposure. You won't be pushing WW since you should only be talking about the A in small doses while Plan Aing and exposing.

Can someone post the link to plan A...thanks...

KGaa12,

Did you expose to OMW?

God Bless
Gamma