Need some advice on recovery.. have been in recovery with FWW for 6 mos, and feel like we are close to establishing a loving relationship. I�ve made a major effort to attend to her needs, but don�t feel like it�s being reciprocated.

Some background: I was an occasional philanderer (FWH), then discovered that W had a 10 year affair. This rocked me to the core, and I�ve had a major attitude/life adjustment. The revelations for both of us was horrifying, and the face peering back at me in the mirror was not the person that I wanted to be. The discovery of the MB website probably saved our marriage, and between Dr. Harley�s advice, some pretty good counseling, and a desire to hold our M together, we�ve weathered the storm so far with sunny days ahead (hopefully).

Here�s where I need advice- after a rocky post-DDay month, our relationship was punctuated by an intense rediscovery of each other, and the love that we had for each other. I�ve never felt so alive, even with some of the dark moments. Fast forward 6 months, and we�ve settled into a relationship that now seems to mirror the �affair-years� when her interests lay elsewhere. I�ve worked hard to consistently meet her EN�s, and have let her know about my ENs, but I just don�t seem to be her priority. I may be coming up short on meeting 15 hours of UA, but I try to be loving and attentive.

I really love her, and could be putty in her hands, but she doesn�t work very hard to meet my ENs- which is now getting my attention and making me trigger, because I�m tortured by my own imagined comparisons to the POSOM. Am pretty sure the A is dead.

Any advice on reigniting the spark? I do try to brush my teeth occasionally, LOL.

UA time is THE most important aspect of recovery. The recommendation of 15 hours a week is to sustain an already loving M. I believe the recommendation for recovery after an A is 20-25 hours a week. You need to find a way to bump that up! We fought UA time for a good long while, it just isn't feasible right? But then we decided to just try it, and overnight it made an enormous difference in our recovery and our feelings for each other. Now, we can tell if we are not getting enough, and we value that time like nothing else in life. I will NEVER go back to an M where we do not prioritize UA time.

If your relationship is mirroring the 'affair years' and you feel her interests lay elsewhere, I would think there is a high liklihood that they might. You say "I am PRETTY SURE the A is dead." Did I understand this to be a 10 YEAR AFFAIR? That is a lifestyle that would be difficult to withdraw from. You need to do some snooping to make SURE the A is dead and there has been NC with her OM (or another OM).

What EP's do you have in place to establish boundaries around your M? Has she been breaking these EP's?

If there is still contact with her OM, or there is a new OM, then obviously you are not really in recovery, she is not going to be meeting your needs, and you will not be able to reignite that spark. Confirming that should be your first order of business.

This is the problem right here. The program really does not work unless you are getting 20+ hours of UA time per week. All of your good work will be of no effect if you don't change your marriage so that you each become each other's FAVORITE leisure activity. If your wife enjoys reading or shopping more than she does being with you, you are not in safe yet.

You need to schedule your 20 hours of UA time once a week and keep doing that until it becomes the best time of your day. You will come to look forward to this time together and won't have a problem getting it in. But you have to take this over the hump at first by going through the motions.

I would get the workbook, Five Steps to Romantic Love, and tear out the UA worksheet in the back. Make copies and get in the habit of scheduling your UA time every week.


Pretty sure? What are you doing to MAKE SURE it is dead? Does she ever see the OM? Does he live close by?

Can you go off on a romantic vacation alone to re-establish your bond?

Thanks Unwritten. I recently read a post that saddened me, and reminded that the secret fantasy life FWW lived and its intense emotional component can't be matched by my relationship with her. I believe that is true, regardless of how much I will try to match it. Would appreciate some veterans commenting on this idea.

We have solid EPs and boundaries, both of us. I monitor her- there would have to be a "James Bond-like" method of contact to elude me, as I'm the computer guy.

How about a secret cell phone? Even a computer guy can't monitor a secret cell phone.

She got away with this deception for 10 long years, and she never really got caught through 'technical' means, you were notified by an outsider. So I am guessing she perfected her James Bond style a long long time ago.

Also, have you in your recovery had some meaningful conversation with her regarding WHY she seems so uninvested? What is her response to this?

I know as part of our recovery we have many, many hours of IC that includes just about every feeling and emotion we are experiencing under the sun. I am wondering what information she is giving you about how SHE is feeling about recovery and what might be her roadblock to it (if it is indeed NOT that she is back in contact with her POSOM).

Melody- Thanks for the comments. We've done a few romantic getaways, and they were great. But we've settled into normalcy... and that's what has alarmed me, since it's too close to being like those 10 years, when I was ignored a lot and had no clue, and we both had Indep. behaviors & schedules.

OM lives in town, there's no contact anymore. Exposure- done, EPs, written plans are all in place.

Also, love your Churchill tag line!

As others have said, UA time is the key.

Your wife will feel motivated to meet your needs when she is in love.

Give these a listen:

Call from "Steve":
http://www.marriagebuilders.com/radio_program/play_segment.cfm?sid=3324
http://www.marriagebuilders.com/radio_program/play_segment.cfm?sid=3325
http://www.marriagebuilders.com/radio_program/play_segment.cfm?sid=3326
http://www.marriagebuilders.com/radio_program/play_segment.cfm?sid=3327

Being in love motivates us to meet emotional needs:
http://www.marriagebuilders.com/radio_program/play_segment.cfm?sid=68

If the husband is on board:
http://www.marriagebuilders.com/radio_program/play_segment.cfm?sid=1973

You should post to your existing threads rather than start new ones. When you return to the board after a gap, click "My Stuff" and "posts" to find your existing thread. There is pertinent information being missed from this new thread you have started.

As long as you live in the same town as OM, with whom your wife had a 10-year affair, you will receive the same advice: you need to move.

If you say, as you have said several times before, that moving is "not an option", then you are choosing to stall and jeopardise your own marital recovery.

If you want your marriage to recover, you need to put it ahead of your locally-based business. At the moment you are putting your business first. That is the choice you are currently making.

She didn't need to be James Bond in years past, all it took was me with my own IBs and me not paying attention. Her comms were pretty low-tech: almost exclusively her cell phone.

We're on a trip with a DD (kids tournament), and will address this immediately, so I may be off-line for the weekend.
She seems to think we're doing OK, but I need reassurances about her & gestures that she seems slow to give.

Does this mean you have returned to IB and schedules? So you have time for IB and do NOT have time for UA?

So if that is the case it is possible for her comm method to be a cell phone this time too, but perhaps a separate cell phone that you are unable to be vigilant about.

I am just trying to get you to see that there is the POTENTIAL for contact with OM. If she is behaving in the same manner she did when she was with him, and is unable to fully invest in R...if it walks like a duck and talks like a duck...

Are you being O&H with her regarding YOUR feelings about R? If you tell her that YOU do not feel like things are going well, that should instigate concern from her and she/both of you should be delving into figuring out why that is. She seems to be unconcerned by that. (See about paragraph...)

You are relying on monitoring electronic means of communication, such as her phone and PC. However, a veteran adulterer such as your wife has developed expertise in the practice of secrecy. The obvious thing for her to do is to contact him via work and to have a secret affair phone. They can also meet in the regular meeting places; presumably all she has to do is go to his workplace, or to their favourite coffee shop.

I wouldn't take the risks you are taking over a known long-term affair. My H had 5 years of lingering EA via workplace phones after the PA became impossible (OW lives in another country, so once he stopped travelling there, physical meetings were ended). When I found out about the workplace contact, the only reason I was willing to stay in the marriage was because he was retiring within 3 weeks of D day. I work from home a lot so we are now together a lot, and when I am at work, he runs the home and keeps an eye on our so who is still at school, so I know where he is at all times.

Long-term affairs are difficult to end, even waning ones like my H's appeared to be, and you claim your wife's was. They might have been waning, but they were still continuing for a reason. The WS still got flattery, attention and excitement from the secret phone calls and sexy texts. If the waning is one-sided - i.e. OW in my situation and OM in yours still wanted the affair to continue - then it only takes a chance opportunity of contact for the supposedly less-interested WS to say "what the heck" and go for coffee.

Coffee leads to sex.

There was no sex for the last 5 years of my H's affair, but I wasn't prepared to put up with OW in his life, even just for phone calls "to see how he was" after I found out about them.

You are prepared to risk contact from OM still in town, and I cannot understand why. I'd have given up both jobs and sold our house and lived on meagre assets if moving to a new town was the solution to NC from a persistent OP.

I hear you, regarding potential contact w/ OM. I've been very vigilant since DDay, but can't rule out a (very) well hidden cell, or some other web-based system that hasn't been discovered. I missed the contact before, but I won't miss it again.
You're right, I need to address my concerns with her, and figure this out. I want to feel more important to her than the laundry, work, or any other mundane task. I'm doing my best to show her affection, and just want more of it in return.

Don't ignore my point about your still living in the same town as OM. The issue won't go away just because you ignore it.

Isn't that what you believed when you came here, before you posted? Did you listen to the radio clips I posted? Did you see SugarCane's crucial point?

Another good clip about moving after an affair.
Radio clip on moving locations after an affair

Please listen.
Radio clip of a WW having an affair the whole 10 years
Segment #2
Segment #3

Tell us what you think.

query: for how many years were you "an occasional philanderer?"